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| #1Mephi1234Jul 11, 2014 6:10:48 | So, the basic rules are out, and we have access to stuff for the four main races - Humans, Elves, Dwarves, and Halflings.
Humans aren't really all that exciting to talk about - they're generalists.
Halflings, interestingly enough, are a curious mix of all three races, but small sized. The generic abilities of the race lend themselves to general things. Lucky and movement bonus are, truthfully, universally applicable. Any class can use a bit of Dexterity. And their subraces seem to lend themselves to being a bit of fey inspired (lightfoot) or dwarf (stoutheart - even said to have dwarf blood!)
Which brings us to the Elves, and to the Dwarves. Now, I'm not going to bore you with details of their culture - you can go read the basic rule set for that. I'm going to sit down and talk, instead, about their roles in the game, or a party, and the effect it has on your classes.
Dwarves tend to be a very proud warrior race. All their abilities tend towards such training - resistance to being poisoned, affinity for heavy armors, tool proficency in making weapons, booze, or fortified buildings. They get a hefty Constitution bonus, letting them take a hit better than any other core race. Mountain dwarves grant even more extra Strength or Armor bonuses (any class that wants strength already gets the armor, and any class that wants the armor couldn't care less about Strength). Hill dwarves get a bit of wisdom and a bit extra health, letting them resist mind control and take even better hits.
All of this? It lends quite a bit of "Fighter" attitude to any choice that the dwarf makes for his classes. Dwarves are built tough to take hits and shrug off damage. They naturally lend themselves to subclasses like the War domain to take advantage of their combat prowress. This is also why they make such combat wizards. They can shrug off the damage, laugh, keep up their concentration buffs, and keep on fighting.
Dwarves are arguably the best at going into melee. If you want to play a character that can thrive in the middle of a battle, as a fighter, barbarian, cleric, druid, skald, spellcaster, whatever? Dwarves are your friend.
Now, on the other side of the equation, we have the Elves. Unlike what many people think, the Dwarf versus Elf comparison has nothing to do with Sword vs Sorcery. Elves are NOT the magic race of the game. Gnomes, tieflings, and dragonborn all have potential to end up as a magic specialist race. Gnomes have a strong natural intelect and illusions. Tieflings had their infernal-wrath-blood-magic. Dragonborn and sorcery. All this, though? Just shows how, despite the reputation, little the elves actually have to do with magic.
Lets take a look at what the elves do get. Dexterity. Perception. Darkvision. Slippery resistance to enchantments. Affinity for bows and a dex-based sword. The wood elf gets hiding bonuses and movement. The high elf gets languages and magic tricks. Do you know what, when taken together, all this adds up to?
Trickster classes. The Rogue, the Bard, the Ranger. Elves aren't built to take a hit like the stout dwarves. The graceful, slender, agile elves are built for sneaking, trickery, and misdirection - they dont' take a hit, they just avoid being hit in the first place. Their natural racial abilities lend themselves to trickery and spying and the like. Even the high elf's cantrip and language make them better beguilers and arcane rogues over evokers, transmuters, alchemists, or necromancers; access to a wide variety of cantrips are gold in the former cases, not so much the latter.
Just as the dwarf makes any class they take a bit more "fightery," so does the elf make any class they follow a bit more "roguish." Its two opposite styles and approaches. Its why that dwarves are considered such a superior option when all we do is look at white room battle options - simply put, while they can fight, rogues excel far more outside of combat, while fighters shine in a fight. One dodges and hides and strikes the unprepared, while the other stands their ground and fights.
This is pretty much the heart of any of the mountain dwarf versus high elf wizard debate, or hill dwarf versus wood elf cleric, or anything similiar. War versus Trickery. Blasters versus Beguiler. Two different approaches that require different tactics and thinking to execute. |
| #2abanathieJul 11, 2014 7:48:24 | You're characterization of the elven race doesn't match fully with lore. That might be your take on past lore; it's not an accurate take in my opinion.
They don't get proficiency with dexterty based swords; they get proficiiency with one dexterty based sword, the short sword, and they get proficiency with one strength based sword, the long sword. Most races, we haven't see the other races in the game, don't have to combat getting a non-attribute based weapon proficiency. Why?
Elves are agile fighters, and dwarves are stout fighters. In this edition, that general paradign still holds true. I wouldn't overthink it into limiting the elvish concept into a trickster. On that note, the drawf does a good job of imparting that concept. The elf generally imparts that concept; however, something simple like a trait that allows the elf to wield a long sowrd, as a finesse weapon would help them more fully embrace that concept with minimal effect on the game's balance. It really isn't a dwarf versus elf thing. They are just two races that have been along the longest, besides human, with differences that contrast well as point of views.
Making a dwarven archetype, the Dwarven Defender, isn't hard to do in the current ruleset. Making an elven archer, one archetype, isn't hard to do currently. However, elves did have other archetypes: the bladesinger and wizard. Making an effective wizard isn't hard to do despite the attractiveness of the dwarven mage. The bladesinger concept becomes more difficult, not much more difficult, just slightly more difficult, if you want to keep with the traditional elven weapons. You get a choice to take a less than optimal racial weapon, take a non-traditional weapon or deal multiple attribue dependency. Why? I mean really why when it should be an easily addressable issue? |
| #3KarnosJul 11, 2014 10:05:45 | Thor is a Dwarf, Loki is an Elf. |
| #4souldoubtJul 11, 2014 10:23:09 | Sounds about right to me.
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| #5abanathieJul 11, 2014 11:17:35 |
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| (Reply to #5)sleypy |
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