Monk idea, work in progress - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 pablox256 Jul 31, 2009 19:25:44	note This char would normally have an experience penalty, but we don't play with it. Alternatives would be take human instead of changling and find something to take instead of warshaper...or someone find me a spot where cleric gets polymorph as a 5th or lower spell (non domain except as Bahamut). Monk 2 / Fighter 2 / Feat Rogue 2 / Warshaper 3 / Fist of the Forest 1 / Cleric 9 / Spelldancer 1 Requires: Str 9, Int 13, Dex 9, Wisdom (buffed) up to 15. (Dex and str are improved by 4 through warshaper). Show
#2 pablox256 Aug 02, 2009 11:12:27	Back to the first page!
#3 playswithfire Aug 02, 2009 17:02:58	Since you already meet the prereqs (assuming you can spare some skill points for Knowledge(religion), there's no reason not to go Cleric 1/Sacred Fist 8 and get a better BAB and some other nice features (including stacking with monk levels for unarmed damage, so you can drop one of your sources of increasing monk level. If you were to drop the Gloves of the Talon, freeing you up, diety wise, you can go human and drop one other feat (maybe snap kick) to get spots for Iron Will and Spell Focus(evil) so you can go Ur-Priest 2/Sacred Fist 7 instead of Cleric 9 and get your ninth level cleric spells. Obviously, some level juggling involved and I haven't ensured you can meet the skill requirements, but it might be worth looking into.
#4 dreamweaver Aug 03, 2009 12:06:54	Well, a few things to suggest looking at/thinking about, but obviously your rules or interpretation of such things in your group may be different. 1) Superior Unarmed Strike and Monk's Belt: I've seen enough talk on these boards about it to convince me that they don't stack. Again, your opinion may differ, but both seem to indicate they increase your monk level by X as opposed to your "effective" monk level for purposes of Unarmed Strike damage. Nothing says that having both wouldn't be useful, for instance if you wandered into an anti-magic zone or something, the belt would stop but the feat would take over. 2) Greater Mighty Wallop and stacking more size increases to get past Collosal "effective" size for your Unarmed Strike damage: I like your idea of "I activate my ring FIRST and THEN add on all the other size increase benefits so I'm 'technically' still only using Greater Mighty Wallop to get up to Collosal size", but I think, and it may be different with your group, that your really breaking things down just so they have a slim chance of getting a pass by your group. I think that any size increase past Collosal would also decrease then the size increase gained by Greater Mighty Wallop by the same amount. I.e.: Collosal +1, well then Greater Mighty Wallop isn't giving you 4 size increases now, it is givning you 3 so your effective size is still Collosal and not pushed beyond it by the size increases your gaining from the Greater Mighty Wallop effect. Outside of those, which as I prefaced, your group may have a different interpretation or be more willing to bend quite so much on the rules, I might suggest possibly dropping the Superior Unarmed Strike, taking Improved Natural Attack [Unarmed Strike], and then only needing Greater Mighty Wallop as cast by a 12th level caster on an item that can be activated 2x per day. I suggest this since it would still grant you Collosal size effective of your Unarmed Strike and you would have it for 24 hours out of the day. In addition, if you had your Greater Mighty Wallop dispelled sometime during the first 12 hours of the day, you'd still be able to reactivate the item at least one more time so you weren't robbed completely of your power for the remainder of the day. Also, I'm not quite certain why you are going with Cleric/Spelldancer, but I assume you have a particular wish for this character to have access to the spells these provide (i.e.: Righteous Might) so you don't have to buy an item to do it, but 8-9 levels of Initiate of the Draconic Mysteries (or whatever it is called) would help you jump that 12d8 to 12d12 (2 die TYPE increases, I believe at level 4 and level 8, of your unarmed strike damage, plus you could choose to deal slashing damage with your unarmed strikes as opposed to only bludgeoning damage). Just some thoughts. I have a full build using Changling with Ranger 2/Fighter 2/Barbarian 1/Fist of the Forest 1/Stone Blessed 3/Deepwarden 2/Warshaper 4/Frenzied Barbarian 4 adding on the +1 LA Mineral Warrior Template that gets pretty sick. Of course, that's less monk/unarmed damage then it is beefy slaughter house with sick AC at almost 60 (including touch and flat-footed in the high 40s). So perhaps that isn't really worth bringing up here. :D
#5 fisharewet Aug 03, 2009 13:47:36	Just some thoughts. I have a full build using Changling with Ranger 2/Fighter 2/Barbarian 1/Fist of the Forest 1/Stone Blessed 3/Deepwarden 2/Warshaper 4/Frenzied Barbarian 4 adding on the +1 LA Mineral Warrior Template that gets pretty sick. Of course, that's less monk/unarmed damage then it is beefy slaughter house with sick AC at almost 60 (including touch and flat-footed in the high 40s). So perhaps that isn't really worth bringing up here. :D You'd get more Con with Half-Minotaur template from Dragon. Unless I'm missing a part of the build, but I'm interested. Could you post the whole thing? *sorry to derail the thread
#6 dreamweaver Aug 03, 2009 16:30:02	You definitely could get more Con, but I also like all of the other "benifits" you get from the Mineral Warrior (namely burrow speed, DR 8/adamantine, nat armor +3, bonus to hit 1/day for an Earth Strike, etc...). I'll see about creating another thread so we don't derail this thread, fisharewet. I'll call it "Changeling Mineral Warrior". May take a bit before it is up since I'll have to dig out the specifics I have on the build (made it a while ago), plus I'm a bit busy, but I'll get it up here eventually! :D
#7 fisharewet Aug 03, 2009 16:39:08	I was actually suggesting using both templates. One is acquired and one is inherent. Looks like you could take it, enjoying the +12 str +6 con, and lose a fighter level.
#8 dreamweaver Aug 03, 2009 16:56:53	Ah, well, I had another build that was based off of using the Mongrel-Folk from Races of Destiny, adding in the Mineral Warrior Template, and then throwing Dragon Born on top of that to get a hefty +10 Con modifier due to race/templates for only a +1 LA equivalent so I could start with a 28 Con, but I haven't played with that in a while. :D Didn't realize the Half-Minotaur template in the Dragon mag was only a +1 LA with no racial HD to add either. My problem is that my game group often finds most of the stuff published in the Dragon mags to be overpowering or too easy to abuse. So we pretty much just stick to the published WotC 3.5 books (don't even use outside d20 based books from other publishers).
#9 fisharewet Aug 03, 2009 17:09:48	Oh it absolutely is overpowered. But hey, you're on CharOp :P +12 str +6 con +4 NA Gore Attack Scent Track All for +1...
#10 dreamweaver Aug 04, 2009 13:44:36	Ok, fisharewet, my "Changeling Mineral Warrior" post is up. :D End of thread jack. ;)

Post/Author/DateTime

Post

pablox256

Jul 31, 2009 19:25:44

*note* This char would normally have an experience penalty, but we don't play with it. Alternatives would be take human instead of changling and find something to take instead of warshaper...or someone find me a spot where cleric gets polymorph as a 5th or lower spell (non domain except as Bahamut).

Monk 2 / Fighter 2 / Feat Rogue 2 / Warshaper 3 / Fist of the Forest 1 / Cleric 9 / Spelldancer 1

Requires: Str 9, Int 13, Dex 9, Wisdom (buffed) up to 15. (Dex and str are improved by 4 through warshaper).

Show

pablox256

Aug 02, 2009 11:12:27

Back to the first page!

playswithfire

Aug 02, 2009 17:02:58

Since you already meet the prereqs (assuming you can spare some skill points for Knowledge(religion), there's no reason not to go Cleric 1/Sacred Fist 8 and get a better BAB and some other nice features (including stacking with monk levels for unarmed damage, so you can drop one of your sources of increasing monk level.

If you were to drop the Gloves of the Talon, freeing you up, diety wise, you can go human and drop one other feat (maybe snap kick) to get spots for Iron Will and Spell Focus(evil) so you can go Ur-Priest 2/Sacred Fist 7 instead of Cleric 9 and get your ninth level cleric spells. Obviously, some level juggling involved and I haven't ensured you can meet the skill requirements, but it might be worth looking into.

dreamweaver

Aug 03, 2009 12:06:54

Well, a few things to suggest looking at/thinking about, but obviously your rules or interpretation of such things in your group may be different.

1) Superior Unarmed Strike and Monk's Belt:

I've seen enough talk on these boards about it to convince me that they don't stack. Again, your opinion may differ, but both seem to indicate they increase your monk level by X as opposed to your "effective" monk level for purposes of Unarmed Strike damage. Nothing says that having both wouldn't be useful, for instance if you wandered into an anti-magic zone or something, the belt would stop but the feat would take over.

2) Greater Mighty Wallop and stacking more size increases to get past Collosal "effective" size for your Unarmed Strike damage:

I like your idea of "I activate my ring FIRST and THEN add on all the other size increase benefits so I'm 'technically' still only using Greater Mighty Wallop to get up to Collosal size", but I think, and it may be different with your group, that your really breaking things down just so they have a slim chance of getting a pass by your group. I think that any size increase past Collosal would also decrease then the size increase gained by Greater Mighty Wallop by the same amount. I.e.: Collosal +1, well then Greater Mighty Wallop isn't giving you 4 size increases now, it is givning you 3 so your effective size is still Collosal and not pushed beyond it by the size increases your gaining from the Greater Mighty Wallop effect.

Outside of those, which as I prefaced, your group may have a different interpretation or be more willing to bend quite so much on the rules, I might suggest possibly dropping the Superior Unarmed Strike, taking Improved Natural Attack [Unarmed Strike], and then only needing Greater Mighty Wallop as cast by a 12th level caster on an item that can be activated 2x per day. I suggest this since it would still grant you Collosal size effective of your Unarmed Strike and you would have it for 24 hours out of the day. In addition, if you had your Greater Mighty Wallop dispelled sometime during the first 12 hours of the day, you'd still be able to reactivate the item at least one more time so you weren't robbed completely of your power for the remainder of the day.

Also, I'm not quite certain why you are going with Cleric/Spelldancer, but I assume you have a particular wish for this character to have access to the spells these provide (i.e.: Righteous Might) so you don't have to buy an item to do it, but 8-9 levels of Initiate of the Draconic Mysteries (or whatever it is called) would help you jump that 12d8 to 12d12 (2 die TYPE increases, I believe at level 4 and level 8, of your unarmed strike damage, plus you could choose to deal slashing damage with your unarmed strikes as opposed to only bludgeoning damage).

Just some thoughts. I have a full build using Changling with Ranger 2/Fighter 2/Barbarian 1/Fist of the Forest 1/Stone Blessed 3/Deepwarden 2/Warshaper 4/Frenzied Barbarian 4 adding on the +1 LA Mineral Warrior Template that gets pretty sick. Of course, that's less monk/unarmed damage then it is beefy slaughter house with sick AC at almost 60 (including touch and flat-footed in the high 40s). So perhaps that isn't really worth bringing up here. :D

fisharewet

Aug 03, 2009 13:47:36

Just some thoughts. I have a full build using Changling with Ranger 2/Fighter 2/Barbarian 1/Fist of the Forest 1/Stone Blessed 3/Deepwarden 2/Warshaper 4/Frenzied Barbarian 4 adding on the +1 LA Mineral Warrior Template that gets pretty sick. Of course, that's less monk/unarmed damage then it is beefy slaughter house with sick AC at almost 60 (including touch and flat-footed in the high 40s). So perhaps that isn't really worth bringing up here. :D

You'd get more Con with Half-Minotaur template from Dragon. Unless I'm missing a part of the build, but I'm interested. Could you post the whole thing?

*sorry to derail the thread

dreamweaver

Aug 03, 2009 16:30:02

You definitely could get more Con, but I also like all of the other "benifits" you get from the Mineral Warrior (namely burrow speed, DR 8/adamantine, nat armor +3, bonus to hit 1/day for an Earth Strike, etc...).

I'll see about creating another thread so we don't derail this thread, fisharewet.

I'll call it "Changeling Mineral Warrior". May take a bit before it is up since I'll have to dig out the specifics I have on the build (made it a while ago), plus I'm a bit busy, but I'll get it up here eventually!

:D

fisharewet

Aug 03, 2009 16:39:08

I was actually suggesting using both templates. One is acquired and one is inherent. Looks like you could take it, enjoying the +12 str +6 con, and lose a fighter level.

dreamweaver

Aug 03, 2009 16:56:53

Ah, well, I had another build that was based off of using the Mongrel-Folk from Races of Destiny, adding in the Mineral Warrior Template, and then throwing Dragon Born on top of that to get a hefty +10 Con modifier due to race/templates for only a +1 LA equivalent so I could start with a 28 Con, but I haven't played with that in a while. :D

Didn't realize the Half-Minotaur template in the Dragon mag was only a +1 LA with no racial HD to add either. My problem is that my game group often finds most of the stuff published in the Dragon mags to be overpowering or too easy to abuse. So we pretty much just stick to the published WotC 3.5 books (don't even use outside d20 based books from other publishers).

fisharewet

Aug 03, 2009 17:09:48

Oh it absolutely is overpowered. But hey, you're on CharOp :P

+12 str
+6 con
+4 NA
Gore Attack
Scent
Track

All for +1...

#10

dreamweaver

Aug 04, 2009 13:44:36

Ok, fisharewet, my "Changeling Mineral Warrior" post is up. :D

End of thread jack. ;)