So my question is this.. now that WoTC has released the 4e PDFs are these considered "legal" for use at the table as far as the RPGA is concerned?
In the past the rules stated that you must own the books to use rules/items out of them. And even though WoTC produced PDFs some GMs would not allow them at the table...
So my question is this.. now that WoTC has released the 4e PDFs are these considered "legal" for use at the table as far as the RPGA is concerned?
I've never known any official rule stopping you from having a PDF copy as being "legal" - the rule, previously, was that you had to have a copy was mostly in place so that if a GM doubted how your abilities worked, he could reference the source material real quick.
To that end, I don't see why a PDF wouldn't be allowed, unless the GM has reason to suspect that it was altered by the player in question - however, if you're goign to be that suspicious, you may as well assume that any paper copies the player provides may have also been printed from an altered PDF, making them void as well.
In short, I *personally* see no reason why PDF copies wouldn't be allowed, though I would encourage you to make sure you're using legal ones at conventions and the like.
of course legal. wanted to make sure that the RPGA considered PDFs legit since before I bought them... since I am kinda double paying.. pdfs are much easier to take with me on the road...
I'm nobody official (you'd need a ruling from Chris or Ian for that), but I can't forsee an issue with PDFs.
Depending on the convention you're attending (IE, GenCon) you might also check with the Senior GM. I personally can't imagine David Christ (Senior GM for GenCon, DDXP, and Origins) having any issue with PDF copies.
For instance, the latest issue of Dragon magazine has a nifty new class feature you want to use, and it is deemed legal for LFR play. You show up with a character using that feature, and the table DM has not seen it/ does not have it. You tell him you have the PDF of the latest issue of Dragon, but you don't have a print-out. There is no outlet available for you to run your laptop (which is very common in large convention halls). As the DM, I am within my rights by the rules as they stand now to disallow it, as I have not seen it and don't know how it works. How do you show the DM the feature?
Will table DMs be required to keep a subscription to D&DI just to stay current?
(Note: I'm just playing devil's advocate here. I have never personally had this come up in 3.5. I usually allow everything I have come across, as I tried to stay current. With 4E having new stuff added monthly (via Dragon) I can see this problem happening.)
Now it's true that it may well be nearly impossible to differentiate between a print-out from an illicitly scanned and shared, or illicitly obtained, copy of a pdf, and a photocopy or self-scan from a genuinely owned physical book. Print-outs from the legally obtained pdfs will (should?) have a watermark (purchaser's email address and order number) on each page, but of course if I photocopy from a purchased copy of (say) "Player's Guide to the Realms" so I don't have to carry the whole book for the one page of rules that pertain to a race I'm playing, that clearly won't have a watermark.
My only concern with PDFs would be when you are using something new, how will you verify it to the DM at the table? I'm not talking about the 3 core books here, as we all have to have them at the table to judge at a convention.
For instance, the latest issue of Dragon magazine has a nifty new class feature you want to use, and it is deemed legal for LFR play. You show up with a character using that feature, and the table DM has not seen it/ does not have it. You tell him you have the PDF of the latest issue of Dragon, but you don't have a print-out. There is no outlet available for you to run your laptop (which is very common in large convention halls). As the DM, I am within my rights by the rules as they stand now to disallow it, as I have not seen it and don't know how it works. How do you show the DM the feature?
Will table DMs be required to keep a subscription to D&DI just to stay current?
(Note: I'm just playing devil's advocate here. I have never personally had this come up in 3.5. I usually allow everything I have come across, as I tried to stay current. With 4E having new stuff added monthly (via Dragon) I can see this problem happening.)
*nods* If they can't show you the PDF, it's just like the old "I have the book, but it's in my hotel, half an hour away. It's then up to GM discretion as to how to proceed if a copy of the class/race/feat/power/item in question can't ACTAULLY be reviewed by the GM in question. If that means adjucating it "blind" (GM intuition of how he feels it should work), or disallowing it, well, that falls back on the player.
No proof? No power.
I imagine that a print out from a pdf, a photocopy from a physical book, or the physical book itself will be required, if you want to use a non-core rules item.
Now it's true that it may well be nearly impossible to differentiate between a print-out from an illicitly scanned and shared, or illicitly obtained, copy of a pdf, and a photocopy or self-scan from a genuinely owned physical book. Print-outs from the legally obtained pdfs will (should?) have a watermark (purchaser's email address and order number) on each page, but of course if I photocopy from a purchased copy of (say) "Player's Guide to the Realms" so I don't have to carry the whole book for the one page of rules that pertain to a race I'm playing, that clearly won't have a watermark.
The PDF has the owner's name and order number on each page.
Print outs may or may not show the watermark, depending on the printer's margin settings (I just sent one page of my PDF to two different laser printers, one showed the mark, one showed a few pixels in the mark's area - the very tippy top of each letter and number).
but I digress... yeah.. I am kinda looking for a "powers-that-be" ruling... in my local RPGA its not an issue (plus they know me).. but I travel a LOT... and would like to have something official saying that its "legal"
If you use a rule that is not from the Core books you must have a copy of it at the table and provide it to the DM to check when requested. This could be the book, the pdf on your laptop, or a copy of the appropriate pages.
Campaigns up to this point have allowed copies. Books get heavy and the weight goes up a ton as years go by (until you end up with the 'War Chest' rolling around). As RPGA DM's it's not our jobs to worry about where somebody got thier copies. We hope they either printed the PDF they bought or copies it from the book they purchased at home. If you are depending on a laptop then you need to keep it charged and ready to show the judge. If your laptop is dead and you are not near an outlet it is not his problem. Plan ahead.
The purpose of you having a copy is not that the GM can verify that you have it, but so that the GM can look at it to see how it works if they are unfamiliar with it. Personally, if I was at a convention and the GM was refusing to let me use X because I had the PDFs and not hardback, I'd seek out the senior GM.
unfortunately I have had a few GMs refuse... but for the most part they dont care.. just figured for GenCon I would like to know BEFORE I went..:D
If a GM refuses your source, you can always appeal to the Senior GM - just in case it happens at GenCon.
Just keep in mind that if you have a PDF, you need to be sure that your laptop is fully charged and ready to display the PDF. We can't promise you access to power at GenCon - and in fact, given the number of tables and people we're anticipating, any power cords we see trailing across the floor will be removed as soon as they're spotted.
Just so you know.