I'm making a Azurine Chaos Incarnate/Cleric. One of my main focuses is Necromancy, including the Necrocarnum Crown and Animate Dead.
What feats/soul melds/amusing broken tricks might you all put together to make this character shine?
I've actually come down on the other side of this before (about Ordered Chaos), though even then I think I admitted that I couldn't prove that a class alignment requirement doesn't count as an effect.
Although you still choose one alignment to use as an incarnate, which then controls things that refer to your "alignment cause", "incarnate cause" (or some similar description) like share incarnum radiance, things that instead refer directly to your alignment, like your aura, would work on both. For some it's simply not clear, like whether detect opposition would detect creatures with either opposite alignment, or only detect creatures with both alignments (like a succubus paladin, who has both a LG alignment and the Chaotic and Evil subtypes), or whether your incarnum radiance matches just your chosen alignment cause or your actual alignment.
But, hey, you wanted broken tricks, right?
From a gameplay/RP perspective you could occasionally sacrifice things in a "ritual to give yourself power" (the fluff for rationalising killing a random animal) but I wouldn't overdo it.
Technically, if you cast something like False Life to get some temp HP, the damage done by the Necrocarnum Circlet takes that off but doesn't actually harm you, so you don't need to suffer the penalty. I would rule against this myself because it spoils the fun, but as written you simply take damage, and temp HP go first.
The fun thing about incarnum is that you can shape completely different soulmelds each day, and as a Cleric you can memorise complimentary spells.
The fun thing about incarnum is that you can shape completely different soulmelds each day, and as a Cleric you can memorise complimentary spells.
There's no doubt it's good for necrocarnum antics, though you'd be sacrificing the best cleric spells, since necrocarnate doesn't give anything to the spellcasting side. But it's still a worthy option.
So, I can be a level 20 character that is 20 Cleric/20 Incarnate, or I can be 7 Cleric/7 Incarnate/13 Necrocarnate, so to go Necrocarnate would probably not be the best option in this case. Besides which, I don't really care for the Necrocarnate. If I really wanted a broken way of getting limitless essentia as a Cleric/Incarnate, Persistant Incarnum Apatheosis would be just fine. =D
Never heard of that feat before now... It's odd. Seems like in the right situation it could be exploited.
Well, the rules for this game is we're allowed to gesalt base class/incarnum base class, but if we choose a prestige class we can only level up that prestige class without any additonal class from gestalt
So, I can be a level 20 character that is 20 Cleric/20 Incarnate, or I can be 7 Cleric/7 Incarnate/13 Necrocarnate, so to go Necrocarnate would probably not be the best option in this case. Besides which, I don't really care for the Necrocarnate. If I really wanted a broken way of getting limitless essentia as a Cleric/Incarnate, Persistant Incarnum Apatheosis would be just fine. =D
Under that ruling, unless the prestige class is Sapphire Hierarch, you're probably best just sticking to Cleric // Incarnate all the way. Honestly, while the incarnate isn't amazing, it isn't awful either, particularly if it's providing some basic effects on top of your persistent cleric spells. It'll also save you some gold, since binds eat up magic item slots most of the time; you can use this extra gold on spellcasting gear you wouldn't normally be able to afford (pearls of power, extra nightsticks if they stack, etc).
I'm not certain if the necrocarnum zombie counts as having been "created" for Corpsecrafter feats; if it does, it'll actually get pretty beefy. And if you're investing in the Corpsecrafter line at all, you'll probably be casting spells to raise undead anyway, and the Revised Necromancer Handbook is worth reading if that's the case.
And if you really want the Ordered Chaos trick, nothing stops you from switching your deity - start out as one without the Law domain, then transition. The Atonement spell pretty explicitly lets clerics change alignment and restores deity-based powers, though it might take up to three atonements to do this (one to change your alignment to Lawful, one to "restore" divine powers with a Law-domain deity, and one to restore your alignment-based powers as an incarnate - the third of which has to come after taking Ordered Chaos, and you have to choose for it to affect you as if you were chaotic), possibly fewer depending on the wording of Ordered Chaos. This isn't that unbelievable - or rather, it's exactly as unbelievable as the Ordered Chaos feat itself. You just have a mechanical way of establishing this background now.
And the Order Chaos is more of a problem with the Incarnate part. I want to pay a Chaos-based Incarnate. If I start off as Lawful at Lv1, I'd have to be a Law Incarnate. Not really too worried about this anyways. While it seems like it would fun for the right situation, I don't think this is one of them. Thanks for the advice for the future though. I'll have to take a closer look into these feindish codexes!
Yes, I'm looking towards Corpsecrafter at the moment. It's pending approval by the DM. The essentia bonus towards initiative along with Nimble Bones would be very nice.
And the Order Chaos is more of a problem with the Incarnate part. I want to pay a Chaos-based Incarnate. If I start off as Lawful at Lv1, I'd have to be a Law Incarnate. Not really too worried about this anyways. While it seems like it would fun for the right situation, I don't think this is one of them. Thanks for the advice for the future though. I'll have to take a closer look into these feindish codexes!
Magic of Incarnum is pretty explicit: If your new alignment is incarnate-compatible, then an Atonement is all you need to reactivate yourself as an incarnate of the new alignment. So you'd start off Chaotic Neutral at level 1, then - once your will save hits +4 - you'd get an Atonement to switch to Lawful Neutral (or switch to LN yourself), pick up the feat (which lets spells affect you as your own alignment (LN) or as Chaotic as you choose), then get an Atonement to connect your cleric powers with your new deity (choose to have the spell affect you as Lawful Neutral) and a separate Atonement to restore your Incarnate powers (choose to have the spell affect you as Chaotic Neutral).
You haven't said your starting level, which makes this somewhat tricky. And I'm not sure if this route is good or not at all.
... you're probably best just sticking to Cleric // Incarnate all the way ...
2nd-ing.
The Incarnum domain 8 spell is the essentia max-er,
to use along with the 3 spells in the spells section.
Get them from your "helpful" party mates.
Probably don't need DMM Persist on Divine Power.
Incarnate combat goodies can make up the difference.
DMM Heighten otoh , is right up Tempest's alley ... (evil grin)
Well, the rules for this game is we're allowed to gesalt base class/incarnum base class, but if we choose a prestige class we can only level up that prestige class without any additonal class from gestalt
It's a good idea to mention special rules like that in the first post, since it saves time.
With a rule like that in the mix, it's probably not even worth going for sapphire hierarch, since the main benefit of that prestige class is that it advances both divine spellcasting and meldshaping, and you've already got that advantage without having to make higher-level chakras harder to access.
Ordered Chaos might still be useful if you planned to do something like take a 1-level monk dip, but even then it's not mandatory (because monks lose nothing except the ability to take more monk levels when they become non-lawful).