Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 terronus Jun 07, 2008 19:22:11	Hello! I've spent a fair amount of time perusing the bard handbooks and really didn't see much in the way of melee bards, so I've decided to try putting out a build, and asking politely if you guys think it might be feasible for a bard 20. This guy can very easily be a "double threat". Outside of combat he uses utility spells like identify, glibness, legend lore, etc. as well as his bardic knowledge. His skills should be focused into social skills (including perform of course!!), concentration and UMD (a must as well!!)... or drop your social stuff if you want to be an acrobat or something unique. My Stats (28 point buy): STR 14 +6 enhancement +2 inherent = +6 DEX 12 +2 enhancement = +2* note... you could focus on INT instead and use cats grace to keep your Dex up for more skill points. You shouldn't need more than a +2 mod because you will wear chainmail from Battle Caster. CON 12 +2 enhancement = +2* CON is also a bit lacking. I only put very general gear below, but spending more on CON is never a bad idea, since you will be on the front lines. Hopefully your healing spells will help in this area too. INT 10 WIS 10 CHA 16 +5 lvl/+5 inherent/+6 enhancement = +11* even though you are becoming a melee bard, this is still your #1 attribute. It gives you a lot of versatility, and even though as a bard I don't use a lot of save type spells, with this nice score you could. feats 1st: Power Attack; Battle Caster 3rd: Snowflake Wardance 6th: Song of the Heart 9th: Arcane Strike 12th: Lyric Spell 15th: Extra Music 18th: Extra Music *this means you are a human. If you want to choose another race, you could drop the extra music... but you can see how he would spend a lot of songs via arcane strike/lyric song and the wardance!
#2 shokatsuryou Jun 07, 2008 22:44:39	I don't know much about bards so I can't really comment on your specific build. However, my favorite melee bard build that I have seen on these boards is JanusJones': Bardic Badass If you have access to Tome of Battle, you might want to give it a look. At the very least you could get some ideas. Good luck.
#3 Blade2718 Jun 08, 2008 7:43:58	There's a distinct lack of inspirational boost. Also, pick up a badge of valor, a vest of legends and slippers of battledancing for even more shenanigans.
#4 reis Jun 08, 2008 10:06:05	needs dragonfire inspiration
#5 terronus Jun 08, 2008 12:34:55	Thanks for the input guys! I didn't include dragonfire inspiration because it takes from the high attack bonuses required to power attack a lot... it would be interesting in play to see if his attacks will be sufficiently high enough to use both consistently... I really like the sheer combat power of JanusJones' build... but to me it just becomes more of a singing warblade than a bard. This is just a personal preference on my part. Perhaps something like bard10/warblade10 would be more suitable with the same initial premise. Blade2718: I did forget to list inspirational boost in this guys spell section, but I did include it while listing his bonuses! Also thank you for mentioning those cool items. I discovered vest and badge, but where can I find the slippers of battledancing?
#6 immortalsoul Jun 08, 2008 13:12:23	They're in the Dungeon Master's Guide II.
#7 Blade2718 Jun 08, 2008 15:43:58	Instead of metalline, try shadow striking from Tome of Magic. It matches the damage reduction of any enemy it hits and is a straight cash enhancement.
#8 CantripN Jun 08, 2008 17:14:35	Actually, Shadow Striking is a +3 Enchantment. Still very much worth it.
#9 eldariel Jun 08, 2008 17:29:16	You can use Greater Heroism for Morale Bonuses To Hit while having Dragonfire Inspiration for the damage; if you face REALLY high AC opponents, you can use the normal Inspiration instead (Dragonfire doesn't force using it), but against normals getting +4 from Greater Heroism and ~+8d6 from Dragonfire Inspiration is preferable to +8/+8. While the To Hit-difference IS relevant, it should be in the higher end of the To Hit-section and 8d6 is 3.5 times more than 8.
#10 CantripN Jun 08, 2008 17:31:59	Plus, there's nothing stopping you from using both versions of Inspiration at once... Use class features, magic, feats or a Harmonizing weapon to accomplish this.
#11 Wyvernhand Jun 08, 2008 19:13:10	Yea, but you run into complications getting Inspirational Boost and Badge of Valor on both of them, since Badge eats up your insp boost for the next buff. Maybe if you started an encounter with DFI running, then dropped it to put up IC in the first round, and just killed stuff in 10 rounds. That would work. Nothing says you can't maintain IC indefinitely out of combat...so long as you don't have to talk or anything.
#12 Blade2718 Jun 08, 2008 19:48:12	Nothing says you can't maintain IC indefinitely out of combat...so long as you don't have to talk or anything. Or you stub your toe. That would make you the Frenzied Berserker of Bards.
#13 terronus Jun 09, 2008 11:41:13	Thanks for pointing out the slippers ImmortalSoul. I feel kind of dumb since they were right next to the vest of legends! I really like the input you guys gave and I don't know why I didn't think myself of using heroism/greater heroism with DFI, or combining two inspire courage... although combining them might be a bit more difficult. I definitely think this is what I would like to use. new feats and average damage Silverbrow Human 1st: Power Attack; Battle Caster 3rd: Snowflake Wardance 6th: Song of the Heart 9th: Dragonfire Inspiration 12th: Arcane Strike 15th: Lyric Spell 18th: Extra Music I guess you could probably get rid of Battle Caster for a Heritage feat for better energy type, or possibly drop Arcane Strike... with dragonfire inspiration and Heroism. Just heroism because it has a nice duration and you can keep it up more often without using as many combat actions. ATK DMG +2 Heroism +8d6 dragonfire energy damage +11 CHA +2 +5 Arcane Strike (this represents a lvl 2 spell) +6 STR +6 +5 Enh +5 +10 dmg echo-blade (sonic) +5 dmg collision +15 BaB +41/36/31 atk +61 damage or +28/23/18 atk +76 damage with power attack in 1 hand +66 damage or +96 damage with power attack in 2 hands with haste and heroism up thats 400 average damage per round. Not too shabby for a bard 20. Although, its still a bit resource intense. Not until the very high levels can you combine your music and spell slots for a large resource pool.