Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 finrod_seregon Jul 13, 2009 18:27:20	Starting lvl 4 feats and all. (illumains found in races of destiny) Definately going warmage using subtle sigil (hide it free action not standard and still gain benifits), and improved sigil Aesh(+2 insight bonus on any melee I have weapon focus with). (illumian feats) (thats 2 feats down.) I am thinking of multiclassing Paladin and Prestige Shadowsentinel (Illumian Prestige). Power words: Aesh: +2 on str checks and str based skill checks. Uur: +2 on Dex checks and dex based skill checks. Aeshuur: when I deal damage with crit or sneak attack I gain a +2 to AC vs that enemy until the beginning of my next turn. thank you in advance.
#2 finrod_seregon Jul 19, 2009 13:27:21	wow this long and no replys. well i adjusted my aims so hopefully that will help. thx for looking in...
#3 dandu Jul 19, 2009 13:32:00	What do you want to do with this character? Why Illimians? Hiding is not useful as a Warmage/Paladin because you don't get any ranks in it, plus you are wearing armor which gives a penalty. You get a small bonus if you invest two feats in a subpar manner, and have horrible multiple attribute dependency to boot. This doesn't seem to be a build that is very effective at anything. Combining two underpowered classes is rarely going to make something powerful.
#4 kurashu Jul 19, 2009 15:27:11	Here. Read this article. http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=2816.0
#5 finrod_seregon Jul 20, 2009 11:45:40	Okay I read the link. I guess they got a point. I was hoping to optimize on the armored Mage feature. We are starting at lv 4. Not sure how far we might go. I was thinking maybe paladin or fighter for the +5 bab req for shadow sentinel if we get that far. I like the illumians and think thier racials are just my style. Also we are playing a racially charged game. Anything not elf dwarf human or gnome are descriminated against.
#6 dandu Jul 20, 2009 12:13:06	Clearly you should play an Kobold Bard who maximizes Perform: Oratory and who hopes to build a better world.
#7 keyes2k4 Jul 20, 2009 12:39:54	I have an idea for you that would allow for good armor use and decent casting. Try duskblade instead of paladin, the build looks like this Duskblade 1 Duskblade 2 Duskblade 3 Duskblade 4 Duskblade 4/ Warmage 1 Duskblade 4/ Warmage 2 Duskblade 4/ Warmage 2/ Shadow Sentinal 1 Duskblade 4/ Warmage 2/ Shadow Sentinal 2 Duskblade 4/ Warmage 2/ Shadow Sentinal 3 Duskblade 4/ Warmage 2/ Shadow Sentinal 4 Duskblade 4/ Warmage 2/ Shadow Sentinal 5 Duskblade 4/ Warmage 2/ Shadow Sentinal 6 Duskblade 4/ Warmage 2/ Shadow Sentinal 7 Duskblade 4/ Warmage 2/ Shadow Sentinal 8 Duskblade 4/ Warmage 2/ Shadow Sentinal 9 Duskblade 4/ Warmage 2/ Shadow Sentinal 10 Duskblade 4/ Warmage 3/ Shadow Sentinal 10 Duskblade 4/ Warmage 4/ Shadow Sentinal 10 Duskblade 4/ Warmage 5/ Shadow Sentinal 10 Duskblade 4/ Warmage 6/ Shadow Sentinal 10 Abilities: High to Low - Str, Con, Int, Dex, Cha, Wis (you'll still need good scores for this to work, 14 in Con, Int, and Dex minimum, 13 minimum in Cha for 3rd level spells.) flaws: Meager fortitude (-3 fort save), Vulnerable (-1 A.C.) Feats: Lvl 1:Weapon Focus: Bastard Sword (2h), Improved Sigil (Aesh), Subtle Sigil Lvl 3: Enhanced Power Sigils Lvl 6: Battle Caster (heavy armors) Lvl 9: Weapon Expertise Lvl 12: Bright Sigil Lvl 15: Improved Toughness (CW) Lvl 18: ?? free feat Strategy: You have a limited spell selection, however you can channel all spells you know into your weapons (because of WM you'll have lesser orb spells to do this.) You have decent HP for a caster, and really good armor, so you can get right in the enemy's face and cut at them. You also get a bunch of bonuses with your Bastard sword, including the umbral blade class feature of the shadow sentinal. You are a melee combatant. Weaknesses: Because of the heavy armor, your dexterity score is penalized, so you will be less able to throw great gobs of energy at your enemies. There is a little issue with needing 4 abilities with a 14 or higher base score, and one which will need a 13 to be effective at 20th level, when you finally get third level spells. If you have the stats, though, this build kinda looks like fun.. Very gish though.
#8 kurashu Jul 24, 2009 15:07:36	Strategy: You have a limited spell selection, however you can channel all spells you know into your weapons (because of WM you'll have lesser orb spells to do this.) The answer to this is no. You can channel TOUCH spells into your weapons, which is what makes Duskblade 13/Ur-Priest 7 such a good build: channelled Harm on a full attack. Honestly, warmage/rainbow servant/prc is going to be your best bet for a warmage. If you want to be an illumian, be an illumian still, just don't take silly feats (subtle sigil and what not). If you want a shadow sentinel, play a shadow sentinel not a warmage. You won't get much milage out of warmage that way. Swordsage then take some shadow sentinel levels then finish out with a Tome of Battle prestige class, if you want to play a shadow sentinel. Have a shadow hand heavy portfolio to accentuate your shadowyness. Swordsage 7/Shadow Sentinel 10/Something 3
#9 keyes2k4 Jul 24, 2009 18:16:49	Good notice, it does say touch spell. Now I'll go through the WM list up to 3rd level spells (which you will only have access to at 20) and show just which are range of "touch" or "ranged touch". 1st: Chill Touch Magic Missile Orb of Acid, Lesser Orb of Cold, Lesser Orb of Electricity, Lesser Orb of Fire, Lesser Orb of Sound, Lesser Shocking Grasp 2nd: Melph's Acid Arrow Scorching Ray 3rd: Poison Ok, so the warmage list seems to suck after first level for channeling spells through the weapon. Fortunately for the Warmage, though, he will be able to cast the other spells on the Warmage spell list to overcome some of his weaknesses (range, for instance). He says in the first post "Definitely going Warmage and using subtle sigil and improved sigil Aesh." Now I don't personally think that this is the most optimized choice for the character, but I worked with it, focusing his feat progression on improving his sigils. My class progression gives him 17/12/7/2 to attack with +3 to each attack from feats, before his strength bonus and any enhancement bonuses his weapon may have. He'll also be in heavy armor and have 14/10/12 for saves, very decent. I'm going to stop here because I think I'm gloating about the build I posted, but I really like it, I may even play it in a campaign I'm joining soon. Alternatively, the character could just lob orbs at their oponent. Having a high BAB and throwing touch spells has its advantage. *note: I would use practiced spellcaster (warmage) as my level 18 feat (or maybe switch out improved toughness and put practiced spellcaster earlier) to improve your orb damage.
#10 finrod_seregon Jul 24, 2009 23:47:42	Taking this all in account I still, due to setting, think I need the subtle to still get racial benefits while averting prejudice which can hurt the whole party. Looking at your advice the improved sigil doesn't come out all that useful. I wanted to go mainly a back up tank/artillery. Middle of the party but able to hit hard and control more mobile enemies with orbs and rays. Also I don't want to go heavy armor I get spell failure chance at heavy but I ignore med. I figure if I get up to WM8 I'll just get mithril fullplate to stay med. I don't necessarily want to go fullplate (higher dex) so I think I'd stick to mithril breastplate. I'm not sure if I want to go pal. I'm thinking fighter to get weapon and melée feats and use lvl feats for wm potentcy. I like the shadow sentinel and they give my melée a great damage boost with thier abilities. So what is the concensus on that?
#11 keyes2k4 Jul 25, 2009 10:12:12	Duskblade gets medium armored casting at 4th level, which is why my build suggested 4 levels of duskblade before anything else. I also really like the shadow sentinal PrC, as it has really cool class abilities and is not completely sub-par (you can still do stuff). It is also a melee only prestige class. For weapon proficiencies, warmage has only simple weapons, where duskblade gets all martial weapons. Going only warmage, you wouldn't even reach the +5 BAB required to become a Shadow Sentinal until you were 10th level of warmage. I think a duskblade/warmage/shadow sentinal is a good idea because you get a lot of "I enhance my blade with x affect". Shadow sentinal gives the blade an enhancement bonus, keen, strength drain, while you channel warmage spells (via hexblade) and add 1d8-3d8 energy damage (lesser orb of your choice, 3d8 after you take practiced spellcaster) into your attack. I don't see shadow sentinal working with warmage alone, primarily because you can't melee very well as a warmage.
#12 finrod_seregon Aug 08, 2009 9:31:47	Okay so I'm not taking improved sigil. I do have subtle though. In my party we have a 1/2 dragon Warblade, a monk2/swordsage2, a beguiler 4, and an aristocrat1 /cleric 3. Now the warblade is tank, the cleric is healer (not sure if they will back-up tank or what), beguiler is control, and mnk/swordsage is damage I assume. It looks like we might need a bit of scouting depending on how monk goes. I'm artillery, but want to fill more of a gap than that. I was wanting to get some in your face time, but with monk and warblade it just seems like we'd leave a big gap else where should I move to melee as well. Any thoughts? Should I maybe go scout for mobility/range and use spells for bigger targets with high ac?
#13 dawnmor Aug 08, 2009 13:00:14	Go with what you want, dude. Paladin/Warmage is a viable option.