Help with Master Thrower Build

Post/Author/DateTimePost
#1

cycada

Jun 01, 2008 21:57:08
Hey all,

I've been working for a little bit on a character concept for an up and coming campaign I'll be in, and I was wondering if the following would work. I know it's probably been done before, but I thought I'd give it a shot anyway.

I was either going to go with this, or with a Invisible Blade.....

Help/critiquing would be appreciated:

Assumed: My DM has removed the XP penalty for multiclassing, much to my pleasure. Also, I'm going to see if my DM will rule that shurikens count as ammunition for enchanting (i.e. 50 shurikens count as one weapon) For this posts purposes, I'm going to assume he says yes.

Dromite Rogue 7/Fighter 6/Master Thrower 5/Monk 1/Exotic Weaponmaster 1

Flaws: Noncombatant

Stats: Str 12, Dex 22, Con 16, Int 16, Wis 16, Cha 14
Required Items: Shuriken of Death (+1 Returning Speed Shuriken) Price: 1006gp 2sp. Other good items would be any that increases Dex or Wis.
Important Skills: Sleight of Hand, Craft(Weaponsmithing), Hide, Move Silently
Progression(removing feats that really don't matter):

1st: Fighter 1:Point Blank Shot, Two-weapon Fighting
2nd: Fighter 1/Monk 1:
3rd: Fighter 2/Monk 1: Free, Rapid Shot
4th: Fighter 3/Monk 1:
5th: Fighter 4/Monk 1: Precise Shot
6th: Fighter 5/Monk 1: Weapon Focus(shuriken)
7th: Fighter 5/Monk 1/Master Thrower 1: Quick Draw
8th: Fighter 5/Monk 1/Master Thrower 2: Improved Two-weapon Fighting
9th: Fighter 5/Monk 1/Master Thrower 3: Manyshot
10th: Fighter 5/Monk 1/Master Thrower 4:
11th: Fighter 5/Monk 1/Master Thrower 5:
12th: Fighter 5/Monk 1/Master Thrower 5/Exotic Weaponmaster 1: Greater Two-weapon Fighting
13th: Fighter 5/Monk 1/Master Thrower 5/Exotic Weaponmaster 1/Rogue 1:
14th: Fighter 5/Monk 1/Master Thrower 5/Exotic Weaponmaster 1/Rogue 2:
15th: Fighter 5/Monk 1/Master Thrower 5/Exotic Weaponmaster 1/Rogue 3: Improved Rapid Shot
16th: Fighter 5/Monk 1/Master Thrower 5/Exotic Weaponmaster 1/Rogue 4:
17th: Fighter 5/Monk 1/Master Thrower 5/Exotic Weaponmaster 1/Rogue 5:
18th: Fighter 5/Monk 1/Master Thrower 5/Exotic Weaponmaster 1/Rogue 6: Improved Natural Armor (or free feat for other races)
19th: Fighter 6/Monk 1/Master Thrower 5/Exotic Weaponmaster 1/Rogue 6: Improved Natural Armor (or free feat for other races)
20th: Fighter 6/Monk 1/Master Thrower 5/Exotic Weaponmaster 1/Rogue 6:


For the thrown weapon tricks I would pick palm throw first, then ranged trip, and weak spot last. Also, for the Exotic weaponmaster class, take the TWF one to lessen these penalties further.

At lvl 20, and assuming that you use the shuriken of death with each volley, the following is true: 4 base, plus 3 for FOB, Speed, and Rapid Shot, plus 3 for TWF. That makes 10 attacks, multiplied by two for palm toss, so 20 total thrown. Each of these is a touch attack that (hopefully) ignores Dex modifier, so that unless your opponent has some magic protection they are pretty much screwed in that department. 1+4d6 each (20+40d6 dmg total if all hit) at the following modifiers(last shuriken thrown is SoD, rest are normal): +22/+22/+22/+22/+22/+18/+17/+13/+12/+8

Also, his armor class will be fairly high despite not wearing armor. Without any magic items, at lvl 20, his armor class will be 25 (+5 natural, +6 Dex, +3 Wis, +1 Size)

Final Note: I thought about sliding in Ascetic Rogue after I saw the description in CV. My heart sank though after I actually read the text. In the description it says that the levels stack for SA dmg, but in the text it says they stack for UA dmg. Quite a big error if you ask me....

Opinions, errors, comments, and suggestions are all welcome. Thanks for reading!

~Cycada

Edit: Removed EWP:shuriken but I'm not quite sure what to replace it with, and fixed the damage calculations. Still decent, but not as good as I had hoped. :D Also, no such luck with the Ascetic Rogue feat, still no errata on it. Lastly, changed the MT trick to Ranged Trip as suggested.
#2

wwad_dup

Jun 01, 2008 22:21:44
You'll have an XP penalty from 4th level on.
#3

cycada

Jun 01, 2008 22:25:34
Assumed: My DM has removed the XP penalty for multiclassing, much to my pleasure.

No offense, but please read all of what I wrote. :D
#4

cycada

Jun 02, 2008 12:20:03
Hehe, this board moves fairly fast...

I would still like to know if this would work, and if there is any improvements to be made.
#5

gilfalas_elaandrin

Jun 02, 2008 13:02:16
One error is that monks are proficient with Shuriken by virtue of their class. You do not need to take EWP: Shuriken so I suggest moving quick draw up to here instead.

Since you have the proficiency from your class, I beleive it works just like having the proficiency for Exotic Weapons Master. Since dwarves can use their Dwarven Waraxe prof to qualify I don't see why monks could not, especially as Dwarves are supposed to treat dwarven waraxes as MARTIAL weapons.

As for the Aesthetic Rogue, double check the errata. It may very well stack SA.

Also, Manyshot is only usable with a bow, as the feat specifies firing arrows, so that will not be usable with this build for shurikens (would still be valid if you busted out a bow though).
#6

reis

Jun 02, 2008 13:11:20
what are you going to do against opponents who have high damage reduction pierced only by adamantine, silver, cold iron or aligned weapons? What about opponents immune to critical hits and precision based damage?

you might be able to overcome golem and undead's immunity with UMD and scrolls of golem/grave strike but that uses actions which isn't good for you either
#7

hsien

Jun 02, 2008 14:39:47
Some notes:

Shuriken are considered ammo, so enchantents are for groups of 50
They are also destroyed like ammo

Since you included Quick Draw, which is a bonus feat for MT1, you may want to also list Imp Critical, bonus for MT5

Trick issue:
Sneaky shot, iirc, would only allow for 1 attack
Besides, you're alreay going against Touch AC, Dex is a minor issue

Palm Throw is a volley, similar to manyshot, and per errata SA dice could only occur once per attack roll, not per shuriken.

Prefer:
Ranged Trip, great for battlefield control as you do damage first
Deadly precision, increase the crit multiplier

Golems:
Scarab of Golembane will allow you to bypass their DR w/o sacrificing actions
#8

cycada

Jun 02, 2008 17:48:53
Also, Manyshot is only usable with a bow, as the feat specifies firing arrows, so that will not be usable with this build for shurikens (would still be valid if you busted out a bow though).

Manyshot is a requirement to get Improved Rapid Shot, I didn't list it in the +attacks for this reason. Thanks for your help otherwise.

Also, Criticals with a shuriken to do...what exactly? 1 extra damage per critical hit isn't exactly useful if you ask me. :D