Making a dragonwrought kobold, pun pun-like - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Making a dragonwrought kobold, pun pun-like

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
divinechaos78
May 06, 2009 18:53:39 Fellow optimizers, I've got a challenge for everyone thats sure to put your skills to the test. Rules are simple; make a venerable dragonwrought kobold thats balanced, geared towards moneymaking and building an empire (religious or otherwise). Based in the Forgotten Realms, using all FR suppliments (domains, initiate feats, etc), Unearthed Arcana stuff (gish builds an flaws allowed), all other 1st party materials basicly.

But the ECL limit is 10, using only any combination of the following classes and prestige classes: rogue, dragonfire adept, scout, paladin, cleric, sorcerer or wizard, knight, swift wing prc, abjurant champion prc, walker in the waste prc, malconvoker prc, vassal of bahamut prc, tempest prc, ninja spy prc, tattooed monk prc, warshaper prc, ordained champion prc, dracolexi prc, and merchant prince prc.

I interested in finding out if anyone can take whats availible here, limitations and all.
*update: ok guys enough with the snide jokes, I've challenged you all the make a build with said limitations to see if you guys can make a kobold thats not so ungodly powerful so quickly as punpun. Seems to me some folks have no ideas or have lost imagination to make a character with said limits stated above.

Come on guys, lets get creative here, can anyone take whats availible here and still come out with a build thats effective, or is it that when someone says kobold.. that pun pun seems to be the end all of ideas? lol
#2
sofawall
May 06, 2009 19:14:32 My entry is Pun-Pun who isn't wearing shoes. Slightly worse than Pun-Pun, but still awesome.
#3
dr_rocktopus
May 06, 2009 19:21:56 My entry appears beside you with a gom jabbar and a box.

I am rarely snide, but this is ridiculous.
#4
SwordDisciple
May 06, 2009 19:23:08 I was going to say.. Where's the link to Pun-Pun?

Here you go.. All done for you

No shoes? Nooooooo

My entry appears beside you with a gom jabbar and a box.

I am rarely snide, but this is ridiculous.

You could make Pun-Pun that has bees coming from his rear?

Not the Bees!!!

:D
#5
true_shinken
May 06, 2009 19:30:14 Yo dawg, we heard you like pun-pun so we put a pun-pun in your car so you can do infinite loops while you ride.
#6
ashyl
May 06, 2009 19:50:19
Yo dawg, we heard you like pun-pun so we put a pun-pun in your car so you can do infinite loops while you ride.

My ribs hurt
#7
sofawall
May 06, 2009 20:41:16
Yo dawg, we heard you like pun-pun so we put a pun-pun in your car so you can do infinite loops while you ride.

#8
dr_rocktopus
May 06, 2009 21:01:01
Yo dawg, we heard you like pun-pun so we put a pun-pun in your car so you can do infinite loops while you ride.

+

Nominated for best suggested use of a Pun-Pun.
#9
divinechaos78
May 07, 2009 1:57:08 apparently when someone says kobold, pun pun is the only thing anyone can come up with lol. oy
#10
dr_rocktopus
May 07, 2009 2:02:15 Prior to the edits, the wording was such that pun-pun sounded like part of the intended problem domain. That is to say: Urgghaoa blurrrghghhhghghgh :: lungs ::

Sorry to have misjudged your intent. Perhaps I can interest you in a Buildomancer, though? What, precisely, are the upper bounds on the desired power?
#11
sofawall
May 07, 2009 2:03:16 Or, you know, Dragonwrought Loredrake White Dragonspawn Greater Draconic Rite of Passage Sorcerer/Incantrix.
#12
dr_rocktopus
May 07, 2009 2:05:12 Pool O' Drool not included, some assembly required.
#13
mister_crowley
May 07, 2009 2:35:35
Or, you know, Dragonwrought Loredrake White Dragonspawn Greater Draconic Rite of Passage Sorcerer/Incantrix.

Too bad Loredrake and Dragonwrought don't stack
#14
SwordDisciple
May 07, 2009 2:54:44
Too bad Loredrake and Dragonwrought don't stack

Interesting comment.. Why don't they? One is a variant, the other a Feat..
#15
divinechaos78
May 07, 2009 3:23:36
Prior to the edits, the wording was such that pun-pun sounded like part of the intended problem domain. That is to say: Urgghaoa blurrrghghhhghghgh :: lungs ::

Sorry to have misjudged your intent. Perhaps I can interest you in a Buildomancer, though? What, precisely, are the upper bounds on the desired power?

Just a build thats bent on balancing both being a money maker and a leader (religious or otherwise). Upper bounds? Please explain as I'm half awake right now having pulled two alnighters. lol
#16
divinechaos78
May 07, 2009 4:58:24 So far just off the top of my head, My attempt has been as follows;

dragonwrought kobold - venerable
2 flaws - variable
2 feats - practiced spellcaster, initiate of mystra
fighter / paladin - gish build taken at 6th
misc feats of interest- heratic of the faith (make up a heresy where mystra will is an aspect of some ancient god or goddess and allow your alignment to drop two levels plus still have access to your paladin abilities despite alignment)

divine justice - take damage an next round deal exact amount of dmg back to sender. totally sick.

martial study / stance - to add abit of spice with blademagic

Leadership (and thanks to venerable dragonwrought we can take epic leadership for kicks heh),

sacred vitality - use a turn for immunity to various types of dmg for 1-min, sick hehe.

Awesome smite - for gaining a few tactical advantages.

using the races of dragon kobold fighter substitution levels at fighter levels 2nd and 4th for the con+2 and the strength +2 boosts, and uses Holy warrior varient replacing spellcasting for bonus feats for levels 4th and 6th, the drakkensteed mount at 5th level, the planar paladin substitution level at 6th for adding celestial template to mount.

then gather the gold and scales to do the rite that makes you into a dragonborn of bahamut.

Then taking cleric at 7th level, domains: spell (gain access to anyspell and greater anyspell) and time (free improved initiative feat, plus bonus spells one of which makes certain spells permanent).

swift wing prc at 8th level, until you get to 5th level in the prc to have wings that work even if your wearing armor since they can be summoned at will. sick.

I'm abit confused as to what else would be good. thinking Walker in the waste at least until you gain sand golem access to be able to build up your own army ala The Mummy. hehe.
#17
kell_kheraptis
May 07, 2009 5:59:03 If you include unseen seer and kobold paragon in that list, Skitter becomes a good candidate. Nothing like running an empire with 3.0 haste :D
#18
sofawall
May 07, 2009 7:25:54
Interesting comment.. Why don't they? One is a variant, the other a Feat..

I'm pretty darn sure one even qualifies you for the other.
#19
mister_crowley
May 07, 2009 18:58:32
I'm pretty darn sure one even qualifies you for the other.

Nope. Loredrake is only for True Dragons. True Dragon is defined as a dragon who gets more powerful as they age. Dragonwrought Kobold does not get more powrful as they age, Dragonwrought Kobold is not a True Dragon. The End.
#20
emy
May 07, 2009 19:06:06
Nope. Loredrake is only for True Dragons. True Dragon is defined as a dragon who gets more powerful as they age. Dragonwrought Kobold does not get more powrful as they age, Dragonwrought Kobold is not a True Dragon. The End.

Their mental stats increase. Is that not "more powerful"? Anyway there's a big long argument about why Kobolds can or cannot take Loredrake, but this is the wrong place for it. (That's Eberron, this is Forgotten Realms.)

As for the OP: Wizard 5/Malconvoker 5. wootles.
#21
mister_crowley
May 07, 2009 19:19:59
Their mental stats increase. Is that not "more powerful"?

Nice try, but no. All races mental stats increase as they get older. Dragonwrought's physical triats just don't get weaker, they don't get more powerful like a true dragon (i.e bonus to all stats, BAB, etc)
#22
dbay
May 08, 2009 0:45:13 Okay. I havent got the book with me, but I think that 10th level sorcs can cast haunt shift (otherwise, you can buy an item that does it for you) and animate dead. You gather up all the cute squirrels and turn them into zombies. You then haunt shift them into factory machinery. You start a production line, with as many skele-squirrels as you can using aid another to boost one of their skill checks. undead need no sleep, and a nonscore has a modifier of +0, so taking 10 they can reliably do this. Lets say you have 103 squirrels, thats a check result of 216 each week. You make whatever you want, longswords as an example. 216x215 (using quick crafting=+10 DC a bunch of times). multiply by three (no need to sleep, eat, or anything), and you get 139320 sp of longswords a week, thats 928 longswords a week. You can arm an army in a month or so.

Of course, being the necro type, your army is made of undead. with them all armed and armoured and such, you sell them out as mercenaries at ludicrously low prices, because they cost you virtually nothing (you may need to build an onyx mine for the spell components). Bonus points if you Awaken them somehow. Once every (or even just one, if you aren't ambitious) nation is dependent on your super cheap armies, you can more or less take over.

Haunt shifting makes great tanks, too. Its a poor man's animate objects.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 divinechaos78 May 06, 2009 18:53:39	Fellow optimizers, I've got a challenge for everyone thats sure to put your skills to the test. Rules are simple; make a venerable dragonwrought kobold thats balanced, geared towards moneymaking and building an empire (religious or otherwise). Based in the Forgotten Realms, using all FR suppliments (domains, initiate feats, etc), Unearthed Arcana stuff (gish builds an flaws allowed), all other 1st party materials basicly. But the ECL limit is 10, using only any combination of the following classes and prestige classes: rogue, dragonfire adept, scout, paladin, cleric, sorcerer or wizard, knight, swift wing prc, abjurant champion prc, walker in the waste prc, malconvoker prc, vassal of bahamut prc, tempest prc, ninja spy prc, tattooed monk prc, warshaper prc, ordained champion prc, dracolexi prc, and merchant prince prc. I interested in finding out if anyone can take whats availible here, limitations and all. *update: ok guys enough with the snide jokes, I've challenged you all the make a build with said limitations to see if you guys can make a kobold thats not so ungodly powerful so quickly as punpun. Seems to me some folks have no ideas or have lost imagination to make a character with said limits stated above. Come on guys, lets get creative here, can anyone take whats availible here and still come out with a build thats effective, or is it that when someone says kobold.. that pun pun seems to be the end all of ideas? lol
#2 sofawall May 06, 2009 19:14:32	My entry is Pun-Pun who isn't wearing shoes. Slightly worse than Pun-Pun, but still awesome.
#3 dr_rocktopus May 06, 2009 19:21:56	My entry appears beside you with a gom jabbar and a box. I am rarely snide, but this is ridiculous.
#4 SwordDisciple May 06, 2009 19:23:08	I was going to say.. Where's the link to Pun-Pun? Here you go.. All done for you No shoes? Nooooooo My entry appears beside you with a gom jabbar and a box. I am rarely snide, but this is ridiculous. You could make Pun-Pun that has bees coming from his rear? Not the Bees!!! :D
#5 true_shinken May 06, 2009 19:30:14	Yo dawg, we heard you like pun-pun so we put a pun-pun in your car so you can do infinite loops while you ride.
#6 ashyl May 06, 2009 19:50:19	Yo dawg, we heard you like pun-pun so we put a pun-pun in your car so you can do infinite loops while you ride. My ribs hurt
#7 sofawall May 06, 2009 20:41:16	Yo dawg, we heard you like pun-pun so we put a pun-pun in your car so you can do infinite loops while you ride.
#8 dr_rocktopus May 06, 2009 21:01:01	Yo dawg, we heard you like pun-pun so we put a pun-pun in your car so you can do infinite loops while you ride. + Nominated for best suggested use of a Pun-Pun.
#9 divinechaos78 May 07, 2009 1:57:08	apparently when someone says kobold, pun pun is the only thing anyone can come up with lol. oy
#10 dr_rocktopus May 07, 2009 2:02:15	Prior to the edits, the wording was such that pun-pun sounded like part of the intended problem domain. That is to say: Urgghaoa blurrrghghhhghghgh :: lungs :: Sorry to have misjudged your intent. Perhaps I can interest you in a Buildomancer, though? What, precisely, are the upper bounds on the desired power?
#11 sofawall May 07, 2009 2:03:16	Or, you know, Dragonwrought Loredrake White Dragonspawn Greater Draconic Rite of Passage Sorcerer/Incantrix.
#12 dr_rocktopus May 07, 2009 2:05:12	Pool O' Drool not included, some assembly required.
#13 mister_crowley May 07, 2009 2:35:35	Or, you know, Dragonwrought Loredrake White Dragonspawn Greater Draconic Rite of Passage Sorcerer/Incantrix. Too bad Loredrake and Dragonwrought don't stack
#14 SwordDisciple May 07, 2009 2:54:44	Too bad Loredrake and Dragonwrought don't stack Interesting comment.. Why don't they? One is a variant, the other a Feat..
#15 divinechaos78 May 07, 2009 3:23:36	Prior to the edits, the wording was such that pun-pun sounded like part of the intended problem domain. That is to say: Urgghaoa blurrrghghhhghghgh :: lungs :: Sorry to have misjudged your intent. Perhaps I can interest you in a Buildomancer, though? What, precisely, are the upper bounds on the desired power? Just a build thats bent on balancing both being a money maker and a leader (religious or otherwise). Upper bounds? Please explain as I'm half awake right now having pulled two alnighters. lol
#16 divinechaos78 May 07, 2009 4:58:24	So far just off the top of my head, My attempt has been as follows; dragonwrought kobold - venerable 2 flaws - variable 2 feats - practiced spellcaster, initiate of mystra fighter / paladin - gish build taken at 6th misc feats of interest- heratic of the faith (make up a heresy where mystra will is an aspect of some ancient god or goddess and allow your alignment to drop two levels plus still have access to your paladin abilities despite alignment) divine justice - take damage an next round deal exact amount of dmg back to sender. totally sick. martial study / stance - to add abit of spice with blademagic Leadership (and thanks to venerable dragonwrought we can take epic leadership for kicks heh), sacred vitality - use a turn for immunity to various types of dmg for 1-min, sick hehe. Awesome smite - for gaining a few tactical advantages. using the races of dragon kobold fighter substitution levels at fighter levels 2nd and 4th for the con+2 and the strength +2 boosts, and uses Holy warrior varient replacing spellcasting for bonus feats for levels 4th and 6th, the drakkensteed mount at 5th level, the planar paladin substitution level at 6th for adding celestial template to mount. then gather the gold and scales to do the rite that makes you into a dragonborn of bahamut. Then taking cleric at 7th level, domains: spell (gain access to anyspell and greater anyspell) and time (free improved initiative feat, plus bonus spells one of which makes certain spells permanent). swift wing prc at 8th level, until you get to 5th level in the prc to have wings that work even if your wearing armor since they can be summoned at will. sick. I'm abit confused as to what else would be good. thinking Walker in the waste at least until you gain sand golem access to be able to build up your own army ala The Mummy. hehe.
#17 kell_kheraptis May 07, 2009 5:59:03	If you include unseen seer and kobold paragon in that list, Skitter becomes a good candidate. Nothing like running an empire with 3.0 haste :D
#18 sofawall May 07, 2009 7:25:54	Interesting comment.. Why don't they? One is a variant, the other a Feat.. I'm pretty darn sure one even qualifies you for the other.
#19 mister_crowley May 07, 2009 18:58:32	I'm pretty darn sure one even qualifies you for the other. Nope. Loredrake is only for True Dragons. True Dragon is defined as a dragon who gets more powerful as they age. Dragonwrought Kobold does not get more powrful as they age, Dragonwrought Kobold is not a True Dragon. The End.
#20 emy May 07, 2009 19:06:06	Nope. Loredrake is only for True Dragons. True Dragon is defined as a dragon who gets more powerful as they age. Dragonwrought Kobold does not get more powrful as they age, Dragonwrought Kobold is not a True Dragon. The End. Their mental stats increase. Is that not "more powerful"? Anyway there's a big long argument about why Kobolds can or cannot take Loredrake, but this is the wrong place for it. (That's Eberron, this is Forgotten Realms.) As for the OP: Wizard 5/Malconvoker 5. wootles.
#21 mister_crowley May 07, 2009 19:19:59	Their mental stats increase. Is that not "more powerful"? Nice try, but no. All races mental stats increase as they get older. Dragonwrought's physical triats just don't get weaker, they don't get more powerful like a true dragon (i.e bonus to all stats, BAB, etc)
#22 dbay May 08, 2009 0:45:13	Okay. I havent got the book with me, but I think that 10th level sorcs can cast haunt shift (otherwise, you can buy an item that does it for you) and animate dead. You gather up all the cute squirrels and turn them into zombies. You then haunt shift them into factory machinery. You start a production line, with as many skele-squirrels as you can using aid another to boost one of their skill checks. undead need no sleep, and a nonscore has a modifier of +0, so taking 10 they can reliably do this. Lets say you have 103 squirrels, thats a check result of 216 each week. You make whatever you want, longswords as an example. 216x215 (using quick crafting=+10 DC a bunch of times). multiply by three (no need to sleep, eat, or anything), and you get 139320 sp of longswords a week, thats 928 longswords a week. You can arm an army in a month or so. Of course, being the necro type, your army is made of undead. with them all armed and armoured and such, you sell them out as mercenaries at ludicrously low prices, because they cost you virtually nothing (you may need to build an onyx mine for the spell components). Bonus points if you Awaken them somehow. Once every (or even just one, if you aren't ambitious) nation is dependent on your super cheap armies, you can more or less take over. Haunt shifting makes great tanks, too. Its a poor man's animate objects.