"In addition, the RPGA Rewards program is undergoing a complete overhaul for 2009. We will be sending everyone enrolled in the Rewards program a special mailing in spring 2009 as part of the new program's launch. The new program will place greater emphasis on being a DM for RPGA games, and the card rewards will be moving out of the Rewards program into a convention support program. The next activity mailing (aimed at DMs) will occur in summer 2009. Visit our website at www.wizards.com/rpga in January 2009 for more information on the program's changes!"
That statement leads me to some obvious and somewhat speculative questions:
Does this mean DM's will continue to get Mini's? or is there going to be some sort of new program altogether?
Will Reward cards only be given at major conventions? If so, will they only be accessible through the Dungeon Delve, or will players who particapte in certain Mods (LFR, Saga, etc.) be given Reward cards?
I know I really like the part about putting some emphasis on DM Rewards. Hopefully that will encourage more people to give it a try.
What say you?
I received my letter today and while I did not expect any Saga Cards, it would have been really nice for the PDF to contain those cards. I was more than disappointed to see that not a single Star Wars card was included in the PDF! The letter says:
"You'll find a code in this letter that you can use to unlock a printable version of all the cards for this mailing."
20 cards were in the PDF! It's nice to see that the D&D players will get to enjoy those cards (there's some nice ones in there...), but once again not a thing for us Star Wars players.
Very disappointing!
The reason is that if they start catering to those who can go to conventions (or catering to those who can go to Gen Con and/or Origins as it seems their focus is only on these cons) then they are only paying attention to a portion of their consumer base.
It don't understand why they would do something like this as this would lead to a sense of favoritism and possibly cause a loss in consumers as there are those of us who can not go to conventions.
We play games. Games that are made to be played by anyone and everyone regardless of what that player's likes and dislikes are, what their economic status is, and what their real life situations (work schedules, etc) are. Doing what is possibly suggested here seems to lead to the contrary.
While not getting physical cards for playing at my FLGS or Home is disapointing, I'll be curious to see what they come up with to reward "regular play" - especially as, by all indications, that style of "local" is up a significant amount. I'm hoping that home/flgs play isn't completely neglected under the new system.
As someone who DMs a lot - yay for better DM rewards! I'll be curious to learn what this increased support is. While alt paint minis were nice, they're often of niche use.
Cards going to convention support? This could be a good thing - depending on how "convention" is defined. People will be mighty disappointed if they have to go to GenCon, DDXP, and the like to get cards/rewards.
On the other hand, if small/regional cons are included under that umbrella, then it will help the "what's the incentive?" crowd - as they'll have a brand new incentive to draw people in.
This is still going to depend on how "small" a convention counts - if I run a "convention" at my FLGS for myself and my group of 6 players, and we get the same support that gets, it might be overkill.
I suppose at the end of the day, it all comes down to - I'm nervous about the change, but hopefully optimistic. As always, we need more information before we can really asses what's changing.
However I still wonder whether there will be an additional last mailing for players. As it seems the current mailing sends 13 cards to anyone with 100 and more points and only 3 cards to anyone with less than 100 points.
Unfortunately I currently have only 97 points, thus I fear I will only get 3 cards and "lose" 10 cards because of mere 3 points. Will the points be reseted once the program switches to focus on rewarding DMs or will there be annother mailing so that the unused points which aren't rewarded with the current mailing get used?
First, more emphasis on rewarding DMs means more incentive for players to give DMing a try. If all it means is that each of the players start wanting to DM a couple times a month to earn a few points it will be a very big positive on most gaming communities and groups. More people wanting to DM means more people getting experience at DMing and potentially recruiting new players.
Second, putting an emphasis on conventions could be really positive as long as consideration will be paid to smaller local conventions. If I could set up a weekend convention with perhaps 30 tables and have a packet of player and DM prizes show up in the mail, it would provide a real boost. In that sense, convention rewards could also be very positive on a small local level. After all, when Wizards talks about grassroots support for something like the RPGA, I get the sense that they are talking about local gamedays and organized play more than they are talking about five guys around a kitchen table.
Finally, I think the scaling back and greater rarity of the cards/rewards is a good thing. If something is too common, it loses its appeal. In any game or community as large and widespread as LFR, you need a few things that have an awe factor associated with them. Things that allow people to claim a place or a certain amount of experience in a community are how you retain long term members and provide incentive for interested new members to stick around.
Just my opinion.
Keith
Another idea that crossed my mind was that they might start giving rewards cards to people who play at the Weekend in the Realms events. Basically they would give the organizer a stack of Reward Cards (all of which would be the same card) and you give them to every player who attends WitR. If WotC puts out 2 or 3 mods a year for WitR then every player would still get access to a new card for each event.
I think that would be a great idea!
And as far as GM's go almost all of our players also run so that wont be a problem for us getting points and GM rewards etc.
They do need an incentive to serve as the DM; I have seen reports that some areas and groups are having difficulty getting enough DMs and having a DM is a key enabler to game play.
LFR has already made a big difference in the number of DMs we have in the local area. Fourth edition prep work is so much easier that our DM pool has more than doubled. I've seen some folks run games that I never thought would even try to run under 3.5, and do a darn good job at it, too! :D
It sure makes life easier on the three or four of us that used to do all the DM work.
(Posted on Christmas Day, because my family still isn't up.)
Personally for participation in a special event, like a WitR, I would rather have a unique or special paint mini. It does not give an advantage in the game play, but it would be a nice momento.
Keith
Finding a way to give "prizes" to players at local events will give them more incentive to keep coming as opposed to finding people to play at their kitchen table and not use the rules like we do in LFR.
I think getting the help from the stores would be key in this. This way every event that one attends they have a chance at walking away with something extra.
This is how it's done with Magic: the Gathering. You bring your cards to play and sometimes walk away with prize packs and/or a special card from WotC.
The only problem with something like this is that there is no entry fee for LFR so the prizes would have to come from WotC if stores did not wish to contribute anything.
Of course you realize this all comes down to us complaining about losing access to something we were getting for free. I guess in all reality they do not have to give us anything.
This would be true however I have not received any rewards cards for my play in LFR.
To be honest I would be happier with a rare mini or a special mini similar to the DCI cards that are given out to M:tG players. Repaints, promos, etc.
This way if say I'm playing a Dwarf Paladin (for example), and I receive a special mini that is of my race and class I'm going to use that and feel like my playing in LFR is more than just a casual gathering.
For DMs this could also be something such as monster minis (which they do now I believe), dungeon tiles, etc.
The rewards cards as they are will have a portion (character creation) of them become obsolete soon with the release of PHB2, plus I feel maybe they are trying to avoid current players only able to obtain these via eBay.
There are a good number of players that play at the same flgs in my area that don't have cards. So one table that has these cards have an advantage which can somewhat dampen the fun for those without it as the challenges are more challenging than they are for those who have them.
Of course you realize this all comes down to us complaining about losing access to something we were getting for free. I guess in all reality they do not have to give us anything.
My issue is not that they are changing, but when. There is less than a week left in this durration.
If the changes effect this durration, and I don't get at least what's on the reward page, I'm never going to bother with reporting again.
If the changes effect the next durration, then it won't matter to me.
My point is that I've been reporting and playing games expecting what is on the rewards page. Changing it this soon to the end of a durration seems like they never planned to honor it. But like I said, if the changes don't take effect till the next durration, we know ahead of time.
My issue is not that they are changing, but when. There is less than a week left in this durration.
If the changes effect this durration, and I don't get at least what's on the reward page, I'm never going to bother with reporting again.
If the changes effect the next durration, then it won't matter to me.
My point is that I've been reporting and playing games expecting what is on the rewards page. Changing it this soon to the end of a durration seems like they never planned to honor it. But like I said, if the changes don't take effect till the next durration, we know ahead of time.
There is no duraction ending in a week. They just mailed out the cards from the previous duration (which will include all your points except for those within the last week or so). So if you have gotten your 3 cards or 13 cards depending upon your play totals then that is more than likely all you will get for this year.
I have not reported anything as a player but I did notice that when I reported as a GM that I also go 4 pts as a player for each module that I GM'd. So apparently some changes have already taken effect (unless it has done this for awhile and I have not noticed it)
There is no duraction ending in a week. They just mailed out the cards from the previous duration (which will include all your points except for those within the last week or so). So if you have gotten your 3 cards or 13 cards depending upon your play totals then that is more than likely all you will get for this year.
I have not reported anything as a player but I did notice that when I reported as a GM that I also go 4 pts as a player for each module that I GM'd. So apparently some changes have already taken effect (unless it has done this for awhile and I have not noticed it)
Yes it is. It always takes them awhile to mail out rewards, this time just took a little longer. Last week or so? My points have not been used this last month.
Of course you realize this all comes down to us complaining about losing access to something we were getting for free. I guess in all reality they do not have to give us anything.
Sure they don't owe us anything in the legal sense, but promises were made and not kept. Certain things were announced based on certain criteria and then were not delivered as promised. The monetary value doesn't enter into it. If the RPGA was not going to be able to deliver on their promises, they could have said something any time in the last 6 months. Instead, they have continued to say those promises would be kept.
There is no duraction ending in a week.
Actually, according to the RPGA rewards site there is a duration ending on December 31. Now, that part of the site hasn't be updated in years, but it is still posted as the official guide to the rewards program. If we are at the point where RPGA posted stuff should be assumed inaccurate or wrong until proved otherwise, that is a sad thing indeed.
Sure they don't owe us anything in the legal sense, but promises were made and not kept. Certain things were announced based on certain criteria and then were not delivered as promised. The monetary value doesn't enter into it. If the RPGA was not going to be able to deliver on their promises, they could have said something any time in the last 6 months. Instead, they have continued to say those promises would be kept.
Actually, according to the RPGA rewards site there is a duration ending on December 31. Now, that part of the site hasn't be updated in years, but it is still posted as the official guide to the rewards program. If we are at the point where RPGA posted stuff should be assumed inaccurate or wrong until proved otherwise, that is a sad thing indeed.
Thank you, that is exactly how I feel. This is how we found it out:
We find out from the Mail Carrier, not RPGA. That we won't be getting anything we expected. We don't find out till we get the package, at Christmas no less. And that no matter how many hours we put into reporting, setting up games, and finding new members, we could have just attended a few games and gotten the same reward. Because that's all we're worth to them.
To a reinactment: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6QNVe9Hbhwc
Thank you, that is exactly how I feel. This is how we found it out:
We find out from the Mail Carrier, not RPGA. That we won't be getting anything we expected. We don't find out till we get the package, at Christmas no less. And that no matter how many hours we put into reporting, setting up games, and finding new members, we could have just attended a few games and gotten the same reward. Because that's all we're worth to them.
To a reinactment: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6QNVe9Hbhwc
While I admit that the 3 card pack seemed rather, situational, as far as use I will unfortunately have to disagree with you on the harshness of this.
This (my disagreement) is based on the fact that the US (the country that houses WotC and the game we love) is one of the many countries (if not the entire world) that's going through harsh economic times that have (until mid-late September) been unknown to the consumers at large. A lot of companies may have had to make cuts on some of the smallest things and/or change how they operate to stay afloat.
If not printing and shipping pieces of cardboard saved WotC some money then that's fine by me.
Also I could have spent my own money on getting all the cards second market (eBay) instead of actually putting forth the effort and playing. This diminishes the "reward" part of these items.
So all in all these changes hopefully are going to be for the better down the road.
While I admit that the 3 card pack seemed rather, situational, as far as use I will unfortunately have to disagree with you on the harshness of this.
This (my disagreement) is based on the fact that the US (the country that houses WotC and the game we love) is one of the many countries (if not the entire world) that's going through harsh economic times that have (until mid-late September) been unknown to the consumers at large. A lot of companies may have had to make cuts on some of the smallest things and/or change how they operate to stay afloat.
If not printing and shipping pieces of cardboard saved WotC some money then that's fine by me.
Also I could have spent my own money on getting all the cards second market (eBay) instead of actually putting forth the effort and playing. This diminishes the "reward" part of these items.
So all in all these changes hopefully are going to be for the better down the road.
The harshness comes from finding out from the Mail Carrier, not RPGA. Here we are expecting a big reward, and we open it find a password to the electronic card of the month club. That completly diminishes the "reward" part of these items.
To a reinactment: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6QNVe9Hbhwc
I would trade all my cards for a one year membership to the Jelly of the Month Club.
:D
The harshness comes from finding out from the Mail Carrier, not RPGA. Here we are expecting a big reward, and we open it find a password to the electronic card of the month club. That completly diminishes the "reward" part of these items.
Arnie, I hate to disagree, but you DID, indeed, find out from the RPGA. All the mail carrier was was a messenger for the RPGA's message.
Look at the letterhead on that mail, and you will see that it says Dungeons & Dragons, followed by RPGA below it.
Your complaint, really, is NOT that the RPGA did not inform you, but that your sense of instant gratification, fostered by email and online forums, was not fulfilled.
Given that many players do not follow these boards, the letter was the most efficient way to notify all active RPGA/D&D Rewards members of the situation. No one who qualified to receive rewards (whose address was correct) was left ignorant.
Also, if you read the letter, you will notice that there is another mailing planned before the new system is put into effect, in Spring 2009, of some sort. All it says is a "special mailing", so no idea what will be included. The GM Rewards mailing is planned for Summer 2009. And, as the letter says, the information on the new rewards program is going to be online on the RPGA website in January, 2009, just a few days away.
Given that, last time I checked, which was a few days ago, before I received my copy of the mailing, but almost certainly after it was mailed, and I still showed the same number of points, I am not sure what is going to be involved in either upcoming mailing.
Upside: I finally have the Zhentarim Quest card.
Downside: Of all the upcoming LFR games I know about, I am the GM for all of them.
And that no matter how many hours we put into reporting, setting up games, and finding new members, we could have just attended a few games and gotten the same reward. Because that's all we're worth to them.
Sooo... are you running games and playing because you enjoy playing D&D? Or are you doing it for the rewards only? I mean, the rewards are nice, but I would still be running and playing RPGA games without them.
Sooo... are you running games and playing because you enjoy playing D&D? Or are you doing it for the rewards only? I mean, the rewards are nice, but I would still be running and playing RPGA games without them.
I enjoy playing D&D.
Reporting RPGA games is annoying.
I run the games because I enjoy D&D.
I report the games to RPGA for the rewards.
I will still be running and playing RPGA games without rewards.
I will not be reporting RPGA games without the rewards that were on the reward page.
I will not be reporting RPGA games without the rewards that were on the reward page.
If you aren't going to be reporting them, then don't order and play them. Seriously. If everyone started doign that the higher ups see the play numbers drop off and then they scrap the campaign. If you like it and enjoy it, then report it so the campaign continues. Who cares if you get a little cardboard card? Reporting games isn't that hard.
If you aren't going to be reporting them, then don't order and play them. Seriously. If everyone started doign that the higher ups see the play numbers drop off and then they scrap the campaign. If you like it and enjoy it, then report it so the campaign continues. Who cares if you get a little cardboard card? Reporting games isn't that hard.
It's not the cards, it's the DM rewards. I got no letter, no cards, no Player or DM rewards. What about my DM points? Will I get nothing for them either? Without a letter, all I know is what's posted on these boards. Which has been a lot of missinformation latly. Can someone post their letter?
It's not the cards, it's the DM rewards. I got no letter, no cards, no Player or DM rewards. What about my DM points? Will I get nothing for them either? Without a letter, all I know is what's posted on these boards. Which has been a lot of missinformation latly. Can someone post their letter?
I have not received my GM rewards either. But I am not worried about it either. Not much use in getting 3 or 4 minis repainted differently than the original run of the mini.
I would rather just get a plastic GM and plastic Players Rewards card that you can view on your sign in.
And as Dragon has stated I think 5 or 6 times in 5 or 6 threads that you have been posting the same complaint in. They arent required to give you anything at all ever. And they are allowed to change the program and contests etc as they see fit.
And since you continue to state you are not getting what the Rewards Program page said you were supposed to get. If you read it Living Forgotten Realms is listed no where on the page for rewards points. So in reality according to the page as its written the points you have for playing LFR mean nothing.
I understand where you are coming from but I think you like whining and *****ing for no good reason. So you didnt get something for FREE. Its not going to make or break your enjoyment of running or playing D&D. And if it does then in my view you have your priorities and sensibilities all wrong.
They arent required to give you anything at all ever. And they are allowed to change the program and contests etc as they see fit.
Quite true in a legal sense, but perhaps not in an ethical sense. The RPGA was never required to start a player/DM reward program. They chose to make those commitments to the Players and DMs of their campaigns. However, once that commitment was made, I think it is a reasonable expectation that they honour the promise. Any monetary value of the rewards, or lack of one, is kind of beside the point. It should not matter if they promised us all $30 limited edition miniatures or 10ยข membership cards (which, incidentally, were not part of this mailing). They chose to make a commitment.
Also, as this was a voluntary program, they do have the right to cancel it or alter it in any way at any time. But we don't have to be happy about it or take it in good humour. They can make any changes they want, bit we also have the right to call them out on changes that we feel violate the spirit of the commitments that they made toward us.
These changes have been known for a while on an internal level. A physical mailing does not happen over night and the contents of letters like the one we received do not get put together at the last minute. Based on my experience with similar organizations, at least the general shape of the changes being made to the mailing and the rewards program was decided a couple months ago. In that time, there has been a couple RPGA reports in Dragon and a couple Living Forgotten Realms Updates news posts on the RPGA site.
Almost every major announcement in the past has either taken place through online channels or, for a couple high profile ones, live at some sort of convention or show. Deliberately choosing to not use the methods that allow for the fastest and most open dissemination of information strikes me as a poor sign. For an organization whose activities depend completely on active and involved volunteers, this is the last in a long line of examples of poor communication and openness at the highest levels. A lot of this is about a perceived lack of respect being shown to the players and DMs.
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I have to agree that the cross posting between the two Reward Cards threads is getting a little silly. If both continue following the same discussion, I'd recommender either merging them or locking one.
Deliberately choosing to not use the methods that allow for the fastest and most open dissemination of information strikes me as a poor sign. .
I only found out 2-3 weeks ago, and I thought it rude to just be just finding out. Why can't they hold the changes off till the Summer durration? I'd be perfectly fine with that.
Like Telvin3d said, and Mithreinmaethor still doesn't get, it's not about money or rewards.
I only found out 2-3 weeks ago, and I thought it rude to just be just finding out. Why can't they hold the changes off till the Summer durration? I'd be perfectly fine with that.
I found out about 2 weeks ago maybe less, when I opened my envelope and read the letter. I didnt look at it as being rude or as if the world was coming to an end either.