Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Zardnaar Mar 16, 2015 16:42:42	For more or less my 3rd 5E campaign running it and 4th campaign played I have been toning down the amount of magic items by a lot. My PCs are just on the verge of level 7 and they own the following items.   1. A +1 dagger. 2. Mask granting +2 charisma+fey presence 1/long rest (Paladin, Sorcerer and Bladelock in the party makes this very good) 3. Gauntlets of Ogre Power (cleric uses this, the others have 18 strength already)    My parties front line fighters are a bladelock and Paladin with a cleric and sorcerer filling out the party. 3 of them can deal magic damage, the Paladin has to use the spell magic weapon or Moon Beam.      In my 1st camapaign I handed out to many magic items as I was using conversions of older adventures and even then I reduced them down drastically. A +2 Greatsword and +2 hand crossbow however did not play nice with the Sharpshooter and Great Weapon Master feats. Now I am using prepublished adventures again but designed for 5E and they do not hand out as many magi items. I have always been of the opinion that if you want a magic weapon for example you should probably use a long sword, short sword, dagger or spear as these are very common magic weapons. Generally I do not change magic items in prepublished adventures to match what PCs are using. If you choose a special snowflake weapon (katanas in 2E) do not expect to find magical versions of them.    This mentality is probably a remnant of AD&D as longswords were one of the best weapons in the game and they were common as magic weapons. A similar theory applied to armor as well as magical plate armor may as well have been non existent while something like +5 chainmail was much more likely to be found. +5 chainmail also gave you a +5 bonus on saves  that were physical attacks like dragon breath and fireball. 4E at least made an effort to fix this with what armor the classes could wear but it retained the buy magic item thing from 3.5 while making it a 1 hour ritual to more or less create the exact item you liked. As youi can guess I prefer AD&D magic item creation rules with the exception of a loss of con point when making a permanent magical item, Losing a con point is fine for something like a holy avenger, not so much for a +1 spear.    This mentality did kind of change with 3E as you could buy magic items and the magic part was a fixed cost so +5 chainmail was only marginally cheaper than +5 full plate. In 3.5 and 5E only 3 types of armor really exist (or are wanted by players). This trend has continued to 5E as well with missile weapons. In Pathfinder/3.5 you really only have 2 ranged weapons. Composite longbows and everything else. In 5E you have 3, longbows, hand crossbows and everything else.     The way I have recently being running 5E is to try and add some real choices to the PCs lives. I am more likely to put in +3 leather armor for example than +3 studded leather. I had a inexperienced player who built a low damage sword and board ranger and I put a flametongue longsword in the game that the PCs managed to find. I am not very likely to put a flametongue greatsword in the game nor am I likely to put a +2 great weapon or missile weapon into the game either. A +3 dagger however would be fine. One is likely to run into trouble in 5E by putting the best enchantments on the most optimal weapons. weapons I consider to be the most optimal weapons in 5E BTW.   Great weapons Hand Crossbows Polearms Longbows    Note these weapons have the best feat support in the game. It is very obvious what the most optimal armor in the game is. In 5E the other weapon styles can't really compete with the above 4 weapons so to balance them out I would be more likely to include better magical weapons and armor.    Now I know the Paladin in the party wants a magical weapon. The PCs were recently facing a lot of elementals and lycanthropes and he was not having the best time of it at times although his nova damage one on one was good. Also note he was far from useless as he had the choice of moonbeam or casting the magic weapon spell. This PC has the great weapon master feat as well but lacks the support to break the -5/+10 part of the feat. Here we have a conflict of interest it seems.   Player wants a magic weapon mostly to bypass immunities.   DM is happy to hand out magic items but is reluctant due to previous experiences with great weapons.    So here is what I am going to do. If a magic great weapon drops in an adventure so be it. I know there are some magical longswords coming up that can be used two handed so he has a choice there. Better damage or being able to deal magic damage.     I have also been looking through the DMG for a weapon he will like and one I do not mind handing out. Put simply I have been looking for one without a magic bonus to hit and one that will not enable buckets of damage as the Paladin is already good at that. Could be worse he is an Oath of the Ancients Paladin instead of an Avenging Paladin. In the latter case at best I may put in a +1 great weapon by level 15 or so. I considered a flametongue but that gives the Paladin a bonus 2d6 damage and the other great weapon user in the party will likely want it. In that scenario (2 PCs wanting the same item that is equally beneficial to both of them) they roll dice. An asshat in the party who wants a magic item "just because" is usually excluded from the rolling process they do get to make an argument as to why they should be allowed to roll though.      So the item I have settled on is the frost brand. As a player I am always happy to find a frostbrand weapon and they were really good in AD&D and the 5E one looks quite nice to have with a 1d6 bonus cold damage and half damage from fire. I will likely work it into an existing adventure or design a side trek where the sword can be retrieved from the barrow of a warlord or barbarian king. Said barrow may or may not be full of traps and undead. I would be happy with a frostbrand as a player. The frostbrand weapon was not that good in 3E as you could get better bang for your buck.   Also note we have some high powered PCs with rolled stats. Said Paladin has a 20 charisma and 18 strength. I have noticed the higher stats has reduced pressure on stat bumps so the PCs are taking feats and often some of the "fun" feats as well instead of the best feats. The sorcerer for example has an 18 con already so she avoided taking warcaster and took the spell sniper feat which she would usually avoid in favor of stat bumps and/or other feats. Higher stats also make some of the MAD classes a bit more viable IMHO. MAD classes usually being ones that want to use medium armor or ones that want a high dexterity and lack the amount of stat bumps fighters and rogues get.    I like magic items as a DM and player. I even like powerful magic items and in OSR gaming you may have an old school frostbrand by level 6 or 7. An old school frost brand is a +3 weapon, +6 vs fire creatures, immunity to non magical fire, half damage vs magical fire. One difference between OSR and modern D&D gaming I have noticed is that weapon will be upgraded in 3E onwards while in BECMI/AD&D you might be perfectly happy to be using that weapon for the next 10 levels. Drizzt has a frostbrand weapon and in the early books it more or less works just like the AD&D one allowing Bruenor to survive being set on fire with oil. Said weapon is also a +6 weapon vs Balors. Another difference is OSR gaming is the lack of feats so you can't stack feats+magic items and easily acquire the key magic item combos that can break the game. The magical Christmas tree effect is fun in older editions, problematic in 3E and 4E. Can be problematic in 5E as well but you have more safe guards as the PCs can not easily aquire a +3 hand crossbow compared to 3E, 4E and Pathfinder where RAW  you have lenient magic item rules.   In older D&D one can run around with a Drow ranger with a frostbrand in one hand, a +5 defender in the other hand and +chainmail and not break the game. Bracers of the Blinding strike however are a bit much with that. OSR Bracers of the Blinding strike would be the equivalent of action surge 3 times per long rest. Actually if I were to convert those bracers to 5E that’s what I would allow them to do giving someone the class features of a high level fighter.
#2 Vahnyu Mar 16, 2015 17:04:47	The more magic items you can find in an adventure, the better, is what I say!   Anyways, if the problem is just bypassing damage resistance, then add custom magic weapons that simply add an element, and nothing more. Maybe add something like on a critical it deals additional xdy damage and call it a day?   Here's a fun one, for shield users Mirror Shield: Whenever you successfully save against a damaging spell that targets your Dex Save, or whenever an attacking spell fails to hit your AC, while wearing this shield, you can spend your Reaction to reflect that spell back to the owner. The owner must save against the spell, or suffer damage as if he was the recipient of that spell. [Special] If you have the Shield Mastery feat, you can reflect that spell without spending a reaction.
#3 SleepsInTraffic Mar 16, 2015 20:09:59	I personally enjoy a large number of magic items but I'll always look at the changes to difficulty that the items provide. Like right now I'm trying to figure out if I am going to give the thief in my game the gloves of thievery. They sound awesome in theory and in theme and in concept for the character however the bonus it provides on top of the expertise and Dex the thief already has would pretty much put failing at thieves tools related checks on a very slim margin. As such I've had to stop myself from handing the item over because it would remove almost all possibility of failure from the part of the game the character is most interested in exploring. Though I have set the item up to be delivered at some later time.
#4 MechaPilot Mar 16, 2015 20:32:35	SleepsInTraffic wrote:
#5 arnwolf666 Mar 16, 2015 20:34:10	I'm a guy who may never hand out a single magic item over 20 levels except maybe a potion or some temporary powerup.  Maybe a simple magic sword on occasion.
#6 Zardnaar Mar 17, 2015 4:19:37	SleepsInTraffic wrote:
#7 masterfat78 Mar 17, 2015 8:22:19	If your pally needs something to help bypass immunities, think about a silvered weapon or a blessed sweapon if you dont want to hand out a magic weapon right away.
#8 Orethalion Mar 17, 2015 8:31:40	3e took the magic out of magic items for me and my group.  They were so numerous that they became mundane items that did "magic" things.  In my current 3e campaign, I decided to make magic items much rarer.  Rather than hand out a +2 long sword, a ring of flying and a +2 dex item, I'd hand out a +2 longsword with a winged crossguard that allowed the wielder to fly 3x day and increased dex by 2 when held.  The result is that the players actually look forward to finding magic items again AND the treasure the ones they find.  Rather than, "Eh, why don't you take this one.", multiple players will often want the item for their character and have to figure out who gets it.    Making magic items rarer, but more powerful, has brought the magic back into magic items for us.  1e and 2e had it right.
#9 Zardnaar Mar 17, 2015 12:00:33	Orethalion wrote:
#10 mellored Mar 17, 2015 12:36:42	masterfat78 wrote:
#11 Rastapopoulos Mar 17, 2015 19:38:05	Zardnaar wrote:
#12 Zardnaar Mar 17, 2015 19:55:47	Rastapopoulos wrote:
(Reply to #12) CCS	Zardnaar wrote:
#14 Rastapopoulos Mar 18, 2015 9:49:45	Zardnaar wrote:
#15 SeamusTheBard Mar 22, 2015 17:59:33	CCS wrote:
#16 DMStevenH Mar 23, 2015 6:40:09	Adamantine weapon, friend. Bypasses resistance, isn't magical.
#17 Zardnaar Mar 23, 2015 11:08:52	Well PCs made it to level 8 before getting their 1st magical two handed weapons. They did find a magical rapier and a dagger before then.    The advedntuires have semi exploded in magic items. Sorcerer now is packing a wand of lighniing and a magic staff that can use lightning bolt, thunderwave or gust of wind.