This thread goes out to all those DM's, who's playing with a grp that enjoys powergaming and optimizing (not munchkinism, for the most part).
And for the record, I enjoy powergaming myself, even as DM, as it allows me to throw some truly epix challenges towards my (*cough* minions *cough*) players.
Anyways, I'll get to the point!
To challenge such powergaming characters, I could easily make a grp of equally powerfull characters, call them BBEG's and then call it a day/game-night. I have done that before, and ofcause it's hillarious to see the players crying when I hit them with powerbuilds like themselves. They are used to owning MM(1 - 5) mobs on a regular basis. Now I don't want to dissappoint them; I want to throw (hard)core mobs after them, but I want to do it with intelligence. I want to combine and create synergies, and REALLY challenge the players, by just using MM 1-5 monsters.
The grp is lvl 8+
Have a blaster wizard, a melee sneak attacker, a warlock sniper, a cleric-zilla and a very hard hitting fighter, who's doing most of the killing right now (I know that will change, with the clerik and the wiz gaining power fast over the next few lvls!).
Even tho they have a warlock sniper, and a blaster wizard I still think their weekness is with ranged mobs (and fortitude saves - 'cept the warr and clrk).
If you have any ideas, I'm glad to hear them
Another one was mordenkainen's disjunction when a high level party started powergaming via their magic item abuse, so I sundered it all. It meant the VoP monk, whom they had been pushing around all game, calling him useless (In character) suddenly got a time to shine as well, as he did not have any such items. That was more for the benefit of the monk, but if people build say... little red raiding hood... breaking their magic items slows their build right down.
Also., the cleric was the very final boss besides the avatar of a god... so they had their spells still for the final final fight
The idea with the antimagic field, and archer support, can that be done with core monsters?
- could be using the antimagic field of a Beholder, while pummeling the PC's with something ranged besides spells. Like a giant with a reach weapon - giving him some 25-30ft reach.
Then maybe use some high end entagle'ish/grapple power to keep the PC's in the antimagic field.
Thanks for you reply
from SRD ..... Challenge Rating: Kobolds with levels in NPC classes have a CR equal to their character level –3.
thus the CR for a Kobold Warrior 6 = 3 .... and your group should be able to to face a CR 8 encounter = 5 Kobold Warrior 6 + 1 Kobold Adept 6(spells)
the 5 Warriors will be Archers typical of the following:
Abilities: Str 9, Dex 14(+1 lvl), Con 10, Int 10, Wis 9, Cha 8
feats: Point Blank Shot, Rapid Shot, Woodland Archer
use Poison on the Arrows(Sassone leaf residue, Contact, DC 16, 2d12 hp/1d6 Con ...... 300 gp)apply it to 50 Arrows(one Dose equivalent) and Divide between them(Each gets 10 Arrows with Poison on them)
Ambush .... make sure that they surround them and all fire at same time(vs Flatfooted AC) ...... the Adept will throw Tanglefoot bags(Ranged Touch Attacks) and Thunderstones(Ranged Touch Attacks) and Alchemist Fire(Ranged Touch Attacks) ..... the Adept will focus on the Spellcasters
that should keep them occupied
excellent way of using what WoTC have given DM's already, without using too many NPC class lvls. It's all about tacts and strategy. I like it.If you guys have more of that kind, please keep them comming
Then maybe use some high end entagle'ish/grapple power to keep the PC's in the antimagic field.
Anything with improved grab then. You could also bull rush things into the antimagic field, however, the main point is a full antimagic field would stop them blasting the monster, they would HAVE to go into combat with it. So if it was a trap rather than a persisted spell then the monsters could be quite different.
Also, spells that affect the mind and confuse the opponent is normally a good idea if you want to take on a power party that doesn't have mind affecting imunity. Remember, death urge is your friend
I had a look through the good ol' players handbook, and daym boi, there's many fun and devastating mind affecting spells. Or transformations to really destroy a weak fort caster type (Baleful Polymorph, I'm looking at you!).
The mob called Zern, will have one of these bad boys pr. day (with a +4 to the DC).
Sidenote: Dimension Shuffle spell is also awesome :P now it's time to play some chess. Rearrange the battlefield as you see fit.
Thanks for the re-posts
I thought of waiting a few lvls and making that a dire werebear.
Since lycanthrope adds 5 to CR for animals ranging from 11 to 20 HD, it's more efficient to use legendary bear (Monster Manual II) than dire bear. You get the same CR, but 8 more HD, 6 more str, 2 more dex, 6 more con, and 3 more natural armor.
A were legendary bear gets cleave and power attack as feats with no customization. A human barbarian 1 can take destructive rage and intimidating rage, then immediately qualify for frenzied berserker after the template is added on.