Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 ashern Feb 28, 2010 11:06:03	Hey guys, going to be starting an upcoming campaign set in the underdark, in an adventure series that the DM said no party he's ever run through it has survived (aparently nine groups have tried...) We've got a strong rest of the party (radiant servant cleric, favored enemy ranger/fighter, Mounted Charger Paladin, and another cleric) and I said I'd play the sorcerer... Problem is I'm usually a wizard person, and I'm not really sure what would be all that great for fighting drow.  I was thinking a fun ray specialist blaster, for standard goodness, but any other suggetsions would be greatly appreciated. All we know about the campaign is that we're going to end up in the drow main city at some point.
#2 carnivore Feb 28, 2010 13:16:58	assuming you are using Flaws and LA Buyoff ...... try this: Phrenic(+2 LA) or 1/2 Fey(+2 LA) Human(LA +2 will be bought off at lvl 6, 9) ..... or you could play a Drow Elf(+2 LA) each race option has advantages: Phrenic: ..... Attribute boosts, PR(= SR = HD+10), Psionics(ML = HD), CHA based saves 1/2 Fey: .... Attribute boosts, Flight, at will Charm, low light Vision, Spell-like abilities Drow: Attribute boosts, SR(11+Class lvls), Darkvision Sorceror 2/ Warlock 3/ Eldritch theurge 5 Flaws: Vulnerable Slow feats: Versatile Spellcaster(Sorceror)(human Bonus) Heighten Spell(Flaw bonus) Practiced Caster(Sorceror)(flaw bonus) 1st lvl: Open feat 3rd lvl: Open feat 6th lvl: Open feat 9th lvl: Open feat 7th lvl Sorceror spells @ 10th lvl Caster 8th lvl Warlock abilities
#3 NiteCyper Mar 01, 2010 1:38:26	Don't you mean caster?
#4 DeAnno Mar 02, 2010 2:05:01	My guide here could be very helpful, as a Mailman-esque sorc build is very good at getting past the high Drow Spell Resistance that makes life hard on casters. community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758... To summarize, there will be two very effective tactics: Learn one (or even two if youre feeling cautious) Lesser Orb of X spells (Spell compendium).  Be sure to have at least either empower spell or maximize spell, and the Practical Metamagic (Races of the Dragon) feat for it.  A cheapened metamagic on a lesser orb will provide some good, SR-No damage at quite low cost for even a level 10 sorc (2nd and 3rd level spells).  You could also take a normal, 4th level Orb spell, but the high cost of 4th and 5th level spells will wear you out more quickly trying to do direct damage. The second trick is to learn the Arcane Fusion spell and the True Casting spell (I believe Complete Mage on both, but check the guide).  Using these, you can use a 5th level spell to cast any single 4th level spell with a +10 bonus to the SR check, and do it as a standard action.  If you are focusing on one target often, you may also want to look at Assay SR (Spell compendium) Lastly, if you want to help both yourself and the clerics at a fairly high cost, you could take a Marshal 1 dip to get a permanent Aura of +your Cha bonus to SR checks for you and your allies.  Losing 5th level spells is especially painful though, so consider this long and wisely.
#5 dawnmor Mar 03, 2010 19:21:05	You could do a Spellthief/Sorcerer/Spellwarp Sniper. I was doing the math for that, turning a fireball spell into a ray, at lvl 10 you can Empower and repeat it, your looking at 10d6 + half the damage from the spell you do, x2.  If your allowed Rods I would use a Rod of Maximize spell to do around 60 + 30 = 90 x2 = 180 Fireball ray damage right there.  Just make sure your Dex is maxxed. With Spelltheif master its a feat from I believe its from Complete Scoundrel.  Could work. Im considering doing something like this on a pixie who enjoys drinking, starting fights and is also a sorcerer doing a Mailman type character.  Who also gambles.  Clone + Invis = Seeing other peoples cards .
#6 phaedrusxy Mar 04, 2010 9:38:17	Typical drow tactics are to ambush the crap out of people (they have 120 ft darkvision), knock them out with poison (and sometimes lead them into traps), and then finish them off after they've been weakened and divided. They also have high spell resistance, and often minions like spiders and driders. The main weakness of drow is their light blindness. So you're going to want to pack a lot of spells (or alchemical items, etc) that suddenly create bright light. You need to build a party (or at least your character) that uses tactics that are specific to deal with their strengths and weaknesses. You need to focus on detecting the enemies before they detect you (or drawing them out into the open under false pretenses), so you don't constantly get pounded in surprise rounds. You'll also need battlefield control, since they're pretty much never alone and no one else in your party seems to be covering that. So forget blasting! You have a bunch of guys in your group that can stab people in the face all day long. Let them deal out the damage. You focus on making sure they get to do that! Your group doesn't need the Mailman, they need God. What books are allowed? What's your stat buy system like? Building a sorcerer is mostly about choosing your spells known wisely, though. Here is a thread with some guidelines for that, but not actual pre-made spell lists (just try not to be too distracted by the pictures...). Pick spells that are versatile, like Glitterdust. It can blind enemies, and also reveal hidden/invisible ones. I'd also suggest taking Dispel Magic as a spell known, because most drow parties have at least one spellcaster in my experience. (They're ruled by female clerics that have male wizards as their lapdogs.) I'd suggest a spell list something like this: Spells known 0th: Detect Magic, Message (This is an incredible spell. Read it. Use it.), Mage Hand, Dancing Lights, Prestidigitation, Launch Item, Caltrops, Ghost Sound, 1 more 1st: Silent Image, Ray of Enfeeblement, Nerveskitter, Benign Transposition, Unseen Servant 2nd: Rope Trick, Glitterdust, Invisibility, Kelgore's Grave Mist (PHB2, medium range, 20' radius, 1 rnd/lvl, 1d6 cold/rnd + fatigue, no save) 3rd: Dispel Magic, Manyjaws (Spell Compendium), Haste 4th: Evard's Black Tentacles, Greater Mirror Image 5th: Wall of Force Also, make yourself a custom runestaff (Magic Item Compedium) that has a bunch of great buff spells in it that last all day (or at least 1 hr/lvl), or that are things you don't expect to cast more than once or twice a day. Here is one I am using for a sorcerer of mine that is around the same level. The Walking Stick (custom Runestaff) This old, gnarled staff looks like a plain walking stick. It provides the wearer with much less mundane methods of travel than walking however, and also contains several spells to insure that he and any companions or equipment traveling with him arrive safely at their destination. It contains the following spells, each useable a number of times noted below: 1st: Horde Gullet (2xday, 1x1x200*2/3=133.33 gp) 2nd: Rope Trick (1xday, so 2x2x200/3=266.67 gp), See Invisible (2xday, 533.33 gp) 3rd: Heart of Water, Anticipate Teleportation (2xday, 3x3x200*2/3=1200 each) 5th: Flight of the Dragon (1xday, 5x5x400/3=3333.33)(Fly 100 (avg) for 1 hr/lvl), Teleport (2xday, 5x5x200*2/3=3333.33) Total cost: 10,000 gp Of course, tailor yours for your situation. You probably don't want Flight of the Dragon, but Dragonsight would be excellent. It's on page 73 of the Spell Compendium, and gives you Lowlight vision x4, normal vision x2, darkvision out to 10 ft/caster level and blindsense out to 5 ft/cl. It also lasts 1 hour/level. Also, I'd highly suggest taking the feats Extend Spell and Versatile Spellcaster. That way, you can reduce the uses per day on all of your buff spells in your staff to 1, but still get them to last all day. They'll still cost two slots (as if you'd cast them twice), but the price of the staff will come down some. Sculpt Spell is another feat that I'd highly advise getting. You could of course opt to use Metamagic Rods of these, also. The lesser ones of both are fairly cheap. Tactics Everyone in your party should get Rings of Darkhidden (Magic Item Compendium, makes you invisible to Darkvision), and should all have Darkvision themselves from either items or spells. Summon an Unseen Servant, and have it drag around a "crash test dummy" that you build. Dress it up to pass as a person from a distance, and stick an everburning torch in its "hand". Send it out ahead of your party as "bait". Make it heavy enough so that it will make noise and set off traps as it is dragged along. You could also use a Silent Image to make it look more realistic, if you want. (Stick an illusion of an adventurer in clunky armor on top of it, for example). Have your bat familiar follow along a bit behind it to detect any hidden enemies that are smart enough not to attack it. Ask your DM if Sunrods are bright enough to trigger the drow's light blindness. If so, get a bunch of them and use Launch Item to toss them into the middle of the drow at the beginning of every fight. They will all be blinded with no save and no spell resistance, which is better than most of your spells can manage.
#7 ashern Mar 04, 2010 11:24:28	@PhaedrusXY- Thank you so much for the tips!  I was actually informed yesterday that one of the other characters is making a sorcerer as well, so I've decided to do a Conjuration Wizard/Warmage/Ultimate Magus.  I know the UM doesn't get a lot of love around here, but my DM waived the spellcraft requirement as long as I got it eventually. I'm also kinda worried about everything, since he's being too friendly about stuff.  For stats we were told 4d6, keep all 4(!).  I rolled it and ended up with a 6, 8, and only a 17 high (still wasn't complaining, it wasn't that bad), so he said he felt sorry for me and rolled stats for me himself. My stats are 12, 20, 19, 21, 15, 14.  Pre racial.  Yeah.  He rolled those and kept them.  Aparently everone else rolled at least one 18 and one above 18.  So.... yeah. Other House Rules: 1. If you can craft it( I.E. take the feat and can cast the spell), you just pay the crafting cost in gp, XP costs are being waived 2. Any Race/source/book you want.  However, he has an eraser for anything too obviously cheesy 3. Starting gold is 55k instead of the normal DMG guidelines. 4. Multiple Ability enhancements on one item are considered "Similar" bonuses (Yeah, I know, but I'm afraid to show up with +4 to every relavent stat) That being said... I took two flaws from UA, Non combatant (when the hell am I ever going to be making melee attack rolls?) and I'm debating between feeble and innatentive for the second. Race I took was strongheart halfling, since I really wanted the feat, and the other bonuses work well (for this character, there really isn't anything but advantages to being smaller...) Class is Specialist Conjuration Wizard (fighter bonus feats swap for improved initiative, and immediate magic familiar swap for abrupt jaunt... Kinda want to do focused specialist, but that would be painful to give up another school) 3, Warmage(oh, warmage's edge... hello...) 1, Ultimate Magus 6 (Oh the joys of +2CL and shenanigans) With Practiced Spellcaster Trick this gives me spells of a Wizard 9/ Warmage 5.  Nothing too amazing, but I basically figured I could use Warmage for any actual damage needs, and that would leave me free to use all of my wizard spells for buffs/BC/ other GOD things. I'm basically set with this level set-up... but anything else I'm open to.  I was planning on taking Wondrous item and Rod crafting feats, and sculpt and maybe another metamagic, to get amazingly cheap rods for spamming.  However, the DM's aparently told the other players to be ready to die, so I'm wondering if my money and feats might be better spent on survivability stuff.  For example, that ring is awesome!  Talk about a way to throw a kink in their plans! Edit: As probably noted, Lesser Orb of X and rays look pretty appealing with this build for warmage stuff.  With an int that will probably be at least 26, and picking up an Empower spellshard (permanent empower for Orb of Acid? yay!) that's a no SR no save (5d8 *1.5)+8.
#8 ashern Mar 07, 2010 23:42:30	Well, an update.  I was informed today that the adventure we're running through will take us all the way up to 18th level, in fairly rapid succession, so I'm questioning my build, since it was designed for level ten effectiveness.  To give myself some more flexibility, I decided to move back to sorcerer for the versatility.  Also, since we're looking at higher level stuff again, I'm kind of stumped for another PrC to take to finish out my progression.  Apparently red wizard of thay is perfectly encouraged as a "balanced" class... So I'm highly tempted to change the race to human, though I'm loathe to do it, since I lose handy racial and size bonuses to most combat things. Anywho, Class is Wiz 3, Sorc 1, Ultimate Magus 6.  Focused Specialist Conjurer, banned schools Evocation, Enchantment, and Necromancy.  Would probably give up Illusion for Red wizard requirement, after writing every appropriate spell in my spellbook.  Use the Sorcerer Spells to help round out my GOD capabilities, while bolstering my number of debuffs/buffs that I can cast a day.  Also, if you glance down at my equipment, I plan on being able to extend all my buffs and sculpt every area spell I feel like, for maximum fun and profit. Alternate Class features: Abrupt Jaunt(replaces familiar), Metamagic Specialist(replaces other familiar), Improved Initiative(replaces scribe scroll) Feats: Feats: Tattoo Focus (Conjuration), Sculpt Spell, Craft (Wondrous Item) Extend Spell, Craft(Rod), Practiced Caster (Sorcerer),Arcane Mastery, Minor Shapeshift(reserve feat) Planned Equipment: (With Craft Wondrous Item and Craft Rod feats taken) Robe of Embodied Perfection(Various attribute boosts as per crafting homerules +5 int/+4dex/+1con/+1wis/+2cha)- 20,000 Rod of Viscid Liquid- 1,000 Heward's Handy Haversack- 1,000 Metamagic Rod Sculpt (3)- 4,500 Metamagic Rod Extend (2)- 3,000 Immovable Rod- 2,500 Empowering Spellshard (lvl 1)- 1,500 Ring of Darkhidden- 3,000 Total: 38,500 out of 55k.  Open to other suggestions for other equipment. Any book or other sources are open.  Aparently the DM has no problems with Red Wizard, and claims BoED and Complete Champion aren't broken...   Thoughts/suggestions/comments about how I'm crazy for getting four banned schools welcomed.