I am casting Necro-Thread on the first gauntlet thread.
1) Contestants will win if they defeat their enemy. Characters will be placed in the following buckets : Single Classed Casters, Single Classed non-Casters, Multiclass Casters, Multi-class non-casters. Post which category you assume your character is in (warblade 20 is not a caster, fighter 18 / pious templar 2 is not a caster, wizard / fighter / abjurant champion/etc is a caster)
2) Character used by the challenger must be the same character (no retraining) beginning to end.
3) Equipment can be changed to deal with new wealth by level adjustments, you can replace sundered gear and you are considered at full, I request that you upgrade existing equipment rather than total rebuilds. Try not to use pre-knowledge.
4) Run the monster intelligently. Other posters will make comments. For damage: Either use weighted averages (hit chance * damage) or threshold (65% = full damage, and then again at 165% / etc). For Skill Checks / Saves, use threshold method at 55%.
5) Battle begins at 30 feet outside the monsters maximum reach.
6) This is a side note argument, in each case the terrain is considered to be neutral, trying to set up a proper battlemat for this is going to be a nightmare so we are working under the 'proper illumination for both sides to see correctly without a crapload of obstacles in the way' principle to keep the number of extraneous variables as manageable as I possibly can.
7) You may not hire, or gain through leadership, any followers, if you want to use leadership to get a mount (as khan did in one build) I will consider it but again trying to avoid too many variables.
8) Currently assume 25pb for characters
9) The battlefields are technically infinite in all directions, sorry dungeon crashers but I can't place barriers without it being arbitrary and most builds work well with a large expanse to play with.
10) Races that are allowed are as follows, PHB, Races, Any non-la Monstrous humanoid (orcs, goblins, kobolds), Non LA races from ECS, non LA races from XPH, Non LA races from MoI, Non LA races from FRCS, Non LA races from Stormwrack, sandstorm, and frostburn, in addition any Races of races without LA will be allowed (including Dragnborn but your base race must follow the rules as listed)
11) For druids, assume that all the monsters in books I pulled from exist for the purposes of your wildshaping, before anyone screams remember that I am allowing a fair amount of pulling.
12) Substitution options are allowable so long as they are from the aforementioned books
13) Spells for casters are available from PH2, PH, Completes, Races of, Spell compendium, Stormwrack, frostburn, sandstorm, Dungeonscape, XPH, MoI, ToM.
14) Feats and weapons listed in all aforementioned books are fair game for use by all.
15) This is the first of a couple ones I plan on resurrecting. Make sure your character is finished as it will be used (unchanged) for later gauntlets.
16) Most of these monsters cannot fly. Using levitation/fly for a non-threatened victory is considered cheese.
17) No TO (theoretical optimization) or campaign busting but CO is fine. (example: pun-pun is bad, persistant divine metamagic is fine)
18) Bonus cool points are awarded for style and ease of getting the character approved by a random DM.
19) No stat-drain/damage FTW tactics please.
20) Pre-buffing is allowed if the duration of the spell is more than 8 hours. Other than that, no prebuffing.
21) Post full characters (skills, feats, equipment, etc)
22) Characters do not have to win.
23) Additional books, UA, Heroes of Horror, Tome of Battle, Tome of Magic (the place where Binders are).
24) No flaws. Traits are acceptable
Scoring:
* Pyrrhic Victory : 1 point (character cannot last one more round)
* Victory : 3 points (character can last one more round)
* Overwhelming Victory : 5 points (no contest)
But they were also warned that they would suffer the slings and arrows and nitpicks of the other participating demipowers as well as the judgement council. Those seeking clarification or question needs to get concensus from posters for a clearer idea on rules, if a person violates them they must begin the battle again and again until their mistakes are ironed out.
CR1: Horrid Rat
The rat has +4 bite (1d6, + 1d6 acid – basically 2d6), AC 20 (touch 14), 7 hp. It has +3 initiative
CR2: Worg
The worg has +7 bite (1d6+4+trip), AC 14 (12 touch), 30 hp. It has +2 initiative
CR3: Runehound
The runehound is ridiculously powerful for CR3. It has +8 bite (2d6+5 with 10’ reach even though it is medium sized) and +5 ranged touch vile spew (5d6, DC15 ref for half, or web). DR5/silver, fast healing 3, cannot be flanked, blindsight 500’. AC 16 (touch 12). HP 37. It has initiative +2.
+4 fort/+5 reflex/+5 will.
CR4: Minotaur
CR5: Adult Arrowhawk
CR6: Girallon
CR7: Chuul
CR8: Lifeleech Otyugh
The lifeleech otyugh is very similar to the chuul, only dumber and a bit stronger. It has 4 tentacles at +14 (1d8+8, average 12.5, 15’ reach and Improved Grab at +18) and a bite +8 (1d6+4, average 7.5, 10’ reach). It is a triped, so quite stable, with a +16 to resist trips and crazy strength (27!). It has fast healing 5 and some funky magical abilities that he can’t use in a mere fighter. Its AC 21 is a bit low for this level, and his 94 hp are just 1 point over the chuul. It has +3 initiative.
CR9: 10 Headed Hydra
CR10: Razor Boar
CR11: Skindancer
CR12: War Troll
CR13: Urophion
CR14: Boneyard
CR15: Sea Drake
CR16: Battletitan
CR17: Maulgoth
CR18: Blackstone Gigant
CR19: Famine Spirit
CR20: Megapede
FAQ
Q: Do we have to start at level 1 and then fight through each combat, or what? Can you set your character level = to a certain point, then see how far up the encounters you can fight?
A: Yes, you have to show your character at each level and fight. However, you can just post it and say "I lose". This is to help people see the rate of maturity of a build, so one that (versus these challenges) cannot compete for most of the levels, is not a really viable build (for purposes of this challenge).
Q: No flaws? Why?
A1: Historic, when this thread was first created, that was the rules.
A2: It supercharges builds and is not always available.
A3: It is lopsided, as rarely-if-ever do the flaws that suposedly balance the feats ever come into play.
Q: Why is there a limited amount of books available for spells?
A1: To keep things manageable.
A2: Historic, when this thread was first created, there was a limited amount of books
A3: C'mon, is this really that big of a limitation to the big 5(7?)?
Q: Do we have to start at level 1 and then fight through each combat, or what? Can you set your character level = to a certain point, then see how far up the encounters you can fight?
A: Yes, you have to show your character at each level and fight. However, you can just post it and say "I lose". This is to help people see the rate of maturity of a build, so one that (versus these challenges) cannot compete for most of the levels, is not a really viable build (for purposes of this challenge).
Q: No flaws? Why?
A1: Historic, when this thread was first created, that was the rules.
A2: It supercharges builds and is not always available.
A3: It is lopsided, as rarely-if-ever do the flaws that suposedly balance the feats ever come into play.
Q: Why is there a limited amount of books available for spells?
A1: To keep things manageable.
A2: Historic, when this thread was first created, there was a limited amount of books
A3: C'mon, is this really that big of a limitation to the big 5(7?)?
For this example, I am showing both methods for damage calculation. It turns out that in most cases, there is no real difference between the two as far as accuracy of the fight -- or the outcome for that matter. I prefer the weighted average method, as it is easier to include crits ... but other people prefer the more simplistic threshold method.
Mr. Underpowered -- Barbarian
Character
Mr. Underpowered (missing skills, total equipment is 50 gp)
Level 1
Barbarian - human
Str 18
Dex 14
Con 11
Int 8
Wis 8
Cha 8
Hps: 12 (14 while raging)
AC: 12 (10 while raging or charging / 8 while both raging and charging)
Skills Jump 4
Mr. Underpowered (missing skills, total equipment is 50 gp)
Level 1
Barbarian - human
Str 18
Dex 14
Con 11
Int 8
Wis 8
Cha 8
Hps: 12 (14 while raging)
AC: 12 (10 while raging or charging / 8 while both raging and charging)
Skills Jump 4
Feats:
Power Attack
Improved Initiative
Equipment:
Greatsword
Tanking Sorceror
Character
Stalwart Sorceror variant (complete mage) - 1 spell known of highest spell slot (min 1), gain +2 hps/lvl, martial weapon proficiency.
Energy Shield variant (dungeonscape) -- when hit, I can use an immediate action to attack to block the damage by giving up a spell. DC 15+ spell level to block 5*spell level.
I use crits for both me and the monster.
formula is
Stalwart Sorceror variant (complete mage) - 1 spell known of highest spell slot (min 1), gain +2 hps/lvl, martial weapon proficiency.
Energy Shield variant (dungeonscape) -- when hit, I can use an immediate action to attack to block the damage by giving up a spell. DC 15+ spell level to block 5*spell level.
I use crits for both me and the monster.
formula is
Damage * hit percent + Damage * crit range * confirm * crit multiplier.
Level 1 Sorceror - Orc
Str 20
Dex 13
Con 12
Int 6
Wis 6
Char 12
AC 12
Hp 7
Equip
Longspear
Dagger
(not sure how much cash)
Skill: Concentration 4
Feats:
Improved Initiative, MWP Longbow
Spells Known:
0 Read Magic, Detect Magic, Ray of Frost, Acid Splash 5/day
1 Fist of stone: 4/day
BTW -- if anyone sees archangel ... this was his gauntlet.
I don't know Southern Magician -- never seen it -- only heard it referenced in possible Mystic Theurge cheese.
What about BoED and BoVD and Libris Mortis
If LM is in, I predict DMM will run over these challenges. Do we have to start at level 1 and then fight through each combat, or what? Can you set your character level = to a certain point, then see how far up the encounters you can fight?
DMM?
biggest problem is lack of burst damage for levels 1 and 2. At 3, you get Balor Nimbus.
When we did the gauntlet way-back-when the goal was to toss your character starting at level one and work your way upward. That helped people see slow-maturing builds/etc.
You do not need to beat each challenge to move onto the next one ... just post something ... this could be as simple as
Level 1: I lose
Level 2: I lose
Level 3: I come into my own ... here is the fight
I have some builds I posted a while back that I would like to see go through these gauntlets, as well as dusting off my old contributions to see if they are still viable.
Southern Magician=RoF just looked it up
What about BoED and BoVD and Libris Mortis
I can add these ... however, remember -- no TO cheese.
Also -- and I cannot stress how important this is -- make sure you post a completed character. This means that for spellcasters -- list spells known as well as spells prepared. There are other gauntlets that I will be ressing ... these same characters will have the option to go through them as well. This means that if you don't have a spell for this first one, you won't have it for the others.
I made the mistake of under-equipping my barbarian ... and then i had to fight the next gauntlet virtually naked. (like around 5% of wbl)
Jungle Orc Barbarian
Show
Abilities: 22, 10, 14, 6, 6, 6 respectively
Feat: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Spiked Chain), Racial Feat: Endurance
Skills: Handle animal 2, Survival 4, Jump 2
HP: 14, 16 raging
AC: 14, 12 if raging or charging, 10 if both
Equipment: Spiked chain, scale mail
Feat: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Spiked Chain), Racial Feat: Endurance
Skills: Handle animal 2, Survival 4, Jump 2
HP: 14, 16 raging
AC: 14, 12 if raging or charging, 10 if both
Equipment: Spiked chain, scale mail
Same question about the limited books for spell sources. Like where's magic of Faerun?
Show
Abilities: 23, 10, 14, 6, 6, 6 respectively
Classes: Barbarian 1/Fighter 3
Feats: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Spiked Chain), Toughness. Racial Feat: Endurance. Fighter Feat: Weapon Focus(Spiked Chain), Improved Initiative
Skills: Handle Animal 5, Survival 4, Jump 2
HP: 43, 51 raging
AC: 15, 13 if raging or charging, 11 if both
Equipment: +1 silver Spiked chain, Breastplate, potion of enlarge person
Abilities: 23, 10, 14, 6, 6, 6 respectively
Classes: Barbarian 1/Fighter 3
Feats: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Spiked Chain), Toughness. Racial Feat: Endurance. Fighter Feat: Weapon Focus(Spiked Chain), Improved Initiative
Skills: Handle Animal 5, Survival 4, Jump 2
HP: 43, 51 raging
AC: 15, 13 if raging or charging, 11 if both
Equipment: +1 silver Spiked chain, Breastplate, potion of enlarge person
Round 2: 5 foot step back, attack Minotaur for 20 damage(.95 x 2d6+14). It dies.
If it were to survive, I would AoO it again before it could hit me, killing it.
It probably wouldn't change anything, but how are you getting an AoO if it only needs to 5' step?
Round 2: 5 foot step back, attack Minotaur for 20 damage(.95 x 2d6+14). It dies.
If it were to survive, I would AoO it again before it could hit me, killing it.
It probably wouldn't change anything, but how are you getting an AoO if it only needs to 5' step?
I was way too tired when I wrote that up. Because in sleepy land you get to magically attack people who 5' adjust. My bad, thanks for the catch.
Also, I didn't realize how long running these relatively simple fights takes.
[sblock]
Abilities: 23(25), 10, 14, 6, 6, 6 respectively
Classes: Barbarian 1/Fighter 6
Feats: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Spiked Chain), Toughness, Self Sufficient. Racial Feat: Endurance. Fighter Feat: Weapon Focus(Spiked Chain), Improved Initiative, Power Attack, Close Quarters Combat
Skills: Handle Animal 5, Survival 5, Knowledge(nature) 1, Jump 3
HP: 64, 78 raging
AC: 15, 13 if raging or charging, 11 if both
Equipment: +2 silver Spiked chain, Gauntlets of ogre power +2, Breastplate, potion of fly, potion of enlarge person[/sblock]
Fight 7
Show
Chuul goes first.
Round 1: It moves up and attacks cautiously. it hits for 11 damage, and thanks to improved grab gets a grapple attempt. However, thanks to close quarters combat I get a free attack on it. Which hits for 15 damage, and gives me another +15 to the grapple check on top of my +13, for a +28 vs its +17. I think I avoid the grapple.
I rage and full attack the chuul, for 18 and 13 damage respectively.
Round 2: It's angry and full attacks me again, attempting to grapple as well with improved grab. It hits with both its claws for 23 damage, and attempts to grab. I get another attack on it for 18 damage, which gives me a +33 vs its +17, I resist the grapple again. (I'm down 34 hp, it's down 54)
I full attack again, hitting it for 18 and 13 again. (I'm down 34, it's down 85)
Round 3: Repeat round 2, it dies.
I limp away after kicking it's body a couple of times.
Round 1: It moves up and attacks cautiously. it hits for 11 damage, and thanks to improved grab gets a grapple attempt. However, thanks to close quarters combat I get a free attack on it. Which hits for 15 damage, and gives me another +15 to the grapple check on top of my +13, for a +28 vs its +17. I think I avoid the grapple.
I rage and full attack the chuul, for 18 and 13 damage respectively.
Round 2: It's angry and full attacks me again, attempting to grapple as well with improved grab. It hits with both its claws for 23 damage, and attempts to grab. I get another attack on it for 18 damage, which gives me a +33 vs its +17, I resist the grapple again. (I'm down 34 hp, it's down 54)
I full attack again, hitting it for 18 and 13 again. (I'm down 34, it's down 85)
Round 3: Repeat round 2, it dies.
I limp away after kicking it's body a couple of times.
Ashern, quite interesting. Have you considered Suel Arcanamach? You could still get up to... 7th, or 8th level spellcasting by level 20. Of course, these seem to be relatively straight-forward encounters. You'd lose a total of, what, two, maybe three points of base attack, I think.
Interesting Idea, and I'll toss it around, but I'm planning on rocking Primeval from here on out. I really just wanted to show that you can have a pure melee character take on all of these challenges, so I'm just working to jack my strength up as high as possible.
Round 2: It's angry and full attacks me again, attempting to grapple as well with improved grab. It hits with both its claws for 23 damage, and attempts to grab. I get another attack on it for 18 damage, which gives me a +33 vs its +17, I resist the grapple again. (I'm down 34 hp, it's down 54)
You don't have Combat Reflexes that I saw, and it gets a free grapple attempt on each claw. So you're quite possibly grappled with the second one. Since it has Constrict, it will do 3d6+5 more damage.
And now you're grappled, so you'll have to "waste" attacks to escape before you can use your weapon, or be stuck making inferior unarmed attacks against it (or draw a dagger/short sword, if you have one). I think you'll probably still win the fight, this just makes it less of a sure thing. It will be close.
Edit: Since you don't even get the first AoO due to the lack of Combat Reflexes, as Meyer points out below for another fight, I think it is actually quite possible you'll lose against the Chuul.
No flaws? Why?
Same question about the limited books for spell sources. Like where's magic of Faerun?
I will reply here, then create a FAQ section with this question in it.
No Flaws? Why?
Reason 1: Historic, when this thread was first created, that was the rules.
Reason 2: It supercharges builds and is not always available.
Reason 3: It is lopsided, as rarely-if-ever do the flaws that suposedly balance the feats ever come into play.
Why is there a limited amount of books available for spells?
Reason 1: To keep things manageable.
Reason 2: Historic, when this thread was first created, there was a limited amount of books
Reason 3: C'mon, is this really that big of a limitation to the big 5(7?)?
Alrighty, don't know how viable this character will be after low levels, but should be a fun attempt. Let's get the ball rolling.
Jungle Orc BarbarianShow
Feat: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Spiked Chain), Racial Feat: Endurance
HP: 14, 16 raging
AC: 14, 12 if raging or charging, 10 if both
Yes, my bad on combat reflexes. I don't get AoO's before I act first round. I also misunderstood improved grab, so I think I lose the fight with the Chuul as mentioned. Also, I did include the damage calculations for the first few fights, but it was slowing down how long it took to type everything out. I'm still using weighted averages, I just haven't been showing them. And you have all my stats in the level by level breakdown.
Finally, yes, I'm novaing. You're completely right, but I'm not a spellcaster, so I rely more on items. Besides, I was viewing this more as a series of arena fights than a "beat all of these in one long day" type scenario. Not sure what else to say there.
meyer_william3 can you stat out the Monsters in the first post .... i dont have access to all of them ... thanks
Yes, my bad on combat reflexes. I don't get AoO's before I act first round. I also misunderstood improved grab, so I think I lose the fight with the Chuul as mentioned. Also, I did include the damage calculations for the first few fights, but it was slowing down how long it took to type everything out. I'm still using weighted averages, I just haven't been showing them. And you have all my stats in the level by level breakdown.
... It helps if numbers are included -- and yes, it totally slows down the fights, but in the past, people have found errors in calculations (charging +2 included the following round, lack of AC reduction for enlarge person/etc) in my fights, as well as others.
Finally, yes, I'm novaing. You're completely right, but I'm not a spellcaster, so I rely more on items. Besides, I was viewing this more as a series of arena fights than a "beat all of these in one long day" type scenario. Not sure what else to say there.
Nothing wrong with nova-ing, I just pointed it out so that other people reading these fights knows that it is not sustainable -- not that sustainability is an aspect of these gauntlets.
Btw ... can you go back and score your fights based on the numbers I posted ... then I will add you to the 2nd page (linked the character and fights, as well as a scoring board).
meyer_william3 can you stat out the Monsters in the first post .... i dont have access to all of them ... thanks
can you post the speed of these monsters as well?
Further: binder from tome of magic, is it considered caster or non-caster?
19) No stat-drain/damage FTW tactics please. --> what is meant with this, no stat-draining of the monsters or no self-draining abilities like hellfire warlock and the like?
Dunno if I have the time to participate, but it seems like a fun challange
You can always go in.
I would have posted all of these with the caveat...run this as your first AND last encounter of the day. Thus, any /day abilities on gear you have apply on the first run, but do NOT on the second. Note the difference.
This shows the power of gear uses vs. constant class abilities.
Another way would be: Fight this creature 4 times. You may use any healing buffs in between, but any longer-term effects are considered to fall away or be dispelled.
Such would also apply to spellcasters. You'd also have to force them to have a 'generic' spell list, instead of customized for the monster.
====Aelryinth
Maybe I'm not looking right, but I only see a list of books allowed for races and a list of books allowed for spells.... isn't there a general list of books allowed, or are all WotC books allowed regarding classes, skills, etc?
Further: binder from tome of magic, is it considered caster or non-caster?
19) No stat-drain/damage FTW tactics please. --> what is meant with this, no stat-draining of the monsters or no self-draining abilities like hellfire warlock and the like?
Dunno if I have the time to participate, but it seems like a fun challange
Binder is considered non-caster -- unless there is a vestige that grants casting (or spell like powers) that simulate it being a caster.
the stat-drain/damage ftw tactics would be things like
"I cast (1d6 int damage) spell on the bear, defeating it"
You are welcome to be a hellfire warlock / etc if you want.
And yes, any class/Prc from any book mentioned is fine.
Binder would be considered a Gish-type, using buffs from class abilities.
You can always go in.
I would have posted all of these with the caveat...run this as your first AND last encounter of the day. Thus, any /day abilities on gear you have apply on the first run, but do NOT on the second. Note the difference.
This shows the power of gear uses vs. constant class abilities.
Another way would be: Fight this creature 4 times. You may use any healing buffs in between, but any longer-term effects are considered to fall away or be dispelled.
Such would also apply to spellcasters. You'd also have to force them to have a 'generic' spell list, instead of customized for the monster.
====Aelryinth
Ael,
Remember, this is the first of a couple different gauntlets. Some of them have multiple encounters ...
For spellcasters, it has already been said that they need to post their entire character -- which includes spells memorized / known (i.e. spellbook/etc)
Meh.
===Aelryinth
Sure, sure. But for spellcasters, it often comes down to "I cast Fly and then pummel it out of its reach" or some such thing. If they can customize spells, it's "I cast this spell three times, it fails one save, and I win."
Meh.
===Aelryinth
Ael, rules of the gauntlet are "no fly out of reach and pummel to death" .. from day one ... so no, that tactic won't be used.
I also created post 2, the faq as well as the list of entries.
Query: The sparrow has 1 ft. land-speed. How does this work?
Dismissal: Likely won't matter since threshold's in and flaws are out, so Strongheart Halfling'd be better than Hengeyokai.
Addendum/post-scriptum: speculation: Strongheart Halfling Warlock, HNRT Fighter, template filler (Dark, Chameleon, God-blooded, ), Blend into Shadows, Darkstalker.
Query: Does Damage Reduction apply per attack?
Query: Does Damage Reduction apply to the extra damage from Hit-and-Run Tactics ACF Fighter added onto an Eldritch Blast?
Query: I plan to have the Warlock invoke "Darkness" as often as possible. Is this considered a constant buff?
Answer: yes
Query: Does Damage Reduction apply to the extra damage from Hit-and-Run Tactics ACF Fighter added onto an Eldritch Blast?
Answer: yes
Query: I plan to have the Warlock invoke "Darkness" as often as possible. Is this considered a constant buff?
Answer: if it lasts 24 hours Yes, but the "Darkness" Invocation has a shorter Duration... notice:
Darkness(CArc p133) 10min/lvl(D),no SR>
– Touched object radiates shadowy illumination in a 20’ radius. Creatures in the darkness have Concealment (20% miss chance).Darkvision cannot see through this spell. The darkness may be blocked by putting the object in a container. This spell Counters and Dispels spells with the [light] category of equal or lower level. Effective Spell Level: 2nd.
so you would probably have to initiate it During the Combat
just my opinion
heres my Entry:
Human
Cloistered Cleric 1
Attributes: (25pt buy)
14 Str
14 Dex
10 Con
12 Int
12 Wis
11 Cha
Feats:
1st lvl: Education
Travel Devotion(human bonus)
Knowledge Devotion(give up Knowledge Domain)
Improved initiative(Time bonus)
Point Blank Shot(Elf Bonus)
Traits:
Aggressive(+2 initiative, -1 AC)
Quick(+10 land speed,-1hp/lvl)
Domains:
Knowledge(given up for Knowledge Devotion)
Time
Elf
Equipment:
5gp Longspear(1d8)
25gp Studded Leather Armor
13gp Light Wooden Shield with Spike
50gp Tanglefoot bag ... in Hand
20gp Alchemist Fire ... in Belt
1gp Wooden Holy Symbol
1gp Travelers outfit
Skills:
32 skill points to spend
Class Skills:
4 ranks Concentration
4 ranks Knowledge (arcana)
4 ranks Knowledge(religion)
4 ranks Knowledge(the planes)
4 ranks Knowledge(Dungeoneering)
4 ranks Knowledge(Nature)
4 ranks Spellcraft
Cross Class Skills:
1 Rank Tumble
1 Rank Spot
Spells Prepared:
0-lvl:
3x Guidance
1st lvl:
Bless
Divine Favor
True Strike: Domain
Combat Stats:
Initiative: +8
Speed 40'
HP 5
AC 16 (base 10 + 3 Armor +1 Shield +2 Dex), Touch 12, Flatfooted 14
Saves(+2 F, +2 R, +3 W)
BAB +0
Ranged Attack bonus: +0 BAB +2 Dex +1 PtBlkSht +1 Insight Knowledge Devo = +4
Melee Attack Bonus: +0 BAB +2 Str +1 Insight Knowledge Devo = +3
Damage:
Alchemist Fire 1d6 + 1d6 next round Ave 7 damage over 2 rounds
Longspear 1d8 + 2 Str = 6 damage
Updated Tactics:
i believe that he wins ..... wins Initiative, Activates Travel Devotion, Move to 10' from Rat(Swift), throw Tanglefoot Bag(ranged Touch Attack)(Standard Action) ... move 30' back(move)
round 2: then do the same with Alchemist Fire(swift action).... and continue after with Longspear keeping out of its reach i will have 10' reach(but still threaten Adjacent(Spiked Shield))
i have 8 rounds left to kill it.... shouldnt be a Problem .... will keep distance and use Spells to Buff if needed
"run monsters intelligently": does that mean that even a monster with an animalistic intelligence should be run smartly, or should it be run appropriate for it's intelligence?
On wealth: as far as I know ability score improvements gained with tomes and wishes need to be gained at once; if you use a +3 tome of intelligence, you need a +5 tome to increase the score to +5 later. Does that mean that you have to keep the tome +3 on your list as well? Or is it simply that at lvl 15 I can spend again that amount of money. (I know items are mentioned in the rules, but it's not really clear to me).
Last one: I'd like to use some prestige class options as featured under "adaption". Would that be ok? I want to make a variant of what I posted here, with the exception of the stuff from pathfinder, of course.
Thnx!
@Carnivore: aren't you supposed to give up a domain for the domainfeat corresponding to that domain (that is, give up knowledge domain for the knowledge devotion feat)?
If you want to get it for free you can. Or you can actually take the feat, and keep the domain.
heres my Entry:
Human
Cloistered Cleric 1
Attributes: (25pt buy)
14 Str
14 Dex
10 Con
12 Int
12 Wis
11 Cha
Feats:
Education
Travel Devotion, Law Devotion, Improved initiative, Point Blank Shot
Domains:
Knowledge(given up for Law Devotion)
Time
Elf
Equipment:
5gp Longspear(1d8)
25gp Studded Leather Armor
3gp Light Wooden Shield
50gp Tanglefoot bag
20gp Alchemist Fire
i believe that he wins ..... wins Initiative, Activates Travel Devotion, move 30' towards Rat(swift)... throw Tanglefoot Bag(ranged Touch Attack)(Standard Action) ... move 30' back(move)
then do the same with Alchemist Fire(swift action)Activating Law Devotion(+3 to Attacks)) .... and continue after with Longspear keeping out of its reach
This post is incomplete -- missing skills, spells known, and as of this moment, doesn't have a holy symbol -- which might cause you issues.
Also, unless you have the tanglefoot bag in your hand, you need an action to draw it ...
Additionally, the tanglefoot glue is brittle and falls off in 2d4 rounds, so ... please post more so that it is clear that you can still win.
More general questions:
"run monsters intelligently": does that mean that even a monster with an animalistic intelligence should be run smartly, or should it be run appropriate for it's intelligence?
On wealth: as far as I know ability score improvements gained with tomes and wishes need to be gained at once; if you use a +3 tome of intelligence, you need a +5 tome to increase the score to +5 later. Does that mean that you have to keep the tome +3 on your list as well? Or is it simply that at lvl 15 I can spend again that amount of money. (I know items are mentioned in the rules, but it's not really clear to me).
Last one: I'd like to use some prestige class options as featured under "adaption". Would that be ok? I want to make a variant of what I posted here, with the exception of the stuff from pathfinder, of course.
Thnx!
"Run monsters intelligently" -- means that play them as you think they should be played if you were the DM and not the player.
Tomes: consider that once you buy the item, you need to eternally set that amount of money aside. When you (later on) need to upgrade it, pay for the next tome (which will include the money previously spent).
If the PrC (and adaption) is from one of the posted books, great. If not, your entry won't be in the scoring, but it might be nice to see.
@Carnivore: aren't you supposed to give up a domain for the domainfeat corresponding to that domain (that is, give up knowledge domain for the knowledge devotion feat)?
you are not required to give up the corresponding Domain .... for the Devotion feat, in general most give up the Bonus Knowledge Domain for Knowledge Devotion ... but in this case Law Devotion gives a flat +3 Sacred to hit which is more useful at this point than a +1 Insight to hit and damage, since the skill check will be so low
This post is incomplete -- missing skills, spells known, and as of this moment, doesn't have a holy symbol -- which might cause you issues.
Also, unless you have the tanglefoot bag in your hand, you need an action to draw it ...
Additionally, the tanglefoot glue is brittle and falls off in 2d4 rounds, so ... please post more so that it is clear that you can still win.
sorry about the Incompleteness.... will get Skills completed... Spells are irrellavant, since he wont be using them(but i can include them), will include a holy symbol
assumed the Tanglefoot bag was in Hand, the Longspear was in other Hand ..... assume average duration for Tanglefoot bag = 5 rounds
you are not required to give up the corresponding Domain .... for the Devotion feat, in general most give up the Bonus Knowledge Domain for Knowledge Devotion ... but in this case Law Devotion gives a flat +3 Sacred to hit which is more useful at this point than a +1 Insight to hit and damage, since the skill check will be so low
Minor quibble ... at 1st level you cannot actually even choose the knowledge devotion due to the level 3 requirement. Additionally, as a cloistered cleric when you give up knowledge domain, you suddenly no longer have access to those tasty knowledges (weird, but look at skill list, it points out that they come from the domain) ... I understand this is neither here nor there, just including it.
sorry about the Incompleteness.... will get Skills completed... Spells are irrellavant, since he wont be using them(but i can include them), will include a holy symbol
assumed the Tanglefoot bag was in Hand, the Longspear was in other Hand ..... assume average duration for Tanglefoot bag = 5 rounds
Regardless of if you think spells are irrelevant, you should still include them
remember, there are other gauntlets to take this character (as posted) through ... those spells might make the difference between failure and success later.Also, please post some numbers in your post --- to hit, damage, etc ... as here is how it looks to me:
When you make your initial touch attack with tanglefoot bag, you have a +2 to hit (dex only), versus a flatfooted touch attack of 11 (10 + 1 for size). This is only a 60% chance to hit, which misses using the threshold method. If you use the weighted damage method, then the rat is only stuck for 60% of 5 rounds -- or 3 rounds, which might not be enough to kill it ... Am I missing something?
** edit, missed the point blank shot -- so threshold method would not have been a miss. See, this is what I was saying earlier about numbers being posted being important
Minor quibble ... at 1st level you cannot actually even choose the knowledge devotion due to the level 3 requirement. Additionally, as a cloistered cleric when you give up knowledge domain, you suddenly no longer have access to those tasty knowledges (weird, but look at skill list, it points out that they come from the domain) ... I understand this is neither here nor there, just including it.
hence why i choose Education .... get Knowledge Allways as a Class Skill no matter what other classes i take, and get +1 to 2 knowledge skills.... if you keep the Domain then you only get the Knowledge skills as class skill(as far as spending the class Skill points on them) as long as you are a cleric
Regardless of if you think spells are irrelevant, you should still include them
Also, please post some numbers in your post --- to hit, damage, etc ... as here is how it looks to me:
When you make your initial touch attack with tanglefoot bag, you have a +2 to hit (dex only), versus a flatfooted touch attack of 11 (10 + 1 for size). This is only a 60% chance to hit, which misses using the threshold method. If you use the weighted damage method, then the rat is only stuck for 60% of 5 rounds -- or 3 rounds, which might not be enough to kill it ... Am I missing something?
sure ... will post some numbers .... i forgot.... i included the wrong order of things .... activate Law Devotion before throwing the Tanglefoot bag .... to assure hit
will clear it up later
Totally agree law devotion is very usefull, my cleric will have it definitely
Though for complexities sake it might be fore fun to go with the chaos devotion.-Meyer: The prestige class and adaptions are from Tome of Magic, should be ok. Another question: is Tome of Battle allowed? You mentioned the warblade in the original post, but couln't find ToB among books allowed.
- Carnivore: my Complete Champion says on page 53, under clerics and domain feats, ".... In addition, you can choose to give up access to a domain in exchange for the corresponding domain feat." That means you can't give up knowledge domain for law devotion domain feat, doesn't it?
Totally agree law devotion is very usefull, my cleric will have it definitely
-Meyer: The prestige class and adaptions are from Tome of Magic, should be ok. Another question: is Tome of Battle allowed? You mentioned the warblade in the original post, but couln't find ToB among books allowed.
He could just take Law Devotion as a feat instead of Education, and keep the Knowledge domain. I don't know why he isn't doing that, anyway...
Meyer: The prestige class and adaptions are from Tome of Magic, should be ok. Another question: is Tome of Battle allowed? You mentioned the warblade in the original post, but couln't find ToB among books allowed.
Oops, another oversight -- thanks. I will be fixing that.
PhraedrusXY,
He did it that way, as, for skills, education is better than the domain (you get bonuses to a couple domains).
Travel Devotion
Type: Domain
Source: Complete Champion
You can move quickly around the battlefield.
Benefit: Once per day as a swift action, you can activate this ability to move up to your speed as a swift action each round. Thus, you can move your speed and then take a full-round action, or move and take two other actions (two move actions or one move action and one standard action). This effect lasts for 1 minute.
Special: You cannot take a 5-foot step in the same round that you use this feat to move as a swift action.
You can select this feat multiple times, gaining one additional daily use each time you take it.
If you have the ability to turn or rebuke undead, you gain one additional daily use of this feat for each two daily turn or rebuke uses you expend.
sorry about the confusion with Law Devotion and Knowledge Domain.... i can give up the Knowledge Domain and take Knowledge Devotion ... which i will do .....
just so you Know .... this build will probably end up like this:
Cloistered Cleric 1/ Fighter(Thug Variant) 18/ ??? 1
it will end up an Archer build .... and Education makes all the Knowledge Skills always class Skills, even for Fighter ....
when Travel Devotion is Activated..... it lasts 1 Minute(10 Rounds) .... i dont have to activate it again .....Travel Devotion
Type: Domain
Source: Complete Champion
You can move quickly around the battlefield.Benefit: Once per day as a swift action, you can activate this ability to move up to your speed as a swift action each round. Thus, you can move your speed and then take a full-round action, or move and take two other actions (two move actions or one move action and one standard action). This effect lasts for 1 minute.
Special: You cannot take a 5-foot step in the same round that you use this feat to move as a swift action.
You can select this feat multiple times, gaining one additional daily use each time you take it.
If you have the ability to turn or rebuke undead, you gain one additional daily use of this feat for each two daily turn or rebuke uses you expend.
sorry about the confusion with Law Devotion and Knowledge Domain.... i can give up the Knowledge Domain and take Knowledge Devotion ... which i will do .....
just so you Know .... this build will probably end up like this:
Cloistered Cleric 1/ Fighter(Thug Variant) 18/ ??? 1
it will end up an Archer build .... and Education makes all the Knowledge Skills always class Skills, even for Fighter ....
thanks ... i missed that part of it -- i had thought it was one activation = one move
Query: Does Damage Reduction apply to the extra damage from Hit-and-Run Tactics [Fighter ACF] added onto an Eldritch Blast?
Answer: yes
As far as I have researched, the extra damage is the weapon's type. e.g. apply the "Point Blank Shot" feat to an arrow to get +1 Piercing damage. PBS + Eldritch Blast = +1 untyped, right?
Query: Does Damage Reduction apply to the extra damage from Hit-and-Run Tactics [Fighter ACF] added onto an Eldritch Blast?
Answer: yes
As far as I have researched, the extra damage is the weapon's type. e.g. apply the "Point Blank Shot" feat to an arrow to get +1 Piercing damage. PBS + Eldritch Blast = +1 untyped, right?
AFAIK that's correct.
by the way .... i think i should get 5 points because there is no contest for my character vs the Rat, it loses without even being able to attack me
should i make a New post for my characters 2nd lvl ... or just Sblock the 1st lvl and Post the second in the same post?
by the way .... i think i should get 5 points because there is no contest for my character vs the Rat, it loses without even being able to attack me
I think it would be easier with a new post per level, that way if there are changes, it is easy to reference. I am linking them on the first page, so they will be easy to find either way.
If you judge yourself at 5 points, that is what you will be shown as
however, I think your character will lose to some of the other gauntlets -- or at least it won't be as easy.Note: I have an interest in making this point
More questions:
- how about pre-knowledge? E.g. that runehound: I know it's a son of a bitch without a silvered weapon. Would my lvl 3 cleric know this and can start with one? Or should I have him make a knowledge check to know? And if I would give him knowledge (dungeoneering) to have him make the check, wouldn't I already be using pre-knowledge in the build (by giving him this not really logical skill)?
- Basicly the "how about pre-knowledge question" goes whenever I have to make a choice: use the law devotion feat for a +3 AC or +3 to hit, charge or notn.. all those choices would effectively have to be made pretty "random" without any information, or am I too strict now? (to a lesser extend, same for potions/scrolls/equipment to buy, which spells to memorize)
- question on pre-knowledge also goes for the binder... it can choose already at lvl 1 between about 8 different vestiges, of which several would be a logical choice. When I use one in a game, I use a great variaty, depending on the adventure, there's not really a default. How would I make this choice for a vestige in the gaunlet? Does my binder know he goes in the arena, does he have an idea what he's up against?
- Meyer: on ToB, what will you be fixing: that you can or you can't use it?
sorry for all the questions, this is just more complicated then I thought it would be
I think it would be easier with a new post per level, that way if there are changes, it is easy to reference. I am linking them on the first page, so they will be easy to find either way.
ok .... great no problem .... will do that
If you judge yourself at 5 points, that is what you will be shown as
i mean just at this level ... but the build i have in mind should do fine even later... we will see
will post my next level soon
- opinion on buffs that have a limited duration, but can be used without limit by a character: I'd say they count as a permanent buff. Sure, their duration is under 8 hours, but in a normal game, you'd use them again every time it's running out of use, effectively being 24 hour buffs.
Note: I have an interest in making this point
For limited duration unlimited use buffs ... lets think this through ... if you decide to spend half your waking life refreshing a buff, then yes, it would be reasonable to have it full duration. If the buff lasts 1 minute, but you spend less than 1/2 your life resetting the counter, then the length of it would be somewhere between almost full (one round used) and empty (just expired). Let me know your thoughts on this. This is similar to how in the MM you have monsters with at-will abilities that don't have them applied.
More questions:
- how about pre-knowledge? E.g. that runehound: I know it's a son of a bitch without a silvered weapon. Would my lvl 3 cleric know this and can start with one? Or should I have him make a knowledge check to know? And if I would give him knowledge (dungeoneering) to have him make the check, wouldn't I already be using pre-knowledge in the build (by giving him this not really logical skill)?
No pre-knowledge unless the gauntlet gives you some. There are 3-4 gauntlets that we used years ago that I am rezzing ... the character you use in one is the one you would use in the next one. It stands then to reason, that a silver weapon might not be useful in the next one.
Also, no knowledge check in the world will let you know at the store to buy a silver weapon before you encounter a monster. Now, if you routinely buy silver, cold iron, and other rare materials el-cheapo weapons, then the knowledge check could tell you "hey buddy, don't use the +1 longsword, use the bone longsword" -- unsure of what you were asking.
Basically the "how about pre-knowledge question" goes whenever I have to make a choice: use the law devotion feat for a +3 AC or +3 to hit, charge or notn.. all those choices would effectively have to be made pretty "random" without any information, or am I too strict now? (to a lesser extend, same for potions/scrolls/equipment to buy, which spells to memorize)
Ok -- treat it like this. Make your character, now ... pretend you are no longer fighting a rune-hound, but instead an aquatic plant monster underwater (potentially in a different gauntlet). If you say to yourself "Gee, I should have bought a Breathe Water potion" then you are using pre-knowledge. If you say instead "Ok, since I am wearing a chain shirt, reasonable strength, I should be good to go" you are not using preknowledge.
Once you arrive on the battlefield, you know as much as you would if you were sitting at a gaming table with a reasonable DM and group. If you routinely are able to figure out the exact quantity of power attack to use for the statistically correct kill shot ... then go-for-it, if you need to guess, then go-for-it.
I hope this helps.
question on pre-knowledge also goes for the binder... it can choose already at lvl 1 between about 8 different vestiges, of which several would be a logical choice. When I use one in a game, I use a great variaty, depending on the adventure, there's not really a default. How would I make this choice for a vestige in the gaunlet? Does my binder know he goes in the arena, does he have an idea what he's up against?
If the gauntlet says "preknowledge" (this one doesn't, some of the others do), then you are walking into an area forwarned (i.e. mini-adventure), if there is no information, assume this is a wandering monster which is not typically found in this area. Feel free to ask specific questions, the gauntlets were made years ago and are not changing.
Meyer: on ToB, what will you be fixing: that you can or you can't use it?
I added ToB and ToM to the allowed books. This was an oversight.
sorry for all the questions, this is just more complicated then I thought it would be
Keep the questions coming, it is helping me to revise/update this and will be helpful in the following gauntlets.
Fun, btw, thnx for ressurecting this one
- A heavy warhorse is easily available at lvl 2, money-wise. Can I buy one? I understand it's a reather superior piece of equipment at that level, but couldn't find a reason not too.
- considering many items have a masterwork variant that gives a +2 on a skill check for 50 extra gc, can I buy a 70 gc masterwork military saddle? (for +2 on all ride checks, +4 to stay in saddle)
- when working with several modes of attack, should I use the tresshold method for each method seperately? That would make the most sense to me, since different attacks do different damage, and if you all make it one pool, it's easy to steer when the attack that does the most damage hits. (example: when I have a weapon attack, a natural weapon attack and my horse, if allowed, has an attack, I intend to use a 65% treshold for each of those, not for them together).
Proposition: "Alchemical Silver has no damage penalty. The fact that Silver has a damage penalty is sort of justifiable,
except that in D&D weapons made out of wood don’t have a damage penalty. The game simply doesn’t
have a fine enough grain to keep track of the ways in which you’d rather have a sword made out of steel
than a silver plated one. Also the thing where DR 1/Silver is in fact impossible to beat is incredibly dumb." - FrankTrollman and K's Dungeonomicon
Second proposition: "There can only be five! An unfortunate and unintended result of the 3.5 DR rules is that as more materi-
als and monsters get written, the chances of you having whatever material your target’s DR is penetrated
by drops to a number pretty close to zero. In order to keep that from happening, we propose that for the
purposes of DR, there are only 5 materials, and absolutely everything counts as one of those five. So if
your weapon isn’t made out of: Adamantine, Iron, Silver, Stone, or Wood, it counts as being made of one
of those materials. Here is a suggested weapon equivalency chart:
...
. Silver:
– Pandemonic Silver
– Astral Driftmetal
– Entropium – Nerra Mirrorblade
– Ysgardian Heartwire
– Mithril"
Human
Cloistered Cleric 1/ Fighter 1(Thug variant)
Attributes: (25pt buy)
14 Str
14 Dex
10 Con
12 Int
12 Wis
11 Cha
Feats:
1st lvl: Education
Travel Devotion(human bonus)
Knowledge Devotion(give up Knowledge Domain)
Improved initiative(Time bonus)
Point Blank Shot(Elf Bonus)
Traits:
Aggressive(+2 initiative, -1 AC)
Quick(+10 land speed,-1hp/lvl)
Domains:
Knowledge(given up for Knowledge Devotion)
Time
Elf
Equipment: (900gp)
600gp Mighty(+2 Str) Composite Longbow
1gp 20x regular Arrows ... all arrows in quivers on Back beside Bow
2gp 20x Cold Iron Arrows
3gp 20x Alchemical Silver Arrows
15gp Longsword ... on Back Sheath
75gp Studded Leather Armor with Spikes
25gp Buckler
50gp Tanglefoot bag ... in Belt
20gp Alchemist Fire ... in Belt
1gp Wooden Holy Symbol .... in Hand, with cord around my neck
1gp Travelers outfit
50gp Potion Shield of Faith ... in Belt
843gp spent
Skills:
38 skill points to spend
Class Skills:
5 ranks Concentration
5 ranks Knowledge (arcana)
5 ranks Knowledge(religion)
5 ranks Knowledge(the planes)
5 ranks Knowledge(Dungeoneering)
5 ranks Knowledge(Nature)
4 ranks Spellcraft
Cross Class Skills:
1 Rank Tumble
1 Rank Spot
Spells Prepared:
0-lvl:
3x Guidance
1st lvl:
Bless
Divine Favor
True Strike: Domain
Combat Stats:
Initiative: +8
Speed 40'
HP 9
AC 16 (base 10 + 3 Armor +1 Shield +2 Dex), Touch 12, Flatfooted 14
Saves(+4 F, +2 R, +3 W)
BAB +1
Ranged Attack bonus: +1 BAB +2 Dex +1 PtBlkSht +1 Insight Knowledge Devo +1 Luck= +6
Melee Attack Bonus: +1 BAB +2 Str +1 Insight Knowledge Devo +1 Luck= +5
Damage:
Alchemist Fire 1d6 + 1d6 next round Ave 7 damage over 2 rounds
Longsword 1d8 + 2 Str +1 Insight +1 Luck= 8 damage
Composite Longbow 1d8 +2 Str +1 insight +1 Luck= 8 damage
Updated Tactics:
i start holding Holy Symbol in my left hand(Buckler strapped to this arm), right hand free ..... Holy Symbol is on a cord around my neck so i can Drop it as a Free action without it falling to the ground, and i can grab it later(Move action) if needed
Round 1: wins Initiative, Activates Travel Devotion, Move 40' back away from Worg(Swift), cast Divine Favor(standard action) Drop Holy Symbol(Free Action), Move 40' back away from Worg while Drawing Tanglefoot Bag from belt(Move action)... now 110' from Worg, Worg will probably choose to make a Double move right at me(Charges possibly)
stats Me 9/9 hp, Worg 30/30hp
round 2: Worg is 10' from me .... i throw Tanglefoot Bag(ranged Touch Attack)(Standard Action) ... move 40' backwhile Drawing Alchemist Fire from belt(move), move 40' more away(Swift) ..... it is Entangled(5 rounds) if it can move it will advance @ 25' speed but cant run or Charge, so it only moves 25'(range between = 25')
stats Me 9/9 hp, Worg 30/30hp
round 3: throw Alchemist Fire(standard action).... move 40' back while Drawing Longbow from back(move), move 40' more away(Swift)... it is Entangled(4 rounds) if it can move it will advance @ 25' speed but cant run or Charge, so it only moves 25'(range between = 80')..... it takes 3 damage from fire
stats Me 9/9 hp, Worg 27/30hp
round 4: Worg is 80' from me ..... move 40' back, Fire 1 shot(hits 60% x 8 damage = 4.8) ... 4 Damage(Standard action) ... move 40' back(Swift action) .... it is Entangled(3 rounds) if it can move it will advance @ 25' speed but cant run or Charge, so it only moves 25'(range between = 135')..... it takes 3 damage from fire
stats Me 9/9 hp, Worg 20/30hp
round 5: Worg is 135' from me ..... move 20' forward(move action), Fire 1 shot(hits 60% x 7 damage = 4.2) ... 4 Damage(Standard action) ... move 40' back(Swift action) .... it is Entangled(2 rounds) if it can move it will advance @ 25' speed but cant run or Charge, so it only moves 25'(range between = 130').....
stats Me 9/9 hp, Worg 16/30hp
round 6: Worg is 130' from me ..... move 15' forward(move action), Fire 1 shot(hits 60% x 7 damage = 4.2) ... 4 Damage(Standard action) ... move 40' back(Swift action) .... it is Entangled(1 rounds) if it can move it will advance @ 25' speed but cant run or Charge, so it only moves 25'(range between = 130').....
stats Me 9/9 hp, Worg 12/30hp
round 7: Worg is 130' from me ..... move 40' back(move action), Fire 1 shot(hits 60% x 7 damage = 4.2) ... 4 Damage(Standard action) ... move 40' back(Swift action) .... it now charges 100'(range between = 110').....
stats Me 9/9 hp, Worg 8/30hp
round 8: Worg is 110' from me ..... move 40' back(move action), Fire 1 shot(hits 60% x 7 damage = 4.2) ... 4 Damage(Standard action) ... move 40' back(Swift action) .... it now charges 100'(range between = 90').....
stats Me 9/9 hp, Worg 4/30hp
round 9: Worg is 90' from me ... Fire 1 shot(hits 60% x 7 damage = 4.2) ... 4 Damage(Standard action) Worg is Dead
i win
- A heavy warhorse is easily available at lvl 2, money-wise. Can I buy one? I understand it's a reather superior piece of equipment at that level, but couldn't find a reason not too.
No. This is the slippery slope to buying 50 dogs and having them beat the monster for you ...
Here is the rule for you ...
7) You may not hire, or gain through leadership, any followers, if you want to use leadership to get a mount (as khan did in one build) I will consider it but again trying to avoid too many variables.
- considering many items have a masterwork variant that gives a +2 on a skill check for 50 extra gc, can I buy a 70 gc masterwork military saddle? (for +2 on all ride checks, +4 to stay in saddle)
The "no" is also because this is really a variant of "i fly and attack without being threatened"
when working with several modes of attack, should I use the tresshold method for each method seperately? That would make the most sense to me, since different attacks do different damage, and if you all make it one pool, it's easy to steer when the attack that does the most damage hits. (example: when I have a weapon attack, a natural weapon attack and my horse, if allowed, has an attack, I intend to use a 65% treshold for each of those, not for them together).
No ... attacks are one pool, else you find yourself never missing if you can make it 65% or higher. (i attack with a natural attack at 65%, i attack with a sword at 65% and my horse (not allowed) attacks at 65% ... three hits, as opposed to what is meant to be two hits).
Combat Stats:
Ranged Attack bonus: +1 BAB +2 Dex +1 PtBlkSht +1 Insight Knowledge Devo +1 Luck= +6
Round 1: wins Initiative, Activates Travel Devotion, Move 40' back away from Worg(Swift), cast Divine Favor(standard action) Drop Holy Symbol(Free Action), Move 40' back away from Worg while Drawing Tanglefoot Bag from belt(Move action)... now 110' from Worg, Worg will probably choose to make a Double move right at me(Charges possibly)
stats Me 9/9 hp, Worg 30/30hp
How would this combat be different if we include the rules from SRD Combat 1 (Full round action to prepare to throw splash weapon)
Also, with only a +6 to hit vs the worgs flat footed touch ac of 10 is a 85% chance, the next touch attack (alchemist fire) is only a 75% chance, this yields a 160% chance -- so you miss with the alchemist fire ... (this affects last combat as well).
Unless you are using the weighted average, in which case the worg is stuck for only 4 rounds, not 5 and only takes 2.65 damage from fire, not 3 (this difference here make the worg at 0 in final round, not dead which means it is a tie). Hmm, it is looking like you should keep track of hitpoints into the tenths, you will do more damage (after looking at your combat closer)
Lastly, this seems to be very similar to "I fly and it cannot attack me".
round 7: Worg is 130' from me ..... move 40' back(move action), Fire 1 shot(hits 60% x 7 damage = 4.2) ... 4 Damage(Standard action) ... move 40' back(Swift action) .... it now charges 100'(range between = 110').....
Why doesn't it run, ending adjacent to you, cause if so ...
round 8: Worg is 5' from me ..... move 40' back(move action), Fire 1 shot(hits 70% x 7 damage = 4.9) ... 4 Damage(Standard action) ... move 40' back(Swift action) .... it now charges 80'(range between = 5')..... It attacks (+9 vs ac 16 = 65% * 7.5 = 4.85), trip attempt (+3 vs +2, 60%, a fail)
stats Me 4/9 hp, Worg 4/30hp
round 9: Worg is 5' from me ... move 5' back (nonaction), Fire 1 shot(hits 70% x 7 damage = 4.9) ... 4 Damage(Standard action) Worg is Dead
... just this change here turns the fight from an overwhelming victory (5 points) into a phyrric victory as you could not last one more round. If we apply the other changes here ... this turns into a loss.
also if it Runs and gets 5', i get AoO(Armor spikes) .... i can also Run and will be able to maintain the distance(i also will boost AC with Potion while moving), since i can spend Turn Attempts to use Travel Devotion a second time
also the Weighted averages would not affect the next Touch attack, since it happens in the next round ..... if that was the case, i could always cast True Strike or Guidance or both if needed to make sure i hit ..... but that would extend the combat requiring using Turn Attempts for an additional Travel Devotion
a Phyrric victory is fine by me
in a way it is similar to "I fly and it cannot attack me"..... however, the same can be said of a Tripping Build, "I trip you, you fall down and cant attack me, i beat on you" ..... you did not specify that the builds were required to trade blows .... "I hit you, you hit me" combat ... most all combats are about Action and Mobility, the more actions you can get, and the more you can dominate in mobility(move better than them, reduce thier movement)
Just tossing that out there ... and yes, you are correct that builds do not have to trade blows (else archers, warlocks, trippers, etc) are not viable for this. Unfortunately, the early entrants get the most scrutiny as other people use what they learn in designing their entrants.
also if it Runs and gets 5', i get AoO(Armor spikes) .... i can also Run and will be able to maintain the distance(i also will boost AC with Potion while moving), since i can spend Turn Attempts to use Travel Devotion a second time
I have no idea how that would work ... just showing you a slightly different outcome.
also the Weighted averages would not affect the next Touch attack, since it happens in the next round ..... if that was the case, i could always cast True Strike or Guidance or both if needed to make sure i hit ..... but that would extend the combat requiring using Turn Attempts for an additional Travel Devotion
There are two different methods, I was mentioning each for other readers ...
Threshold method does affect each attack (it is a cumulative method).
Weighted average (as you mention) does not take into account past attacks -- you are correct, but my post didn't imply that it did (I listed the percent of success times the amount of damage for that attack).
However, you didn't address my question about the combat 1 section of SRD saying it takes a full round action to prepare a splash weapon for use ...
re: Damage Reduction and Special Materials:
Proposition: "Alchemical Silver has no damage penalty. The fact that Silver has a damage penalty is sort of justifiable, except that in D&D weapons made out of wood don’t have a damage penalty. The game simply doesn’t have a fine enough grain to keep track of the ways in which you’d rather have a sword made out of steel than a silver plated one. Also the thing where DR 1/Silver is in fact impossible to beat is incredibly dumb." - FrankTrollman and K's Dungeonomicon
Second proposition: "There can only be five! An unfortunate and unintended result of the 3.5 DR rules is that as more materials and monsters get written, the chances of you having whatever material your target’s DR is penetrated by drops to a number pretty close to zero. In order to keep that from happening, we propose that for the purposes of DR, there are only 5 materials, and absolutely everything counts as one of those five. So if your weapon isn’t made out of: Adamantine, Iron, Silver, Stone, or Wood, it counts as being made of one of those materials. Here is a suggested weapon equivalency chart:
...
. Silver:
– Pandemonic Silver
– Astral Driftmetal
– Entropium – Nerra Mirrorblade
– Ysgardian Heartwire
– Mithril"
No thank you, I prefer to change the rules of DnD as little as possible.
FYI: there are items / enhancements that can be applied to weapons to take care of this problem.
FYI: blaster mages have the same issues with monsters with immunities/energy resistance.
However, you didn't address my question about the combat 1 section of SRD saying it takes a full round action to prepare a splash weapon for use ...
this is something i never remember reading .... i found it here in the SRD
www.systemreferencedocuments.org/resourc...
on the Table: Actions in Combat/ Full-Round Action
however there was nothing that explained what this entailed ..... no Clarification, i have never even used that rule .... i have just used what i found here in the Description for throwing Splash Weapons:
www.systemreferencedocuments.org/resourc...
and under Equipment here:
www.systemreferencedocuments.org/resourc...
there is nothing that indicates some special action is needed to use these weapons.
how would you like to proceed? ..... i could say i Prepaired all of my splash weapons before the fight
question:
What is the speed of a Runehound?
agreed ... but the Alchemist Fire i used in the first level was ... it still would not affect the outcome very much
Sorry. I haven't been paying attention that closely. This thread moves fast, and I've been busy. It is interesting, though. I might enter something if I ever have time (I doubt I will...).
However, you didn't address my question about the combat 1 section of SRD saying it takes a full round action to prepare a splash weapon for use ...
this is something i never remember reading .... i found it here in the SRD
www.systemreferencedocuments.org/resourc...
on the Table: Actions in Combat/ Full-Round Action
however there was nothing that explained what this entailed ..... no Clarification, i have never even used that rule .... i have just used what i found here in the Description for throwing Splash Weapons:
www.systemreferencedocuments.org/resourc...
and under Equipment here:
www.systemreferencedocuments.org/resourc...
there is nothing that indicates some special action is needed to use these weapons.
how would you like to proceed? ..... i could say i Prepaired all of my splash weapons before the fight
Lol ... I have no idea, which is why i tossed that question out there ... maybe someone else knows (rule compendium, other?)
.. and 50', from MMIII
how would Runehound respond to a Creature moving away from itself .... would it use the Charge action(Full Round Action: Double Move) or Run(Full Round action: 4x Speed) to 5' distance from creature?
- A heavy warhorse is easily available at lvl 2, money-wise. Can I buy one? I understand it's a reather superior piece of equipment at that level, but couldn't find a reason not too.
No. This is the slippery slope to buying 50 dogs and having them beat the monster for you ...
Here is the rule for you ...
7) You may not hire, or gain through leadership, any followers, if you want to use leadership to get a mount (as khan did in one build) I will consider it but again trying to avoid too many variables.- considering many items have a masterwork variant that gives a +2 on a skill check for 50 extra gc, can I buy a 70 gc masterwork military saddle? (for +2 on all ride checks, +4 to stay in saddle)
The "no" is also because this is really a variant of "i fly and attack without being threatened"when working with several modes of attack, should I use the tresshold method for each method seperately? That would make the most sense to me, since different attacks do different damage, and if you all make it one pool, it's easy to steer when the attack that does the most damage hits. (example: when I have a weapon attack, a natural weapon attack and my horse, if allowed, has an attack, I intend to use a 65% treshold for each of those, not for them together).
No ... attacks are one pool, else you find yourself never missing if you can make it 65% or higher. (i attack with a natural attack at 65%, i attack with a sword at 65% and my horse (not allowed) attacks at 65% ... three hits, as opposed to what is meant to be two hits).
Thnx for the answers!
On the last point: ok, no worries. I proposed it the way I did because if you pool all attacks together, it's rather easy to choose which attack hits. Example: first hit with a "soft" attack that doesn't make the tresshold, then use the big 2handed weapon attack that hits, and use another weak attack that misses. Then again, if we agree on using every round the same sequence, it should be ok.
I do have some more questions about the first 2 points.
First, I do NOT want to buy 50 dogs. I see the slippery slope there. I want to invest half of my precious few skill points in ride (cross class!), get into the prestige paladin at later levels, spent half of my wealth on a mount and relevant equipment and, most importantly, ride a mount. To ride on and charge my foe. To make the parallel to a normal game, I wouldn't be surprised if my DM would tell me to go *fill in yourself* if I asked if I could buy 50 dogs and take 'em with me on adventure. I would be upset if I would invest rescources in riding and wouldn't be allowed to buy a horse.
If the heavy warhorse does too much damage compared with the CR of the encounter, I'm fine with using a light warhorse for the CR2 encounter. But disallowing it alltogether seems weird, especially if gaining a mount with leadership does seem to be ok (see example in the rules). So: not hiring, not leadershipping, just using a mode of combat. If this is not allowed, it effectively nerfs a lot of builds (e.g. paladin charger up to lvl 5) that are quite straight, imho.
On the second note, please eleborate on how having an item that gives +2 to skill checks, that has a precedent for a lot of skills, would be in any way similar to flying 100 feet over the head of a helpless opponent and dropping rocks on it's poor unprotected head till it stops moving? I don't want to use hit and run tactics to stay invunerable, or anything, I just want to use a mount to attack my foe. If the rule is "no custom items, period", no worries.... but if that's not the rule, I'd like more info.
On the second note, please eleborate on how having an item that gives +2 to skill checks, that has a precedent for a lot of skills, would be in any way similar to flying 100 feet over the head of a helpless opponent and dropping rocks on it's poor unprotected head till it stops moving? I don't want to use hit and run tactics to stay invunerable, or anything, I just want to use a mount to attack my foe. If the rule is "no custom items, period", no worries.... but if that's not the rule, I'd like more info.
"- considering many items have a masterwork variant that gives a +2 on a skill check for 50 extra gc, can I buy a 70 gc masterwork military saddle? (for +2 on all ride checks, +4 to stay in saddle)"
Masterwork tools are of that which you speak. Essentially, they are 50 gp. It could be a masterwork ass cushion saddle graft. It could be a mouth-tooth-piece to make your clicks, whistles, and other assorted human-to-horse verbalese more pleasant to the horse's auditory sensory systems.
Lastly, this seems to be very similar to "I fly and it cannot attack me".
You have a gauntlet full of melee powerhouses. Every character that wins will be a character that finds a way to avoid being hit.
Show
7. How can one find "the gauntlet threads" of old, themselves?
8. What constitutes defeat of the enemy by a contestant?
9. re: buckets: is this categorization merely aesthetic?
10. What constitutes a caster?
11. What constitutes a non-caster?
12. Are mysteries (ToM) considered spells?
13. Are invocations considered spells?
14. Is the "Artificer" base class a caster?
15. Point two shouldn't precede neither your 21st point nor your 15th.
16. You imply the challenger must establish a build to follow from which to not stray, however one knows not the level of the build required. Thus, the build cannot be planned.
17. Point two implies single-entry. Confirm the implication with explication.
18. What constitutes "retraining"? Just the character option from PHBII?
19. What do you mean "you are considered at full"? One's at full WBL?
20. What's the motivation of between the monster and the gauntlet-runner?
21. I don't understand the threshold method: 65% of what? Why 65%? Is it an arbitrary number?
22. How does one get to where one begins?
23. What's the definition of "neutral terrain"?
24. Why is "trying to set up a proper battlemat for this is going to be a nightmare"? Take a generic map of a location that is most plausible for all of the participant-beings' being there), and have it wrap-around, have an infinite amount adjacent to each other, have infinite featureless terrain beyond that or whatever else as a solution to boundaries.
25. If both players have Darkvision, is no illumination "proper illumination for both sides to see correctly"? What about shadowy illumination and low light-vision?
26. You say "without a crapload of obstacles in the way"; do you imply that there can be a crapload of obstacles out of the way? That there's still obstacles in the way, just not what's considered "a crapload"?
27. re: variables: locked in place, forced to trade attacks vs. a proper battle.
28. Is buying a slave considered hiring? The difference is that to hire means paying the worker instead of buying the slave from the slave-seller.
29. Infinite expanse =/= nothing for a Dungeon crasher to send their opponents flying into. You admit you're nerfing non-casters, increasing the disparity between them and casters?
30. re: arbitrariness: LIFE IS ARBITRARY.
31. "most builds work well with a large expanse to play with." This statement and your 16th point (i.e. "Using levitation/fly for a non-threatened victory is considered cheese.") are contradictory.
32. By "Races", do you mean the "Races of..." series?
33. What are races of races?
34. It's time to pull out the big-guns: community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758...
35. Point 12 precedes point 13: is this intentional?
36. The way point 16 is phrased, this isn't even a rule, it's just an opinion.
37. Define "[theoretical optimization] or campaign busting".
38. Define CO.
39. Are you the judge of point 18?
40. Why do you oppose "stat-drain/damage"?
41. You never explicitly disallow "stat-drain/damage FTW tactics".
42. Why eight or more hours for prebuffs?
43. What do you mean by point 22?
44. "Q: Why is there a limited amount of books available for spells?
A2: Historic, when this thread was first created, there was a limited amount of books[.]” I find this point to be controversial. "Added UA and Heroes of Horror ... these were overlooked in the first time this gauntlet was posted." (post #8)
45. "Q: Why is there a limited amount of books available for spells?
A3: C'mon, is this really that big of a limitation to the big 5(7?)?" I find this point to be controversial.
46. Judging by the Dungeonscape variant of the "Tanking Sorceror", my 35th point becomes "as opposed to "aforementioned", do you just mean "mentioned"?"
47. "Tanking Sorceror": "I use crits for both me and the monster.
formula is
Damage * hit percent + Damage * crit range * confirm * crit multiplier."
d6 Eldritch Blast damage = 3.5 * ((19/20)+3.5) * 3.5 * 1/20 * (19/20) * 2?
48. "...the goal was to toss your character starting at level one and work your way upward." (post #13) I don't know what this means.
49. "I made the mistake of under-equipping my barbarian ... and then i had to fight the next gauntlet virtually naked. (like around 5% of wbl)" (post #14) See point 19.
50. "any class/Prc from any book mentioned is fine." (post #34) You don't have this in the first post.
51. "rules of the gauntlet are "no fly out of reach and pummel to death"" (post #37) You didn't say that.
52. re: “Carnivore's Cloistered Cleric/Thug Archer” in the “multi classed noncasters” bucket: if one plays a caster-class but doesn't spell-cast, one is considered a "noncaster"?
53. ""Run monsters intelligently" -- means that play them as you think they should be played if you were the DM and not the player." (post #46) What difference does that make?
54. "Tomes: consider that once you buy the item, you need to eternally set that amount of money aside." (post #46) You didn't say that.
55. "If the PrC (and adaption) is [not] from one of the posted books ... your entry won't be in the scoring..." You didn't say that.
56. "if you decide to spend half your waking life refreshing a buff, then yes, it would be reasonable to have it full duration." (post #62) You mean "yes, limited-duration unlimited-use buffs are considered to have a duration equal to or greater than eight hours for the purposes of this gauntlet"?
57. "No pre-knowledge unless the gauntlet gives you some." (post #62) Ipso facto.
58. "Also, no knowledge check in the world will let you know at the store to buy a silver weapon before you encounter a monster." (post #62) I find this or these point(s) to be controversial.
59. "If the gauntlet says "preknowledge" (this one doesn't, some of the others do), then you are walking into an area forwarned (i.e. mini-adventure), if there is no information, assume this is a wandering monster which is not typically found in this area." (post #62) This statement helps my solution presented in my 24th point.
60. "the gauntlets were made years ago and are not changing." (post #62) Fallacious.
61. re: post #67: What constitutes a "follower"?
62. re: post #67: What constitutes "leadership"?
63. "The "no" is also because this is really a variant of "i fly and attack without being threatened"" (post #67) You're disallowing all kiting tactics? The response itself is unintentionally controversial.
64. re: post #67: I don't understand the paragraph about the statement that "attacks are one pool", at the bottom of post.
65. re: post #68 and #70: I find this or these point(s) to be controversial. Define the disallowed tactic. You have yet to give a scientific definition.
66. re: post #71: I find this or these point(s) to be controversial.
7. How can one find "the gauntlet threads" of old, themselves?
8. What constitutes defeat of the enemy by a contestant?
9. re: buckets: is this categorization merely aesthetic?
10. What constitutes a caster?
11. What constitutes a non-caster?
12. Are mysteries (ToM) considered spells?
13. Are invocations considered spells?
14. Is the "Artificer" base class a caster?
15. Point two shouldn't precede neither your 21st point nor your 15th.
16. You imply the challenger must establish a build to follow from which to not stray, however one knows not the level of the build required. Thus, the build cannot be planned.
17. Point two implies single-entry. Confirm the implication with explication.
18. What constitutes "retraining"? Just the character option from PHBII?
19. What do you mean "you are considered at full"? One's at full WBL?
20. What's the motivation of between the monster and the gauntlet-runner?
21. I don't understand the threshold method: 65% of what? Why 65%? Is it an arbitrary number?
22. How does one get to where one begins?
23. What's the definition of "neutral terrain"?
24. Why is "trying to set up a proper battlemat for this is going to be a nightmare"? Take a generic map of a location that is most plausible for all of the participant-beings' being there), and have it wrap-around, have an infinite amount adjacent to each other, have infinite featureless terrain beyond that or whatever else as a solution to boundaries.
25. If both players have Darkvision, is no illumination "proper illumination for both sides to see correctly"? What about shadowy illumination and low light-vision?
26. You say "without a crapload of obstacles in the way"; do you imply that there can be a crapload of obstacles out of the way? That there's still obstacles in the way, just not what's considered "a crapload"?
27. re: variables: locked in place, forced to trade attacks vs. a proper battle.
28. Is buying a slave considered hiring? The difference is that to hire means paying the worker instead of buying the slave from the slave-seller.
29. Infinite expanse =/= nothing for a Dungeon crasher to send their opponents flying into. You admit you're nerfing non-casters, increasing the disparity between them and casters?
30. re: arbitrariness: LIFE IS ARBITRARY.
31. "most builds work well with a large expanse to play with." This statement and your 16th point (i.e. "Using levitation/fly for a non-threatened victory is considered cheese.") are contradictory.
32. By "Races", do you mean the "Races of..." series?
33. What are races of races?
34. It's time to pull out the big-guns: community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758...
35. Point 12 precedes point 13: is this intentional?
36. The way point 16 is phrased, this isn't even a rule, it's just an opinion.
37. Define "[theoretical optimization] or campaign busting".
38. Define CO.
39. Are you the judge of point 18?
40. Why do you oppose "stat-drain/damage"?
41. You never explicitly disallow "stat-drain/damage FTW tactics".
42. Why eight or more hours for prebuffs?
43. What do you mean by point 22?
44. "Q: Why is there a limited amount of books available for spells?
A2: Historic, when this thread was first created, there was a limited amount of books[.]” I find this point to be controversial. "Added UA and Heroes of Horror ... these were overlooked in the first time this gauntlet was posted." (post #8)
45. "Q: Why is there a limited amount of books available for spells?
A3: C'mon, is this really that big of a limitation to the big 5(7?)?" I find this point to be controversial.
46. Judging by the Dungeonscape variant of the "Tanking Sorceror", my 35th point becomes "as opposed to "aforementioned", do you just mean "mentioned"?"
47. "Tanking Sorceror": "I use crits for both me and the monster.
formula is
Damage * hit percent + Damage * crit range * confirm * crit multiplier."
d6 Eldritch Blast damage = 3.5 * ((19/20)+3.5) * 3.5 * 1/20 * (19/20) * 2?
48. "...the goal was to toss your character starting at level one and work your way upward." (post #13) I don't know what this means.
49. "I made the mistake of under-equipping my barbarian ... and then i had to fight the next gauntlet virtually naked. (like around 5% of wbl)" (post #14) See point 19.
50. "any class/Prc from any book mentioned is fine." (post #34) You don't have this in the first post.
51. "rules of the gauntlet are "no fly out of reach and pummel to death"" (post #37) You didn't say that.
52. re: “Carnivore's Cloistered Cleric/Thug Archer” in the “multi classed noncasters” bucket: if one plays a caster-class but doesn't spell-cast, one is considered a "noncaster"?
53. ""Run monsters intelligently" -- means that play them as you think they should be played if you were the DM and not the player." (post #46) What difference does that make?
54. "Tomes: consider that once you buy the item, you need to eternally set that amount of money aside." (post #46) You didn't say that.
55. "If the PrC (and adaption) is [not] from one of the posted books ... your entry won't be in the scoring..." You didn't say that.
56. "if you decide to spend half your waking life refreshing a buff, then yes, it would be reasonable to have it full duration." (post #62) You mean "yes, limited-duration unlimited-use buffs are considered to have a duration equal to or greater than eight hours for the purposes of this gauntlet"?
57. "No pre-knowledge unless the gauntlet gives you some." (post #62) Ipso facto.
58. "Also, no knowledge check in the world will let you know at the store to buy a silver weapon before you encounter a monster." (post #62) I find this or these point(s) to be controversial.
59. "If the gauntlet says "preknowledge" (this one doesn't, some of the others do), then you are walking into an area forwarned (i.e. mini-adventure), if there is no information, assume this is a wandering monster which is not typically found in this area." (post #62) This statement helps my solution presented in my 24th point.
60. "the gauntlets were made years ago and are not changing." (post #62) Fallacious.
61. re: post #67: What constitutes a "follower"?
62. re: post #67: What constitutes "leadership"?
63. "The "no" is also because this is really a variant of "i fly and attack without being threatened"" (post #67) You're disallowing all kiting tactics? The response itself is unintentionally controversial.
64. re: post #67: I don't understand the paragraph about the statement that "attacks are one pool", at the bottom of post.
65. re: post #68 and #70: I find this or these point(s) to be controversial. Define the disallowed tactic. You have yet to give a scientific definition.
66. re: post #71: I find this or these point(s) to be controversial.
Anyways, to drop my 2 cents:
I'm happy that Meyer took the trouble of putting this thing back online. It seems like a fun challange and brings some life back into the CO-board. I can imagine it takes quite some time, going through old posts, making rules, closely reading all the entries. +1 for all that, for starters.
I don't have any problem with the fact that Meyer sets up some rules. A challange like this doesn't get, as far as I'm concerned, less fun when some books are disallowed, or certain features. It makes it more challlenging and that's fine. Also, there has to be, ultimately, a judge, just like there's a DM in a normal DnD session. I personally have an opion on the use of flaws, but it's irrelevant. I choose to participate in this, and if I don't like the rules as set, I can leave.
I also agree that in a non-specified setting like this, flat terrain, no difficulties with moving, that certain tactics can get rather lame: the flying above a monster that can't do that is a good example.
Problem is, as Ikeren stated, that the gaunlet is made up from monsters who are very powerfull in melee. There on the high end of their CR, and are usually tackeled with a party of 4 when encountered. That's pretty difficult, which means any participants will need to use some tricks, tactics or whatever you want to call it, to emerge victorious. Wether this are ways to extend reach, limit the mobility of the monster, use hit & run tactics, frequent abrubt jaunts (for the wizards), use potions, scrolls... this gaunlet will, as far as I can see, NOT be completed in a very succesful way by a standard human fighter wielding a greatsword and charging in. Actually, he'll get ripped to pieces.
With that in mind, I'd rather have a ruling that says "no lame tactics" and being judged on that (maybe with some style bonus points or whatever, either by meyer or a general consensus among other participants) then that stuff get's disallowed because they open up the possibility for lame tactics.
That's clearer for the participants and prevents that you put a lot of time in a build that gets disallowed on something that's only arguably, or not at all, covered in the first post.
Show
Q 7. How can one find "the gauntlet threads" of old, themselves?
A. Unsure, I had these saved off from when I participated in them. It is also not in anyones interest to publish them beforehand, as part of what I am doing is trying to recreate the gauntlet series as they happened. One thing it revealed is how much participants crafted their toons to defeat one specific monster. When the next set appeared (in the 2nd gauntlet), some toons were unprepared (i.e. lack of adaptibility, reliance on metagame knowledge)
Q 8. What constitutes defeat of the enemy by a contestant?
A. Um. I don't understand what this means, Are you asking what death, causing a monster to retreat, extreme paralysis, or any other number of normal measures of defeatedness would be?
Q 9. re: buckets: is this categorization merely aesthetic?
A Assuming you are referring to caster/non-caster/single-classed/multi-classed. Its partly historic and partly the way I wanted to do it.
Q 10. What constitutes a caster?
Q 11. What constitutes a non-caster?
A. Um .... I don't know how to answer this. A cleric 1/fighter 19 is not a caster. A wizard 5/fighter1/abjurant chamption 5/that other Prc 9 is a caster. No ToB only character is a caster. Seriously, I doubt there will be any objections to how I assign the characters into the buckets. Since this is really not imporant to the match, I am unsure that it really matters.
Q12. Are mysteries (ToM) considered spells?
A. I don't know what mysteries are. If they look like spells then they are.
Q13. Are invocations considered spells?
A. Yes. (notice that WoTC considers the warlock to be a caster class).
Q 14. Is the "Artificer" base class a caster?
A. It would count as one.
Q. 15. Point two shouldn't precede neither your 21st point nor your 15th.
A. You do not have a point two.
Q. 16. You imply the challenger must establish a build to follow from which to not stray, however one knows not the level of the build required. Thus, the build cannot be planned.
A. This makes no sense. Your level 1 entry works for the level 1 monster, etc. At ever stage of the game, you know the level of the build you are submitting.
Q 17. Point two implies single-entry. Confirm the implication with explication.
A. No. As you noticed by my two entries, you can submit as many as you want.
Q. 18. What constitutes "retraining"? Just the character option from PHBII?
A. I guess. I am unsure what exactly you are asking. If you are saying "Can I pay someone to psychic reformation me" the answer is no.
Q. 19. What do you mean "you are considered at full"? One's at full WBL?
A. This means that you do not need to keep track of sundered equipment/etc in your WBL, nor do you need track of things like potions/scrolls/etc used. Now, things with permanent effects (Tomes) would carry over, so their cost needs to be considered part of your WBL.
Q. 20. What's the motivation of between the monster and the gauntlet-runner?
A. The same motivation that there is, when playing DnD, you are traveling from place to place, and the DM says "Roll initiative".
Q. 21. I don't understand the threshold method: 65% of what? Why 65%? Is it an arbitrary number?
A. Threshold method. Lets say that you have a 50% chance to hit the opponent. Your attack in round one hits 50%, which is not enough to trigger threshold. This means you miss. The next round, your 50% results in 100% (the 50 from last round, plus the 50 from this round), which surpasses the 65% threshold resulting in a hit. The third round you will miss (150), the fourth round you will hit (200).
65% was arbitrary, but was agreed to in the previous gauntlet by the participants. 50% led to some concerns (I have a 50% to grapple you, you have a 50% to resist grapple, which one wins?)
Q. 22. How does one get to where one begins?
A. Unsure, does it matter? Whatever method is used, results in the lack of short-term buffs already talked about.
Q. 23. What's the definition of "neutral terrain"?
A. Meaning, do not worry about terrain. There is no trees in the way, no corridors, no rough terrain, no water to swim through, no lava to avoid, etc.
Q. 24. Why is "trying to set up a proper battlemat for this is going to be a nightmare"? Take a generic map of a location that is most plausible for all of the participant-beings' being there), and have it wrap-around, have an infinite amount adjacent to each other, have infinite featureless terrain beyond that or whatever else as a solution to boundaries.
A. Are you offering to set this up? That verbage was copy/pasted from original gauntlet. In future gauntlets we gained proficiency in setting up positioning over the web, so for those, we have facing/positioning/etc.
Q. 25. If both players have Darkvision, is no illumination "proper illumination for both sides to see correctly"? What about shadowy illumination and low light-vision?
A. What does this matter?
Q. 26. You say "without a crapload of obstacles in the way"; do you imply that there can be a crapload of obstacles out of the way? That there's still obstacles in the way, just not what's considered "a crapload"?
A. No obstacles. None. Zero. Nothing that hinders movement/etc.
Q. 27. re: variables: locked in place, forced to trade attacks vs. a proper battle.
A. Other entrants have used things like the wizards jaunt, chronocharms, maneuvers, swift spells, etc ...
Q. 28. Is buying a slave considered hiring? The difference is that to hire means paying the worker instead of buying the slave from the slave-seller.
A. Don't look for loopholes. Yes, a slave is the same as hiring. The goal is to see a build in action. If the character spens WBL on slaves/hirelings/etc then the character himself will not be needed. So that is disallowed. The same for making an army of undead.
Q. 29. Infinite expanse =/= nothing for a Dungeon crasher to send their opponents flying into. You admit you're nerfing non-casters, increasing the disparity between them and casters?
A. No. I do not admit that I am nerfing non-casters. I say "here are the rules". Some of them might benefit casters, others might benefit non-casters. Some hurt casters, others hurt non-casters.
Q. 31. "most builds work well with a large expanse to play with." This statement and your 16th point (i.e. "Using levitation/fly for a non-threatened victory is considered cheese.") are contradictory.
A. No, think of it like this. If you are the DM and every encounter you have melee critters, and your party levitates up for a nonthreatened victory, you realize that the encounters themselves would change (or, by DMG XP section, little or no XP would be given for the encounters). Since this gauntlet challenges are non-changing, I am unable to react in that fashion.
Q. 32. By "Races", do you mean the "Races of..." series?
A. Yes.
Q. 34. It's time to pull out the big-guns: community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758...
A. I don't understand what you mean by this.
Q. 36. The way point 16 is phrased, this isn't even a rule, it's just an opinion.
A. Its in the rules section, the way it is phrased is meant to mean "don't do this, and here is why."
Q. 37. Define "[theoretical optimization] or campaign busting".
A. TO was the old forums. It means "nothing that you think would result in your character being banned, or the DM saying 'NO' outright". This includes things like Pun-Pun, genesis-time-flowing, haunt-shift into a robot, etc. Campaign Busting was a thread way-back-when, it included similar things (using the anger disease for infinite strength, etc). This is basically alluded to in the example clarification I made in that line.
Q. 38. Define CO.
A. Stuff able to see play at a normal table. If you have questions as to which is which, ask me -- or post to the thread and maybe someone else can answer.
Q. 39. Are you the judge of point 18?
A. If/when we have enough entrants to make it worth-while, I can do that, or anyone else can.
Q. 40. Why do you oppose "stat-drain/damage"?
A. Historic reasons as well as the ease of victory versus some of the monsters by using a no-save spell.
Q. 41. You never explicitly disallow "stat-drain/damage FTW tactics".
A. My phrasing is meant to be friendlier than tyrannical. Intertpret as you wish.
Q. 42. Why eight or more hours for prebuffs?
A. Historic reasons as well as chances are that if you have a long term buff like that, it will see play.
Q. 43. What do you mean by point 22?
A. A very successful warblade in the first gauntlet was able to survive for 15+ rounds in some of the fights, he ultimately died, but the character was showing his extreme survivability and in a team environment would have done very well.
Q. 44. "Q: Why is there a limited amount of books available for spells?
Historic, when this thread was first created, there was a limited amount of books[.]” I find this point to be controversial. "Added UA and Heroes of Horror ... these were overlooked in the first time this gauntlet was posted." (post #8)
A. Huh? How do you find this point to be controversal? At the time these gauntlets were created, some of the books were not PUBLISHED yet. Additionally, since options from UA and Heroes of Horrors were used in the first time this was ran, it obviously was legal.
45. "Q: Why is there a limited amount of books available for spells?
C'mon, is this really that big of a limitation to the big 5(7?)?" I find this point to be controversial.
A. You are welcome to find anything controversal that you want to. Do you have a spell you would like to use that you cannot from that large list of books?
Q 46. Judging by the Dungeonscape variant of the "Tanking Sorceror", my 35th point becomes "as opposed to "aforementioned", do you just mean "mentioned"?"
A. Yes, that would be a good change.
Q. 47. "Tanking Sorceror": "I use crits for both me and the monster.
formula is
Damage * hit percent + Damage * crit range * confirm * crit multiplier."
d6 Eldritch Blast damage = 3.5 * ((19/20)+3.5) * 3.5 * 1/20 * (19/20) * 2?
A. No. Your parenthesis are wrong
It would be more like this
3.5*(19/20) + 3.5*(1/20) * (19/20)
Original damage of 3.5 times 95% chance to hit plus
Original damage times 5% crit chance * 95 % confirm chance times crit multiplier bonus (1)
Resulting in ...
No Crits : 3.325 damage
Crit: 3.49125 damage
Q. 48. "...the goal was to toss your character starting at level one and work your way upward." (post #13) I don't know what this means.
It means that start the gauntlet at level one and work upwards with your build. If your build is late in maturing, it will lose the first multiple. This is just the way it works.
Q. 49. "I made the mistake of under-equipping my barbarian ... and then i had to fight the next gauntlet virtually naked. (like around 5% of wbl)" (post #14) See point 19.
A. No. These are two different things. My post is talking about me using the same character at the same level (level 5 barbarian) in multiple builds. Point 19 (WBL) is talking about leveling up. When I surpassed my original level in the first gauntlet (I didn't go to 20) then I had my full WBL.
Q. 50. "any class/Prc from any book mentioned is fine." (post #34) You don't have this in the first post.
A. I assumed it is understood ... but I can mention things like "as is equipment, rules, etc"
Q. 51. "rules of the gauntlet are "no fly out of reach and pummel to death"" (post #37) You didn't say that.
A. "Using levitation/fly for a non-threatened victory is considered cheese." This is clear to me.
Q. 52. re: “Carnivore's Cloistered Cleric/Thug Archer” in the “multi classed noncasters” bucket: if one plays a caster-class but doesn't spell-cast, one is considered a "noncaster"?
A. Can you give me an example of this? For instance, in Carnivore's build, he casts spells at level 2 and from his description of what he is going to be doing, he will be casting multiple spells. Or, to state it differently, a wizard without spells is very similar to a commoner.
Q. 53. ""Run monsters intelligently" -- means that play them as you think they should be played if you were the DM and not the player." (post #46) What difference does that make?
A. It means things like "Don't have the monster keep making the same mistakes each round (provoking when it is not advantageous, etc)". Basically, when you post your battles -- people who are watching the gauntlet will comment on how it was run.
Q. 54. "Tomes: consider that once you buy the item, you need to eternally set that amount of money aside." (post #46) You didn't say that.
A. I don't understand. If one were to buy a tome, read it (to gain the bonus), then how do you (nightcypher) consider their WBL? Are you under their WBL as they don't have the item anymore?
Q. 55. "If the PrC (and adaption) is [not] from one of the posted books ... your entry won't be in the scoring..." You didn't say that.
A. I said something similar "these are the allowed books/etc" if you do not follow the rules, should the build be scored?
Q. 56. "if you decide to spend half your waking life refreshing a buff, then yes, it would be reasonable to have it full duration." (post #62) You mean "yes, limited-duration unlimited-use buffs are considered to have a duration equal to or greater than eight hours for the purposes of this gauntlet"?
A. No, I mean exactly what I said. In most adventures I am in, I will not put up with a character slowing the party down to do something like this. This type of tactic (in the extreme (every round)) results in all party buffs being of half duration during non-combat situations, as well as results in certain actions not being possible (i.e. a rogue with a 2 round buff cannot disable a track usually while keeping his buff active).
Q. 57. "No pre-knowledge unless the gauntlet gives you some." (post #62) Ipso facto.
A. In a later gauntlet, there is a section marked "pre-knowledge".
Q. 58. "Also, no knowledge check in the world will let you know at the store to buy a silver weapon before you encounter a monster." (post #62) I find this or these point(s) to be controversial.
A. This is not controversal (unless we are using different definitions of the word). In DnD, you cannot walk into a store, roll a knowledge check, then based on the results, buy an item -- when the knowledge check is based on an action/circumstance that your character does not know about.
Q. 59. "If the gauntlet says "preknowledge" (this one doesn't, some of the others do), then you are walking into an area forwarned (i.e. mini-adventure), if there is no information, assume this is a wandering monster which is not typically found in this area." (post #62) This statement helps my solution presented in my 24th point.
A. I am not willing to set up the battlemat for this. If you are willing, be my guest, I would appreciate the help.
Q. 60. "the gauntlets were made years ago and are not changing." (post #62) Fallacious.
A. The monsters in the gauntlet as well as their relationship to the player has not changed. The rules surrounding the gauntlet are changing somewhat (although, since the spirit of the original gauntlet is retained, and some of the changes actually occurred during the original gauntlet, even those changes might not really be changes)
Q. 61. re: post #67: What constitutes a "follower"?
A. Um. ... a follower .... basically anything that isn't something like an animal companion, familiar, or other similar thing.
Q. 62. re: post #67: What constitutes "leadership"?
A. The feat. And this is from point 7 in the rules section.
Q. 63. "The "no" is also because this is really a variant of "i fly and attack without being threatened"" (post #67) You're disallowing all kiting tactics? The response itself is unintentionally controversial.
A. No. I am not disallowing all kiting tactics. This should be demonstratably false by the inclusion of Carnivore's character.
Q 64. re: post #67: I don't understand the paragraph about the statement that "attacks are one pool", at the bottom of post.
A. When we did this, attacks were one pool, skill checks another.
Q. 65. re: post #68 and #70: I find this or these point(s) to be controversial. Define the disallowed
tactic. You have yet to give a scientific definition.
66. re: post #71: I find this or these point(s) to be controversial.
A. Quote what you are finding controversial ...
Q 7. How can one find "the gauntlet threads" of old, themselves?
A. Unsure, I had these saved off from when I participated in them. It is also not in anyones interest to publish them beforehand, as part of what I am doing is trying to recreate the gauntlet series as they happened. One thing it revealed is how much participants crafted their toons to defeat one specific monster. When the next set appeared (in the 2nd gauntlet), some toons were unprepared (i.e. lack of adaptibility, reliance on metagame knowledge)
Q 8. What constitutes defeat of the enemy by a contestant?
A. Um. I don't understand what this means, Are you asking what death, causing a monster to retreat, extreme paralysis, or any other number of normal measures of defeatedness would be?
Q 9. re: buckets: is this categorization merely aesthetic?
A Assuming you are referring to caster/non-caster/single-classed/multi-classed. Its partly historic and partly the way I wanted to do it.
Q 10. What constitutes a caster?
Q 11. What constitutes a non-caster?
A. Um .... I don't know how to answer this. A cleric 1/fighter 19 is not a caster. A wizard 5/fighter1/abjurant chamption 5/that other Prc 9 is a caster. No ToB only character is a caster. Seriously, I doubt there will be any objections to how I assign the characters into the buckets. Since this is really not imporant to the match, I am unsure that it really matters.
Q12. Are mysteries (ToM) considered spells?
A. I don't know what mysteries are. If they look like spells then they are.
Q13. Are invocations considered spells?
A. Yes. (notice that WoTC considers the warlock to be a caster class).
Q 14. Is the "Artificer" base class a caster?
A. It would count as one.
Q. 15. Point two shouldn't precede neither your 21st point nor your 15th.
A. You do not have a point two.
Q. 16. You imply the challenger must establish a build to follow from which to not stray, however one knows not the level of the build required. Thus, the build cannot be planned.
A. This makes no sense. Your level 1 entry works for the level 1 monster, etc. At ever stage of the game, you know the level of the build you are submitting.
Q 17. Point two implies single-entry. Confirm the implication with explication.
A. No. As you noticed by my two entries, you can submit as many as you want.
Q. 18. What constitutes "retraining"? Just the character option from PHBII?
A. I guess. I am unsure what exactly you are asking. If you are saying "Can I pay someone to psychic reformation me" the answer is no.
Q. 19. What do you mean "you are considered at full"? One's at full WBL?
A. This means that you do not need to keep track of sundered equipment/etc in your WBL, nor do you need track of things like potions/scrolls/etc used. Now, things with permanent effects (Tomes) would carry over, so their cost needs to be considered part of your WBL.
Q. 20. What's the motivation of between the monster and the gauntlet-runner?
A. The same motivation that there is, when playing DnD, you are traveling from place to place, and the DM says "Roll initiative".
Q. 21. I don't understand the threshold method: 65% of what? Why 65%? Is it an arbitrary number?
A. Threshold method. Lets say that you have a 50% chance to hit the opponent. Your attack in round one hits 50%, which is not enough to trigger threshold. This means you miss. The next round, your 50% results in 100% (the 50 from last round, plus the 50 from this round), which surpasses the 65% threshold resulting in a hit. The third round you will miss (150), the fourth round you will hit (200).
65% was arbitrary, but was agreed to in the previous gauntlet by the participants. 50% led to some concerns (I have a 50% to grapple you, you have a 50% to resist grapple, which one wins?)
Q. 22. How does one get to where one begins?
A. Unsure, does it matter? Whatever method is used, results in the lack of short-term buffs already talked about.
Q. 23. What's the definition of "neutral terrain"?
A. Meaning, do not worry about terrain. There is no trees in the way, no corridors, no rough terrain, no water to swim through, no lava to avoid, etc.
Q. 24. Why is "trying to set up a proper battlemat for this is going to be a nightmare"? Take a generic map of a location that is most plausible for all of the participant-beings' being there), and have it wrap-around, have an infinite amount adjacent to each other, have infinite featureless terrain beyond that or whatever else as a solution to boundaries.
A. Are you offering to set this up? That verbage was copy/pasted from original gauntlet. In future gauntlets we gained proficiency in setting up positioning over the web, so for those, we have facing/positioning/etc.
Q. 25. If both players have Darkvision, is no illumination "proper illumination for both sides to see correctly"? What about shadowy illumination and low light-vision?
A. What does this matter?
Q. 26. You say "without a crapload of obstacles in the way"; do you imply that there can be a crapload of obstacles out of the way? That there's still obstacles in the way, just not what's considered "a crapload"?
A. No obstacles. None. Zero. Nothing that hinders movement/etc.
Q. 27. re: variables: locked in place, forced to trade attacks vs. a proper battle.
A. Other entrants have used things like the wizards jaunt, chronocharms, maneuvers, swift spells, etc ...
Q. 28. Is buying a slave considered hiring? The difference is that to hire means paying the worker instead of buying the slave from the slave-seller.
A. Don't look for loopholes. Yes, a slave is the same as hiring. The goal is to see a build in action. If the character spens WBL on slaves/hirelings/etc then the character himself will not be needed. So that is disallowed. The same for making an army of undead.
Q. 29. Infinite expanse =/= nothing for a Dungeon crasher to send their opponents flying into. You admit you're nerfing non-casters, increasing the disparity between them and casters?
A. No. I do not admit that I am nerfing non-casters. I say "here are the rules". Some of them might benefit casters, others might benefit non-casters. Some hurt casters, others hurt non-casters.
Q. 31. "most builds work well with a large expanse to play with." This statement and your 16th point (i.e. "Using levitation/fly for a non-threatened victory is considered cheese.") are contradictory.
A. No, think of it like this. If you are the DM and every encounter you have melee critters, and your party levitates up for a nonthreatened victory, you realize that the encounters themselves would change (or, by DMG XP section, little or no XP would be given for the encounters). Since this gauntlet challenges are non-changing, I am unable to react in that fashion.
Q. 32. By "Races", do you mean the "Races of..." series?
A. Yes.
Q. 34. It's time to pull out the big-guns: community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758...
A. I don't understand what you mean by this.
Q. 36. The way point 16 is phrased, this isn't even a rule, it's just an opinion.
A. Its in the rules section, the way it is phrased is meant to mean "don't do this, and here is why."
Q. 37. Define "[theoretical optimization] or campaign busting".
A. TO was the old forums. It means "nothing that you think would result in your character being banned, or the DM saying 'NO' outright". This includes things like Pun-Pun, genesis-time-flowing, haunt-shift into a robot, etc. Campaign Busting was a thread way-back-when, it included similar things (using the anger disease for infinite strength, etc). This is basically alluded to in the example clarification I made in that line.
Q. 38. Define CO.
A. Stuff able to see play at a normal table. If you have questions as to which is which, ask me -- or post to the thread and maybe someone else can answer.
Q. 39. Are you the judge of point 18?
A. If/when we have enough entrants to make it worth-while, I can do that, or anyone else can.
Q. 40. Why do you oppose "stat-drain/damage"?
A. Historic reasons as well as the ease of victory versus some of the monsters by using a no-save spell.
Q. 41. You never explicitly disallow "stat-drain/damage FTW tactics".
A. My phrasing is meant to be friendlier than tyrannical. Intertpret as you wish.
Q. 42. Why eight or more hours for prebuffs?
A. Historic reasons as well as chances are that if you have a long term buff like that, it will see play.
Q. 43. What do you mean by point 22?
A. A very successful warblade in the first gauntlet was able to survive for 15+ rounds in some of the fights, he ultimately died, but the character was showing his extreme survivability and in a team environment would have done very well.
Q. 44. "Q: Why is there a limited amount of books available for spells?
Historic, when this thread was first created, there was a limited amount of books[.]” I find this point to be controversial. "Added UA and Heroes of Horror ... these were overlooked in the first time this gauntlet was posted." (post #8)
A. Huh? How do you find this point to be controversal? At the time these gauntlets were created, some of the books were not PUBLISHED yet. Additionally, since options from UA and Heroes of Horrors were used in the first time this was ran, it obviously was legal.
45. "Q: Why is there a limited amount of books available for spells?
C'mon, is this really that big of a limitation to the big 5(7?)?" I find this point to be controversial.
A. You are welcome to find anything controversal that you want to. Do you have a spell you would like to use that you cannot from that large list of books?
Q 46. Judging by the Dungeonscape variant of the "Tanking Sorceror", my 35th point becomes "as opposed to "aforementioned", do you just mean "mentioned"?"
A. Yes, that would be a good change.
Q. 47. "Tanking Sorceror": "I use crits for both me and the monster.
formula is
Damage * hit percent + Damage * crit range * confirm * crit multiplier."
d6 Eldritch Blast damage = 3.5 * ((19/20)+3.5) * 3.5 * 1/20 * (19/20) * 2?
A. No. Your parenthesis are wrong
It would be more like this
3.5*(19/20) + 3.5*(1/20) * (19/20)
Original damage of 3.5 times 95% chance to hit plus
Original damage times 5% crit chance * 95 % confirm chance times crit multiplier bonus (1)
Resulting in ...
No Crits : 3.325 damage
Crit: 3.49125 damage
Q. 48. "...the goal was to toss your character starting at level one and work your way upward." (post #13) I don't know what this means.
It means that start the gauntlet at level one and work upwards with your build. If your build is late in maturing, it will lose the first multiple. This is just the way it works.
Q. 49. "I made the mistake of under-equipping my barbarian ... and then i had to fight the next gauntlet virtually naked. (like around 5% of wbl)" (post #14) See point 19.
A. No. These are two different things. My post is talking about me using the same character at the same level (level 5 barbarian) in multiple builds. Point 19 (WBL) is talking about leveling up. When I surpassed my original level in the first gauntlet (I didn't go to 20) then I had my full WBL.
Q. 50. "any class/Prc from any book mentioned is fine." (post #34) You don't have this in the first post.
A. I assumed it is understood ... but I can mention things like "as is equipment, rules, etc"
Q. 51. "rules of the gauntlet are "no fly out of reach and pummel to death"" (post #37) You didn't say that.
A. "Using levitation/fly for a non-threatened victory is considered cheese." This is clear to me.
Q. 52. re: “Carnivore's Cloistered Cleric/Thug Archer” in the “multi classed noncasters” bucket: if one plays a caster-class but doesn't spell-cast, one is considered a "noncaster"?
A. Can you give me an example of this? For instance, in Carnivore's build, he casts spells at level 2 and from his description of what he is going to be doing, he will be casting multiple spells. Or, to state it differently, a wizard without spells is very similar to a commoner.
Q. 53. ""Run monsters intelligently" -- means that play them as you think they should be played if you were the DM and not the player." (post #46) What difference does that make?
A. It means things like "Don't have the monster keep making the same mistakes each round (provoking when it is not advantageous, etc)". Basically, when you post your battles -- people who are watching the gauntlet will comment on how it was run.
Q. 54. "Tomes: consider that once you buy the item, you need to eternally set that amount of money aside." (post #46) You didn't say that.
A. I don't understand. If one were to buy a tome, read it (to gain the bonus), then how do you (nightcypher) consider their WBL? Are you under their WBL as they don't have the item anymore?
Q. 55. "If the PrC (and adaption) is [not] from one of the posted books ... your entry won't be in the scoring..." You didn't say that.
A. I said something similar "these are the allowed books/etc" if you do not follow the rules, should the build be scored?
Q. 56. "if you decide to spend half your waking life refreshing a buff, then yes, it would be reasonable to have it full duration." (post #62) You mean "yes, limited-duration unlimited-use buffs are considered to have a duration equal to or greater than eight hours for the purposes of this gauntlet"?
A. No, I mean exactly what I said. In most adventures I am in, I will not put up with a character slowing the party down to do something like this. This type of tactic (in the extreme (every round)) results in all party buffs being of half duration during non-combat situations, as well as results in certain actions not being possible (i.e. a rogue with a 2 round buff cannot disable a track usually while keeping his buff active).
Q. 57. "No pre-knowledge unless the gauntlet gives you some." (post #62) Ipso facto.
A. In a later gauntlet, there is a section marked "pre-knowledge".
Q. 58. "Also, no knowledge check in the world will let you know at the store to buy a silver weapon before you encounter a monster." (post #62) I find this or these point(s) to be controversial.
A. This is not controversal (unless we are using different definitions of the word). In DnD, you cannot walk into a store, roll a knowledge check, then based on the results, buy an item -- when the knowledge check is based on an action/circumstance that your character does not know about.
Q. 59. "If the gauntlet says "preknowledge" (this one doesn't, some of the others do), then you are walking into an area forwarned (i.e. mini-adventure), if there is no information, assume this is a wandering monster which is not typically found in this area." (post #62) This statement helps my solution presented in my 24th point.
A. I am not willing to set up the battlemat for this. If you are willing, be my guest, I would appreciate the help.
Q. 60. "the gauntlets were made years ago and are not changing." (post #62) Fallacious.
A. The monsters in the gauntlet as well as their relationship to the player has not changed. The rules surrounding the gauntlet are changing somewhat (although, since the spirit of the original gauntlet is retained, and some of the changes actually occurred during the original gauntlet, even those changes might not really be changes)
Q. 61. re: post #67: What constitutes a "follower"?
A. Um. ... a follower .... basically anything that isn't something like an animal companion, familiar, or other similar thing.
Q. 62. re: post #67: What constitutes "leadership"?
A. The feat. And this is from point 7 in the rules section.
Q. 63. "The "no" is also because this is really a variant of "i fly and attack without being threatened"" (post #67) You're disallowing all kiting tactics? The response itself is unintentionally controversial.
A. No. I am not disallowing all kiting tactics. This should be demonstratably false by the inclusion of Carnivore's character.
Q 64. re: post #67: I don't understand the paragraph about the statement that "attacks are one pool", at the bottom of post.
A. When we did this, attacks were one pool, skill checks another.
Q. 65. re: post #68 and #70: I find this or these point(s) to be controversial. Define the disallowed
tactic. You have yet to give a scientific definition.
66. re: post #71: I find this or these point(s) to be controversial.
A. Quote what you are finding controversial ...
With that in mind, I'd rather have a ruling that says "no lame tactics" and being judged on that (maybe with some style bonus points or whatever, either by meyer or a general consensus among other participants) then that stuff get's disallowed because they open up the possibility for lame tactics.
That's clearer for the participants and prevents that you put a lot of time in a build that gets disallowed on something that's only arguably, or not at all, covered in the first post.
Surprisingly enough, "lame tactics" is too generic and requires a lot of discussion ... for instance, some people find that Divine Metamagic Persist is lame/cheese, but when we ran it 3 or so years ago, it didn't blow over entries out of the water the way we initially thought.
This fight was done by including crits. I am copy/pasting my entry from the original gauntlet. Please point out mistakes that we might have missed back then, as well as possible errors that crept in due to errata/new books/etc.
Mr. Fighter level 2
Level 1 ... Fighter ... Orc
Equipment cost: 110 gold.
Str 21
Dex 12
Con 12
Int 10
Wis 6
Char 6
HPs: 11
AC: 15
Skills:
Tumble 4 (Cityscape variant)
Jump 4
Level 1 ... Fighter ... Orc
Equipment cost: 110 gold.
Str 21
Dex 12
Con 12
Int 10
Wis 6
Char 6
HPs: 11
AC: 15
Skills:
Tumble 4 (Cityscape variant)
Jump 4
Equipment:
Chain Shirt
Halberd
Feats:
Improved Initiative, Power Attack
Round 1:
My Initiative is a +5, beating the rats +3.
I charge it, dealing 8.25 damage
some people find that Divine Metamagic Persist is lame/cheese, but when we ran it 3 or so years ago, it didn't blow over entries out of the water the way we initially thought.
No flaws, limited spells sources, and 1 encounter per day. Divine Metamagic Persist is about getting your great abilities through 4-5 encounters. This gauntlet, as opposed to the over-powered casters one that my DMM cleric slaughtered repeatedly, seems designed around burst output, which things like rage/1day support whearas a DMM persist cleric doesn't.
Lol, sorry for cutting the quote of there. I didn't think about the implication.
Divine Metamagic Persist is lame/cheese, but when we ran it 3 or so years ago, it didn't blow over entries out of the water the way we initially thought.
No flaws, limited spells sources, and 1 encounter per day. Divine Metamagic Persist is about getting your great abilities through 4-5 encounters. This gauntlet, as opposed to the over-powered casters one that my DMM cleric slaughtered repeatedly, seems designed around burst output, which things like rage/1day support whearas a DMM persist cleric doesn't.
That is one of the gauntlets I plan on ressurrecting. I look forward to seeing how nova builds handle it. This however, was the first gauntlet in the series.
(minor quibble, can you fix your quote of me so that it shows that I say "some people find DMM is lame/cheese" instead of "DMM is lame/cheese" ... as I do not agree with that statement)
I have asked others for an example spell that they need/require that is not already available from the large amount of books. Do you have one?
Oh, and I would be pleased if you wanted to submit your DMM cleric (pre-level 5 of the other gauntlet).
One more general question: what's the guideline on equipment? No item higher then 50% of total character wealth?
I could be wrong, but I think that DMG says 25% ... if it is a different number, can someone please correct me here?
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Show
1) Contestants will win if they defeat their enemy.
Q 8. What constitutes defeat of the enemy by a contestant?A. Um. I don't understand what this means, Are you asking what death, causing a monster to retreat, extreme paralysis, or any other number of normal measures of defeatedness would be?
I won't rephrase this.
Characters will be placed in the following buckets : Single Classed Casters, Single Classed non-Casters, Multiclass Casters, Multi-class non-casters.
Q 9. re: buckets: is this categorization merely aesthetic?A Assuming you are referring to caster/non-caster/single-classed/multi-classed. Its partly historic and partly the way I wanted to do it.
Paraphrase: why place characters in buckets? What point is there to it?
Characters will be placed in the following buckets : Single Classed Casters, Single Classed non-Casters, Multiclass Casters, Multi-class non-casters. Post which category you assume your character is in (warblade 20 is not a caster, fighter 18 / pious templar 2 is not a caster, wizard / fighter / abjurant champion/etc is a caster)
Q 10. What constitutes a caster?Q 11. What constitutes a non-caster?
A. Um .... I don't know how to answer this. A cleric 1/fighter 19 is not a caster. A wizard 5/fighter1/abjurant chamption 5/that other Prc 9 is a caster. No ToB only character is a caster. Seriously, I doubt there will be any objections to how I assign the characters into the buckets. Since this is really not imporant to the match, I am unsure that it really matters.
“A cleric 1/fighter 19” is a multi-classed caster, innit?;
A Jade Phoenix Mage with spell-casting from a source other than class-levels is a caster, innit?
Re: bucket-assignment: depends on what bucket you're heading for, innit?
Re: “unimporance”: This answers a bit of question 9.
Characters will be placed in the following buckets : Single Classed Casters, Single Classed non-Casters, Multiclass Casters, Multi-class non-casters. Post which category you assume your character is in (warblade 20 is not a caster, fighter 18 / pious templar 2 is not a caster, wizard / fighter / abjurant champion/etc is a caster)
Q12. Are mysteries (ToM) considered spells?A. I don't know what mysteries are. If they look like spells then they are.
How do I know if they look like a spell?
Characters will be placed in the following buckets : Single Classed Casters, Single Classed non-Casters, Multiclass Casters, Multi-class non-casters. Post which category you assume your character is in (warblade 20 is not a caster, fighter 18 / pious templar 2 is not a caster, wizard / fighter / abjurant champion/etc is a caster)
Q13. Are invocations considered spells?A. Yes. (notice that WoTC considers the warlock to be a caster class).
Invocations're spells because “levels of prestige
classes that provide +1 level of spellcasting effectively
stack with the warlock’s level to determine his eldritch blast
damage” and “a warlock also gains new invocations known at
these prestige class levels as though he had gained a level
in the warlock class”?
Complete ArcanePage 18
WARLOCKS AND PRESTIGE CLASSES
Warlocks benefi t in a specifi c way from prestige classes that
have “+1 level of existing arcane spellcasting class” or “+1
level of existing spellcasting class” as a level advancement
benefi t. A warlock taking levels in such a prestige class
does not gain any of his class abilities, but he does gain
an increased caster level when using his invocations and
increased damage with his eldritch blast. Levels of prestige
classes that provide +1 level of spellcasting effectively
stack with the warlock’s level to determine his eldritch blast
damage (treat his combined caster level as his warlock class
level when looking at Table 1–1: The Warlock to determine
eldritch blast damage) and his eldritch blast caster level (half
his total caster level from his warlock levels and his levels
in the prestige class that grant him an increased spellcast-
ing level). A warlock also gains new invocations known at
these prestige class levels as though he had gained a level
in the warlock class.
A warlock cannot qualify for prestige classes with
spellcasting level requirements, as he never actually learns
to cast spells. However, prestige classes with caster level
requirements, such as the acolyte of the skin, are well suited
to the warlock. A warlock’s caster level for his invocations
fulfi lls this requirement. See page 71 in Chapter 3 for more
details on caster level requirements, spellcasting level
requirements, and specifi c spell requirements for feats and
prestige classes.
I don't see how you can say invocations are spell from the wording of this rule.
Characters will be placed in the following buckets : Single Classed Casters, Single Classed non-Casters, Multiclass Casters, Multi-class non-casters. Post which category you assume your character is in (warblade 20 is not a caster, fighter 18 / pious templar 2 is not a caster, wizard / fighter / abjurant champion/etc is a caster)
Q 14. Is the "Artificer" base class a caster?A. It would count as one.
Why?
2) Character used by the challenger must be the same character (no retraining) beginning to end.…
15) … Make sure your character is finished as it will be used (unchanged) for later gauntlets.
...
21) Post full characters (skills, feats, equipment, etc)
Q. 15. Point two shouldn't precede neither your 21st point nor your 15th.A. You do not have a point two.
I meant your second point in the original, title-post of rules.
2) Character used by the challenger must be the same character (no retraining) beginning to end.…
15) … Make sure your character is finished as it will be used (unchanged) for later gauntlets.
...
21) Post full characters (skills, feats, equipment, etc)
Q. 16. You imply the challenger must establish a build to follow from which to not stray, however one knows not the level of the build required. Thus, the build cannot be planned.A. This makes no sense. Your level 1 entry works for the level 1 monster, etc. At ever stage of the game, you know the level of the build you are submitting.
No comment.
2) Character used by the challenger must be the same character (no retraining) beginning to end.
Q. 18. What constitutes "retraining"? Just the character option from PHBII?A. I guess. I am unsure what exactly you are asking. If you are saying "Can I pay someone to psychic reformation me" the answer is no.
Why?
4) Run the monster intelligently.
Q. 20. What's the motivation of between the monster and the gauntlet-runner?A. The same motivation that there is, when playing DnD, you are traveling from place to place, and the DM says "Roll initiative".
The motivation between the monster and the gauntlet-runner, i.e. the character that must defeat the monster for the purposes of this “Necro-thread gauntlet 1”, is “the same motivation that there is” for the DM asking the person who's playing a PC in the game they're hosting, to perform a d20 die-roll, supposedly to initiate a random encounter? F-, see me after class.
I change the wording of my original question, that is your my question #20: why does the monster that one is to face at a certain level equal to one's own, engage in combat with one's character? A rule you give is to run the monster intelligently, but consensus states that aversion from conflict is smart, or wise. You give no reason to justify the fights as anything but stupid, thus inherently breaking rule #4 in every fight where one does not provide sufficient motivation for the conflict itself, themselves.
4) ... For damage: Either use weighted averages (hit chance * damage) or threshold (65% = full damage, and then again at 165% / etc). For Skill Checks / Saves, use threshold method at 55%.
Q. 21. I don't understand the threshold method: 65% of what? Why 65%? Is it an arbitrary number?A. Threshold method. Lets say that you have a 50% chance to hit the opponent. Your attack in round one hits 50%, which is not enough to trigger threshold. This means you miss. The next round, your 50% results in 100% (the 50 from last round, plus the 50 from this round), which surpasses the 65% threshold resulting in a hit. The third round you will miss (150), the fourth round you will hit (200).
65% was arbitrary, but was agreed to in the previous gauntlet by the participants. 50% led to some concerns (I have a 50% to grapple you, you have a 50% to resist grapple, which one wins?)
5) Battle begins at 30 feet outside the monsters maximum reach.
6) This is a side note argument, in each case the terrain is considered to be neutral, trying to set up a proper battlemat for this is going to be a nightmare so we are working under the 'proper illumination for both sides to see correctly without a crapload of obstacles in the way' principle to keep the number of extraneous variables as manageable as I possibly can.
Q. 22. How does one get to where one begins?A. Unsure, does it matter? Whatever method is used, results in the lack of short-term buffs already talked about.
6) This is a side note argument, in each case the terrain is considered to be neutral, trying to set up a proper battlemat for this is going to be a nightmare so we are working under the 'proper illumination for both sides to see correctly without a crapload of obstacles in the way' principle to keep the number of extraneous variables as manageable as I possibly can.
Q. 23. What's the definition of "neutral terrain"?A. Meaning, do not worry about terrain. There is no trees in the way, no corridors, no rough terrain, no water to swim through, no lava to avoid, etc.
6) This is a side note argument, in each case the terrain is considered to be neutral, trying to set up a proper battlemat for this is going to be a nightmare so we are working under the 'proper illumination for both sides to see correctly without a crapload of obstacles in the way' principle to keep the number of extraneous variables as manageable as I possibly can.
Q. 24. Why is "trying to set up a proper battlemat for this is going to be a nightmare"? Take a generic map of a location that is most plausible for all of the participant-beings' being there), and have it wrap-around, have an infinite amount adjacent to each other, have infinite featureless terrain beyond that or whatever else as a solution to boundaries.A. Are you offering to set this up? That verbage was copy/pasted from original gauntlet. In future gauntlets we gained proficiency in setting up positioning over the web, so for those, we have facing/positioning/etc.
6) This is a side note argument, in each case the terrain is considered to be neutral, trying to set up a proper battlemat for this is going to be a nightmare so we are working under the 'proper illumination for both sides to see correctly without a crapload of obstacles in the way' principle to keep the number of extraneous variables as manageable as I possibly can.
Q. 25. If both players have Darkvision, is no illumination "proper illumination for both sides to see correctly"? What about shadowy illumination and low light-vision?A. What does this matter?
6) This is a side note argument, in each case the terrain is considered to be neutral, trying to set up a proper battlemat for this is going to be a nightmare so we are working under the 'proper illumination for both sides to see correctly without a crapload of obstacles in the way' principle to keep the number of extraneous variables as manageable as I possibly can.
Q. 26. You say "without a crapload of obstacles in the way"; do you imply that there can be a crapload of obstacles out of the way? That there's still obstacles in the way, just not what's considered "a crapload"?A. No obstacles. None. Zero. Nothing that hinders movement/etc.
6) This is a side note argument, in each case the terrain is considered to be neutral, trying to set up a proper battlemat for this is going to be a nightmare so we are working under the 'proper illumination for both sides to see correctly without a crapload of obstacles in the way' principle to keep the number of extraneous variables as manageable as I possibly can.
Q. 27. re: variables: locked in place, forced to trade attacks vs. a proper battle.A. Other entrants have used things like the wizards jaunt, chronocharms, maneuvers, swift spells, etc ...
7) You may not hire, or gain through leadership, any followers, if you want to use leadership to get a mount (as khan did in one build) I will consider it but again trying to avoid too many variables.
Q. 28. Is buying a slave considered hiring? The difference is that to hire means paying the worker instead of buying the slave from the slave-seller.A. Don't look for loopholes. Yes, a slave is the same as hiring. The goal is to see a build in action. If the character spens WBL on slaves/hirelings/etc then the character himself will not be needed. So that is disallowed. The same for making an army of undead.
re: “Don't look for loopholes.”: No items, Commoner-only, FINAL DESTINATION.
9) The battlefields are technically infinite in all directions, sorry dungeon crashers but I can't place barriers without it being arbitrary and most builds work well with a large expanse to play with.
Q. 29. Infinite expanse =/= nothing for a Dungeon crasher to send their opponents flying into. You admit you're nerfing non-casters, increasing the disparity between them and casters?A. No. I do not admit that I am nerfing non-casters. I say "here are the rules". Some of them might benefit casters, others might benefit non-casters. Some hurt casters, others hurt non-casters.
9) The battlefields are technically infinite in all directions, sorry dungeon crashers but I can't place barriers without it being arbitrary and most builds work well with a large expanse to play with.…
16) Most of these monsters cannot fly. Using levitation/fly for a non-threatened victory is considered cheese.
Q. 31. "most builds work well with a large expanse to play with." This statement and your 16th point (i.e. "Using levitation/fly for a non-threatened victory is considered cheese.") are contradictory.A. No, think of it like this. If you are the DM and every encounter you have melee critters, and your party levitates up for a nonthreatened victory, you realize that the encounters themselves would change (or, by DMG XP section, little or no XP would be given for the encounters). Since this gauntlet challenges are non-changing, I am unable to react in that fashion.
10) Races that are allowed are as follows, PHB, Races, Any non-la Monstrous humanoid (orcs, goblins, kobolds), Non LA races from ECS, non LA races from XPH, Non LA races from MoI, Non LA races from FRCS, Non LA races from Stormwrack, sandstorm, and frostburn, in addition any Races of races without LA will be allowed (including Dragnborn but your base race must follow the rules as listed)
11) For druids, assume that all the monsters in books I pulled from exist for the purposes of your wildshaping, before anyone screams remember that I am allowing a fair amount of pulling.
12) Substitution options are allowable so long as they are from the aforementioned books
13) Spells for casters are available from PH2, PH, Completes, Races of, Spell compendium, Stormwrack, frostburn, sandstorm, Dungeonscape, XPH, MoI, ToM.
14) Feats and weapons listed in all aforementioned books are fair game for use by all.
Q. 34. It's time to pull out the big guns: community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758...A. I don't understand what you mean by this.
16) Most of these monsters cannot fly. Using levitation/fly for a non-threatened victory is considered cheese.
Q. 36. The way point 16 is phrased, this isn't even a rule, it's just an opinion.A. Its in the rules section, the way it is phrased is meant to mean "don't do this, and here is why."
17) No TO (theoretical optimization) or campaign busting but CO is fine. (example: pun-pun is bad, persistant divine metamagic is fine)
Q. 37. Define "[theoretical optimization] or campaign busting".A. TO was the old forums. It means "nothing that you think would result in your character being banned, or the DM saying 'NO' outright". This includes things like Pun-Pun, genesis-time-flowing, haunt-shift into a robot, etc. Campaign Busting was a thread way-back-when, it included similar things (using the anger disease for infinite strength, etc). This is basically alluded to in the example clarification I made in that line.
17) No TO (theoretical optimization) or campaign busting but CO is fine. (example: pun-pun is bad, persistant divine metamagic is fine)
Q. 38. Define CO.A. Stuff able to see play at a normal table. If you have questions as to which is which, ask me -- or post to the thread and maybe someone else can answer.
18) Bonus cool points are awarded for style and ease of getting the character approved by a random DM.
Q. 39. Are you the judge of point 18?A. If/when we have enough entrants to make it worth-while, I can do that, or anyone else can.
19) No stat-drain/damage FTW tactics please.
Q. 40. Why do you oppose "stat-drain/damage"?A. Historic reasons as well as the ease of victory versus some of the monsters by using a no-save spell.
19) No stat-drain/damage FTW tactics please.
Q. 41. You never explicitly disallow "stat-drain/damage FTW tactics".A. My phrasing is meant to be friendlier than tyrannical. Intertpret as you wish.
20) Pre-buffing is allowed if the duration of the spell is more than 8 hours. Other than that, no prebuffing.
Q. 42. Why eight or more hours for prebuffs?A. Historic reasons as well as chances are that if you have a long term buff like that, it will see play.
22) Characters do not have to win.
Q. 43. What do you mean by point 22?A. A very successful warblade in the first gauntlet was able to survive for 15+ rounds in some of the fights, he ultimately died, but the character was showing his extreme survivability and in a team environment would have done very well.
Q: Why is there a limited amount of books available for spells?Historic, when this thread was first created, there was a limited amount of books[.]
Q. 44. I find this point to be controversial. "Added UA and Heroes of Horror ... these were overlooked in the first time this gauntlet was posted." (post #8)A. Huh? How do you find this point to be controversal? At the time these gauntlets were created, some of the books were not PUBLISHED yet. Additionally, since options from UA and Heroes of Horrors were used in the first time this was ran, it obviously was legal.
Q: Why is there a limited amount of books available for spells?C'mon, is this really that big of a limitation to the big 5(7?)?
Q. 45. I find this point to be controversial.A. You are welcome to find anything controversal that you want to. Do you have a spell you would like to use that you cannot from that large list of books?
Damage * hit percent + Damage * crit range * confirm * crit multiplier.
Q. 47. d6 Eldritch Blast damage = 3.5 * ((19/20)+3.5) * 3.5 * 1/20 * (19/20) * 2?A. No. Your parenthesis are wrong
It would be more like this
3.5*(19/20) + 3.5*(1/20) * (19/20)
Original damage of 3.5 times 95% chance to hit plus
Original damage times 5% crit chance * 95 % confirm chance times crit multiplier bonus (1)
Resulting in ...
No Crits : 3.325 damage
Crit: 3.49125 damage
I made the mistake of under-equipping my barbarian ... and then i had to fight the next gauntlet virtually naked. (like around 5% of wbl)
Q. 49. See point 19.19. What do you mean "you are considered at full"? One's at full WBL?A. No. These are two different things. My post is talking about me using the same character at the same level (level 5 barbarian) in multiple builds. Point 19 (WBL) is talking about leveling up. When I surpassed my original level in the first gauntlet (I didn't go to 20) then I had my full WBL.
Maybe I'm not looking right, but I only see a list of books allowed for races and a list of books allowed for spells.... isn't there a general list of books allowed, or are all WotC books allowed regarding classes, skills, etc?
And yes, any class/Prc from any book mentioned is fine.
Q. 50. You don't have this in the first post.A. I assumed it is understood ... but I can mention things like "as is equipment, rules, etc"
Sure, sure. But for spellcasters, it often comes down to "I cast Fly and then pummel it out of its reach" or some such thing.
Ael, rules of the gauntlet are "no fly out of reach and pummel to death" .. from day one ... so no, that tactic won't be used.
Q. 51. You didn't say that.A. "Using levitation/fly for a non-threatened victory is considered cheese." This is clear to me.
...Contestants
...Multi Classed Noncasters
...
Carnivore's Cloistered Cleric/Thug Archer Level 1 -- 5 points, rat doesn't get a chance to attack.
Carnivore's Cloistered Cleric/Thug Archer Level 2 -- 1 point, would lose if combat lasted another round.
will be posting my 3rd lvl character monday(possibly Sunday if i can work on it then)
will read everyones posts completely later(wow, they seem very long and detailed)
Hope to see some cool fights added when I return!
Human
Cloistered Cleric 1/ Fighter 2(Thug variant)
Attributes: (25pt buy)
14 Str
14 Dex
10 Con
12 Int
12 Wis
11 Cha
Feats:
1st lvl: Education
Travel Devotion(human bonus)
Knowledge Devotion(give up Knowledge Domain)
Improved initiative(Time bonus)
Point Blank Shot(Elf Bonus)
3rd lvl: Law Devotion, Weapon Focus(Composite Longbow)(Fighter bonus)
Traits:
Aggressive(+2 initiative, -1 AC)
Quick(+10 land speed,-1hp/lvl)
Domains:
Knowledge(given up for Knowledge Devotion)
Time
Elf
Equipment: (2700gp)
375gp Masterwork Longbow
1gp 20x regular Arrows ... all arrows in quivers on Back beside Bow
2gp 20x Cold Iron Arrows
3gp 20x Alchemical Silver Arrows
0gp Club ... on Back Sheath
75gp Studded leather with Spikes
25gp Buckler
50gp Tanglefoot bags ... in Belt
1gp Wooden Holy Symbol .... in Hand
1gp Travelers outfit
750gp Potion of Haste
1400gp Anklet of Translocation
2698gp spent
Skills:
44 skill points to spend
Class Skills:
5 ranks Concentration
5 ranks Knowledge (arcana)
6 ranks Knowledge(religion)
6 ranks Knowledge(the planes)
6 ranks Knowledge(Dungeoneering)
6 ranks Knowledge(Nature)
4 ranks Spellcraft
Cross Class Skills:
1 Rank Tumble
1 Rank Spot
Skill Tricks:
Collector of Stories(+5 Knowledge checks)
Spells Prepared:
0-lvl:
3x Guidance
1st lvl:
Bless
Divine Favor
True Strike: Domain
Combat Stats:
Initiative: +8
Speed 40'
HP 14
AC 16 (base 10 + 3 Armor +1 Shield +2 Dex), Touch 12, Flatfooted 15
Saves(+5 F, +2 R, +3 W)
BAB +2
Ranged Attack bonus: +2 BAB +2 Dex +1 PtBlkSht +2 Insight Knowledge Devo +1 Luck +1 Haste +3 Law +1 WF= +13
Melee Attack Bonus: +2 BAB +2 Str +2 Insight Knowledge Devo +1 Luck +1 Haste +3 Law = +11
Damage:
Club 1d6 + 2 Str +1 Insight +1 Luck= 7.5 damage
Composite Longbow 1d8 +1 insight +1 Luck= 6.5 damage
Updated Tactics:
i start holding Holy Symbol in my left hand(Buckler strapped to this arm), right hand holds Potion of Haste ..... Holy Symbol is on a cord around my neck so i can Drop it as a Free action without it falling to the ground, and i can grab it later(Move action) if needed
stats Me 13/13 hp, Runehound 37/37hp
Round 1: wins Initiative, Drink Haste Potion(Standard Action) ... Activates Travel Devotion, Move 80' back away from Runehound(Swift), Move 80' away from Runehound while Drawing Tanglefoot bag(move action)..... Runehound uses Run action to 4x speed, move to 10' from me(Threatens with Bite) (range between 10')
stats Me 13/13 hp, Runehound 37/37hp
Round 2: Runehound is 10' from me .... use Anklet of Translocation(Swift action, does not provoke AoO) move 10' from Runehound, throw Tanglefoot bag(standard action)+8 Ranged Touch Attack(+2 BAB +2 Dex +1 PtBlkSht +2 Insight Knowledge Devo +1 Haste), Move 80' from Runehound (100' from Runehound) ..... Runehound is Entangled(max move 25', no Run or Charge,-2 Attack, -4 Dex) moves 25' towards me(range Between 75')(entangled 4 more rounds)
stats Me 13/13 hp, Runehound 37/37hp
Round 3: Runehound is 75' from me .... Activate Law Devotion(Swift action)...cast Divine Favor(Standard action)drop holy symbol(Free Action), move 80' away from Runehound while drawing Longbow(Move Action) .... Runehound moves 25'(entanlgled 3 more rounds)(range between 130')
stats Me 13/13 hp, Runehound 37/37hp
Round 4: Runehound is 130' from me .... i fire Full Attack (2 @ +13/+13 = 85% x 6.5 = 5.525 x 2 shots = 11 damage total)(full round action) ... move 80'(Swift action) ... Runehound moves 25'(entanlgled 2 more rounds)(range between 195')
stats Me 13/13 hp, Runehound 26/37hp
Round 5: Runehound is 195' from me .... i fire Full Attack (2 @ +13/+13 = 85% x 6.5 = 5.525 x 2 shots = 11 damage total)(full round action) ... move 80'(Swift action) ... Runehound moves 25'(entanlgled 1 more round)(range between 250')
stats Me 13/13 hp, Runehound 15/37hp
Round 6: Runehound is 250' from me .... i fire Full Attack (2 @ +13/+13 = 85% x 6.5 = 5.525 x 2 shots = 11 damage total)(full round action) ... move 80'(Swift action) ... Runehound uses Run action to 4x speed(200'), (Range between 130')
stats Me 13/13 hp, Runehound 4/37hp
Round 7: Runehound is 130' from me .... i fire Full Attack (2 @ +13/+13 = 85% x 6.5 = 5.525 x 2 shots = 11 damage total)(full round action) Runehound is dead
if an 8th round is needed because of some math error ..... i will have moved again in the 7th, it will close
Round 8: assume Runehound is 10' from me .... use Anklet of Translocation(Swift action, does not provoke AoO) move 10' from Runehound,i fire Full Attack (2 @ +13/+13 = 85% x 6.5 = 5.525 x 2 shots = 11 damage total)(full round action) .... now it is dead for sure
Total Victory 5 points
Updated Tactics:
i start holding Holy Symbol in my left hand(Buckler strapped to this arm), right hand holds Potion of Haste ..... Holy Symbol is on a cord around my neck so i can Drop it as a Free action without it falling to the ground, and i can grab it later(Move action) if needed
Good thing you happen to be holding the correct things in your hands
Hey, you might want to join the church of luck -- take a look at the benefits for joining ...
[EDIT] If you do so, please make sure to account for the costs involved in being part of the church -- and list your rank in it -- should be really low. You can only take credit for things from the gauntlet.
Your character has been posted with his win (unless someone else sees an error that I missed)
nevermind ..... found it:
Luck Domain (CC)
+2 bonus on Knowledge checks to prepare for an upcoming challenge/adventure
+1 bonus on caster level checks to overcome spell resistance
1/day bonus equal to +1/3 character levels on a single saving throw
1/day force an opponent to reroll an attack, check or save, after you know the result of the roll
I have asked others for an example spell that they need/require that is not already available from the large amount of books. Do you have one?
Wieldskill, Magic of Faerun, is good cheese for stuff like this.
Is there a handbook to Affiliations anywhere?
I have asked others for an example spell that they need/require that is not already available from the large amount of books. Do you have one?
Wieldskill, Magic of Faerun, is good cheese for stuff like this.
Is there a handbook to Affiliations anywhere?
Might you be thinking of entering the gauntlet?
Affiliations Part One
here is a nice post from Jedda over at BGAffiliations Part One
Human
Cloistered Cleric 1/ Fighter 3(Thug variant)
Attributes: (25pt buy)
14 Str
15 Dex(14 +1 Lvl)
10 Con
12 Int
12 Wis
11 Cha
Feats:
Travel Devotion(human bonus)
Knowledge Devotion(give up Knowledge Domain)
Improved initiative(Time bonus)
Point Blank Shot(Elf Bonus)
1st lvl: Education
3rd lvl: Law Devotion, Weapon Focus(Composite Longbow)(Fighter bonus)
Traits:
Aggressive(+2 initiative, -1 AC)
Quick(+10 land speed,-1hp/lvl)
Domains:
Knowledge(given up for Knowledge Devotion)
Time
Elf
Equipment: (5400gp)
1725gp Masterwork Mighty(+2) Composite Longbow with Least Crystal of Energy Assault(Fire) and Tripple Alchemical Retainer(holding 1 Fire, 1 Cold, 1 Elec capsule each)
1gp 20x regular Arrows ... all arrows in quivers on Back beside Bow
2gp 20x Cold Iron Arrows
3gp 20x Alchemical Silver Arrows
615gp MW Longsword with Least Crystal of Return ... on Back Sheath
150gp Chain Shirt with Spikes
205gp Darkwood Buckler
100gp 2x Tanglefoot bags ... in Belt
1gp Wooden Holy Symbol .... in Hand
1gp Travelers outfit
750gp Potion of Haste
1400gp Anklet of Translocation
4953gp spent
447 left
Skills:
50 skill points to spend
Class Skills:
5 ranks Concentration
7 ranks Knowledge (arcana)
7 ranks Knowledge(religion)
7 ranks Knowledge(the planes)
7 ranks Knowledge(Dungeoneering)
7 ranks Knowledge(Nature)
4 ranks Spellcraft
Cross Class Skills:
1 Rank Tumble
1 Rank Spot
Skill Tricks:
Collector of Stories(+5 Knowledge checks)
Spells Prepared:
0-lvl:
3x Guidance
1st lvl:
Bless
Divine Favor
True Strike: Domain
Combat Stats:
Initiative: +8
Speed 40'
HP 18
AC 17 (base 10 + 4 Armor +1 Shield +2 Dex), Touch 12, Flatfooted 15
Saves(+5 F, +3 R, +4 W)
BAB +3
Ranged Attack bonus: +3 BAB +2 Dex +1 PtBlkSht +2 Insight Knowledge Devo +1 Luck +1 Haste +3 Law +1 WF +1 MW= +15
Melee Attack Bonus: +3 BAB +2 Str +2 Insight Knowledge Devo +1 Luck +1 Haste +3 Law +1 MW= +13
Damage:
Longsword + 1d8 + 2 Str +2 Insight +1 Luck= 9.5 damage
Composite Longbow 1d8 + 2 Str +2 Insight +1 Luck +1 Fire= 10.5 damage
Updated Tactics:
i start holding Holy Symbol in my left hand(Buckler strapped to this arm), right hand holds Potion of Haste ..... Holy Symbol is on a cord around my neck so i can Drop it as a Free action without it falling to the ground, and i can grab it later(Move action) if needed .... range between = 40'
stats Me 18/18 hp, Minotaur 39/39hp
Round 1: wins Initiative, Drink Haste Potion(Standard Action) ... Activates Travel Devotion, Move to 80' back away from Minotaur(Swift), Move 80' away from Minotaur while Drawing Tanglefoot bag(move action)..... Minotaur uses Run action to 4x speed(120'), close to 80' from me
stats Me 18/18 hp, Minotaur 39/39hp
Round 2: Minotaur is 80' from me .... move 70' towards Minotaur(swift action), throw Tanglefoot bag(standard action)+9 Ranged Touch Attack(+3 BAB +2 Dex +1 PtBlkSht +2 Insight Knowledge Devo +1 Haste), Move 80' from Minotaur (90' from Minotaur) ..... Minotaur is Entangled(max move 15', no Run or Charge,-2 Attack, -4 Dex) moves 15' towards me(range Between 75')(entangled 4 more rounds)
stats Me 18/18 hp, Minotaur 39/39hp
Round 3: Minotaur is 75' from me .... Activate Law Devotion(Swift action)...cast Divine Favor(Standard action)drop holy symbol(Free Action), move 80' away from Minotaur while drawing Longbow(Move Action) .... Minotaur moves 15'(entangled 3 more rounds)(range between 140')
stats Me 18/18 hp, Minotaur 39/39hp
Round 4: Minotaur is 140' from me ....Activate Triple Alchemical Retainer(all Capsules)(Swift action) ... i fire Full Attack (2 @ +15/+15 = 100% x (10.5+10.5 Alchemical) x 2 shots = 42 damage total)(full round action) ... Minotaur is Dead
Overwhelming Victory : 5 points (no contest)
this was way too easy ..... actually could have done it earlier
Ashern -- are you planning on updating your primeval entrant?
Other's anyone want to toss a DMM Persist cleric into the mix? By now, you have some baselines for how to post, expectations, as well as an idea of how other builds fare.
Personally, I would like to see some ToB builds tossed in here to see if 3-4 years time has changed things at all.
ToB makes Melee combat way to easy ...
You would think so .... but when this last occurred, a crusader build made a wonderful tank, but had issues defeating the enemies. The submitter was satisfied with that, and he counted it as a success due to how he wanted to play it (survivability), combats lasted >12 rounds each.
Generic Spellcaster
Warmage/ Psion/ Cerebremancer
Ranger/ Psion/ Slayer
Ranger
Alrighty, I finally got around to it and I'm ready to throw my hat into the ring. Might I present my chosen champion for this gauntlet. This is my first time using this style of combat calculations, (My head still hurts from all the math) but I think I didn't do too bad. All my damage calculations use the weighted average system. I also round down for all rolls. (Mine and bad guys)
The Unnamed Spartan Warrior
Level 1
Race: Human
Class: Barbarian 1 [Lion Totem Varient]
Str 18 / Dex 14 / Con 11 / Int 8 / Wis 8 / Cha 8
HP: 12 (14 while Raging)
AC: 17 (18 with Dodge)
Fort: +2 / Ref: +2 / Will: +0
Skills: Jump 4 ranks
Feats: Battle Jump (Forgotten Realms: Unapproachable East), Dodge
Gear: (50g Total)
Shortspear (2g)
Studded Leather Armor (25g)
Shield Heavy Wooden (7g)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fight 1: Horrid Rat
*Rat Wins Initiative. Rat Goes first*
-Round 1-
Rat moves up to me to preserve AC. Bites me for 8 damage. I counter with an AoOp for 3 damage.
On my turn I declare dodge on the rat, rage, and attack it for 8 damage, killing it.
~Fight Synopsis~
I could not have lasted another round. Fight Score: Pyrric Victory (1 point)
~RP Sample~
As the spartan traveled through the dank caves that crisscrossed along the cliffsides, he heard a rustle from up ahead. His keen eyes caught a flicker of movement as something small and dark dashed towards him. The spartan thrust his spear forward and felt the ripping of flesh acorss his blade. Pain seemed to follow pain as the spartan felt something bite down on his calf, almost severing the tendon. Now fully able to see his target, the sparten pointed his spear tip at the filthy beasts head and thrust it down. Bone and flesh split cleanly by the edge of his speartip as the now dead rat lay lifeless on the ground. Its head still bleeding from being split in two. "Pest..."
Level 2
Class: Barbarian 1 [Lion Totem Varient] / Fighter 1
HP: 22 (26 while Raging)
AC: 17 (18 with Dodge)
Fort: +4 / Ref: +2 / Will: +0
Skills: Jump 5 ranks
Feats: Battle Jump, Dodge, Mobility
Gear: (900g)
Masterwork Silver Shortspear (301g + Price of being Silver)
Studded Leather (25g)
Heavy Wooden Shield (7g)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fight 2: Worg
*Initiatives are tied. Worg goes first.*
-Round 1-
Worg uses move action to move to me and attack. I AoOp for 7 damage. It bites me for 5 points of damage and trips me. On my turn I declare dodge, rage, stand from prone, and attack. Me standing provokes an AoOp from the worg who bites me for another 6 points of damage. I barely resist being tripped again. My attack deals 10 damage.
-Round 2-
Worg bites me for another 6 points of damage. I barely manage to resist being tripped again. I attack for 10 damage.
-Round 3-
Worg bites me for another 6 damage. Lets say I fail the trip this time. I fall prone. I attack from prone, dealing 6 damage, killing the worg.
~Fight Synopsis~
I could not have lasted another round. Fight Score: Pyrric Victory (1 point)
~RP Sample~
The air was tense as the spartan finally found his prey, or should I say the prey found him. Cold eyes glared back at him as the feral wolf let out a growl. "Come to your death..." whispered the spartan. As if in agreement, the beast bounded forward, sinking its fangs into the spartans leg; but, not before the spartan was able to slash a shallow wound across the beasts back. As flesh ripped from bone the beast brought the spartan to the ground.
Anger flashed through the spartans eyes as he rose from the ground. The sensation of the pain searing through his shoulder as the beast bit him barely registering within the mind of the stubborn warrior. Responding with his own snarl, the warrior drove his spear into the beasts front leg. Teeth and blade flashed as the spartan and the word traded blows, pain for pain, blood for blood.
As the worg tore into the spartans wounded leg, the spartan fell to the ground once more. Knowing the beast would go for the kill, the spartan pulled his spear close and angled it up just as the beasts maw was leaping for his throat. Jagged razor sharp teeth stared back at the spartan as blood trickled down his spear shaft. The beast shutted for a moment before slumping down to the ground. As the spartan withdrew his spear from the beasts heart he muttered "Stupid mutt...."
Level 3
Class: Barbarian 1 [Lion Totem] / Fighter 2
HP: 32 (38 while Raging)
AC: 17 (18 with Dodge)
Fort: +5 / Ref: +2 / Will: +0
Skills: Jump 6 ranks
Feats: Battle Jump, Dodge, Mobility, Power Attack, Improved Bullrush
Gear: (2,700g)
MW Silver Shortspear (301g + price of silver)
Studded Leather Armor (25g)
Heavy Wooden Shield(7g)
Potion of Haste x1 (750gp) ~hung on belt
Triple Weapon Capsule Retainer (450gp) ~attached to shortspear
Quickflame x1 (25g) ~loaded into capsule
Quickfrost x1 (25g) ~ loaded into capsule
Quickspark x1 (25g) ~ loaded into capsule
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fight 3: Rune Hound
*Initiative is a draw. Rune Hound goes first.*
-Round 1-
Rune Hound moves 50 feet back to put put the distance between us at 90 feet. It uses its Vile Spew dealing 21 points of acid damage to me. On my turn I use a standard action to drink my haste potion and my move to move 60 feet back. Putting the total distance between us at 150 feet.
-Round 2-
Rune Hound runs to close the distance between us to 70 feet, so as to prevent me from charging. (Normally my charge range is 60ft) On my turn I use a swift action to activate my triple weapon capsule retainer, thus activating all three. I then charge the Rune Hound. The Rune Hound AoOps me for 8 damage. I then full attack the Rune Hound dealing 54 points of damage overall, killing the Rune Hound.
~Fight Synopsis~
I could not have lasted another round. Fight Score: Bad A** Pyrric Victory (1 point)
~RP Sample~
An unearthly snarl echoed from the twisted beasts lips. The spartan gritted his teeth as he mustered his strength for the inevitable fight. With a sudden burst of speed the beast seemed to bound off in retreat. It was a foolish miscalculation on the spartans part. As the beast neared one ninety paces it spun on its feet and a sickening churning sound echoed from its throat before the beast expelled a large clump of greenish bile.
The attack caught the spartan off guard as he felt the sticky bile splash across his shield and spray along his body. His skin seared in pain and the spartan knew he could not afford to let the beast release another purtrid assault. Grasping a smile vile from his belt, the spartan popped the cork and drank deeply of its contents. Adrenaline surged through his body as the potion took effect. Curious, the spartan decided to test the beasts cunning. With great speed the spartan retreated back in order to goad the beast into following.
As if in reply, the beast charged after the spartan, its mouth still dripping with bile from its previous assault. To the spartans joy, the beast proved to be a worthy foe, stopping many feet from him as if it was wary of something. "Thats right.... your not as stupid as you look." The spartan smiled as he tapped the base of his spear, releasing a mixture of alchemical substances onto his weapon. His eagerness to kill had risen to the point of no return. Fixing his gaze on the beast the spartan whispered.... "but too late."
Every muscle in the spartans body surged as he charge the beast. As he propelled his body forward the beast saw its chance and struck quickly, tearing flesh from the spartan's shoulder. Undaunted by the pain, the spartan gave a fierce roar as he drove his spear into the beasts long neck. His temped flared as he ripped his spear from its flesh and spun around, using the momentum to impale the point of his spear through the beasts jaws. The smell of burnt flesh filled the air as the beast fell limp. Its own weight ripped its head from the spartans bloody spear.
excellent job
The Unnamed Spartan Warrior
Level 1
Race: Human
Class: Barbarian 1 [Lion Totem Varient]
Str 18 / Dex 14 / Con 11 / Int 8 / Wis 8 / Cha 8
Feats: Battle Jump (Forgotten Realms: Unapproachable East), Dodge
Shortspear (2g)
Fight 1: Horrid Rat
*Rat Wins Initiative. Rat Goes first*
-Round 1-
Rat moves up to me to preserve AC. Bites me for 8 damage. I counter with an AoOp for 3 damage.
On my turn I declare dodge on the rat, rage, and attack it for 8 damage, killing it.
~Fight Synopsis~
I could not have lasted another round. Fight Score: Pyrric Victory (1 point)
Since the rat wins initiative, you are flatfooted, as such, you cannot make an AoO on it.
Weighted average works like this:
The rat has a +4 to hit you, your flatfooted AC is 15, so it has a 50% chance to hit you. It deals 2d6 damage (7 on average), so you would take 3.5 damage.
Your turn to attack:
You rage, so have a to hit bonus of +7 (bab 1, str 6). versus an AC of 20, you have a 65% to hit, dealing 1d6+6 (9.5 on average), so you deal 6.15 damage.
It attacks you again, this time your AC is 16 (not flatfooted, raging, dodging), it has a 45% chance to hit you, dealing 3.15 damage, (total taken 6.65)
Your turn, you hit and kill it -- and since you could easily have taken another round of combat, this is a success.
Just curious, will the others continue with the higher level encounters? The more the merrier!
One more general question: what's the guideline on equipment? No item higher then 50% of total character wealth?
I could be wrong, but I think that DMG says 25% ... if it is a different number, can someone please correct me here?
Mhhh, was working on my build, found in the DMG that indeed 25% is given as an example on how a DM could limit gear of characters created above 1st level. It's not a hard rule though.
What will we do with this? If it's 25%, then for example the tripple weapon caplule retrainer wouldn't be allowed at lvl 2.
normally i find that buying many cheap items is more effective than buying a single expensive item ..... but at low levels it makes it difficult since eveything costs so much, at 12th lvl .. more cheap items is better but a single nice item might be all that a character could buy.... if characters keep upgrading thier items within reason, it shouldnt be too much of a problem
some items are Broken to begin with(exa: Candle of Invocation, etc...) and would require some ruling
Mr. L&O level 1 Incanate
Dragonborn Water Orc Lawful neutral
Level 1
HP 11
Essentia 1
Strength 20
Dex 11
Con 20
Int 6
Wis 6
Chr 6
AC 16
Attack bonus +5
Damage d8+7 or 2d6 touch
Melds Lightning Gauntlets, Flame Mantle
Saves F 7 R 0 W 0
Skills 1 UMD 1 ride
Feat Expanded Soulmeld Capacity
Racial modifiers +2 dodge bonus to AC vs Dragons, Aspect of the Mind
Traits Muscle Bound
Equipment
Chain Shirt
Lrg Wooden Shield
Long Spear
Clubs
Backpack
13 gold
Dragonborn Water Orc Lawful neutral
Level 1
HP 11
Essentia 1
Strength 20
Dex 11
Con 20
Int 6
Wis 6
Chr 6
AC 16
Attack bonus +5
Damage d8+7 or 2d6 touch
Melds Lightning Gauntlets, Flame Mantle
Saves F 7 R 0 W 0
Skills 1 UMD 1 ride
Feat Expanded Soulmeld Capacity
Racial modifiers +2 dodge bonus to AC vs Dragons, Aspect of the Mind
Traits Muscle Bound
Equipment
Chain Shirt
Lrg Wooden Shield
Long Spear
Clubs
Backpack
13 gold
1 Does the minataurs charge allow it to use its gore in addition to the normal attack on the end of a charge or instead of?
2 Rune hounds stats in the opening seems to be doing less damage than the one in the MM3, was their an errata?
level 4 Mr L&O
Water Orc Lawful neutral
Level Incarnate 4
HP 36
Essentia 4
Strength 21 23
Dex 11
Con 20
Int 6
Wis 6
Chr 6
AC 14
Attack bonus +9
Damage d8+9+4d6 or 4d6 touch
Melds Lightning Gauntlets(Bound expanded ), Flame Mantle(2), Fellmist robe(2), Astral Vambraces DR= 2+2e/magic)
Skills 1 UMD 1 ride 1 K Planes 1tumble
Feat Expanded Soulmeld Capacity, 1 TBA
Class abilities Incarnum Radiance
Saves F 9 R 1 W 2
Racial modifiers +2 dodge bonus to AC vs Dragons, Aspect of the Mind
Traits Muscle Bound
Equipment
Chain Shirt
Lrg Wooden Shield
Msw. Long Spear
Gauntlet
Clubs
Backpack
Triple weapon capsule retainer 450
2 capsules 100
Belt of strength+2
38 gold
Level Incarnate 4
HP 36
Essentia 4
Strength 21 23
Dex 11
Con 20
Int 6
Wis 6
Chr 6
AC 14
Attack bonus +9
Damage d8+9+4d6 or 4d6 touch
Melds Lightning Gauntlets(Bound expanded ), Flame Mantle(2), Fellmist robe(2), Astral Vambraces DR= 2+2e/magic)
Skills 1 UMD 1 ride 1 K Planes 1tumble
Feat Expanded Soulmeld Capacity, 1 TBA
Class abilities Incarnum Radiance
Saves F 9 R 1 W 2
Racial modifiers +2 dodge bonus to AC vs Dragons, Aspect of the Mind
Traits Muscle Bound
Equipment
Chain Shirt
Lrg Wooden Shield
Msw. Long Spear
Gauntlet
Clubs
Backpack
Triple weapon capsule retainer 450
2 capsules 100
Belt of strength+2
38 gold
2)i dont know .... will check it out
also can you identify what Class you are using ...... and when you change classes, if you do
L&O 6
Water Orc Lawful neutral
Level Incarnate 6
HP 54
Essentia 8
Strength 21 23
Dex 11
Con 20
Int 6
Wis 6
Chr 6
AC 16 11 touch
Attack bonus +10
Damage d8+9+5d6 or 4d6 touch
Melds Lightning Gauntlets(Bound expanded ), Flame Mantle(3), Fellmist robe(3), Astral Vambraces DR= 2+2e/magic 2, vitality belt
)
Skills 1 UMD 1 ride 1 K Planes 1tumble
Feat Expanded Soulmeld Capacity, 1 Shape soulmeld blink shirt Bonus Essentia
Class abilities Incarnum Radiance
Saves F 9 R 1 W 2
Racial modifiers +2 dodge bonus to AC vs Dragons, Aspect of the Mind
Traits Muscle Bound
Equipment
Chain Shirt
Lrg Wooden Shield
Msw. Long Spear
Gauntlet
Clubs
Backpack
Triple weapon capsule retainer 450
2 capsules 100
Belt of strength+2
138 gold
Amulet of Deflection 2000
+1 Armor 1150
Potion of Flight 750
4138
Water Orc Lawful neutral
Level Incarnate 6
HP 54
Essentia 8
Strength 21 23
Dex 11
Con 20
Int 6
Wis 6
Chr 6
AC 16 11 touch
Attack bonus +10
Damage d8+9+5d6 or 4d6 touch
Melds Lightning Gauntlets(Bound expanded ), Flame Mantle(3), Fellmist robe(3), Astral Vambraces DR= 2+2e/magic 2, vitality belt
)
Skills 1 UMD 1 ride 1 K Planes 1tumble
Feat Expanded Soulmeld Capacity, 1 Shape soulmeld blink shirt Bonus Essentia
Class abilities Incarnum Radiance
Saves F 9 R 1 W 2
Racial modifiers +2 dodge bonus to AC vs Dragons, Aspect of the Mind
Traits Muscle Bound
Equipment
Chain Shirt
Lrg Wooden Shield
Msw. Long Spear
Gauntlet
Clubs
Backpack
Triple weapon capsule retainer 450
2 capsules 100
Belt of strength+2
138 gold
Amulet of Deflection 2000
+1 Armor 1150
Potion of Flight 750
4138
Did not recognise some of the monsters, but I can see the hydra giving my build a lot of trouble. Not a real surprise there, I guess.