Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Ramzour Jul 14, 2014 14:26:21	Currently, Mage Armor is a touch spell that you cast upon against any unarmored creature. A protective, magical force surrounds the target for 8 hours. It ends early if the target wears armor, or if you choose to dismiss the spell early.   Here are some ideas I had:     Idea #1 As an Action, you can change the target of the Mage Armor spell and move the protective magical field to another creature. The spell would still only last 8 hours in total. I like how that offers some good roleplaying potential as the Wizard can give someone else the Mage Armor if they really need it.   Idea #2 Mage Armor can be cast on anyone, even if they are wearing armor. If the target is armored, they gain +1 AC. If the target is unarmored, they gain +3 AC.
#2 kill_the_wiz_first Jul 14, 2014 14:53:12	I had to look up the spell (haven't made my way through the listing extensively yet) and the mechanics really break realism for me so I will be going with the RamRules#2 for my Remu ruleset.
#3 knightserpent Jul 14, 2014 15:09:15	I like number one and think that doesn't break anything.  The others, however, have the potential to greatly unbalance things.  Sword and Board Fighter with Defense style already has a very high armor class, especially if fuly armored in the best money can buy.  Adding another point, while only one, is still too high in my opinion.   But as I had said, I like the first one.  I like the idea of protecting others.  Question, do we know how mage armor would stack with natural armor?  Normally, I would imagine... So it could be used on potintial animal friends.
#4 Ramzour Jul 14, 2014 15:26:23	knightserpent wrote:
#5 Ramzour Jul 14, 2014 15:28:13	kill_the_wiz_first wrote:
#6 Saelorn Jul 14, 2014 16:15:48	Ideas #2 and #3 really just scream to be optimized, as something the tank will always have after a certain point (when a level 1 spell slot becomes a trivial expenditure for the wizard). Of those two, I would say that #3 is worse since it's better than a real shield for most purposes, thus removing one of the big decisions that a fighting character gets to make. It's supposed to be a tough decision, whether to take the increased AC of a shield or the increased damage of a greatsword (or dual-wielding).
#7 Ashrym Jul 14, 2014 16:30:58	I like the first of the three options listed the best. I wouldn't change it, personally, because it's better than light armor and such a long duration that it's pretty good as is. Mage armor plus dex investment plus shield and/or blur is already stacking a lot of defences, especially with spell mastery later on. Essentially 3 points of AC already seems like a good investment of the spell slot the way it is.
#8 Lawolf Jul 14, 2014 16:33:12	Saelorn wrote:
#9 Polaris Jul 14, 2014 16:50:02	I don't think I like any of those (but I do agree that Mage armor should be changed).   #1 This one is fairly innocuous but IMO it's also pretty useless since Mage Armor doesn't operate on a target with any kind of armor, and for those classes (except wizard) that aren't armored (namely Monks) their class ability to provide defense is generally superior to Mage Armor and won't stack with it.  I am not saying there are never cases where putting mage armor on someone else couldn't be useful, but it seems very rare and very very situational.   #2 and #3 As others have said is simply too much.  It would be too tempting to stack this on top of a person that already has a good AC and then look out.   I think that the actually role of Mage Armor needs to be recognized and adjusted to fit.  Specifically Mage Armor is de facto  the wizard class feature that gives the wizard a competative AC with other character classes [just as Intuitive Defense does with the Monk].  Given this I would:   1.  Make Mage Armor target the caster only. 2.  Make Mage Armor a Cantrip [if not an outright Wizard class feature] 3.  Make Mage Armor a cantrip with a length of say an hour and perhaps 12+Dex AC [same as studded leather]   -Polaris
#10 Qmark Jul 14, 2014 17:06:55	Simple solution: 13 AC "armor". Doesn't stack with any actual armor worn, but may supercede it.   Polaris wrote:
#11 Polaris Jul 14, 2014 18:13:46	Qmark wrote:
#12 FFSAA Jul 14, 2014 21:59:09	Uuuuuhhhh... wut?  You want to make an overpowered spell BETTER?  As the best light armor in the game right now only gives 12+DEX you're already giving a level 1 party memeber the equivalent of magical +1 studded leather armor... which even a monk can use.  The spell needs nerfed, not buffed.   If you want to improve it then make it's usefulness extend beyond the first few levels.  Maybe by letting it also be used to enhance non-magical light and medium armor with a +1 for instance.
#13 FFSAA Jul 14, 2014 22:00:11	Polaris wrote:
#14 Polaris Jul 14, 2014 22:20:07	FFSAA wrote:
#15 Ramzour Jul 15, 2014 0:27:01	Lawolf wrote:
#16 Ramzour Jul 15, 2014 0:33:27	Polaris wrote:
#17 Ramzour Jul 15, 2014 0:34:35	Polaris wrote:
#18 Ramzour Jul 15, 2014 0:36:26	FFSAA wrote:
#19 Polaris Jul 15, 2014 0:38:45	Ramzour wrote:
#20 Polaris Jul 15, 2014 0:43:46	Ramzour wrote:
#21 Ramzour Jul 15, 2014 1:00:07	Polaris wrote:
#22 Polaris Jul 15, 2014 1:07:34	Ramzour wrote:
#23 Ramzour Jul 15, 2014 2:32:08	Polaris wrote:
#24 Nausicaa Jul 15, 2014 3:02:06	Polaris wrote:
#25 Ramzour Jul 15, 2014 3:13:11	I suppose that's one solution. You essentially give all mages an extra spell slot for the cost of a cantrip slot. I guess that could balance out. I wouldn't bother changing the duration though. If it's at-will, then what's the difference between 6 seconds every hour or 6 seconds every 8 hours? Negligible difference.
#26 Polaris Jul 15, 2014 8:06:24	Nausicaa wrote:
#27 Ramzour Jul 15, 2014 9:24:08	Besides, the High Elf ability says to pick a cantrip from the Wizard's spell list, so that wouldn't prohibit the elf from taking it anyway. (Specific beats General)
#28 FFSAA Jul 15, 2014 10:49:44	Ramzour wrote:
#29 FFSAA Jul 15, 2014 10:54:07	Polaris wrote:
#30 ChrisCarlson Jul 15, 2014 10:55:40	FFSAA wrote:
#31 RustedKitsune Jul 15, 2014 11:05:56	FFSAA wrote:
#32 RustedKitsune Jul 15, 2014 11:08:59	FFSAA wrote:
#33 Person_Man Jul 15, 2014 11:14:44	I think that Mage Armor should be eliminated entirely.    Wizards get more resources then any other class.    As long as the DM allows them to Rest from time to time, they can fill any role, solve any problem, kill any level appropriate creature.    They supposedly compensate for this by having fewer hit points and lower AC.  But the primary determinant of whether you have high or low hit points is your Con bonus, and Mage Armor gives them +1 Light Armor for 8 hours a day, with no Concentration, for a single 1st level spell.    If Wizards are supposed to be "squishy" then they should be squishy.
#34 emwasick Jul 15, 2014 11:19:13	If Mage Armor becomes a cantrip, mountain dwarf wizards' ability to wear armor becomes less valuable.
#35 RustedKitsune Jul 15, 2014 11:39:19	emwasick wrote:
#36 emwasick Jul 15, 2014 15:41:38	t RustedKitsune wrote:
#37 FFSAA Jul 15, 2014 19:58:15	emwasick wrote:
#38 ChrisCarlson Jul 15, 2014 20:07:52	FFSAA wrote:
#39 Saelorn Jul 15, 2014 20:22:17	FFSAA wrote: