Laser pistol solve all problems for those who want to use two hand crossbow!
Looks to me like the anti-matter rifle solves problems faster.
Antimatter = necrotic damage?
Yes, please.
Shotguns don't create cone AOEs?
No, thank you.
Wow, guns that don't explode when you use them! And they don't magically bypass armor, either!
For the first time, I might actually want to include firearms in my setting. Neat!
Grifford wrote:
AaronOfBarbaria wrote:
Why would anybody use a shotgun?
EDIT: Presuming other firearms are available, of course.
Saelorn wrote:
Shirebrok wrote:
It seems like most of those guns are a bit more modern than rennaisance era pistols, so yes they're a lot better than crossbows.
Guns are better than bows, that's why we don't usually use bows when we need to off each other anymore.
No, it's not good for mixing weapon techs from a game-play standpoint, but if guns are common enough that it's a concern then you're probably dealing with a situation where other weapons would be getting phased out anyway.
Grifford wrote:
Thank_Dog wrote:
The rules for the shotgun are uninspiring.
I would give a shotgun advantage on attacks at medium range. And an extra die of damage at point blank.
Saelorn wrote:
That's what the primitive guns are for.
UngeheuerLich wrote:
Wheeee! I've waited so long for this to be unlocked! So I'm guessing gunpowder and explosives could be made with alchemist's supplies( historically, black powder was discovered by Chinese alchemists), and and the various firearms could be crafted using tinkerer's tools. Assuming there's a module in there for making crafting not take forever, this could help make rock gnomes more appealing! Yesssss.... a wild-eyed gnomish fighter, wielding her experimental "high-velocity combustion-powered lead pellet propellor( HVCPLPP for short, it's a working title, shut up)" with worrying confidence given how few eyebrows she has left. Laughing gleefully at each mostly-intentional explosion. Her horrifying battlecry an uncertain "Ahhh, hold on. Let me try something out here..."
Also, about the shotgun thing: bear in mind that these priceless weapons, like the rest of the weapons, probably aren't considered all equal value. If a shotgun is indeed worse than other weapons, then those other weapons will probably "cost" more.
Well, loading property would limit you to one shot per action.
Yes, but it would require use of action surge, since using a bonus action to reload would interupt the attack action expending its only two shots. With the other modern firearms, that wouldn't be a problem.
Fralex wrote:
Ahaha, the Reload property is almost EXACTLY what I wrote for mine months ago (it's here under Equipment). I have firearms in my game, and although no one in the party has one yet, I'm still planning on using the ones I wrote (for the sake of the Deadly property, the affinity for rogues, and the high cap to being a good gunslinger). I've altered mine to match up with the official reload property, powder kegs and horns, and made the ranges the same. Glad I've got some official bombs to use now too.
Also, the futuristic weapons also share a lot in common with the Thundercats guns my friend wrote during the playtest (that I edited).
What do you guys think of the official renaissane firearms in comparison to mine?
UngeheuerLich wrote:
Saelorn wrote:
WHO LAMED UP SHOTGUNS!
WHERE MY 3d6 OR 2D12 DAMAGE!!!
rampant wrote:
You had me at "Roll initiative for the dynamite."
Way too much damage for me.
Pistol 1d6 one-handed
Rifle 1d12 Two-handed
Radiant damage for a laser gun is just wrong.
A Bow will kill you just as easily as an alien Ray gun. All the damage is over the top for me. Cowboys in space for me.
I can't think of a less engaging way to handle figuring out alien technology than what they propose in this section. Roll repeated Intelligence checks and compare it to a chart? No thanks.
@ arnwolf, 1.) If the aliens are building a half decent laser pistol it will in fact kill you more easily than the bow and arrow, not because the bow isn't deadly but because the laser pistol is more so. Think about it the bolt travels faster, doesn't get screwed up by wind or gravity, does all sorts of tissue damage even if it gaves you or hits a non-vital zone, and the definition of vital zone is a lot larger for a laser pistol that boils your internal fluids than for something that puts a small hole in you. 2.) There's just not really room in 5e's weapon system to take all those advantages into account besides upping the damage. The game simply doens't support that level of fiddly detail for individual weapons.
IF you want a fire-fly type game where you have bullets in space, don't allow laser pistols, it's that simple.Say they use guns in space because lasers are clumsy inefficient weapons that don't miniaturize well, and are genereally more suited for catapulting ships into space than precision people killing.
Fralex wrote:
rampant wrote:
You are thinking about PCs with firearms versus nPCs without firearms but... have you thought about nPC without firearms versus enemies with firearms? For example a goblin subrace who created a steampunk civilitation, ruled by spriggans, or a group of kobolds who use biopunk technology, with a living gun like Tyrandis from Warhammer 40.000 or the gun teeth-shooter from movie ExistenZ. Don´t forget squires can reload the firearms.
Another matter is the smoke. In the past the gunpowder hadn´t got so good quailty and they created a lot of smoke.
Some DMs could create anti-firearms spells.
How well supported do you think firearms will be? Right now I'm running a rogue that dual wields hand crossbows with the crossbow master feat, but everyone at the table knows it's just because I've got a big throbbing purple worm for firearms and I'd jump on pistols in a heartbeat... except you can't really dual wield them unless you'd extend crossbow mastery to firearms, or WotC included an optional feat for them. I think a feat that gave you proficiency in one type of firearm and let you dual wield pistols (but maybe, unlike crossbow master, wouldn't let you attack from melee range) would be a good idea.
Now if Warforged can get embedded firearms... oh baby...
Luis_Carlos wrote:
Luis_Carlos wrote:
I was hoping for a renaissance (sorry, no spell check in the forums 
) firearm alternative where you could only fire as your first action (if it's loaded) and it bypassed AC, DEX bonus, saves, whatever. To hit AC 10 + magic bonus, double or triple bow damage. Stuns. Size lowers your firearm defensive AC (ie: large size and up are easier to hit.) Use a WIS mod and proficiency (if you have it) to hit. Then, your gun is a fragile bludgeon, bayonet, or you drop it and draw a real weapon.
Extenuating circumstances could allow you to fire again. Like cover, spending a few rounds reloading it right, or whatever.
But whatever. I doubt I'll use more than single shot stuff anyway. Like I have. (Cannons, magic warforged gun-arms, etc.)
About alien tech... has anybody thought about a d20 Future - D&D "crossover"? Let´s imagine the fraals (little gray aliens) exploring and looking for new allies to fight againts the illithids and another creatures from Far Realm. And my own version of mechalus is a humanoid race who is almost living contructs, and they can get the template half-golem (MM 2 3th Ed) and create warforgeds and shardminds (Because I worth it!!). Another idea is to mixture the kaortis from Fiend Folio (3th) and the necromorphes from Dead Space videogames.
Had you imagined anytime your own D&D version of James Cameron's "Avatar" where the invaders are goblins riding steapunk mechas to fight againts the wood elves, or a D&D version of the serie "Falling Skies", or to mixture Stargate, Spelljammer and Gamma World.
Luis_Carlos wrote:
I don´t say only that module. I mean a campaign about fraal visiting a D&D world, and changing it, something like Mark Twain's "a Connectitc yankee in king Arthur´s court" or Stargate.
I mean adding to Spelljammers the races from Star Wars, Star Wars, Babylon 5, Farscape, Andromeda, Stargate, Doctor Who, Mass Efect, Halo, Destiny, Guardians of the Galaxy, Green Larten...
Let´s imagine a "crystal sphere" what is like the Bermudas triangle of multiverse... and the time dragons are linked (because they are like the D&D timelords). The original idea was a group of time-crystal spheres would be like a backup of the space-time continium to avoid temporal paradoxes by chronomancers and another chrononauts.. but some groups discovered the way to travel to a pocket universe linked to the rest of lots of crystal spheres... Let´s say it would be like Urban Arcana, but D&D worlds are the visited.. and changed by visitors. Do you remember the teleseries "V" and "Earth: final conflict"? let´s imagine parallele universes where even gods are different, for example Tharizdun isn´t (totally) crazy, he doesn´t destroy all but conquer the rest of parallele earths.
Luis_Carlos wrote:
iserith wrote:
thehobb wrote:
I can see a half-dragon ogre with a cannon under one arm and has several kobold attendants that reload the cannon for him on their turns. He has no breath weapon and makes up for it with a cannon. It would also work with ogres and goblins.
Saelorn wrote:
I'm wondering if cannons will be listed in the siege weapons section.
Had I would forgoten to mention Flash Gordon.
Have you seen the setting "Iron Lords of Jupiter" from Polyedron Magazine #160. 161?
But you should to remember firearms can break the balance of power. In the past I have mentioned two example, a simple goblin with an axe and a shield, and a goblin with a rifle from the top of a tree.
A D&D with firearms would be a d20 Modern with superheroes and it needs a special game design.
And abot technology, a simple motor like a car can change the war totally. If a group of gnomes can create a arcanepunk war charriot, it would enough to block the chavalry's attack. With an arcanepunk motor a battering arm becomes a drill machine.
Even if you wanna do cow-boys and aliens having the future weapons deal mor damage makes sense, it'll enocurage the cowboys to use smart tactics to avoid letting the enemy get too many clear shots and reward them for scavenging the cool guns.
If you want a setting like say starwars were guns and swords are in use simultaneously you gotta make the swords equally badass. A lightsaber sould do a lot damage. IF you want bows to deal damage on par with a plasma pistol then you need something like chewie's bow caster that packs a bit more punch than just shoving a pointy bit into someone.
Primitive peoples make less efficient weapons, the Navi form avatar were able to go toe-to-toe with a bunch of high-tech discount mercenaries because they had monstrous size, stats, and tons of firendly monster animal companions.
Now I pondering doing pre-Dresden Dresdenverse.
You know with the guns and wizards in a smaller city with Monster X not all dead and Monster Y not almost all dead and before Micheal, Shiro and Sanya get the swords and such.
Shoot a troll right in the face.
Lawolf wrote:
Orzel wrote:
Too bad wizards in dresden operate almost nothing like they do in DnD.
ankiyavon wrote:
I didnt think I'd be interested in guns and alien tech, but actually I'm very glad it's in there now. Might have pirates with basic pistols, or exploding gunpowder kegs, etc, that's all cool. And I like the alien tech rules for any kind of tech, eg: tinker gnome tech, or whatever - a useful guideline I might need at some stage. Well done devs!
rampant wrote:
Also, all firearms should be simple weapons.
The main thing that "killed" the bows in early modern age is that any halfwit could learn to fire a musket in few minutes.
For shotguns, it is stated that they are using single slug in one shell.
but I think that shotgun will get more versatility as more ammunitions gets added, as shotgun can fire almost everything, and every calliber bullet.
Also, no option for firing both shots at the same time.
Psikerlord wrote:
thehobb wrote:
i think that 'alien tech' could be compared to arcane (or even divine) artifact in fantasy setting.
And we could use a catapult to throw a stone with a magic rune, what would summon a swamn to attack the enemy musketeers.
* In the WW II there was a real archer, Jack Churchill, the real Green Arrow/Hawkeye.
* A simple catrip could create a little piece of ectoplasm to block a enemy cannon. If a psion can create psionic contructs, a little stone of ectoplam could be a free at-will power, or could create a construct like a walking tower shield, like the mobile barricades from Call of duty: advanced warfare.
* Exosuits and mechas, yes I mean robotic armours like Iron Man´s movie, or the Power Loader used by Ripley to face the alien queen. They oughts to be a extra XPs rewards like monster mount, a mindless contruct monster mount. A simple and stupy goblin wearing a steapunk exosuit is more dangerous for PCs.
I wonder how hard it would be to do a Alloy of Law (Mistborn Series, by Brandon Sanderson) type srtting? Basically old west with beginnings of electricity, and magic.
Maybe I've played too many video games but to me "burst fire" should be more like 3-5 bullets on a single target. Something that increases the damage slightly from a single shot but uses more ammo. using 10 rounds and hitting an area should be "automatic fire"
I tend to agree on the shot gun. I like the idea of ammo that adds a die of dmg at point blank as stated above. in d20 modern a shot gun did 2d10 and a sawed off did 2d8
I asked this in the rules section thinking I wasn't going to post here but here goes again. What does 5ft from a point mean? How does that differ from 10ft cube on a grid? can a point be a 5ft square and then target 9 total squares?
Guns are about the same as black poweder weapons in Star Wars Saga. We had been using kegs of gunpowder as 6d6 DC 13 dex save for half damage.
Our guns do penetrate armor but take 5 rounds to reload.
Mistwell wrote:
I'm glad these renaissance firearms aren't hindered by the same loading time issues that 3e's firearms have. The one unfortunate downside of the loading property however is that characters who gain extra attacks per attack action are disincentivized to use firearms.
MechaPilot wrote:
Azzy1974 wrote:
AaronOfBarbaria wrote:
AaronOfBarbaria wrote:
FFSAA wrote:
Must ... resist ... urge ... to create ... Gamma World ... conversion ... rules ! 
BRJN wrote: