Stats (35 Point Buy): Str 8, Dex 16, Con 12, Int 20, Wis 10, Cha 11
Level Breakdown: Diviner7/(Alt)Loremaster10/Archmage3
(Open to suggestions on the level breakdown with the exception of (alt)loremaster10, that stays)
Prohibited School: Illusion (or enchantment); I dont want to give up evokation, soley for the fun of it.
To get into (Alt)Loremaster ASAP three feats (Which levels?) Will be spent on either item creation or metamagic feats, or a combination of the two. Suggestions for maximum utility? Craft Wonderous Item looks like a shoo-in. This leaves one "free" choice feat, and im not sure how to spend it. Ive always been quite fond of Collegiate Wizard, but im not sure how usefull that would be. Imput on feat breakdown by level would be much appriciated. Skills will be so plentiful theres no worry of how the breakdowns gonna work.
Im not completely set on Archmage for the 3 missing levels, suggestions for a good class? If i could pursuade my DM to give Elf Paragon full wizard progression how would that look to fill in the three levels? Likewise, i think that magical trickster looks very appealing... if i could convince my DM to give it full caster progression.
The theme of this character is loosely based on my character having a hardon for forbidden knowledge, and im trying not to go too far out of that concept.
Once you get to Diviner 5, switch to Master Specialist for 2 levels. It will give you Skill Focus (Spellcraft) for free which is a requirement for Archmage.
So youre vote is for Archmage, rather than Magical Trickster or Elf Paragon, or does it really just come down to where i wanna go with my character?
So youre vote is for Archmage, rather than Magical Trickster or Elf Paragon, or does it really just come down to where i wanna go with my character?
At least I recommend you to go with Archmage. Pick those Master specialist levels too.
(Actually, probably 95%)
Archmage is a great PrC with some very nice abilties to choose from. I usually take at least a couple levels to top off 90% of my wizard builds.
(Actually, probably 95%)
Well, with my wizard build i want to be doing a lot of divining, conjurering, and evoking for complete battlefeild control/devistation... but i really just wanna play around with metamagic and complete devistation (This is my FIRST wizard). Sonic Fireball seems soooo coooooool (Energy sub, or archmage ability)
Fireball seems cool, but in practice your fighter deals more damage without as much expended resources. A simple Haste is almost always better, not to mention things like Unluck.
Ya, BUUUT...
easy metamagic (empower) + metamagic school focus + metamagic trick + maxamize + empower + sonic fireball = pretty sick. Especially sense my Greyelf, (With the help of Maddness), will have NATURAL intelligence of around 30... then throw in some intelligence increasing magic items... and ive got pleeenty of fireballs (sonic balls?) to throw around
A Warmage or a Sorcerer blast better most of the time.
Even with all that (and that's using a whole lot of feats and class features), it's inferior to a pouncing Barbarian. Not that you can't make Blasting a viable option, but being a Wizard is not the way to do it.
A Warmage or a Sorcerer blast better most of the time.
Naturally, but my enormouse int is gonna give me a lot of leeway. (SP?) Also, with the alternate loremaster my DM is building/working on, ill easily be able to get those abilities feats, seeing as i could potentially get a feat every other lvel from the lore master secret. (Altered obviously, sense the origonal stuuupidly doesnt allow for the taking of the same secret twice)
Im no genuis, but i beg to differ. A fullattack from a barbarian on a charge isnt going to out-do that, on a one-to-one basis... Maybe over the long haul, but still. Im just going at this for fun, i think my build will allow me to do just about everything i wanna do.
Im no genuis, but i beg to differ. A fullattack from a barbarian on a charge isnt going to out-do that, on a one-to-one basis...
If he's made for charging he will. He will not only do more damage - he will do much more damage.
A charge build is usually doing about 100+ points/damage by level 12 (at least).
Consider:
10th level 1/2 orc Barbarian (lion totem)/Fighter
2-H Heavy Flail +2 (1d10 +2)
Str 30 (1/2 orc, 20 start, +4 enhance item, rage for +10 total)
Heedless Charge (+20)
Base damage 1d12 +32
Leap attack at level 10: (1d10+32) x 3, say 114 points, with the pounce he gets 2 attacks, so 228 points. More with dungeoncrasher/knockback
Before I get flamed by all the fighter guys out there for my suboptimal fighter build - I point out that I'm a wizard guy - not a fighter guy!
Now how much is that blasting 10th level wizard going to do?
Base fireball damage would indicate 35 points.
Empower would make it 52
Maximize would make it 105
If they fail their save, if they don't have energy resistance.
A 1st level Druid in this scenario with snakes swiftness (1st level spell) - will do 114. (Normally in this case, snake's swiftness wouldn't work, because it doesn't stack with Haste. However, you were throwing fireballs instead of buffing your ally)
When you get to 20th level - it's much worse. The blasts just don't keep up with the charging.
However - if you use your spells to set up your charging fighter, keep him in charging distance - and giving him extra attacks, restrict your enemies attacks etc. You will be extremely effective.
If you want to take advantage of a high save DC - consider Debuffing or Enchantment options for spells that require a save and then Blind/Stun/Dominate/Daze/Paralyze your opponent while the fighter gleefully chops them to little bits.
If he's made for charging he will. He will not only do more damage - he will do much more damage.
A charge build is usually doing about 100+ points/damage by level 12 (at least).
Consider:
10th level 1/2 orc Barbarian (lion totem)/Fighter
2-H Heavy Flail +2 (1d10 +2)
Str 30 (1/2 orc, 20 start, +4 enhance item, rage for +10 total)
Heedless Charge (+20)
Base damage 1d12 +32
Leap attack at level 10: (1d10+32) x 3, say 114 points, with the pounce he gets 2 attacks, so 228 points. More with dungeoncrasher/knockback
Before I get flamed by all the fighter guys out there for my suboptimal fighter build - I point out that I'm a wizard guy - not a fighter guy!
Now how much is that blasting 10th level wizard going to do?
Base fireball damage would indicate 35 points.
Empower would make it 52
Maximize would make it 105
If they fail their save, if they don't have energy resistance.
A 1st level Druid in this scenario with snakes swiftness (1st level spell) - will do 114. (Normally in this case, snake's swiftness wouldn't work, because it doesn't stack with Haste. However, you were throwing fireballs instead of buffing your ally)
When you get to 20th level - it's much worse. The blasts just don't keep up with the charging.
However - if you use your spells to set up your charging fighter, keep him in charging distance - and giving him extra attacks, restrict your enemies attacks etc. You will be extremely effective.
If you want to take advantage of a high save DC - consider Debuffing or Enchantment options for spells that require a save and then Blind/Stun/Dominate/Daze/Paralyze your opponent while the fighter gleefully chops them to little bits.
Psssh touche. Still, almost no one has energy resistance sound, and a charge only hits one enemy. Why cant i blast... and buff? xD I really just want my wizard to be devistatingly powerful directly, and indirectly.
NOT to mention, that all the PCs in this upcoming group are not sophisticated enough in their DnD to pull off such calculations, let alone know when to charge. So more often than not, not only will i be the lead the party in terms of damage, ill also be holding them together buff wise.
Play a Beguiler instead. Perfect for Shackled City.
I prefer to play a wizard, the character ive already designed isnt suited to be a beguiler.
I really just want my wizard to be devistatingly powerful directly, and indirectly
In that case I have 2 words for you: Multiple Threat
Check out my guides (in my sig) and look for spells that are listed as "Dual Threat" or "Multiple Threat" when one of the spell types is "blast".
This way you can still control the battlefield and debuff - all while doing direct damage...;)
i still dont know if i wanna go with archmage or magical trickster (depending on if i can get my DM to go along with giving it a full caster progression)No, trust me, you want archmage. Making your touch spells ranged will help... you have no idea. And if you're set on blasting - a bad plan, as treantmonklvl20's VERY SUB-PAR (sorry, I had to:D) barbarian shows - the mastery of elements is usually better than spending feats... especially if you're wanting to go metamagic heavy.
i suppose... though i have to say i wouldnt be taking a level of archmage till 18th level. (18, 19, 20).
Why? No reason you couldn't interrupt your progression to take a level @14.
Personal taste, i may intermit it, but we'll see. besides, yeah a tweaked out barbarian may be able to out do damage... on a single target. And also, no body im gonna play with is even remotely that... min/maxy. I just wanna be a wizard to throw around the most damage in my party, as well as dominate the battle feild with conjuration. My wizard is gonna focus on diviniation, evocation, and conjuration. Forbidding illusion. (its illusion or enchantment, i picked illusion)
What should my feat breakdown be? I am having particular difficulty figuring out which feat to take at first level. Collegiate Wizard? or one that would allow me to gain the maddness/insanity abiliy as per the maddness domain?
Feat breakdown please?
No, trust me, you want archmage. Making your touch spells ranged will help... you have no idea. And if you're set on blasting - a bad plan, as treantmonklvl20's VERY SUB-PAR (sorry, I had to:D) barbarian shows - the mastery of elements is usually better than spending feats... especially if you're wanting to go metamagic heavy.
:raincloud I actually played a similar build in a campaign about 6 months ago for - oh, about 2 sessions. It was a goliath fighter/barbarian/exotic weapon master with a spiked chain who could charge with pounce for 100+ points of damage and trip opponent for free afterwards with Knockdown feat.
I was quite proud - as I never play fighter-types, and thought the build was quite well optimized. I was convinced to play a fighter type because in this group (which I was new to) there was already a sorcerer and therefore, "The arcane role is taken care of"
I got a few
stares from my fellow players on my first charge where I did about 10X more than the other fighter in damage and tripped the opponent afterwards. I realized then that my DM, although asking for my first character in this group to be optimized, defined it quite differently than me.I had pre-approved the build with the DM, however, I should have realized that he didn't know what it was capable of when he asked why I had made a fighter without weapon specialization...
I also discovered in the first session that the "Arcane role" was in fact filled by a fireball/cone of cold slinging sorcerer. This group had nobody even close to optimized.
In the second session an opponent cast "Web" and I spent the entire combat (and more) getting out of it. I was level 12 - totally destroyed by a 2nd level spell. I had made my save. I retired the character after that session with the self-admission, "I am not a fighter-guy".
The DM was quite open to the idea of my character being retired, "I know I told you to optimize - but I don't think anyone was quite ready for how optimized you character was."
After that I made a conjurer and specialized in Battlefield control and buffing (a couple debuffs - but that was minor with this character). Because I was not directly doing damage - nobody seemed to think this character was overpowered - and suddenly we started winning combats easily and regularly. In a campaign that saw characters die almost every session up to that point (and a tpk), we never suffered another party casualty for the rest of the campaign.
I'm quite surprised nobody figured out the effect my wizard was having on combat, because to me it was quite obvious that the battlefield controls were what was winning the combats - even if the other characters were doing the hp damage.
However, clearly they didn't as they were always wondering why I had any fun playing a wizard that doesn't sling fireball. I don't think any of them realized the effect that the conjurer was having on combat.
The experience was the single-greatest definining moment in my inspiration for the idea of a "God" wizard helping the mortals win the combat and thinking that they did the work.
If you didn't take Spontaneous Divination at level 5 Wiz, it rocks. Getting the Oracle Domain from Divine Oracle will boost your CL +2. It also gives you a better version of Evasion if you stick with it for a few levels.
BTW, if you take Spont Div at 5, you can qualify for Ultimate Magus very easily. You basically always get a wizard level since you only have one class but it opens UMD (and is much easier to qualify for than Loremaster).
The experience was the single-greatest definining moment in my inspiration for the idea of a "God" wizard helping the mortals win the combat and thinking that they did the work.
I had a very similar experience with my first Wizard. Although it was only my second campaign w/ 3.5, all the players were simply amazed at how I was playing it. I got a lot of compliments and a lot of "I've never seen a Wizard played so effectively". It was quite rewarding!
@OP: It looks like you are going for flavor vs. power... I'd drop 3 levels of Loremaster for 3 more levels of Diviner. The bonus feat (or domain granted power if you use CChampion) is worth it. edit: I see you are set on LM 10. I have no advice, then.
Yeah, I'm in the middle of going through that one right now... I've been playing with my current group for probably six months, and I've just started running a GOD wizard. It's fun... one of the guys just told the DM (who's new to DMing) that if he thought a challenge was too hard for us, he needed to go 2 CR higher. (This is the same guy that whines at our main DM all the time because he throws stuff at us that averages CR+3... we have no BC in that game at all.:rolleyes
I don't think they've figured out that it's because they're constantly buffed and the bad guys are regularly stuck/fallen/unable to move. (Band of Steel is rapidly climbing my list of top spells.:cool The only annoying thing is that nobody seems to notice that my wizard is actually doing stuff, much less dominating encounters. We had a mob fight, and half of the melee types spend most of their short lives on the ground due to sculpted Grease, while the archers were totally ineffective due to Wall of Smoke. Oh, and my wizard killed the boss w/ a shortbow and the Caltrops cantrip.:D After we were done, the guy who's been running all the caster types in this group for years was getting on my case because I never bothered casting Lesser Orb of Fire.Sorry, back on topic. I'd make sure you're going to have the pre-reqs for Master Specialist... dam good prestige class, but I can't tell if you've ensured you can get in yet. It'll free up feats later, though. If you're determined to do some blasting, pick a good spell... mebbe Enervation or Wings of Flurry... and take Arcane Thesis.
I think you can get into Archmage a level sooner with Heighten Spell and Metamagic School Focus (divination).
If you didn't take Spontaneous Divination at level 5 Wiz, it rocks. Getting the Oracle Domain from Divine Oracle will boost your CL +2. It also gives you a better version of Evasion if you stick with it for a few levels.
BTW, if you take Spont Div at 5, you can qualify for Ultimate Magus very easily. You basically always get a wizard level since you only have one class but it opens UMD (and is much easier to qualify for than Loremaster).
I dont want ultimate magus, and i dont know how i feel about divine oracle beacuse my character is deffinatly not divine oriented. Im trying to optimize within my flavor restraints, and loremaster is the focus of my character.
Where is spontaneous divination?