Master Thrower - Dex and Int based

Post/Author/DateTimePost
#1

vrischika111

Oct 20, 2008 3:54:45
I'd like to use the master thrower options:
  • throw 2 small weapon each attack(no str bonus);
  • attack 2 adjacent opponents each attack;
  • ranged touch attack (no str bonus)

here's the suggested build:

RACE:
my best choice: Air goblin (+4 Dex, -2 str/con) (UA variant of goblin)
can also choose:tinker gnome (from dragonlance) +2 dex +2 int, ...

CARAC:
Only DEX and INT are important, no others (Con might help for HP though)

Progression: (classes might provide additional advantages
1- Swordsage 1 : free weapon focus (dagger) +1/0
[INDENT]1 shadow hand stance (pre-req for later feat : Shadow blade) -> Island of blades (you and ally flank adjacent foes)
1 setting sun manoeuver (pre-req for later stance: giant killing stance) -> Mighty throw (str or DEX)
5 other manoeuvers.... burning blade, distracting ember, sudden leap, wolf fang strike, wind stride for example[/INDENT]
Level 1 feat : Point Blank shot (+1/+1 if less than 30ft)
2- swashbuckler 1 free weapon finesse (use dex as bonus to hit instead of str)
3- SwB 2; lvl 3 feat : precise shot (no -4/0 if shooting in melee with firends)
4- SwB 3 : insightfull strike : adds INT dam to finesse weapon (for opponents not immune to critical attack)
5- Fighter 1 : feat : rapid shot (+1 att/R all att have -2/0)
6- Master thrower 1: free quick draw, Palm Throw (2 weapon thrown for a single attack roll, damage roll separately, no str bonus)
Feat lvl 6 : 2 weapon fighting
7- Warblade 1 battle clarity: if not flat footed bonus INT to ref save - max = warblade lvl, 1 in this case.
one stance : iron hand (lvl 1 or 2): Punishing stance : +1d6 melee damage, -2 ac (pre-req for bloodstorm blade)
3 manoeuvres (lvl 1 or 2) : iron hand :steel wind as standard, melee attack 2 opponents you threaten.
two others: rabid wolf strike, mountain hammer,
8- Fighter 2 : deadly defence: fighting defensively give +1d6 dam
9- Bloodstorm Blade 1 (PrC from Tome of battle) returning attack, throw anything, weapon aptitude (you qualify for fighter feats as fighter+warblade+BlBl-2
lvl 9 feat : shadow hand (add dex damage instead of Str to melee attack when in shadow stance !)
10- BlBl 2: martial throw, thunderous blow -> as swift treat your range attack as melee (for purpose of feat, capacity, ...)
11 - BlBl 3 : free fighter feat : Weapon Specialization (dagger) 0/+2
12 - cleric 1 :
fire domain replaced by fire devotion (+1 melee dam +1/3lvl, max +7) 1/J .
can be reactivated by paying 2 turn attempts. Lasts for 1 minute
undeath domain : free extra turning (to power up fire devotion-> min 3/J if cha 10+)
you can also profit from spell like divine power +1/+1 and shield of faith +2 ac
lvl 12 feat : ranged weapon master (+2/+2 all range attacks)
13 - Master thrower 2 : evasion
14 - Master thrower 3 : two with one blow -> if attacking adjacent opponents : -4 to attack rolls to attack both opponents
15 - Master thrower 4 : snatch arrow
lvl 15 feat : improve 2 weapon fighting
16 - Master thrower 5 : critical throw (double the threat range); weak spot -> if attacking opponent of same or greater size : range attack = range touch attack, no Str dam.
17 - crusader and martial spirit stance (you loose the +Dex damage, but heal you or an ally in 30ft range of 2HP per hit, with 16 or 32 attacks per round...)
18 - BlBl 4 (as I said above) : lighting ricochet. you can now limit yourself to 2 master magic weapons
feat lvl 18: greater 2WF
19 - Wiz Spe transmuter, sudden shift variant : gains +2 in one characteristic for 1 minute (+1 to hit, AC and Dam)
20 - Dragon shaman, power aura +1 damage

this build gives, with ranged dagger attacks:
let's base on Dex 24 and int 18 and 2x dagger +4 (quite realistic isn't it ?)
* bonus AC : Int (max 1) from warblade, 2 from shield of faith +4 mage armor + 4 shield (arcane spell) +2 fighting defensively +7 dex : AC 30 ! (for a naked guy, not bad)
* BAB +16
* permanent modifiers summary: W.foc +1/+0, W.Spe +0/+2, range master +2/+2, point blank +1/+1, W. finesse +7/+0 (dex), -2/0 rapid shot (extra att), -2/0 (2 weapon fighting, extra att), -4/+1d6 deadly defense, 0/+1 dragon shaman, +4/+4 for magic weapon
* conditional/limited modifiers: sudden shift +2 dex 1/J: +1/+1 (and +1 AC), spell divine power: +1/+1, fire devotion +0/+7 3/J, +0/+7 dex (shadow feat, when in shadow stance)
* if same size or greater (small or greater) : range attacks are touch attack.

* attacks +25/+25/+25/+25/+20/+20/+15/+15/+11/+11 with +26+1d6 to each attack
and 2nd hand +25/+25/+20/+20/+15/+15 (with a crit threat of 17-20)

(if this seems too low, you can always forget the defensive fight and the +1d6, but remember - it's touch attacks... or take combat reflex have have -2 att +2 ac and the +1d6)

- for 2 adjacent opponents -4/0 but can target both (still as ranged touch for small or greater opponents)

* at the cost of one iron manoeuvre that you can't use, all your thrown weapons are returning
[some manoeuvres adds flaming to your weapon for 1 round, but this requires a swift action, and switf is needed to activate the "range to melee" capacity]

using the flaws, you could choose many shots and improved rapid shot, to avoid the -2 for all attacks, the feat tree might need revising to meet the criteria
#2

vrischika111

Oct 20, 2008 4:09:21
(as I'm editing, reply to Carnivore)
Trip might be great, but it's my dex+4 vs opponent's dex/str (+4 if greater) + any other bonus he might have.
furthermore, they win a +4 AC bonus when prone (harder to hit).
I liked the idea of attacking 32 times (if 2 adjacent opponents)
#3

carnivore

Oct 20, 2008 6:57:59
looks good... but i prefer these Master thrower thrown weapon tricks:

Palm Throw – Each attack with little thrown weapons (i.e., daggers, shuriken, & darts) can be with two of the weapons. Do not apply your Strength modifier to the damage of either.

Trip Shot – On a successful thrown weapon attack, you can make a Trip Attack in addition to the damage. Make a Dexterity check with a +4 bonus opposed by your the opponent’s Strength or Dexterity check (whichever is better). Advantages such as ‘Stability’ apply.

Weak Spot – When attacking an opponent of your size or larger, you may make a Ranged Touch Attack (instead of a Normal Ranged Attack), though you may not apply your Strength modifier to the damage. You may only take this trick as a 5th level Master Thrower.


Trip Shot is especially valuable... since it allows you to control the Battlefield and do damage at the same time, and the Trip check is a Dexterity Check for you... thus even small characters can be effective

:D
#4

vrischika111

Oct 21, 2008 5:36:12
a good night of rest and some modification:

cleric 1 :
fire domain replaced by fire devotion (+1 melee dam +1/3lvl, max +7) 1/J .
can be reactivated by paying 2 turn attempts. Lasts for 1 minute
undeath domain : free extra turning (to power up fire devotion)
you can also profit from spell like divine power +1/+1 and shield of faith
crusader and martial spirit stance (you loose the +Dex damage, but heal you or an ally in 30ft range of 2HP per hit, with 16 or 32 attacks per round...)
BlBl 4 (as I said above) : lighting ricochet. you can now limit yourself to 2 master magic weapons
Wiz Spe transmuter, sudden shift variant : gains +2 in one characteristic for 1 minute (+1 to hit, AC and Dam)
Dragon shaman, power aura +1 damage

take deadly defense feat : fighting defensively (-4 att -> +2 AC) add +1d6 dam to attacks
#5

emy

Oct 21, 2008 13:50:59
If you're dipping Cleric anyway, you may as well dip Cloistered Cleric. You don't lose anything except 1 HP and maybe some attack bonus if you're using variant fractional attack bonus.

You also get an extra domain (knowledge) which can be traded for Knowledge Devotion. If you have a rank in the appropriate knowledge skill, you can make a check and get insight bonuses on attack rolls and damage rolls. Even if you have the minimum (1 rank, no synergy, no skill boosts, int 8), you will always at least get the minimum of +1 to attack and damage, with a 1/4 chance of +2. It does have a prerequisite of a Knowledge skill at 5, but it's almost like getting something for nothing.

quick edit: See Complete Champion pg 60 for more info on Knowledge Devotion.
also: also see this SRD page for more info on the Cloistered Cleric.
#6

vrischika111

Oct 22, 2008 0:50:17
thks Emy,

I'm indeed using the cloistered cleric in another build (and knowledge devotion).

I know the devotion feats (as I'm using the fire one to get incr dam)

the thing is that C.Champion says you cannot have more than one devotion feat unless they are linked/justified toghether... I cannot easily justify fire linked to knowledge for this thrower... this is a pain as RAW, they limit the options on a RP-based decision.

Anyway, might be worth swapping my undeath/fire cleric to knowledge/undeath/fire cloistered... as the build is INT based as well
#7

vrischika111

Oct 27, 2008 4:29:39
crusader and healing is a nice flavor, but I found this:
Barbarian, Ferocity variant:
adds +4str, +4dex instead of std rage benefits.

so you can replace crusader (+4 dex, no healing possible)
or wizard specialist (better bab and HP and +2dex)