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| #1edwin_suApr 09, 2015 8:27:53 | Most RPG systems seem to exell in ine type of gameplay/campaign type, and I don't think D&D 5th edition is a exeption. There are many campaign types : Hack and Slash, Story Telling, Exploration, Comedic Or Satire, The Economic, the intrigue capaign, and many more.
So if you look at 5th edition without any modification ( PHB only) what kind of campaign is this system best suited for ? What are campaign types you can make work well with a minimum amount of modificationmaybe just adding some rules from the DMG. And what are campaign types that would need a lot of work to make work well with 5th editon ?
For example a intrigue campaign centered around a kings court might require some work to pull of well with 5th editon. you might want to create better suited backgrounds, maybe change the skills a bit to make the social interaction skills more granular, look at the reward system as standard most xp comes from killing things and combat and killing might be prety rare in this kind of campaign.
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| #2rampantApr 09, 2015 8:57:41 | 5e is good at fast combat that doens't nuke 'too much' of the tactical aspect. It's a decent enough dungeon crawler, but doens't stand out as exceptional otherwise.
It can handle social and exploration enncounters but doens't really have a system in play to reward them or demonstrate growth in those arenas, soa campeign hevaily focused on such matters requires a lot more investment in the story by each player in order for the payoffs to be of any value. |
| #3edwin_suApr 09, 2015 9:16:22 |
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| #4IstborApr 09, 2015 9:17:01 | I always found D&D to be like the 'Human' of Table Tops. It can be good at certain things as a base, but with some focus during creation, it can be good any just about any aspect. There are still those games that master an aspect that D&D can only hope to be a journeyman in.
I have found it to be very good at the open world campaign so far. I will also agree with the statement that it does fast and dirty combats pretty well. My group is pretty grid heavy when combat comes to play, but with 5e I am finding it easier to work in more theater of the mind with quick chance encounters or during elongated scenes and chases.
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| #5Farmer42Apr 09, 2015 9:43:59 | D&D is, and always has bee, a good, baseling high fantasy and sword and sorcery genre game. It doesn't do a lot GREAT, but it does a fair amount well. |
| #6abs1nthApr 09, 2015 10:37:35 | Basing it only on the PHB makes it difficult to say because so much depends on the design of the DM. However, if I look at the system I see a focus on combat.. My instinct is to say dungeon crawling but I don't even know if there is particularly anything in the PHB that promotes that structure over others. That's sort of the problem. If I were to include the DMG, I would say linear narrative-driven combat game with occasional exploration and social encounters.
I don't know how you would be able to make an intrigue campaign in 5e, an adventure, sure. Don't get me wrong, it's possible but why would you? |
| #7setiApr 09, 2015 10:40:38 | D&D 5e is good because it's simple, has brand-name recognition, and while it doesn't do everything super well, it does a great job at being an iconic fantasy TTRPG.
I prefer Call of Cthulhu (not the d20 version) for creepy, investigative horror RPGing, and I prefer D&D 4e for its tactical combat and balanced, easy to mod ruleset. I also like Numinera for its out there art, style, and general aethetic/theme. I prefer FF's d6 Star Wars for sci-fi action. I prefer 4e's GammaWorld for crazy one-offs.
But, 5e is awesome at being the 'generic' D&D experience. I still want 5e to put out splat books and setting books before I really make a call on it....And that seems like it'll be years. |
| #8AaronOfBarbariaApr 09, 2015 11:19:15 | Thus far 5th edition has served me well in the following fashions:
Heroic Horror - not the insidious, cerebral terror with paranoid sense of dread that I would use Call of Cthulhu for, but something along the lines of fantasy-styled Supernatural wherein the stakes are high, but the odds aren't stacked against the protagonists. (Loading up on holy water like a soldier grabs ammo in an action flick, rather than panickedly praying in desperation because nothing else seems to be working so it is time for an, excuse the pun, hail Mary.)
Dungeon Survival - you wake up, you have no idea where you are, no idea who the people you are with are, but you do know you aren't where you went to sleep... and thank goodness there was a smattering of equipment nearby, or you and your new friends wouldn't have survived long enough to have the opportunity to worry you might die of thirst. Maybe if you can keep your wits about you, and these forced-allies of yours can pull their weight, you can find a way out of here (and maybe figure out who brought you here, how, and why).
And it does sandboxy worldbuild while you explore, constantly change gears between dungeon-delving, wilderness exploration and survival, city-focused intrigue and political machinations at least as well as any other version of D&D I've played thus far (which is all of them, and most of their clones - though there are little bits that one does better than another, 5th edition feels at least 2nd best overall... especially since all the parts that I feel another version does better are things that 5th edtion hasn't actually covered in full yet). |
| #9sirkaikillah11Apr 09, 2015 11:58:11 |
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| #10abs1nthApr 09, 2015 12:57:54 |
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| #11edwin_suApr 09, 2015 13:26:05 | A document of bran droppngs from 2 dungeon masters talking about what they might change aboit 5th edition for one of their streamed shows.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1JNnkyFVKrA0o3Sv7O_NZxXUV4l1naFAxT10mbmBWsNY/edit
I love peeking into thse kind of things to see how people are customising the game to fir their campaign |
| #12sirkaikillah11Apr 09, 2015 13:24:27 | If getting past the guards is the goal.Then whether they defeated the guards in combat or by sneaking past the guards, they were succesful at overcoming the challenge. Full xp for the encounter. In a situation like that if I only awarded xp for killing the guards. Then thier is no reward for sneaking past the guards. Players have no xp incentive to do anything else but kill and loot.
It depends on the random encounter. Not all random encounters are combat oriented. Kill hungry monster preying on pcs is one. Helping distitute refugees may be another. A sneaky thief would be another robbng pcs in the night another. Each would present different challenges and outcomes not all solved by combat only.
All the rules for building monsters, magic items, how to build encounters and reward xp and how to run an ongoing campaign are in the DMG. If the OP is asking about DMing different styles of games then the answers would be in the DMG. I disagree the PHB is only a third of the core rules and offers very little if anything for a dm looking for advice and rules for Dming. In fact the discussion of types of style of play is in the DMG. |
| #13KentusApr 09, 2015 13:36:59 | D&D 5e is great on customizing it to your needs, since it is simple, but have enough tools to work with. The official campaigns make a good mix of combat, exploration and social interaction so far. Even if combat might be the most time consuming aspect and has the most rules to it, it's normally not more important then the other two pillars: It just need more rules. Normally you can avoid combat if you're smart enough and get rewarded anyway (in the official campaigns and I do the same).
If we look at the more exploration or social interaction designed classes, you see a lot of benefits there too and only a fraction of spells are direct combat spells, while most are very versatile in their uses.
So I would say, D&D 5e is about balancing these three things. Since it's more simple, it's a great way for a DM to come up with a great array of challenges and plots, which are easily converted into rules. |
| #14caecafortunaApr 09, 2015 16:48:51 | I have not had any issues in using the ruleset to accomplish any type of playstyle. The rules are straightforward, appropriately detailed and allow for easy customization to alter for any type of high fantasy adventure. Would I use it for a mystery role play? No. Would I use it as a mass combat simulator? No. But for roleplaying, it suits my needs more than adequately. |
| #15DiffanApr 10, 2015 6:14:34 | On the surface I believe 5e is best suited for a light-hearted, beer & pretzels kind of game. Combat is tactical-lite and the characters aren't overly laden with mechanical widgets, thus promoting a stronger emphasis on non-combat areas. One can, with relative ease, change this with different rules and DM implementation but just looking at the system casually, it's the impression that I get |
| (Reply to #15)sirkaikillah11 |
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| (Reply to #16)Diffan |
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| (Reply to #17)sirkaikillah11 |
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| #19ankiyavonApr 11, 2015 0:41:01 | Like others have said, I think 5E is the best compromise system.
If you just want a single very specific experience, there exists a specialty system that will do it better than 5E. But if you want to be able to vary your experience from week to week (which I think is a good baseline for the generic D&D, and indeed the generic tabletop RPG, experience; one of the benefits tabletop RPGs have over CRPGs is their flexibility, and I think it's a reasonable assumption that a generic campaign would want to show that off), that's what 5E is designed for. |
| #20TheNovaLordApr 11, 2015 4:25:39 | Fast Play Mobile combats High magic and high fantasy |
| #21RhennyApr 11, 2015 7:03:19 | Flexibility and hacking. Simple, transparent chasis with modular design allows for easier modification and add ons.
Also, it is very easy to balance 3 pillars in sessions since combat doesn't need to take very long. That said if you like, you can design more intricate combat encounters to skew the balance if that's what your group likes.
For me, it achieves a story developing/mechanical balance which individual users can manipulate according to preference. |
| #22WuzzardApr 11, 2015 7:29:41 | D&D is good at playing D&D. The question you should be asking is what variation of D&D are all these other games. Seriously. As far as I am concerned, there is D&D, and then a bunch of D&D like games that try to differentiate themselves by focusing on different aspects of play. |
| (Reply to #3)rampant |
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| #24danycApr 11, 2015 13:05:48 | 5e is first and foremost a D&D edition so it does most of the same things that D&D has always done. That is, standard high fantasy style games, dungeon crawls, monster slaying, and whatnot. I don't think it's any weaker than any prior edition at doing some of the other stuff that might come up (heavy skill use, social settings, etc) although it's not stronger either. A skill check is a skill check is a skill check, something that's held pretty even for 3 editions now. The one thing I'd highlight RP/story/social/skill wise compared to prior editions are the Backgrounds. Although they're obviously a fairly simple system, I still find they add a lot in terms of letting players put some RP focus in their character WITHOUT forcing them to 'pay' for it in terms of combat effectiveness (by spending a feat, for instance).
In terms of particular strengths, I think it shines most in 'crawl' style open-world approaches. Dungeon, urban, or outdoor doesn't matter too much, but due to the speed of the combats and the resource design, I'm better able to handle a party wandering around getting up to trouble in this edition than any I can think of.
For example, doing an overland trek:
- I can do actual random enocunters. Due to bounded accuracy, anything +/- a few CR is a reasonable thing for them to fight. - Combat is fast enough that an easy random encounter is over quickly, and even a hard one isn't going to bog down so much it takes up too much of the session. - I don't need to have a lot of complex pre-made maps and setpieces, compared to 4e where a simple map sapped a lot of the fun of the heavy grid-centric combat. - Neither I nor the players have to be quite so terrified of getting resource usage 'right': With less total spells and concentration limiting buff stacking, it's OK to do 1 encounter in a day and then let the party sleep (see also point #2 about 'easy' encounters). Similarly, with hit dice, short rest abilities, and cantrips, the party isn't afraid to use their stuff if they need to. - The game actually has some simple, sane rules for overland travel, including a useful, meaningful and well integrated system for exhaustion.
Due to all of the above, I've rediscovered a love for this kind of game style. It's really amazing how effortlessly you can throw in a fight, free of a lot of the worries of getting everything exactly right. |
| #25Tony_VargasApr 13, 2015 23:31:11 |
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| #26edwin_suApr 14, 2015 7:39:38 |
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| #27edwin_suApr 14, 2015 7:44:20 |
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| #28ZardnaarApr 14, 2015 11:38:38 |
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| #29FFSAAApr 14, 2015 11:39:15 |
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| #30ZardnaarApr 14, 2015 11:40:49 |
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| (Reply to #29)Rhenny |
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| #32NoonApr 14, 2015 18:38:01 |
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| (Reply to #32)Storyteller-Zero |
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| #34NimrodVanHallApr 15, 2015 0:53:18 | What is D&D 5th edition good for ?
it's good for playing dungeons and dragons!
Its a good game if you want to get together with friends and have a story together that is mostely an action movie in a highmagic fantasy setting.
As D&D progressed to hit scores of differing classes got alot closer, to the point were if you want to damage another ll classes can do it there are varieing was of hurting your opponents, and the focus on how mutch is hurt and how mutch is influencing your opponenets otherwise. The focus of interacting with others in D&D seems to be violence. followed at a distance by exploration followed at an even larger distance by social interaction.
The best illustration of this in the game might be the cleric, the mirracle workers of the gods. Clerics have many ways to inluence the physical world; in physical combat, but verry little in the way of convincing other people with words, bards and rogues make far better preachers then clerics.
In order to get good at social interaction a character has the option of getting proficiency in persuasion, diplomacy and intimidation. Sense motive is useflull as well. Its hard to get all for of these skills. especially since the combat side of the game all but requires characters to become profficient in perception and either athletics or acrobatics. The ability score that influences influencing other people, in a non violent manner is charisma, meaning that unless your a bard, sorcerer, warlock or paladin you sacrifice combat prowes for social intercation.
I like 5e i think its an incredibly elegant system that is easy on the DM for for running the worlds inhabitants, and the combats the players have with them. For the playes it allows them to play alot of achetypes, and is relatively balanced. I love that the backgrounds in the way 5e implemented them force you to think about the bonds flaws and personality of the characters. Its enough to get rid of the cardboard feel characters that 4e tended to give, but gets nowere near the detail and feel of place in the world that the Old World of Darkness did give. This is a good thing because it focuses the attention the the world that the DM creates and the (heroic) actions of the characters!
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| #35PsikerlordApr 15, 2015 5:17:26 | ime 5e does well with battles (quick) and from the time saving allows it to also do exploration and interaction well. Sandbox style works great because TotM is core and you can actually run random encounters, side treks, etc at the drop of a hat.
5e should be able to do anything well, with the right DM and players. |
| #36edwin_suApr 15, 2015 7:48:58 |
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| #37abs1nthApr 15, 2015 9:00:58 |
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| #38edwin_suApr 15, 2015 10:21:37 |
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| #39Farmer42Apr 15, 2015 10:24:04 | Then set out XP expectations and reward along those expectations? There are many systems that just reward flat XP at the end of each session. There's no reason you can't run D&D like that. |
| #40edwin_suApr 15, 2015 10:33:41 |
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| #41abs1nthApr 15, 2015 12:03:32 |
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| #42edwin_suApr 15, 2015 11:51:30 |
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| (Reply to #42)Farmer42 |
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| #44abs1nthApr 15, 2015 12:20:04 |
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| #45Farmer42Apr 15, 2015 12:26:46 | If you're having trouble getting the players play pirates in a priate campaign, maybe a pirate campaign isn't what they want to play. That's the same thing with the exploration campaign. If you feel like you need to condition your players, you're breaking one of the core design goals of tabletop RPGs. It isn't collaborative at that point. |
| #46GnarlApr 15, 2015 12:39:53 |
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| #47edwin_suApr 15, 2015 12:40:04 |
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| (Reply to #47)Farmer42 |
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| #49setiApr 15, 2015 19:22:17 | 5e is a good system, and a good game, don't get me wrong. It's much better than 1e, 2e, 3x/PF and better in several ways over 4e. (Lower numbers, less math, and less feat bloat, for sure.)
But, I cannot understand how so many of you seem to think it's easy to 'hack' and house rule compared to previous editions.
4e was much easier to hack. You could build anything in 4e, and it'd be balanced, fun, and totally in line with anything officially published with little effort. Also, 4e made the chores of DMing much easier. It also empowered players to not have to always ask 'DM may I?' like every other edition. |
| (Reply to #49)arnwolf666 |
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| #51edwin_suApr 15, 2015 20:26:28 |
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| #52ZardnaarApr 15, 2015 21:25:16 |
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| #53ZardnaarApr 15, 2015 21:31:57 |
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| (Reply to #50)seti |
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| (Reply to #54)arnwolf666 |
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| (Reply to #49)Rhenny |
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| #58danycApr 16, 2015 19:09:36 | I took a look at that linked video and I'm not sure what it remotely has to do with this thread, because the criticisms of those guys would apply to every and all editions of D&D (combat focused, minimal/abstracted systems for the other stuff). All their 'oh well it doesn't do much good at all for our game' is just a sign they really should have been playing something else.
And I don't see how 5e fails to support a pirate game. You can build dex oriented melee characters, and many people in fact argue they're outright superior. If someone WANTS to play a heavy armor character, that's not a sign of 5e failing to support pirates, it's a sign of one of the players not wanting to play a pirate, which is a table consensus/social contract issue not a rule issue. |
| #59edwin_suApr 16, 2015 20:41:11 |
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| #60Tony_VargasApr 17, 2015 21:43:47 |
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| (Reply to #49)Tony_Vargas |
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| #62setiApr 17, 2015 22:19:08 | I guess by 'hack' I mean modify, re-fluff, add to, and create stuff. Like building new monsters, single AEDU powers, items, encounters, even classes. True, making all the powers for a class in 4e at once would be a lot of work. But, it's not so hard doing it level by level, as the PC levels. Then, you're just making up 3-8 or so. Not 80-100.
I don't mean 'hack' as re-program. 5e is hard to 'hack' to me because it's balance isn't clear, it's classes and monster/encounter design is...Not clear. There's too many sub-systems, and too much stuff that seems arbitrary (or even lazy) to me. |
| (Reply to #62)Tony_Vargas |
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| #64SirAntoineApr 18, 2015 19:01:12 | More power to the DM!
I would hope 5th Edition brings more people back to the older editions, too. The little taste of the old-school feel offered by the new edition could point new players in that direction. |
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| #66MechaPilotApr 18, 2015 20:42:43 |
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| (Reply to #64)Diffan |
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| #68SirAntoineApr 18, 2015 21:34:30 |
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| (Reply to #66)seti |
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| #70MechaPilotApr 18, 2015 22:07:54 |
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| #71SirAntoineApr 18, 2015 22:08:58 |
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| #72MechaPilotApr 18, 2015 22:14:45 |
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| #74MechaPilotApr 18, 2015 22:27:04 |
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| #75SirAntoineApr 18, 2015 22:32:12 |
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| #76MechaPilotApr 18, 2015 22:50:43 |
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| #77SirAntoineApr 18, 2015 22:51:26 |
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| #78MechaPilotApr 18, 2015 22:54:55 |
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| #79kalilApr 18, 2015 23:10:44 |
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| #80SirAntoineApr 18, 2015 23:16:52 |
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| (Reply to #26)sirkaikillah11 |
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| #82LaserFaceApr 18, 2015 23:45:38 | The main thing I can say for 5th edition is that it's much simpler from an entry level standpoint than 3.x or 4th edition. Sometimes this can be a good thing, sometimes it can be a bad thing. A running joke I have with a pal who does the GM stuff for 5th with us when we're going over rules is for me to proclaim "STREAMLINED!" Resistance? No variable amounts it's half damage forever. DC enemies need to beat for your abilities? 8+Proficiency+Relevant Stat, for every single class from fighter to wizard to cleric. Etc.
Though that's an extreme example. I personally prefer Battle Master Fighter, where by the end you got 9 special moves (out of a one page long list of 15) you can use up to 6 times between short rests. If you are the kind of player who can't bear to play DnD without a spell list, Eldritch Knight has you covered.
If I had to give the two objective weaknesses of 4th ed, it would be how reliant it is on a Grid if you hate grids, and how leveling up will always be a somewhat involved process for EVERY class, not just spellcasters. How much you can roleplay,or how much is "In the hands of X", that's not tied to the system, that is tied to how your players or GM does things. But you can't take away the grid, orthe need to look over a brand new class and level specific list every single level.
I find it worth the time, but then there is a reason I consider the 4th edition tools worth the subscription while 5th edition tools would make me laugh at the price and go without.
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| #84RhennyApr 19, 2015 2:58:23 | When I was younger and new to D&D our groups would only use some rules and modify others mostly because we couldn't understand. Discovery of the game and the rules was part of the excitement back then. Now a days it's easier to follow the rules (guidelines) because the books are more clearly written, but mostly because we have so much experience with D&D. |
| #85XunValDorl_of_HouseKilsekApr 19, 2015 5:11:22 | I have seen some people mention rewards. All I can say for myself is that I don't play D&D to get an "in game" reward, nor do I expect one. We play the game for the in game interaction and everything that involves. |
| (Reply to #69)grendel111111 |
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| (Reply to #69)Diffan |
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| #88danycApr 19, 2015 14:53:28 |
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| #89Tony_VargasApr 19, 2015 16:20:11 |
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| #90Tony_VargasApr 19, 2015 16:55:12 |
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| #91SirAntoineApr 19, 2015 18:05:21 |
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| #92DiffanApr 20, 2015 8:30:47 | Well said Danyc. I think the DMs job has remained relatively the same regardless of edition. |
| #93kalilApr 20, 2015 8:55:52 |
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