I want to make a Spellthief - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

I want to make a Spellthief

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
karanth
May 08, 2008 5:08:23 Ok, I am rolling a level 10 character into a party containing the following:

A Sorc10, doing the blaster thing.

A Rogue8/Fighter2, mainly in it for the huge sneak attacks and doing the trapfinding.

A Wiz10 specializing in battlefield control and buffs, light on the debuffs though.

A Cleric9/(no idea what)1, not really sure about this character. I think he does melee, though.

I've looked at a few classes, and what I'd like to make is a Spellthief. They always seemed interesting, and I think it could really adds something here.

After talking to the DM, I have a few limits on what I can use, though:

All Core books.
Anything from Complete Adventurer.
Anything from Player Handbook II.

Anything else will be approved/disallowed on a case-by-case basis.
#2
jaronk
May 08, 2008 5:12:23 Be aware that the class is relatively weak, and that the Beguiler basically does this concept better.

That said, see if you can get into the Shadowcraft Mage PrC. Traditionally this class is very overpowered using an entry of Wizard, Cleric, or Beguiler, but off Spelltheif it's actually quite reasonable, and the 40% concealment is really useful.

JaronK
#3
karanth
May 08, 2008 6:08:27 "Relatively weak" is alright, the flavor of the class is just one reason I went for it over Beguiler.

Also, where is the Shadowcraft Mage PrC? I'm trying to recall where it is.

EDIT: By flavor, I mean the stealing spells bit. That rubs me in all the right ways, even if it isn't so useful.
#4
rebel7284
May 08, 2008 7:09:32 Wiz 4, Spellthief 1, Unseen Seer 2, Arcane Trickster 10, X3

shadowcraft mage is in races of stone.
#5
phaxi
May 08, 2008 7:16:34 Any chance you'd get your hands on complete scoundrel? If so, there's the master spellthief feat there (which brings a whole new meaning to spellthieves).
#6
vicen_korel
May 08, 2008 10:04:29 This seems like it should be a good mix.

Master Spellthief feat, spellthief 9/ chameleon 10

Kind of red mage-ish.
#7
zendu
May 08, 2008 12:00:47 Master Spellthief is great, but it changes the flavor entierly. If you are going to take it, ask your DM if he thinks the spell steal abilities scale with it. RAW its a little fuzzy.

I'd look at factorum 3, it gives you some nice int synergy and a spell of your own to cast.
#8
deathlessjuan
May 08, 2008 13:08:25 Duskblade + Spellthief + Chameleon

And take Master Spellthief. Effective from 1st level to 20th level. Saves would be a little low due to the Chameleon having no good saves but a cloak of resistance would make up for that (or dip Paladin or similar class for CHA to saves)

With your 4d6, drop lowest and rerolling 1's, you should have no trouble dealing with the MAD (Multiple Ability Dependant) nature of the build.
#9
karanth
May 08, 2008 15:20:30 I do have Complete Scoundrel, and as long as I avoid using Master Spellthief to do things like get a CL 30 at tenth level, I should be fine, considering other feats that affect sneak attacks and class levels (The one that lets Paladins and Rogues multiclass and add stuff together comes to mind, can't think of the name right now.)

Chameleon on Spellthief looks like it could be fun, but the interaction with Master Spellthief looks odd, and it hurt my brain thinking of how it would work once I no longer have Arcane Focus, then next day I get it...

Duskblade would easily be doable, though, and could be very interesting. I was looking at the Abjurant Champion PrC, and between all three, I think it might turn into something very interesting.

Would a Spellthief7/Abjurant Champion3 be any good? I'd have to use a feat to get the martial weapon proficiency to qualify, but I think it could do very well, with Master Spellthief and Practiced Spellcaster putting the CL up to 10, helping keep my spells from being dispelled. Three feats out of 4 (5 for human) is kind of hefty, but the results look to be worth it.

Am I off on that?
#10
jaronk
May 08, 2008 16:14:11 Note that Master Spelltheif does not raise the level of spells you can hold, so you'll still need Spelltheif 9 (or Spelltheif 6 and a major bloodline) to actually hold 9th level spells.

JaronK
#11
jameswilliamogle
May 08, 2008 17:41:21
Note that Master Spelltheif does not raise the level of spells you can hold, so you'll still need Spelltheif 9 (or Spelltheif 6 and a major bloodline) to actually hold 9th level spells.

JaronK

Or just do what I do, and spam sneak attacks on spellcasters to remove their highest level spells, forgetting about the storage.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 karanth May 08, 2008 5:08:23	Ok, I am rolling a level 10 character into a party containing the following: A Sorc10, doing the blaster thing. A Rogue8/Fighter2, mainly in it for the huge sneak attacks and doing the trapfinding. A Wiz10 specializing in battlefield control and buffs, light on the debuffs though. A Cleric9/(no idea what)1, not really sure about this character. I think he does melee, though. I've looked at a few classes, and what I'd like to make is a Spellthief. They always seemed interesting, and I think it could really adds something here. After talking to the DM, I have a few limits on what I can use, though: All Core books. Anything from Complete Adventurer. Anything from Player Handbook II. Anything else will be approved/disallowed on a case-by-case basis.
#2 jaronk May 08, 2008 5:12:23	Be aware that the class is relatively weak, and that the Beguiler basically does this concept better. That said, see if you can get into the Shadowcraft Mage PrC. Traditionally this class is very overpowered using an entry of Wizard, Cleric, or Beguiler, but off Spelltheif it's actually quite reasonable, and the 40% concealment is really useful. JaronK
#3 karanth May 08, 2008 6:08:27	"Relatively weak" is alright, the flavor of the class is just one reason I went for it over Beguiler. Also, where is the Shadowcraft Mage PrC? I'm trying to recall where it is. EDIT: By flavor, I mean the stealing spells bit. That rubs me in all the right ways, even if it isn't so useful.
#4 rebel7284 May 08, 2008 7:09:32	Wiz 4, Spellthief 1, Unseen Seer 2, Arcane Trickster 10, X3 shadowcraft mage is in races of stone.
#5 phaxi May 08, 2008 7:16:34	Any chance you'd get your hands on complete scoundrel? If so, there's the master spellthief feat there (which brings a whole new meaning to spellthieves).
#6 vicen_korel May 08, 2008 10:04:29	This seems like it should be a good mix. Master Spellthief feat, spellthief 9/ chameleon 10 Kind of red mage-ish.
#7 zendu May 08, 2008 12:00:47	Master Spellthief is great, but it changes the flavor entierly. If you are going to take it, ask your DM if he thinks the spell steal abilities scale with it. RAW its a little fuzzy. I'd look at factorum 3, it gives you some nice int synergy and a spell of your own to cast.
#8 deathlessjuan May 08, 2008 13:08:25	Duskblade + Spellthief + Chameleon And take Master Spellthief. Effective from 1st level to 20th level. Saves would be a little low due to the Chameleon having no good saves but a cloak of resistance would make up for that (or dip Paladin or similar class for CHA to saves) With your 4d6, drop lowest and rerolling 1's, you should have no trouble dealing with the MAD (Multiple Ability Dependant) nature of the build.
#9 karanth May 08, 2008 15:20:30	I do have Complete Scoundrel, and as long as I avoid using Master Spellthief to do things like get a CL 30 at tenth level, I should be fine, considering other feats that affect sneak attacks and class levels (The one that lets Paladins and Rogues multiclass and add stuff together comes to mind, can't think of the name right now.) Chameleon on Spellthief looks like it could be fun, but the interaction with Master Spellthief looks odd, and it hurt my brain thinking of how it would work once I no longer have Arcane Focus, then next day I get it... Duskblade would easily be doable, though, and could be very interesting. I was looking at the Abjurant Champion PrC, and between all three, I think it might turn into something very interesting. Would a Spellthief7/Abjurant Champion3 be any good? I'd have to use a feat to get the martial weapon proficiency to qualify, but I think it could do very well, with Master Spellthief and Practiced Spellcaster putting the CL up to 10, helping keep my spells from being dispelled. Three feats out of 4 (5 for human) is kind of hefty, but the results look to be worth it. Am I off on that?
#10 jaronk May 08, 2008 16:14:11	Note that Master Spelltheif does not raise the level of spells you can hold, so you'll still need Spelltheif 9 (or Spelltheif 6 and a major bloodline) to actually hold 9th level spells. JaronK
#11 jameswilliamogle May 08, 2008 17:41:21	Note that Master Spelltheif does not raise the level of spells you can hold, so you'll still need Spelltheif 9 (or Spelltheif 6 and a major bloodline) to actually hold 9th level spells. JaronK Or just do what I do, and spam sneak attacks on spellcasters to remove their highest level spells, forgetting about the storage.