I have to ask: Why is the RPGA so slow? For that matter, why is the website so poorly designed and implemented? Why are there no clear instructions on going, running an event, etc.? And for goodness sakes, why is joining SUCH a hassle?
Worse, these seem to be ongoing problems that drag on for years. Is it because all the labor is being done by volunteers? It seems to me that two or three individuals with fair coding experience, a modest budget, and 3 months could fix the entire thing forever. How is this *not* worth it to Wizards?
What gives?
30+ days after Gencon with no data entry, and worse, little to no communication on data entry beyond "we're working on it."
I have to ask: Why is the RPGA so slow? For that matter, why is the website so poorly designed and implemented? Why are there no clear instructions on going, running an event, etc.? And for goodness sakes, why is joining SUCH a hassle?
Worse, these seem to be ongoing problems that drag on for years. Is it because all the labor is being done by volunteers? It seems to me that two or three individuals with fair coding experience, a modest budget, and 3 months could fix the entire thing forever. How is this *not* worth it to Wizards?
What gives?
I don't know how experienced you are with the RPGA, but no small part of the current issue stems from the fact that right before GenCon the RPGA database was merged with the DCI database.
Unfortunately this proved to be far more problematic that anyone was prepared for and on multiple levels.
Typically we try to enter data at RPGA HQ for the major conventions as they happen. Unfortunately the merge made it so that reporting events was impossible - even Chris Tulach's login proved to be unsuitable for the task with the admin rights he has.
So, all the reporting data was packed up and shipped to WotC for processing. The database has been improving on a daily basis to accomodate the needs of the RPGA since then however.
Part of the reporting problem since GenCon and now has been that all the tables for a day have to be reported simultaniously - there was no option to enter, say, half the tables, then save your progress, and then enter the other half later.
As we were running about 100 tables of 7 people each (6 players +1 judge) that's a near-impossible job to complete in one sitting (especially if, as they'd done in the past, an entire day's worth of events has to be entered - because now it's three slots of events that have to be entered all at once).
So that's why things are so slow right now. This is a step in the right direction, however, as this change HAS had some benefits. Most noteably, now that we're sharing the DCI database, problem resolution is no longer the black whole it used to be. If you report a problem with an evert, you'll get a reply a day or so (in my experience). Plus we have a database that isn't ancient, and staff knows how to program for it. This means we can expect improvements down the line and hopefully more functionality for campaigns.
Communication *is* an issue. I've never been to the WotC offices, so I can only speculate why, but having watched RPGA staff at shows, they juggle a LOT of different tasks. We usually hear from Chris Tulach once a month or so here in the forums, and he seems to simply be a VERY busy guy.
I've taken it on myself, as forum VCL, to propose a couple ideas to Chris that I think might help improve communication. I'm waiting to hear back. Keep your fingers crossed that I can give things a small bump in that area.
As far as I can tell the only two dedicated RPGA staff (the ones that draw an "RPGA Paycheck" are Chirs Tulach and Ian Richards. It may be they need a third person on their staff, and if LFR is helping grow the RPGA as some reports are indicating, it may be that next year's budget will allow for such. We can only speculate, hope, and wait and see.
(and as long as I'm hoping/wishing/dreaming I can prepare my resume. . .)I don't know if any of my barely-informed ramblings have shed any light or helped at all, but I certainly hope it helps a little.
The DCI/RPGA system is a really poor implementation of what should be a simple database front end. There is a complete lack of documentation and lots of little things, like the system not automatically creating a new character entry when the DM reports a new character instead of an existing one.
The main site is no better. The most recent news item is from the middle of last month. and the previous one from the month before that. With a massive database switchover still getting the bugs worked out, new adventures coming out every week and a major event at the end of the coming month you would think enough is happening to rate a news post at least every week or so.
I understand that the system was recently switched over to work with the existing DCI system (shortly before I joined), but if it was not ready for prime time it should have been delayed. I am enjoying playing in LFR and plan to stick around, but I have to say my impression of the RPGA/DCI is very much a fan project being held together by duct tape instead of a professional operation acting as D&Ds public face.
As another player new to the RPGA, I have to echo the sentiments here.
The DCI/RPGA system is a really poor implementation of what should be a simple database front end. There is a complete lack of documentation and lots of little things, like the system not automatically creating a new character entry when the DM reports a new character instead of an existing one.
The main site is no better. The most recent news item is from the middle of last month. and the previous one from the month before that. With a massive database switchover still getting the bugs worked out, new adventures coming out every week and a major event at the end of the coming month you would think enough is happening to rate a news post at least every week or so.
I understand that the system was recently switched over to work with the existing DCI system (shortly before I joined), but if it was not ready for prime time it should have been delayed. I am enjoying playing in LFR and plan to stick around, but I have to say my impression of the RPGA/DCI is very much a fan project being held together by duct tape instead of a professional operation acting as D&Ds public face.
I suspect they wanted (needed?) the new database to do some of the things with character management they wanted to do with LFR.
Since LFR had a hard launch date of GenCon, the database had to go live at that time as well, come Hell or high water.
We were told that the database was being worked on and tested as much as six weeks out before GenCon on the judge mailing list, but it DOES appear still more time was needed, which is unfortunate.
I'm no database expert, but I have worked on things that seem to be similar in scope. In fact, re-doing what exists now should be fairly straightforward with MySQL + PHP.
Is there some way I can help? Is the staff volunteer?
Well, I do appreciate the responses guys...I didn't mean hurt anyone's feelings; it just gets frustrating. If matters are taking this long, perhaps it would be best to scrap what you have and just start fresh. Requirements like "all events for the same day must be entered at the same time" make it clear that the database is being shoe-horned into a role for which it wasn't designed (or well-suited).
The ability to save an event-in-progess is now function (I'm told) and has been for a week or so.
Scrapping isn't likely to be an option - especially now that we're part of the DCI database (which stores who-knows-how-many records for Magic: the Gathering, D&D Minis, Axis & Allies, and other games). At this point it's best to ride out what's left of the storm.
I'm no database expert, but I have worked on things that seem to be similar in scope. In fact, re-doing what exists now should be fairly straightforward with MySQL + PHP.
Is there some way I can help? Is the staff volunteer?
The database staff are not. Chris and Ian are not. As far as I know, anyone else official in the RPGA ranks is volunteer (Global LFR Admins, module authors, Dave Christ (senior GM of major cons), etc).
If you want to assist the RPGA, the thing we usually need most is people willing to GM at their local level. Beyond that, you can also step up as an author for a region by contacting your local PoC if you think that's for you.
I've been working on high volume SQL databases and services that depend thereon for the past year.
Completely scrapping isn't possible, but in my world, we take frequent backups. You should always be able to fall back to a backup database.
Even if it was something as simple as saying these are the issues that are being concentrated on right now even though we have no timeline. Or this is the stuff that got fixed, even if it was really minor.
It seems like unless there is a game breaking issue or a corporate announcement nothing comes down from on high. Stuff shows up out of nowhere or things get fixed or changed and very little flow of information precedes or follows.
I got my taste of the RPGA at PAX. It was fun. I loved it actually. The crew there (though busy as hell) was as helpful as could be. There were a bazillion people trying to play D&D there, some waiting for 2hours + just to "hope" someone else didn't come to a match so they could play. 4th edition has taken D&D to a whole new lvl of popularity that needs to be nurtured.
Once I read enough of the boards to understand that the DCI and RPGA enter the same area , I dug out my old DCI # and started logging into the site again. Yes, I lose the event that I participated in at PAX, but at least I can get people interested in D&D in my community by attempting to run events. It's at least a step forward for me , instead of sitting on my hands waiting for my number to get input.
The site seems like it is built for MTG not RPGA anything once I am logged in. It is not well organized and if I wasn't so bound and determined to get official RPGA events going in my community, I would have given up long ago. I hope the users/players don't have to deal with the same site once the ball gets rolling. I also hope there is a way for me as a new Herald GM to enter all the items that are needed, instead of waiting around for someone at WotC to do it.
I have to agree 100% with bugleyman. I understand the explanations that were given as to why things are going so poorly, but it just seems like a lot of this could have been avoided and horrible timing for it all. WotC and coding/software of any kind just don't mix.
I got my taste of the RPGA at PAX. It was fun. I loved it actually. The crew there (though busy as hell) was as helpful as could be. There were a bazillion people trying to play D&D there, some waiting for 2hours + just to "hope" someone else didn't come to a match so they could play. 4th edition has taken D&D to a whole new lvl of popularity that needs to be nurtured.
Once I read enough of the boards to understand that the DCI and RPGA enter the same area , I dug out my old DCI # and started logging into the site again. Yes, I lose the event that I participated in at PAX, but at least I can get people interested in D&D in my community by attempting to run events. It's at least a step forward for me , instead of sitting on my hands waiting for my number to get input.
The site seems like it is built for MTG not RPGA anything once I am logged in. It is not well organized and if I wasn't so bound and determined to get official RPGA events going in my community, I would have given up long ago. I hope the users/players don't have to deal with the same site once the ball gets rolling. I also hope there is a way for me as a new Herald GM to enter all the items that are needed, instead of waiting around for someone at WotC to do it.
Well, as the DCI is built (primarily) for Magic: the Gathering, (and games like Axis and Aliies, Dreamblade, etc) your impression isn't that far off. It Is designed around M:tG. The RPGA tools are there, however, and they're growing.
I'm not sure what you mean about entering items needed, so let me clarify. As a herald-level GM you can sanction an RPGA event yourself. When the event/adventure is completed you report the results yourself.
The only time the RPGA gets directly involved in reporting is at major conventions (DDXP, GenCon, Origins, and (apparently) PAX.
I'm not sure what you mean about entering items needed, so let me clarify. As a herald-level GM you can sanction an RPGA event yourself. When the event/adventure is completed you report the results yourself.
The only time the RPGA gets directly involved in reporting is at major conventions (DDXP, GenCon, Origins, and (apparently) PAX.
That's exactly what I was needing to know. I think the only thing I am waiting on now is a stack of cards so I can get started.
If you want to assist the RPGA, the thing we usually need most is people willing to GM at their local level. Beyond that, you can also step up as an author for a region by contacting your local PoC if you think that's for you.
I do judge as often as I can. For my part, the single most important thing the RPGA could do to support judging at the local level would be to adopt the DCI "scratch code" model for membership cards. I could (and would) literally sign up half a dozen new people pretty much every time I judge a game at the FLGS, but waiting 4+ weeks to be able to report events (due to waiting for initial data entry for new members) is an absolute deal-killer.
As for writing adventures: I will give that some serious thought. Thanks for the suggestion.
I feel the entire RPGA process is a decade or so behind. The default method for joining should be via the web. The card/scratch off/snail mail should be the slow alternative method. I only see this as getting worse if/when DDI gets running, as it will be easier for new people to get into LFR games but they will be unable to reap any benefits given the slow RPGA membership process.
I also find the RPGA process to be painfully slow. I've had a number for nearly a month (not long compared to some others) and I still can't log in using it. Apparently I need to wait for the powers that be to send me some sort of physical mail with a password or some such. I've tried using the temp passwords recommended in various threads to no avail.
I feel the entire RPGA process is a decade or so behind. The default method for joining should be via the web. The card/scratch off/snail mail should be the slow alternative method. I only see this as getting worse if/when DDI gets running, as it will be easier for new people to get into LFR games but they will be unable to reap any benefits given the slow RPGA membership process.
There was a period of time a few years ago when you could join via the web. Unfortunately this led to a lot of numbers being consumed (bloating the database) but then never actually showing to play an event - anywhere.
In my experience no organized play group does web signups. For RPGA, DCI, WizKids, and Upper Deck Entertainment I've had to get a physical card at an event every time. I haven't tried Privateer Press yet, and there may be another I'm not aware of, but this seems to be the standard.
In my experience no organized play group does web signups. For RPGA, DCI, WizKids, and Upper Deck Entertainment I've had to get a physical card at an event every time. I haven't tried Privateer Press yet, and there may be another I'm not aware of, but this seems to be the standard.
Paizo's Pathfinder organized play does web sign ups, but that program is admittedly in its infancy, and they may change things up a bit down the road once they have some more experience.
I do realize the DCI cards work for RPGA play (though it was needlessly painful to figure this out). I just think that it would be best for all involved if the RPGA and DCI just used co-branded cards that follow the "scratch" model and tossed the old style cards entirely. If there is a downside, I'm not sure what it is...
In a more general sense, I think someone upthread hit it on the head...though there are various technical and practical snafus which are really frustrating, the underlying problem is a lack of clear, concise, and up to date communication from the RPGA.
In my experience no organized play group does web signups.
The RPGA does web signups; that's how I got my number. All I had to do was put in a request to customer service, wait the 4-6 weeks they said it would take, follow up with another request in the 7th week, and after receiving a notice in the 8th week that my membership had been processed, send another request reminding them that they hadn't sent me my number.
In all seriousness, I don't think they should make it harder to get a membership just so they can prevent some database bloat. If that's their reasoning, they've got their priorities out of order. RPGA play has the potential to expand quickly with the launch of 4e and LFR. There are a lot of players who want to start RPGA events in their area, and the RPGA should be making it easier for them to do so, not harder.
I guess I'm not seeing the problem with web sign ups.
In a more general sense, I think someone upthread hit it on the head...though there are various technical and practical snafus which are really frustrating, the underlying problem is a lack of clear, concise, and up to date communication from the RPGA.
I think that's a common cry.
So let me ask what you'd like to see in the way of making improvements. Let me remind you, that although I'm the forum VCL, I'm still just a user like you and don't have any power to make changes, but I'd like to see if there are any proposals we could try taking to the RPGA as suggestions.
As I said upthread, I actually made a few suggestions myself, and I'm waiting to hear back on them. But instead of a "generic" answer of "communicate more" - what specifically would you like to see - in a general sense, as well as in a "perfect world".
The Camarilla (White Wolf's LARP organization) allows web signups.
I knew someone would find an exception.
I still think this is the minority, however - though I'm willing to be proven wrong.So let me ask what you'd like to see in the way of making improvements.
I think the single biggest improvement would be a weekly news post from one of the RPGA employees. Doesn't have to be long. Just a couple paragraphs that mention anything that has come out in the last week, anything that is coming out in the next week and any deadlines coming up. Add on a mention of whatever problems they are actively looking into at the moment and the occasional mention of issues like the Surge Armor item or tweaks to the DCI database and I think it will keep 95% of us happy.
All we need is something to show that there is some active direction going on and that issues are being addressed, even if actual solutions might take a while.
This, as well as a good guide on how to sanction an event are to be found in this month's RPGA Report in Dragon Magazine, here.
Looks like I need to update my FAQ.
I guess I'm not seeing the problem with web sign ups.
The reasons that have been given in the past:
1) Whether or not the number actually got used, in their old system, they needed to process every application. Until a couple of years ago, you could get an RPGA number online by taking the Herald-level test, and they found that the vast majority of RPGA numbers issued this way were NEVER used...and, yet, staff time was spent in having to process them.
2) As a worldwide organization, which allows minors to join, the RPGA has to follow the most stringent laws about protecting the personal information of those minors. From what I understand, some European countries have very strict laws about soliciting personal information from minors online, and WotC's lawyers decided to take a conservative approach on the topic.
WotC's lawyers decided to take a conservative approach on the topic.
While they are very valuable to a company, there is a reason you don't let lawyers and accountants actually run the company. As a hobby business where fans will come to them, rather than them having to chase them down Wizards can afford to a little difficult, but if Wizards make it too painful for the hobbyist then the company might as well not run the RPGA at all.
The casual players will never jump through all the byzantine hoops and the hard core people will have their enthusiasm knocked out of them by the time they actually hear something back. I think the real reason this process is a pain isn't that lawyers are worried, but because it isn't a direct profit source and so it never gets the focus it needs to be fixed up properly. The accountants and lawyers in hobby companies always miss how important a happy community is to a thriving hobby as it is difficult to but into a straight number on the bottom line. How do most people get recruited into the hobby? Almost always by another enthusiastic fan.
The RPGA could be a great program to keep a constant community buzz going about the hobby, but today it seems to be Wizards red-headed step child. I am certain those that are working directly on the RPGA are working hard, but the lack of results points to a lack of real backing from the business itself. That said, it is almost impossible for us to see what is really going on in the background, maybe there is a bright new day just ahead, but for now the RPGA isn't really delivering as it should to the company or to the hobbyists.
While they are very valuable to a company, there is a reason you don't let lawyers and accountants actually run the company. As a hobby business where fans will come to them, rather than them having to chase them down Wizards can afford to a little difficult, but if Wizards make it too painful for the hobbyist then the company might as well not run the RPGA at all.
That's lovely to say, when it's not your money. When some German parents decide to sue you, because your web site let their 13-year-old enter his name, address, birth date, and e-mail address, in violation of his country's laws, you might feel differently.
It's all about managing risk. Yup, corporate lawyers are paid to be conservative (I work in advertising, I deal with them all the time).