Help with some builds for a Multi Character Game - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Help with some builds for a Multi Character Game

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
harmonicdiscord
May 15, 2009 21:05:07 My D&D group decided to run a game where we all took turns being a DM and we had 3 characters made up to run on different adventures. Each character levels when the other one does.

We can use any book but psionics, LA buyoff is allowed, we may be able to take 2 flaws (this one is still up for vote) and the best part of all is 45 POINT BUY!!! Woot!

So I have a few ideas floating around my head and wanted to ask all your opinions.

My first idea is a Lesser Aasimar bard 1/ Paladin 17 or 18 / Monk 1 or 2

Now I was wondering if the monk level(s) were worth it. It makes the character even more MAD by needing a higher Wisdom for AC and I don't know if the unarmed attacks will be better than a 2 handed power attacker. Any thoughts?

My other ideas are more in the concept phase:

Strongheart Halfling Druid 17 / Master of Many Forms 3
Petal Sorcerer or Warlock with no ideas about prestige classes
Whisper Gnome Ninja or Rogue stealthy build with a leaning towards master thrower with shurikens.

I somewhat need the three characters to fill one of three roles in the party. One needs to be a warrior type, one a caster type and one a support character.

Enjoy!
#2
gorfnad_the_shiznit
May 16, 2009 0:20:47 Lets see

Lesser Aasimar Bard 4/ Monk 2/ Paladin 14
Feats: Ascetic Mage, Devoted Performer, Ascetic Knight, Initiate of Milil, Superior Unarmed Strike. I'm not fully sure which order that these would go in. However you would I think end up with Unarmed Strike of a 20th level Monk, Cha to AC and Saves, Bardic Music abilities and uses per day as an 18th level bard, Smite Evil per day as a 14th level paladin with damage as a 20th level paladin. Although you could just go Divine Bard 1/ Monk 2/ Paladin 17 and take out the Ascetic Mage and go with Serenity instead for an entirely wis based character. I think you'll need a combination of Monastic Training/Knight Training for either build though.
#3
gorfnad_the_shiznit
May 16, 2009 0:40:37 For the Whisper Gnome
Rogue 3/ Swashbuckler 3/ Carmendine Cobra Strike Monk 2/ Master Thrower 2/ Invisible Blade 5/ Warblade 1/ Bloodclaw Master 4
Rogue 2/ Swashbuckler 3/ Carmendine Cobra Strike Monk 2/ Master Thrower 2/ Invisible Blade 5/ Warblade 1/ Bloodclaw Master 5
Rogue 3/ Swashbuckler 3/ Carmendine Cobra Strike Monk 2/ Master Thrower 2/ Fixed by Author, Invisible Blade 10
Rogue 3/ Swashbuckler 3/Carmendine Cobra Strike Monk 2/ Invisible Blade 5/ Master Thrower 2/ Duelist 5 (Int to AC three times)
Rogue 3/ Swashbuckler 3/ Fighter 4/Invisible Blade 5/ Master Thrower 5 (Int to AC only once)
All of these get Int to AC at least twice, sneak attack, and can throw 16 daggers a round with palm throw. With Rogue 3 trade trap sense for the substitution ability from dungeonscape that allows you to sneak attack for half against things normally immune to it. A Gauntlet of Infinite Blades is definitely a must have for these builds.
#4
gorfnad_the_shiznit
May 16, 2009 0:42:43 Strongheart Halfling Druid 5/ Planar Shepard 10/ X full divine casting class 5 or more druid. That's really all I have to say about that one since Druids are not my specialty.
#5
Weezel
May 16, 2009 1:08:40
Strongheart Halfling Druid 5/ Planar Shepard 10/ X full divine casting class 5 or more druid. That's really all I have to say about that one since Druids are not my specialty.

I can strongly recommend using Ghostwise Halfling for a druidic race, because honestly it just sucks being unable to communicate while wildshaped when you will be wildshaped all day long. If you have a generous DM the Speak Without Sound ability also might let you cast spells without speaking the verbal componants out loud ;)
#6
harmonicdiscord
May 16, 2009 11:54:50
I think you'll need a combination of Monastic Training/Knight Training for either build though.

I believe Ascetic Mage, Devoted Performer and Ascetic Knight takes care of the multiclassing for Paladin and Monk does it not?

Also does anyone have any ideas on the Petal character? What about combining two ideas and making a Petal Ninja/Rogue If the petal idea doesn't work I'll probably throw the shadow template on the Whisper Gnome and use the druid and paladin as my other two characters.
#7
harmonicdiscord
May 16, 2009 12:05:08
For the Whisper Gnome
Rogue 3/ Swashbuckler 3/ Carmendine Cobra Strike Monk 2/ Master Thrower 2/ Invisible Blade 5/ Warblade 1/ Bloodclaw Master 4
Rogue 2/ Swashbuckler 3/ Carmendine Cobra Strike Monk 2/ Master Thrower 2/ Invisible Blade 5/ Warblade 1/ Bloodclaw Master 5
Rogue 3/ Swashbuckler 3/ Carmendine Cobra Strike Monk 2/ Master Thrower 2/ Fixed by Author, Invisible Blade 10
Rogue 3/ Swashbuckler 3/Carmendine Cobra Strike Monk 2/ Invisible Blade 5/ Master Thrower 2/ Duelist 5 (Int to AC three times)
Rogue 3/ Swashbuckler 3/ Fighter 4/Invisible Blade 5/ Master Thrower 5 (Int to AC only once)
All of these get Int to AC at least twice, sneak attack, and can throw 16 daggers a round with palm throw. With Rogue 3 trade trap sense for the substitution ability from dungeonscape that allows you to sneak attack for half against things normally immune to it. A Gauntlet of Infinite Blades is definitely a must have for these builds.

Also why would you want Cobra Strike Monk? Just for the Dodge and Mobility? I don't see what the use for Spring Attack is.
#8
harmonicdiscord
May 16, 2009 14:57:58 Also would Versatile Spellcaster allow me to qualify for ascetic mage? I think I read that somewhere but I can't seem to find it.
#9
gorfnad_the_shiznit
May 16, 2009 15:01:08
Also why would you want Cobra Strike Monk? Just for the Dodge and Mobility? I don't see what the use for Spring Attack is.

Prereqs for duelist if you go that route. Any of the UA monk substitutions could work as well (Passive Way Monk + Trip Shot from Master Thrower comes to mind). Stunning Fist and Combat Reflexes are okay as well (especially combat reflexes), it's just stunning fist really doesn't do much at higher levels because of the DC and since this is a dagger based build it really wouldn't have much impact. Also if you're doing rogue and monk like this then you can have evasion from one of them, spell reflection from the other, and you get improved evasion with master thrower.
#10
gorfnad_the_shiznit
May 16, 2009 15:17:25
Also does anyone have any ideas on the Petal character? What about combining two ideas and making a Petal Ninja/Rogue

A petal rogue could work, ninja not so much. However Petals make awesome Warlock and Bards. Warlock 3/ Bard 7/ Sublime Chord 2/ Eldritch Theurge 8 would be a semi decent build for a petal. A more combat oriented one would be Bard 6/ Crusader 2/ Jade Phoenix Mage 2/ Sublime Chord 2/ Jade Phoenix Mage 8. For a Rogue build something like Rogue 3/ Warlock 7/ Telfammar Shadowlord 4/ Hellfire Warlock 3/ Uncanny Trickster 3 for a shadowpouncing petal. Rogue 3/ Beguiler 6/ Unseen Seer 1/ Beguiler 1/ Unseen Seer 9 can also be interesting since it brings a lot of sneak attack damage to the table with Hunters Eye. Maybe even some mix of Rogue/ Swordsage or Ninja Swordsage might work as well.
#11
harmonicdiscord
May 16, 2009 20:58:44 How would you build out the Warlock, Bard Petal?
#12
gorfnad_the_shiznit
May 16, 2009 22:42:41
How would you build out the Warlock, Bard Petal?

1. Bard (for more skill points) - Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Flyby Attack, Flaw: Slow, Flaw: Love of Nature
2. Warlock
3. Warlock - Melodic Casting
4. Warlock
5. Bard
6. Bard - Versatile Spellcaster
7. Bard
8. Bard
9. Bard - Song of the Heart
10. Bard
11. Sublime Chord
12. Sublime Chord - Knowledge Devotion
13. Eldritch Theurge
14. Eldritch Theurge
15. Eldritch Theurge - Words of Creation
16. Eldritch Theurge
17. Eldritch Theurge
18. Eldritch Theurge - Improved Precise Shot
19. Eldritch Theurge
20. Eldritch Theurge

Otherwise a shadow pouncing petal might be amuzing
1. Rogue- Dodge, Mobility, Craven
2. Rogue
3. Warlock Blind fight
4. Warlock
5. Warlock
6. Warlock Spring Attack
7. Warlock
8. Warlock - Take the Flee the Scene invocation
9. Rogue - Quicken: Flee the Scene (Trade Trap Sense for Penetrating Strike)
10. Telflammar Shadowlord
11. Telflammar Shadowlord
12. Telflammar Shadowlord - Mortal Bane
13. Telflammar Shadowlord
14. Telfammar Shadowlord
15. Telfammar Shadowlord - Spell Hand
16. Arcane Trickster
17. Arcane Trickster
18. Arcane Trickster - Darkstalker
19. Arcane Trickster
20. Arcane Trickster

Pretty much once you get to level 13 with this build you can do whatever after that mostly though something sneaky and stabby.

1. Swordsage - Dodge, Mobility, Blind Fight
2. Warlock
3. Warlock - Shadowblade
4. Warlock
5. Warlock
6. Warlock - Spring Attack
7. Warlock
8. Swordsage
9. Telflammar - Shadowlord Quicken: Flee the Scene
10. Telflammar Shadowlord
11. Telflammar Shadowlord
12. Telflammar Shadowlord - Adaptive Style
13. JPM
14. JPM
15. JPM - Martial Study Shadow Stride
16. JPM
17. JPM
18. JPM - Craven or Gloom Razor
19. JPM
20. JPM
#13
harmonicdiscord
May 19, 2009 12:37:20
1. Bard (for more skill points) - Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Flyby Attack, Flaw: Slow, Flaw: Love of Nature

What's the reason for Flyby Attack?
#14
gorfnad_the_shiznit
May 19, 2009 16:12:54
What's the reason for Flyby Attack?

For any character that can fly it can be a very useful feat and you meet the prereqs at level 1 just by being a petal.
Taken from the Warlock Information Compilation
Flyby Attack: Your invocations and blast takes a standard action to activate, and thus Spring Attack, Shot on the Run, and Ride by Attack won't work with them. Flyby Attack allows you to make a standard action as part of a flying move action, allowing every invocation, blast, and any other standard action, and has no other feat prerequisites. You need to pick up the Fell Flight invocation, or have a flight speed by virtue of race or template (Avorial, Dragonborn, etc).
NOTE: Some DM's won't allow you to take this feat because it isn't in the Player's Hanbook, but the Monster Manual is a core book: ask the DM if they'd allow a high level Wizard to take Craft Construct in return. They'll then counter with "you don't have a fly speed all the time" to which you reply "its 24/7!!" and then throw some Cheetos and cans of soda at him. Then find another group. I'd rate this feat higher than Precise Shot even, it's the best you can get. *****+

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 harmonicdiscord May 15, 2009 21:05:07	My D&D group decided to run a game where we all took turns being a DM and we had 3 characters made up to run on different adventures. Each character levels when the other one does. We can use any book but psionics, LA buyoff is allowed, we may be able to take 2 flaws (this one is still up for vote) and the best part of all is 45 POINT BUY!!! Woot! So I have a few ideas floating around my head and wanted to ask all your opinions. My first idea is a Lesser Aasimar bard 1/ Paladin 17 or 18 / Monk 1 or 2 Now I was wondering if the monk level(s) were worth it. It makes the character even more MAD by needing a higher Wisdom for AC and I don't know if the unarmed attacks will be better than a 2 handed power attacker. Any thoughts? My other ideas are more in the concept phase: Strongheart Halfling Druid 17 / Master of Many Forms 3 Petal Sorcerer or Warlock with no ideas about prestige classes Whisper Gnome Ninja or Rogue stealthy build with a leaning towards master thrower with shurikens. I somewhat need the three characters to fill one of three roles in the party. One needs to be a warrior type, one a caster type and one a support character. Enjoy!
#2 gorfnad_the_shiznit May 16, 2009 0:20:47	Lets see Lesser Aasimar Bard 4/ Monk 2/ Paladin 14 Feats: Ascetic Mage, Devoted Performer, Ascetic Knight, Initiate of Milil, Superior Unarmed Strike. I'm not fully sure which order that these would go in. However you would I think end up with Unarmed Strike of a 20th level Monk, Cha to AC and Saves, Bardic Music abilities and uses per day as an 18th level bard, Smite Evil per day as a 14th level paladin with damage as a 20th level paladin. Although you could just go Divine Bard 1/ Monk 2/ Paladin 17 and take out the Ascetic Mage and go with Serenity instead for an entirely wis based character. I think you'll need a combination of Monastic Training/Knight Training for either build though.
#3 gorfnad_the_shiznit May 16, 2009 0:40:37	For the Whisper Gnome Rogue 3/ Swashbuckler 3/ Carmendine Cobra Strike Monk 2/ Master Thrower 2/ Invisible Blade 5/ Warblade 1/ Bloodclaw Master 4 Rogue 2/ Swashbuckler 3/ Carmendine Cobra Strike Monk 2/ Master Thrower 2/ Invisible Blade 5/ Warblade 1/ Bloodclaw Master 5 Rogue 3/ Swashbuckler 3/ Carmendine Cobra Strike Monk 2/ Master Thrower 2/ Fixed by Author, Invisible Blade 10 Rogue 3/ Swashbuckler 3/Carmendine Cobra Strike Monk 2/ Invisible Blade 5/ Master Thrower 2/ Duelist 5 (Int to AC three times) Rogue 3/ Swashbuckler 3/ Fighter 4/Invisible Blade 5/ Master Thrower 5 (Int to AC only once) All of these get Int to AC at least twice, sneak attack, and can throw 16 daggers a round with palm throw. With Rogue 3 trade trap sense for the substitution ability from dungeonscape that allows you to sneak attack for half against things normally immune to it. A Gauntlet of Infinite Blades is definitely a must have for these builds.
#4 gorfnad_the_shiznit May 16, 2009 0:42:43	Strongheart Halfling Druid 5/ Planar Shepard 10/ X full divine casting class 5 or more druid. That's really all I have to say about that one since Druids are not my specialty.
#5 Weezel May 16, 2009 1:08:40	Strongheart Halfling Druid 5/ Planar Shepard 10/ X full divine casting class 5 or more druid. That's really all I have to say about that one since Druids are not my specialty. I can strongly recommend using Ghostwise Halfling for a druidic race, because honestly it just sucks being unable to communicate while wildshaped when you will be wildshaped all day long. If you have a generous DM the Speak Without Sound ability also might let you cast spells without speaking the verbal componants out loud ;)
#6 harmonicdiscord May 16, 2009 11:54:50	I think you'll need a combination of Monastic Training/Knight Training for either build though. I believe Ascetic Mage, Devoted Performer and Ascetic Knight takes care of the multiclassing for Paladin and Monk does it not? Also does anyone have any ideas on the Petal character? What about combining two ideas and making a Petal Ninja/Rogue If the petal idea doesn't work I'll probably throw the shadow template on the Whisper Gnome and use the druid and paladin as my other two characters.
#7 harmonicdiscord May 16, 2009 12:05:08	For the Whisper Gnome Rogue 3/ Swashbuckler 3/ Carmendine Cobra Strike Monk 2/ Master Thrower 2/ Invisible Blade 5/ Warblade 1/ Bloodclaw Master 4 Rogue 2/ Swashbuckler 3/ Carmendine Cobra Strike Monk 2/ Master Thrower 2/ Invisible Blade 5/ Warblade 1/ Bloodclaw Master 5 Rogue 3/ Swashbuckler 3/ Carmendine Cobra Strike Monk 2/ Master Thrower 2/ Fixed by Author, Invisible Blade 10 Rogue 3/ Swashbuckler 3/Carmendine Cobra Strike Monk 2/ Invisible Blade 5/ Master Thrower 2/ Duelist 5 (Int to AC three times) Rogue 3/ Swashbuckler 3/ Fighter 4/Invisible Blade 5/ Master Thrower 5 (Int to AC only once) All of these get Int to AC at least twice, sneak attack, and can throw 16 daggers a round with palm throw. With Rogue 3 trade trap sense for the substitution ability from dungeonscape that allows you to sneak attack for half against things normally immune to it. A Gauntlet of Infinite Blades is definitely a must have for these builds. Also why would you want Cobra Strike Monk? Just for the Dodge and Mobility? I don't see what the use for Spring Attack is.
#8 harmonicdiscord May 16, 2009 14:57:58	Also would Versatile Spellcaster allow me to qualify for ascetic mage? I think I read that somewhere but I can't seem to find it.
#9 gorfnad_the_shiznit May 16, 2009 15:01:08	Also why would you want Cobra Strike Monk? Just for the Dodge and Mobility? I don't see what the use for Spring Attack is. Prereqs for duelist if you go that route. Any of the UA monk substitutions could work as well (Passive Way Monk + Trip Shot from Master Thrower comes to mind). Stunning Fist and Combat Reflexes are okay as well (especially combat reflexes), it's just stunning fist really doesn't do much at higher levels because of the DC and since this is a dagger based build it really wouldn't have much impact. Also if you're doing rogue and monk like this then you can have evasion from one of them, spell reflection from the other, and you get improved evasion with master thrower.
#10 gorfnad_the_shiznit May 16, 2009 15:17:25	Also does anyone have any ideas on the Petal character? What about combining two ideas and making a Petal Ninja/Rogue A petal rogue could work, ninja not so much. However Petals make awesome Warlock and Bards. Warlock 3/ Bard 7/ Sublime Chord 2/ Eldritch Theurge 8 would be a semi decent build for a petal. A more combat oriented one would be Bard 6/ Crusader 2/ Jade Phoenix Mage 2/ Sublime Chord 2/ Jade Phoenix Mage 8. For a Rogue build something like Rogue 3/ Warlock 7/ Telfammar Shadowlord 4/ Hellfire Warlock 3/ Uncanny Trickster 3 for a shadowpouncing petal. Rogue 3/ Beguiler 6/ Unseen Seer 1/ Beguiler 1/ Unseen Seer 9 can also be interesting since it brings a lot of sneak attack damage to the table with Hunters Eye. Maybe even some mix of Rogue/ Swordsage or Ninja Swordsage might work as well.
#11 harmonicdiscord May 16, 2009 20:58:44	How would you build out the Warlock, Bard Petal?
#12 gorfnad_the_shiznit May 16, 2009 22:42:41	How would you build out the Warlock, Bard Petal? 1. Bard (for more skill points) - Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Flyby Attack, Flaw: Slow, Flaw: Love of Nature 2. Warlock 3. Warlock - Melodic Casting 4. Warlock 5. Bard 6. Bard - Versatile Spellcaster 7. Bard 8. Bard 9. Bard - Song of the Heart 10. Bard 11. Sublime Chord 12. Sublime Chord - Knowledge Devotion 13. Eldritch Theurge 14. Eldritch Theurge 15. Eldritch Theurge - Words of Creation 16. Eldritch Theurge 17. Eldritch Theurge 18. Eldritch Theurge - Improved Precise Shot 19. Eldritch Theurge 20. Eldritch Theurge Otherwise a shadow pouncing petal might be amuzing 1. Rogue- Dodge, Mobility, Craven 2. Rogue 3. Warlock Blind fight 4. Warlock 5. Warlock 6. Warlock Spring Attack 7. Warlock 8. Warlock - Take the Flee the Scene invocation 9. Rogue - Quicken: Flee the Scene (Trade Trap Sense for Penetrating Strike) 10. Telflammar Shadowlord 11. Telflammar Shadowlord 12. Telflammar Shadowlord - Mortal Bane 13. Telflammar Shadowlord 14. Telfammar Shadowlord 15. Telfammar Shadowlord - Spell Hand 16. Arcane Trickster 17. Arcane Trickster 18. Arcane Trickster - Darkstalker 19. Arcane Trickster 20. Arcane Trickster Pretty much once you get to level 13 with this build you can do whatever after that mostly though something sneaky and stabby. 1. Swordsage - Dodge, Mobility, Blind Fight 2. Warlock 3. Warlock - Shadowblade 4. Warlock 5. Warlock 6. Warlock - Spring Attack 7. Warlock 8. Swordsage 9. Telflammar - Shadowlord Quicken: Flee the Scene 10. Telflammar Shadowlord 11. Telflammar Shadowlord 12. Telflammar Shadowlord - Adaptive Style 13. JPM 14. JPM 15. JPM - Martial Study Shadow Stride 16. JPM 17. JPM 18. JPM - Craven or Gloom Razor 19. JPM 20. JPM
#13 harmonicdiscord May 19, 2009 12:37:20	1. Bard (for more skill points) - Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Flyby Attack, Flaw: Slow, Flaw: Love of Nature What's the reason for Flyby Attack?
#14 gorfnad_the_shiznit May 19, 2009 16:12:54	What's the reason for Flyby Attack? For any character that can fly it can be a very useful feat and you meet the prereqs at level 1 just by being a petal. Taken from the Warlock Information Compilation Flyby Attack: Your invocations and blast takes a standard action to activate, and thus Spring Attack, Shot on the Run, and Ride by Attack won't work with them. Flyby Attack allows you to make a standard action as part of a flying move action, allowing every invocation, blast, and any other standard action, and has no other feat prerequisites. You need to pick up the Fell Flight invocation, or have a flight speed by virtue of race or template (Avorial, Dragonborn, etc). NOTE: Some DM's won't allow you to take this feat because it isn't in the Player's Hanbook, but the Monster Manual is a core book: ask the DM if they'd allow a high level Wizard to take Craft Construct in return. They'll then counter with "you don't have a fly speed all the time" to which you reply "its 24/7!!" and then throw some Cheetos and cans of soda at him. Then find another group. I'd rate this feat higher than Precise Shot even, it's the best you can get. *****+