How to turn fire into sonic dmg - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

How to turn fire into sonic dmg

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
jaxtor
Jun 03, 2009 10:52:00 Ok so I came up with a good idea that I want to play, Rogue 14 / Wizard 5 / Incantatrix 9 gestalt build. Using the feat double wand wielder and the Incantatrix's ability to apply meta magic feats to wands. Now the only thing is I want to use scorching ray so I can get my sneak attack dmg on with scorching ray. But I'm looking for a meta magic feat so I can turn the fire dmg into sonic. Because at this lvl many things have fire resistance or immunity.
#2
gilfalas_elaandrin
Jun 03, 2009 11:18:28 Check CA for 'Energy Substitution' and the DMG for PrC Archmage.

Archmage levels are the better of the two. Neither one allows you to alter wands though. I don't know of any feat that allows you to alter the energy from a wand.

See if your DM will let you research Sonic Ray instead of Scorching Ray and just make wands of that. Should be simple to swap one energy for another and have the rest of the spell be basically identical.
#3
Senevri
Jun 03, 2009 11:24:41
Archmage levels are the better of the two. Neither one allows you to alter wands though. I don't know of any feat that allows you to alter the energy from a wand.

Metamagic Spell Trigger.
#4
risner
Jun 03, 2009 12:25:59
Check CA for 'Energy Substitution' and the DMG for PrC Archmage.

Energy Sub can't sub to Sonic.
#5
xakypshalorn
Jun 03, 2009 12:37:19 Also, unless your DM makes special consideration for you, your wasting your time using scorching ray for sneak attacks. It takes a standard action to fire one (two with double wand wielder) to fire up to 4 rays, but only one of them counts for sneak attack according to the rules.

(I would debate with the DM that taking Greater Manyshot as a feat should allow the same kind of independent precision for ray volleys it allows for the manyshot standard action bowshot.)
#6
muertog
Jun 03, 2009 13:08:58 You could also go the easy route of the MMfeat from Sandstorm that turns half the fire damage into unresistable fire damage.

Sonic damage tends to reduce the damage one die size down, so even researching a "sonic ray" spell would result in reduced damage dealt.
#7
Senevri
Jun 03, 2009 14:46:00 Sonic Ray is a fort-save 3rd(IIRC) level spell that caps at 10d8 :P

That being said, there are non-SA ways of adding damage to it, Lyric Thaum comes to mind immediatel.y
#8
Treantmonklvl20
Jun 03, 2009 15:49:21 As mentioned - Energy Sub does not allow a change to Sonic since 3.5 (it was allowed in 3.0 and everyone took it)

However, the Archmage energy sub ability still allows it.

I know of no way to apply the Archmage ability to wands though.

I would recommend the following:

1) Go Spellwarp Sniper (not a PrC I recommend often I admit) - it will allow you to convert spells such as Sonic Orbs and Shout spells into ray spells.

2) Use split ray to get multiple castings/round. You will find this to be more effective and easier to get than dual wand wielder (which you get later)

3) (If you are set on using wands - otherwise stop at step 2) Get a metamagic wand grip to split ray your wands

4) Once you get dual wand wielder, then get 2 metamagic wand grips and fire 4 independant rays from wands per round. Add SwSn sudden raystrike to your sneak attack on all 4 attacks - much d6 damage die rolling ensues. However, expect some BIG gold costs to maintain this.

However, if you want fun from Dual Wand Wielder earlier on, I recommend foregoing ray spells entirely. Go Rogue/Cleric, pick up a couple wands of cause light wounds, flank and SA with melee touch attacks. Cause LW wands are dirt cheap - and immunity is rare (pick up some cure wands for undead). If you want REALLY cheap wands - cause minor wounds wands ultimately work as well.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 jaxtor Jun 03, 2009 10:52:00	Ok so I came up with a good idea that I want to play, Rogue 14 / Wizard 5 / Incantatrix 9 gestalt build. Using the feat double wand wielder and the Incantatrix's ability to apply meta magic feats to wands. Now the only thing is I want to use scorching ray so I can get my sneak attack dmg on with scorching ray. But I'm looking for a meta magic feat so I can turn the fire dmg into sonic. Because at this lvl many things have fire resistance or immunity.
#2 gilfalas_elaandrin Jun 03, 2009 11:18:28	Check CA for 'Energy Substitution' and the DMG for PrC Archmage. Archmage levels are the better of the two. Neither one allows you to alter wands though. I don't know of any feat that allows you to alter the energy from a wand. See if your DM will let you research Sonic Ray instead of Scorching Ray and just make wands of that. Should be simple to swap one energy for another and have the rest of the spell be basically identical.
#3 Senevri Jun 03, 2009 11:24:41	Archmage levels are the better of the two. Neither one allows you to alter wands though. I don't know of any feat that allows you to alter the energy from a wand. Metamagic Spell Trigger.
#4 risner Jun 03, 2009 12:25:59	Check CA for 'Energy Substitution' and the DMG for PrC Archmage. Energy Sub can't sub to Sonic.
#5 xakypshalorn Jun 03, 2009 12:37:19	Also, unless your DM makes special consideration for you, your wasting your time using scorching ray for sneak attacks. It takes a standard action to fire one (two with double wand wielder) to fire up to 4 rays, but only one of them counts for sneak attack according to the rules. (I would debate with the DM that taking Greater Manyshot as a feat should allow the same kind of independent precision for ray volleys it allows for the manyshot standard action bowshot.)
#6 muertog Jun 03, 2009 13:08:58	You could also go the easy route of the MMfeat from Sandstorm that turns half the fire damage into unresistable fire damage. Sonic damage tends to reduce the damage one die size down, so even researching a "sonic ray" spell would result in reduced damage dealt.
#7 Senevri Jun 03, 2009 14:46:00	Sonic Ray is a fort-save 3rd(IIRC) level spell that caps at 10d8 :P That being said, there are non-SA ways of adding damage to it, Lyric Thaum comes to mind immediatel.y
#8 Treantmonklvl20 Jun 03, 2009 15:49:21	As mentioned - Energy Sub does not allow a change to Sonic since 3.5 (it was allowed in 3.0 and everyone took it) However, the Archmage energy sub ability still allows it. I know of no way to apply the Archmage ability to wands though. I would recommend the following: 1) Go Spellwarp Sniper (not a PrC I recommend often I admit) - it will allow you to convert spells such as Sonic Orbs and Shout spells into ray spells. 2) Use split ray to get multiple castings/round. You will find this to be more effective and easier to get than dual wand wielder (which you get later) 3) (If you are set on using wands - otherwise stop at step 2) Get a metamagic wand grip to split ray your wands 4) Once you get dual wand wielder, then get 2 metamagic wand grips and fire 4 independant rays from wands per round. Add SwSn sudden raystrike to your sneak attack on all 4 attacks - much d6 damage die rolling ensues. However, expect some BIG gold costs to maintain this. However, if you want fun from Dual Wand Wielder earlier on, I recommend foregoing ray spells entirely. Go Rogue/Cleric, pick up a couple wands of cause light wounds, flank and SA with melee touch attacks. Cause LW wands are dirt cheap - and immunity is rare (pick up some cure wands for undead). If you want REALLY cheap wands - cause minor wounds wands ultimately work as well.