Kobold Trapmaker - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Kobold Trapmaker

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
ghostie1337
Jul 26, 2008 17:10:50 For an arena game I wanted to make a Kobold trap maker, but I have a problem- the traps.

I can't access the arena before hand, so I need portable traps. I start at level one, so cheap traps would be best, and a backup plane is needed.

I'm leaning towards rogue for my class, so I can plant trap, hide, then attempt a sneak attack. Although, this is not important.

Character Creation-
Level 1
32 pointbuy
Max gold for your class
Any books boy BoED and BoVD
No Alignment restrictions

One person put down caltrops and covered them over with leather, then threw dirt on top, but that has no hard stats and caused some problems with search/spot DC's and such.

Any ideas for a kobold in need?
#2
cycada
Jul 26, 2008 17:25:57 Most of the "combat traps" are only accessible via Prestige classes, but besides those I would guess it would mostly be DM fiat.
#3
carnivore
Jul 26, 2008 17:36:37 as Cycada said..... Combat trapsmith is the PrC you would need to look at.... however it is not as good as it may seem

here is a link to The Trapsmith Handbook.... but it is useful:

http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=992544

you might just do this:

1) somehow get a Wand of Grease .... or be a Spell caster who can cast it or Psion who can manifest it.

2)get lots of Sneak attack damage to use(several levels of classes that give and progress Sneak attack)

3)use Grease on an Area where the enemy is standing..... they are flatfooted unless they have 5 ranks in Balance(unlikely)...

4)then use ranged attacks and do Sneak Attack damage each time as long as they are Balancing

:D
#4
ghostie1337
Jul 26, 2008 17:40:12 Looking at the DMG I could make a "free" trap-

If I lower Disable Device to 0, I can raise search to 29 with a -100 gp cost modifier.

So Cr is now -1.

Caltrops are 1gp, they deal 1 damage so +1 CR. Price is -99gp, CR is 0.

Give it a +0 attack bonus, so making it never miss is free. Cost -99, Cr 0.

So cost is 0, takes a DC 30 search check to find, and takes a DC 20 craft (trap making check).

Is the above legal? Or have I misused the rules?
#5
carnivore
Jul 26, 2008 17:44:57 Caltrops are not Traps.... they are Weapons...

Caltrops: A caltrop is a four-pronged iron spike crafted so that one prong faces up no matter how the caltrop comes to rest. You scatter caltrops on the ground in the hope that your enemies step on them or are at least forced to slow down to avoid them. One 2- pound bag of caltrops covers an area 5 feet square.

Each time a creature moves into an area covered by caltrops (or spends a round fighting while standing in such an area), it might step on one. The caltrops make an attack roll (base attack bonus +0) against the creature. For this attack, the creature’s shield, armor, and deflection bonuses do not count. If the creature is wearing shoes or other footwear, it gets a +2 armor bonus to AC. If the caltrops succeed on the attack, the creature has stepped on one. The caltrop deals 1 point of damage, and the creature’s speed is reduced by one-half because its foot is wounded. This movement penalty lasts for 24 hours, or until the creature is successfully treated with a DC 15 Heal check, or until it receives at least 1 point of magical curing. A charging or running creature must immediately stop if it steps on a caltrop. Any creature moving at half speed or slower can pick its way through a bed of caltrops with no trouble.

Caltrops may not be effective against unusual opponents.

even in the DMG ....they are not llisted as Traps

:D
#6
ghostie1337
Jul 26, 2008 17:46:18
Caltrops are not Traps.... they are Weapons...

even in the DMG ....they are not llisted as Traps

:D

I'm using it as a component of a trap, not the trap itself. For arguments sake there is a piece of cloth over it.
#7
carnivore
Jul 26, 2008 17:49:49 also if a creature .... say Dwarf with Boots and 16 dex is walking around thru a 5' square... the caltrops must beat AC 15... since his base AC = 10 +2 Boots+ 3 Dex

if the same Dwarf was a Monk wearing Shoes with an 18 Wis and 16 Dex .... then it would have to beat an AC 19

Caltrops are only useful vs low level opponents who are not wearing any shoes and have Low Dex scores

:D
#8
carnivore
Jul 26, 2008 17:52:58 notice this:

ELEMENTS OF A TRAP
All traps—mechanical or magic—have the following elements: trigger, reset, Search DC, Disable Device DC, attack bonus (or saving throw or onset delay), damage/effect, and Challenge Rating. Some traps may also include optional elements, such as poison or a bypass. These characteristics are described below.

what is the Trigger for this Trap?
What is the Reset for this Trap?
what is the Disable Device DC?

Caltrops with a cloth over them.... do not constitute a trap

:D
#9
ghostie1337
Jul 26, 2008 17:54:45
notice this:

what is the Trigger for this Trap?
What is the Reset for this Trap?
what is the Disable Device DC?

Caltrops with a cloth over them.... do not constitute a trap

:D

Trigger=Location
Reset=None
Disable Device DC=0
#10
cycada
Jul 26, 2008 17:56:55 Even if you would consider said caltrop thing a trap, it would take a minimum of one day to craft (as per the standard craft rules.) Or atleast I'm pretty sure.

Edit: A trap has to have a disable device DC of atleast 1, since otherwise it would be undestroyable.
#11
ghostie1337
Jul 26, 2008 17:58:20
also if a creature .... say Dwarf with Boots and 16 dex is walking around thru a 5' square... the caltrops must beat AC 15... since his base AC = 10 +2 Boots+ 3 Dex

if the same Dwarf was a Monk wearing Shoes with an 18 Wis and 16 Dex .... then it would have to beat an AC 19

Caltrops are only useful vs low level opponents who are not wearing any shoes and have Low Dex scores

:D

Thats why I made it an always hit trap.
#12
ghostie1337
Jul 26, 2008 17:58:59
Even if you would consider said caltrop thing a trap, it would take a minimum of one day to craft (as per the standard craft rules.) Or atleast I'm pretty sure.

Edit: A trap has to have a disable device DC of atleast 1, since otherwise it would be undestroyable.

Okay, so that brings extra cost to 1gp, not to much to worry about.
#13
cycada
Jul 26, 2008 18:02:25 Again, it would still take a day to build. And where is the never-miss trap idea coming from? I'm pretty sure that almost all traps require atleast some sort of roll.

Edit: I found it. Keep in mind if you are trying to make a never miss trap, it MUST have an onset delay. And truthfully, as a DM, I would never allow a caltrop trap to be a nevermiss trap.
#14
carnivore
Jul 26, 2008 18:02:40
Trigger=Location
Reset=None
Disable Device DC=0

there must be a reset to qualify to be a trap...... ALL elements must exist to qualify to be a trap.... it must have a Reset and Disable Device DC 1 at least

how are you making it always hit?..... its attack roll is just d20 with no modifiers

:D
#15
ghostie1337
Jul 26, 2008 18:03:38
Again, it would still take a day to build. And where is the never-miss trap idea coming from? I'm pretty sure that almost all traps require atleast some sort of roll.

Its in the DMG, +1000gp, but I'm using other things to bring down the price.
#16
cycada
Jul 26, 2008 18:10:53 As I said in my above post, if it's never miss then it must have an onset delay of atleast 1 round (which adds +3 to the CR of the trap) Even so, this trap would have NO use in an arena, since any item using a craft dc takes a minimum of 1 day to make.
#17
ghostie1337
Jul 26, 2008 18:14:00 Well then, I guess this idea is dead. Maybe I'll try something else then.
#18
carnivore
Jul 26, 2008 18:14:56 you are using the DMG incorrectly.... that table was for "COST MODIFIERS FOR MECHANICAL TRAPS".... to qualify for a Mechanical Trap.... (yours doesnt even qualify to be a trap).... it Must "Move"... in addition .... there is no DC 0 trap... it must have a Positive Number... DC 1 minimum... adding the Never Miss to a DC 1 trap costs 1000gp total ... but a Mechanical Trap has a Base cost of 1000gp Minimum anyway.... notice:
Mechanical Trap Cost
The base cost of a mechanical trap is 1,000 gp. Apply all the modifiers from Table: Cost Modifiers for Mechanical Traps for the various features you’ve added to the trap to get the modified base cost.

:D
#19
ghostie1337
Jul 26, 2008 18:20:35
you are using the DMG incorrectly.... that table was for "COST MODIFIERS FOR MECHANICAL TRAPS".... to qualify for a Mechanical Trap.... (yours doesnt even qualify to be a trap).... it Must "Move"... in addition .... there is no DC 0 trap... it must have a Positive Number... DC 1 minimum... adding the Never Miss to a DC 1 trap costs 1000gp total ... but a Mechanical Trap has a Base cost of 1000gp Minimum anyway.... notice:

:D

I really am bad at reading rules for things.
#20
carnivore
Jul 26, 2008 18:23:38 no problem :D thats what d20 Character Optimization is really good at

:D
#21
cycada
Jul 26, 2008 18:29:13 /thread

On an unrelated note: Carnivore, you need an AIM or other Instant messenger of some sort.
#22
tytalus
Jul 27, 2008 3:46:41 A quick way for a low-level kobold to make traps is the Draconic Rite of Passage [RotD]. Pick the Create Trap spell (also [RotD]).

The only problem is that these traps are not too tough, but on the other hand it only takes a standard action to lay the trap.
#23
commx
Jul 27, 2008 6:24:16
Looking at the DMG I could make a "free" trap-

If I lower Disable Device to 0, I can raise search to 29 with a -100 gp cost modifier.

So Cr is now -1.

Caltrops are 1gp, they deal 1 damage so +1 CR. Price is -99gp, CR is 0.

Give it a +0 attack bonus, so making it never miss is free. Cost -99, Cr 0.

So cost is 0, takes a DC 30 search check to find, and takes a DC 20 craft (trap making check).

Is the above legal? Or have I misused the rules?

There are two not-really-minor things you missed. Minimum CR, and Minimum Cost. The former is 1, and the latter CR*1000. So the cost for a trap can never be less than 1000Gp, or 333.33Gp if you are Crafting it yourself.
#24
ghostie1337
Jul 27, 2008 9:40:01 Actually, I just found Booby Traps in DMG II, most have Craft (Trapmaking) 20, cost 50gp and if you take a -10 on the check you can make it as a full round action.

4(INT)+4(Ranks)+2(Kobold)+3(Skill Focus)+1(Specialized Trait)+2(Masterwork Artisans Tools)=16
On a roll of a 4 or higher I can make one, and on a roll of 14 or higher I can make one as a full round action. The ritual is probably a better idea.

So either 1 minute/1 round as a full round with a penalty or I can cast a the spell Create Trap.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 ghostie1337 Jul 26, 2008 17:10:50	For an arena game I wanted to make a Kobold trap maker, but I have a problem- the traps. I can't access the arena before hand, so I need portable traps. I start at level one, so cheap traps would be best, and a backup plane is needed. I'm leaning towards rogue for my class, so I can plant trap, hide, then attempt a sneak attack. Although, this is not important. Character Creation- Level 1 32 pointbuy Max gold for your class Any books boy BoED and BoVD No Alignment restrictions One person put down caltrops and covered them over with leather, then threw dirt on top, but that has no hard stats and caused some problems with search/spot DC's and such. Any ideas for a kobold in need?
#2 cycada Jul 26, 2008 17:25:57	Most of the "combat traps" are only accessible via Prestige classes, but besides those I would guess it would mostly be DM fiat.
#3 carnivore Jul 26, 2008 17:36:37	as Cycada said..... Combat trapsmith is the PrC you would need to look at.... however it is not as good as it may seem here is a link to The Trapsmith Handbook.... but it is useful: http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=992544 you might just do this: 1) somehow get a Wand of Grease .... or be a Spell caster who can cast it or Psion who can manifest it. 2)get lots of Sneak attack damage to use(several levels of classes that give and progress Sneak attack) 3)use Grease on an Area where the enemy is standing..... they are flatfooted unless they have 5 ranks in Balance(unlikely)... 4)then use ranged attacks and do Sneak Attack damage each time as long as they are Balancing :D
#4 ghostie1337 Jul 26, 2008 17:40:12	Looking at the DMG I could make a "free" trap- If I lower Disable Device to 0, I can raise search to 29 with a -100 gp cost modifier. So Cr is now -1. Caltrops are 1gp, they deal 1 damage so +1 CR. Price is -99gp, CR is 0. Give it a +0 attack bonus, so making it never miss is free. Cost -99, Cr 0. So cost is 0, takes a DC 30 search check to find, and takes a DC 20 craft (trap making check). Is the above legal? Or have I misused the rules?
#5 carnivore Jul 26, 2008 17:44:57	Caltrops are not Traps.... they are Weapons... Caltrops: A caltrop is a four-pronged iron spike crafted so that one prong faces up no matter how the caltrop comes to rest. You scatter caltrops on the ground in the hope that your enemies step on them or are at least forced to slow down to avoid them. One 2- pound bag of caltrops covers an area 5 feet square. Each time a creature moves into an area covered by caltrops (or spends a round fighting while standing in such an area), it might step on one. The caltrops make an attack roll (base attack bonus +0) against the creature. For this attack, the creature’s shield, armor, and deflection bonuses do not count. If the creature is wearing shoes or other footwear, it gets a +2 armor bonus to AC. If the caltrops succeed on the attack, the creature has stepped on one. The caltrop deals 1 point of damage, and the creature’s speed is reduced by one-half because its foot is wounded. This movement penalty lasts for 24 hours, or until the creature is successfully treated with a DC 15 Heal check, or until it receives at least 1 point of magical curing. A charging or running creature must immediately stop if it steps on a caltrop. Any creature moving at half speed or slower can pick its way through a bed of caltrops with no trouble. Caltrops may not be effective against unusual opponents. even in the DMG ....they are not llisted as Traps :D
#6 ghostie1337 Jul 26, 2008 17:46:18	Caltrops are not Traps.... they are Weapons... even in the DMG ....they are not llisted as Traps :D I'm using it as a component of a trap, not the trap itself. For arguments sake there is a piece of cloth over it.
#7 carnivore Jul 26, 2008 17:49:49	also if a creature .... say Dwarf with Boots and 16 dex is walking around thru a 5' square... the caltrops must beat AC 15... since his base AC = 10 +2 Boots+ 3 Dex if the same Dwarf was a Monk wearing Shoes with an 18 Wis and 16 Dex .... then it would have to beat an AC 19 Caltrops are only useful vs low level opponents who are not wearing any shoes and have Low Dex scores :D
#8 carnivore Jul 26, 2008 17:52:58	notice this: ELEMENTS OF A TRAP All traps—mechanical or magic—have the following elements: trigger, reset, Search DC, Disable Device DC, attack bonus (or saving throw or onset delay), damage/effect, and Challenge Rating. Some traps may also include optional elements, such as poison or a bypass. These characteristics are described below. what is the Trigger for this Trap? What is the Reset for this Trap? what is the Disable Device DC? Caltrops with a cloth over them.... do not constitute a trap :D
#9 ghostie1337 Jul 26, 2008 17:54:45	notice this: what is the Trigger for this Trap? What is the Reset for this Trap? what is the Disable Device DC? Caltrops with a cloth over them.... do not constitute a trap :D Trigger=Location Reset=None Disable Device DC=0
#10 cycada Jul 26, 2008 17:56:55	Even if you would consider said caltrop thing a trap, it would take a minimum of one day to craft (as per the standard craft rules.) Or atleast I'm pretty sure. Edit: A trap has to have a disable device DC of atleast 1, since otherwise it would be undestroyable.
#11 ghostie1337 Jul 26, 2008 17:58:20	also if a creature .... say Dwarf with Boots and 16 dex is walking around thru a 5' square... the caltrops must beat AC 15... since his base AC = 10 +2 Boots+ 3 Dex if the same Dwarf was a Monk wearing Shoes with an 18 Wis and 16 Dex .... then it would have to beat an AC 19 Caltrops are only useful vs low level opponents who are not wearing any shoes and have Low Dex scores :D Thats why I made it an always hit trap.
#12 ghostie1337 Jul 26, 2008 17:58:59	Even if you would consider said caltrop thing a trap, it would take a minimum of one day to craft (as per the standard craft rules.) Or atleast I'm pretty sure. Edit: A trap has to have a disable device DC of atleast 1, since otherwise it would be undestroyable. Okay, so that brings extra cost to 1gp, not to much to worry about.
#13 cycada Jul 26, 2008 18:02:25	Again, it would still take a day to build. And where is the never-miss trap idea coming from? I'm pretty sure that almost all traps require atleast some sort of roll. Edit: I found it. Keep in mind if you are trying to make a never miss trap, it MUST have an onset delay. And truthfully, as a DM, I would never allow a caltrop trap to be a nevermiss trap.
#14 carnivore Jul 26, 2008 18:02:40	Trigger=Location Reset=None Disable Device DC=0 there must be a reset to qualify to be a trap...... ALL elements must exist to qualify to be a trap.... it must have a Reset and Disable Device DC 1 at least how are you making it always hit?..... its attack roll is just d20 with no modifiers :D
#15 ghostie1337 Jul 26, 2008 18:03:38	Again, it would still take a day to build. And where is the never-miss trap idea coming from? I'm pretty sure that almost all traps require atleast some sort of roll. Its in the DMG, +1000gp, but I'm using other things to bring down the price.
#16 cycada Jul 26, 2008 18:10:53	As I said in my above post, if it's never miss then it must have an onset delay of atleast 1 round (which adds +3 to the CR of the trap) Even so, this trap would have NO use in an arena, since any item using a craft dc takes a minimum of 1 day to make.
#17 ghostie1337 Jul 26, 2008 18:14:00	Well then, I guess this idea is dead. Maybe I'll try something else then.
#18 carnivore Jul 26, 2008 18:14:56	you are using the DMG incorrectly.... that table was for "COST MODIFIERS FOR MECHANICAL TRAPS".... to qualify for a Mechanical Trap.... (yours doesnt even qualify to be a trap).... it Must "Move"... in addition .... there is no DC 0 trap... it must have a Positive Number... DC 1 minimum... adding the Never Miss to a DC 1 trap costs 1000gp total ... but a Mechanical Trap has a Base cost of 1000gp Minimum anyway.... notice: Mechanical Trap Cost The base cost of a mechanical trap is 1,000 gp. Apply all the modifiers from Table: Cost Modifiers for Mechanical Traps for the various features you’ve added to the trap to get the modified base cost. :D
#19 ghostie1337 Jul 26, 2008 18:20:35	you are using the DMG incorrectly.... that table was for "COST MODIFIERS FOR MECHANICAL TRAPS".... to qualify for a Mechanical Trap.... (yours doesnt even qualify to be a trap).... it Must "Move"... in addition .... there is no DC 0 trap... it must have a Positive Number... DC 1 minimum... adding the Never Miss to a DC 1 trap costs 1000gp total ... but a Mechanical Trap has a Base cost of 1000gp Minimum anyway.... notice: :D I really am bad at reading rules for things.
#20 carnivore Jul 26, 2008 18:23:38	no problem :D thats what d20 Character Optimization is really good at :D
#21 cycada Jul 26, 2008 18:29:13	/thread On an unrelated note: Carnivore, you need an AIM or other Instant messenger of some sort.
#22 tytalus Jul 27, 2008 3:46:41	A quick way for a low-level kobold to make traps is the Draconic Rite of Passage [RotD]. Pick the Create Trap spell (also [RotD]). The only problem is that these traps are not too tough, but on the other hand it only takes a standard action to lay the trap.
#23 commx Jul 27, 2008 6:24:16	Looking at the DMG I could make a "free" trap- If I lower Disable Device to 0, I can raise search to 29 with a -100 gp cost modifier. So Cr is now -1. Caltrops are 1gp, they deal 1 damage so +1 CR. Price is -99gp, CR is 0. Give it a +0 attack bonus, so making it never miss is free. Cost -99, Cr 0. So cost is 0, takes a DC 30 search check to find, and takes a DC 20 craft (trap making check). Is the above legal? Or have I misused the rules? There are two not-really-minor things you missed. Minimum CR, and Minimum Cost. The former is 1, and the latter CR*1000. So the cost for a trap can never be less than 1000Gp, or 333.33Gp if you are Crafting it yourself.
#24 ghostie1337 Jul 27, 2008 9:40:01	Actually, I just found Booby Traps in DMG II, most have Craft (Trapmaking) 20, cost 50gp and if you take a -10 on the check you can make it as a full round action. 4(INT)+4(Ranks)+2(Kobold)+3(Skill Focus)+1(Specialized Trait)+2(Masterwork Artisans Tools)=16 On a roll of a 4 or higher I can make one, and on a roll of 14 or higher I can make one as a full round action. The ritual is probably a better idea. So either 1 minute/1 round as a full round with a penalty or I can cast a the spell Create Trap.