Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 TomCosta Mar 26, 2015 18:29:57	So I think the streamlining of the skills in 5E is great, but it did strike me there were a few skills missing. Strength (Might), Charisma (Streetwise), and some sort of Endurance skill or feat.   The Might skill has very limited utility in general, and could be captured simply by a generic Strength check, but then I thought of all those "Strongman" competitors and body builders and thought that those were things you could actually train to get better at. Similarly, you look at the survival training of military special forces or the endurance training of marathoners or the Zulu running messengers and that too is a skill. However, in this case, the rules governing Constitution checks rely almost exclusively on saves. I'm not sure I agree, but I see the point and took the path of least resistance to turn it into the Endurance feat. Finally, streetwise, knowledge (local), and gather information have been skills in the past because they capture something not quite captured by the other skills. I think that's true. I see the argument that you could use the other Charisma skills to get at most of this, but I do think streetwise is a bit more than that and frankly, we have survival as a skill for rural settings, streetwise in some ways is the same for urban settings.   Strength Checks  Might . You continually work to build the power of your body’s muscles. You may train for and participate in various feats of strength contests or “strongman” competitions such as the Highland Games. Your Strength (Might) check covers situations where you use brute force to push, pull, drag, lift, or break things (so long as it does not involve an attack roll or saving throw). Examples include the following activities: • Force open a stuck, locked, or barred door • Break free of bonds • Push through a tunnel that is too small • Pull a laden wagon • Hang on to a wagon while being dragged behind it • Tip over a statue • Move a boulder or keep it from rolling • Throw something for distance, especially something not designed to be thrown such as a keg or caber (a long wooden pole) • Arm wrestling or tug of war contests   Charisma Checks  Streetwise . When in a settlement—a village, town, or city – you can make a Charisma (Streetwise) check  to gather information about what’s going on, who the movers and shakers are, where to get what you need (and how to get there), and where not to go. You can also hustle goods to get a good price. Examples include the following activities: • Find the best person to talk to for news, rumors, and gossip without drawing attention to yourself • Find out about available jobs • Find dealers of illegal items • Track down a missing person or wanted individual • Blend into a crowd to get the sense of key topics of conversations • Sell items for a decent price without an established business, guild, or network • Find a good deal to purchase items outside established or legal businesses and guilds • Pick up on local street slang and identify local customs and traditions   Feats Endurance Harsh conditions and long exertions do not easily tire you. (See PH 181-186 and DMG 109-111, 256-257.) • Increase your Constitution score by 1, to a maximum of 20. • You have advantage on Constitution checks and saving throws that can result in exhaustion, including those involving lack of sleep, laboring without rest, running a marathon, forced marches, food and water deprivation, holding your breath, extreme temperatures, and certain illnesses and diseases. • Your Constitution modifier is considered 2 higher when determining the number of minutes you can hold your breath, the number of rounds you can survive when you run out of breath, and the number of days you can go without food. • You are considered acclimated to high altitudes up to 20,000 feet.
#2 BRJN Mar 29, 2015 18:28:43	I miss Streetwise, too.  My first shot at a 5e character concept was wiped out due to lack of this critical skill.   Appraise hasn't been seen since 3e.  I'm having a hard time building a business empire using 3e rules because so many of the Prestige Classes require ranks in Appraise.  I'm going to have to add it as an NPC-only skill, something an Expert or Craftsman could take.  So I can staff my shop(s) with people who know what they are talking about, AND recognize the difference between Masterworks and Junk.
#3 Horwath Mar 30, 2015 7:58:33	I do like the Endurance feat. Maybe add that you only need 6 hrs of sleep per day(3 hrs for elves).   As for skills, they are not needed.   Might is Athletics basicaly. And streetwise is in persuasion IMO.   Appraise could be linked to int check + some tools proficiency. I.E. if you have poison kit proficiency you can use that check to appraise value and quality of poisons.
#4 TomCosta Mar 30, 2015 14:38:12	Thanks for the comments. Two quick comments.   Might is not Athletics. It quite specifically is a host of abilities purposefully excluded from Athletics. Now you could include it, but that's changing the rules as much as I have. That said, I hemmed and hawed on this one. For example were the rules for breaking down doors and the like predicated on their not being a proficiency bonus? Then I thought, even if they were, how often does it come up and how often are folks going to choose it. And in that, there was a reason not create the skill at all, except I felt it was something that folks would want their barbarian to have or fighter or goliath or whatever and would be fun to play out, so why not.   Regarding appraise. I thought about that too, but since craft and profession are gone (with some good reason I think) and largely replaced with tool proficiency, I figured you could always give proficiency in appraisal tools such as the loup or whatever that jewelers magnifying lens is called. If you've ever looked through one of those, you know it takes a certain amount of skill -- for most of us, the difference between a nice diamond and a really nice diamond is hard to spot without some prodding from the jeweler.
#5 TomCosta Mar 30, 2015 14:43:46	Oh, and Streetwise, I definitely felt was worth pursuing. I agree it could be gotten at by use of various other Charisma skills, but it seemed more than that and frankly to include a certain amount of Wisdom in it as well and if nothing else be the urban opposite of Survival.
#6 Farmer42 Mar 31, 2015 3:52:26	Then why not just rule it as a Survival (Wisdom) check?  And as an athelete, I can assure you athletics covers everying you listed in might.  Caber toss is a quintessential Athletics (strength) check.  Same with shotput.  How do sprinters train?  Weights and drags.  How do distance runners train?  Weights and drags.  How do football players train?  Weights and drags.  Nothing you described can't be accounted for with an Athletics or strength check.   I'll give you streetwise isn't neatly put into one of the skills.  But that's fine.  It was always a poor fit in one skill anyway.  It was TOO GOOD as one skill.  A streetwise check was a knowledge, dimplomacy, and gather info check rolled into one, depending on how you ruled it.  Now, if it fits their background, just give the player advantage on the roll for the appropriate trait or skill instead of having a catch-all.  It's also worth noting that many of those things you list are covered by backgrounds, now.  So taking one skill is better than backgrounds, which reward you with two.
#7 TomCosta Mar 31, 2015 17:11:36	Regarding Athletics. Everyone can assure me that those things are covered by Athletics, but the rules explicitly segregate them and make them simple Strength checks. But I agree that one can train to improve at those things, thus the new skill. I also agree, btw, that swimmers, climbers, and jumpers will do a lot of weight training, but again there appears to have been a decision made not to include those skills into Athletics.   I obviously disagree that Streetwise is too good of a skill. How is that much different from saying Survival is too good of a skill. As to why its not a Wisdom skill, its because urban survival requires more interaction and Charisma than Wisdom. That said, honestly, I've never been quite sure why Survival was a Wisdom and not an Intelligence skill. I suppose there is some good gut instinct involved, but mostly its knolwedge of how to make a fire, which berries you can eat, and the like that is going to save your bacon. You do make a good point on the backgrounds eating up some of that space, but I still think its worth having.
#8 cowleymen Apr 03, 2015 14:43:15	I wouldnt mind playing with a might skill. out of the four characters i have played in 5e so far, two of them would have might instead of athletics if I was at your table. How ever, every game I have played just used athletics for everything you have mentioned. Side note, in an oddball conversation talkin about skills and using an alt modifier then from the norm, one think that got mentioned was athletics being pretty muched locked into place with str. But what about if your watching a sport you have never played. Athletics(int) check to study and figure out the basic rules. I love the inherient flexability to 5e's skill system.   As for streetwise, I think it is covered by most of the face skills, deception not making sense to me because what are you going to do, lie about where you want to go and figure out some how where your REALLY need to go afterwards? Not to mention most barkeeps, waitresses/whenches, even village/town, city officals will probably tell you up front where to find things and some going ons like bounties, troubles, ect going on around town. It just always seemed like a tool to get around some simple RP then one that enables the social pillar.