Spellcasters and Weapons

Post/Author/DateTimePost
#1

arnwolf666

Sep 24, 2014 17:26:21

Am I missing something.  Is there any reason for most spellcasters to even carry a weapon with the at-will cantrips.

#2

Slyck314

Sep 24, 2014 17:44:45
If he takes a cantrip to attack with maybe. You could easily just take utility cantrips.
#3

Ashrym

Sep 24, 2014 17:47:24

 

Longer range than cantrips in the event range matters. At lower levels weapon damage is more than cantrip damage.

#4

Mistwell

Sep 24, 2014 17:49:27

Opportunity attacks?

#5

Lawolf

Sep 24, 2014 18:04:19

Reasons Weapons Are Useful

 

Deal more damage at low level

Allow you to pick utility cantrips

Might have superior range

Allow you to dual wield

Are not obviously magical in nature

Allow you to make opportunity attacks

 

It basically becomes a matter of preference mostly. If you don't want to cast magical attacks at-will, don't take an attack cantrip. 

(Reply to #5)

arnwolf666

Lawolf wrote:
#7

Miladoon

Sep 24, 2014 19:10:26

With this edition, I can put a greatsword on my first level wizard and use utility cantrips.  

#8

strider13x

Sep 24, 2014 19:16:47

Remember you are at Disadvantage when you make a ranged attack roll when an enemy is within 5'.

#9

Ravenmancer

Sep 24, 2014 22:21:12

Attack cantrips are great. You can get a ranged one and a melee one and be set. Or take one that forces a save and not worry about it.

But my wizard would still carry a ranged weapon even if he weren't proficient. Casting Light on a crossbow bolt or a dart is an easy way to check out a long corridor or cavern. Plus it makes for fun times if you actually stick one onto a baddie.

#10

BW0222

Sep 24, 2014 23:42:56

Several reasons...

 

* Ranged cantrips in melee are at a disadvantage.

* You may not have a melee and ranged cantrip. You may only know two or three cantrips and many classes don't have any. Shocking grasp is pretty much it for most classes.

* Most cantrips do less damage than weapons -- typically as they don't get any type of ability bonus.

* Most cantrips do a specific type of damage which may be useless against a foe.

* You do not provoke opportunity attacks with cantrips.

* You don't have the option of having reach weapons.

* You can't dual wield for an extra attack.

* You don't have the option to make a shove or tripping attack.

* Your ranged cantrips may have limited range -- vs. say a bow or crossbow.

* You might be silienced.

* You often make yourself look like a spell caster -- hence making it more likely you'll be targetted.

 

 

#11

Shiroiken

Sep 24, 2014 23:50:57

Beholders

#12

Ramzour

Sep 25, 2014 2:19:20

Everyone here missed the big one: because your character would want a weapon.

 

Who cares what the mechanical reasons are! There is no mechanical benefit to wearing pants, but your character probably does that, right? So what's the difference?

 

Also, without a dagger, how is your wizard supposed to cut up his material ingredients? Makes sense he would carry a "ritual knife" (aka dagger) with him.

 

And, without a wizard staff, how is your wizard supposed to look like a wizard? If you follow Pratchett logic, a wizard is only a wizard because people believe he's a wizard. You've gotta look the part. The hat. The shoes. And of course, the staff. Otherwise you'll get laughed at by everyone else. Or maybe your character wants to buck tradition and change things up! Wizards don't have to use a wizard staff, you proclaim! Maybe you can start your own Staffless Wizards Guild in Neverwinter. 

 

(notice how none of my reasons involve numbers or dice?)

 

#13

Delazar78

Sep 25, 2014 3:16:25

Ramzour wrote:
(Reply to #12)

1eejit

Ramzour wrote:
#15

Ramzour

Sep 25, 2014 3:38:56

Yes, who wouldn't want a big knob on the end of your staff?

#16

Strill

Sep 25, 2014 6:53:20

Ramzour wrote:
#17

Timborama

Sep 25, 2014 7:19:24

Ha! Penal...

#18

Karnos

Sep 25, 2014 9:13:48

Extra attack under haste or similiar effects.

#19

DemoMonkey

Sep 25, 2014 9:45:13

Can you solve both problems by using your pants AS a weapon?

#20

Eric888

Sep 25, 2014 13:16:24

Because of how point buy works, it is very common for spellcasters to have a starting dexterity modifer equal to their spellcasting modifier. So for levels 1-4, a light crossbow and potentially even a dagger can do more damage with the same to-hit as a cantrip.

 

The question isn't "why do casters have weapons?", the question should be "why are casters at my table using cantrips?" It all changes at level 5 of course.

(Reply to #12)

arnwolf666

Ramzour wrote:
#22

Ramzour

Sep 25, 2014 14:22:39

arnwolf666 wrote:
(Reply to #22)

arnwolf666

Ramzour wrote:
#24

Saelorn

Sep 25, 2014 14:28:51

Ramzour wrote:
#25

StuleBrown

Sep 25, 2014 15:04:20

arnwolf666 wrote:
#26

Ramzour

Sep 25, 2014 15:21:07

Ray of Frost cannot do the same thing a dagger or staff can do....and vice versa. Different damage types, different purposes.

 

If you want to bash a guy in the head, you use a staff.

If you want to cut a piece of bread, you use a blade.

If you want to freeze your enemies, use Ray of Frost

 

There are plenty of reasons to use any given attack. There is no one weapon or cantrip that is always better if every situation.

#27

Strill

Sep 25, 2014 15:21:43

StuleBrown wrote:
#28

Zardnaar

Sep 25, 2014 15:23:48

Cleric attack cantrip sacred flame kind of stinks at low levels so if you are a wood elf cleric for example a longbow is better similar deal if you are a Dwarf.

#29

Ramzour

Sep 26, 2014 0:37:55

Zardnaar wrote:
#30

Zardnaar

Sep 26, 2014 3:20:16

Ramzour wrote:
#31

Ramzour

Sep 26, 2014 4:13:51

Zardnaar wrote:
#32

Zardnaar

Sep 26, 2014 4:22:10

Ramzour wrote:
#33

Ramzour

Sep 26, 2014 5:11:08

I agree with you that before level 5, the weapon probably deals a bit more damage than the cantrip because you add your ability modifier to damage. But that's not the only part of the equation. What about all the other factors involved?

 

What's the distance to the target? Does the target have cover? Does the target have better AC or Saves? Is the target vulnerable or resistant to certain damage types? How much ammo do you have? Do you have 2 hands free to use a bow (which means you cannot use a shield)? Does the caster have a good weapon stat (STR or DEX) compared to their casting stat? Do you currently have Advantage or Disadvantage on attack rolls?

#34

Brock_Landers

Sep 26, 2014 5:43:28

Delazar78 wrote:
#35

Ramzour

Sep 26, 2014 6:06:31

Brock_Landers wrote:
#36

Brock_Landers

Sep 26, 2014 6:15:45

Ramzour wrote:
#37

Rastapopoulos

Sep 26, 2014 8:55:54

 

At will cantrips?

 

Sorry, don't know what it is, never heard of it, never will. 

 

Might as well have a side-arm for emergencies when your spells run out for the day.