Question: Is this wording intended to mean "with temporary hit points from sources other than invigorating powers" ie: a maximum of one invigorating con bonus of hit points + one other source
OR Is this wording mean that a battlerager could continue to stack up temporary hit points with multipule crushing surge attacks ... ie: no limit?
I have met several people (gm's and players) who all agree that it is not clear. DM's in my area tend to rule they don't stack b/c that can become silly when your 1st level fighter has 20+ temp hp. But the wording is ambiguous.
Anyone know (for sure) and can point me at the proof?
Elgaardian War Wizard (who sometimes pretends to be a minotaur fighter)
BATTLERAGER VIGOR
Appears in Martial Power
Each time an enemy hits you with a melee or a close attack, you gain temporary hit points equal to your Constitution modifier (after the attack is resolved).
When you gain temporary hit points by hitting with an attack that has the invigorating keyword, those temporary hit points stack with any other temporary hit points you already have.
When wearing light armor or chainmail, you gain a +1 bonus to damage rolls with melee and close weapon attacks whenever you have temporary hit points. This bonus increases to +2 if you’re wielding an axe, a hammer, a mace, or a pick.
They stack. See the bolded portion of the feature above, stack with any other temporary hit points. Any means any, even from the same source.
But unless that 1st level Battlerager Fighter has an insane AC & Constitution, he is unlikely to have mre than 10 temp hps, much less more.
Any temp hps gained from being melee or close attack are the Con bonus amount, and only come into play if his current temp hp total, after the attack, is less than the amount given from the feature. Those temp hps do NOT stack.
And, remember, the Invigorating temp hps are equal to the Con mod again, so not that much.
Best case (with reasonable stats) scenario, for a 1st level Fighter, would be a Dwarf with 18 Con, and the Dwarf Stoneblood feat, so 6 temp hps from being attacked, +4 temp hps per successful invigorating attack, so, at most, 14 temp hps, and that assumes APing for a second attack in a round.
Once the monsters notice that certain attacks don't seem to do much, they'll start hitting him with Ranged and other non-close/melee attacks, pretty much killing his ability to gain temp hps.
Believe me, something like that happened to my third level dwarf Battlerager in a recent game, but most of the combatants were ranged to begin with.
But he doesn't have Improved Vigor yet, he took the Dwarven Weapon training feat so he could use a craghammer (until he finishes retraining out of the Shield powers and feats, and switch to a 2h weapon).Best case (with reasonable stats) scenario, for a 1st level Fighter, would be a Dwarf with 18 Con, and the Dwarf Stoneblood feat, so 6 temp hps from being attacked, +4 temp hps per successful invigorating attack, so, at most, 14 temp hps, and that assumes APing for a second attack in a round.
actually I would think not considering the following:
Invigorating: If you are trained in the Endurance
skill, you gain temporary hit points equal to
your Constitution modifier when you hit with a
power that has this keyword. No invigorating power
grants temporary hit points more than once per
turn, even if you hit more than once with the power
or use more than one power with the invigorating
keyword in a round
Now I am sure a lot will be made of the mixing of the terms TURN and ROUND, but I would put the maximum at 10, not 14
actually I would think not considering the following:
Now I am sure a lot will be made of the mixing of the terms TURN and ROUND, but I would put the maximum at 10, not 14
You are correct, "or more than one power" covers the at-will/encounter/daily mixing issue with an AP.
So, really, 12 temp hp, and that for an Con-maxed Dwarf (20) Battlerager build with Dwarf Stoneblood.
And then, given that the average Battlerager is not likely to be running around with scale and shield (yeah, i know, but mine started play as a 1H fighter, not a Battlerager), but chainmail and 2H weapon, they are fairly easy to hit.
Chainmail: +6 AC, so likely to not have more than an AC of 16, which many Strikers can equal, and 16 is much easier to hit than 19, which is scale armor and heavy shield.
Add-in that Con is not one of their to-hit stats, and the extra temp hps from the power use may not happen, as they need to hit with that power to gain the temp hps...