The RPGA in the UK - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

The RPGA in the UK

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
katestwinsister
Jul 05, 2008 8:36:00 Can anyone at Wizards explain to me the pretty dire state of marketing D&D in the UK through the RPGA?

Let me explain. I am a very experienced D&D DM with lots of conventions behind me. I am able to attend all of the UK conventions in the South of the UK. I would love to volunteer to run games.

I have volunteered for GenCon UK and have heard nothing back, with just over a month to go. I have tried in the past to volunteer to run 'official' games at Dragonmeet, and ended up running my own. I have tried to run games at other conventions. It's very difficult to get anywhere, and very frustrating.

Conventions I have attended as a player have had DMs who do not play D&D regularly. Most recently I attended Games Expo which was a good event but at least two of the DMs running the D&D events didn't even like 4th edition!

What is going on? Wizards, are you relying on volunteers to do your marketing for you? Volunteers who are clearly hard pressed for time and who cannot do a good enough job. All it would take is to hire someone full time to run convention support in the UK - surely this isn't too much to ask? Convention support is surely one of the best ways to market 4th edition.

Come on Wizards, stop short-changing the UK. There are loads of us here who love D&D, and loads of us ready to support 4th edition, but what you're giving us is patchy and badly-organised. We deserve better!
#2
darrell_uk
Jul 06, 2008 5:44:17 Wizards only run one (two?) events in America, and they have at least ten times the players base we have here in the UK. (All the publishers I've ever talked to privately always say to expect 90% of their world-wide sales from the US.) Why should they do something here that they don't really do over there?

They are not responsible for Gen Con in either country, or any of the other countries where it runs, that's Gen Con LLC, which is owned/run by someone else. That said, the gentleman coordinating volunteer DMs for the UK event has finally managed to finalise the schedule and reward program in the last couple of days, so if you have contacted him, expect to hear back soon.

World wide, the RPGA doesn't go about organising events, with the exception (I believe) of D&D EXperience. What they do is to make available product to be run by anyone who wishes to organise it. All you would need to do is to contact a convention's organisers, ask if they would like you to prepare some RPGA events (e.g Living Greyhawk/Forgotten Realms), and if they do, find some other DMs, book the adventures, and advertise it. It works, I should know, I've done it often enough...

I'm afraid that I can't comment on your Games Expo experience, as I wasn't there, but I agree that people who don't like a system probably shouldn't be running it, and if they are should definitely be keeping their mouths shut at what was meant to be one of the UK's main preview games, it's just professionalism after all.

And finally, the UK marketing for D&D has (apparently) been handed to Esdevium Games Ltd, a major UK distributor, according to this post of the UK Role Players forums
http://www.ukroleplayers.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=31847#p31847

They were responsible for organising the UK 4th Edition launch party at the London Dungeon, among other things.

Hope this helps explain a few things.
#3
Beowulfe
Jul 06, 2008 7:00:00 I know I have had some bad GMs before at conventions. I just went to the senior GM and told them about the issues. In most cases, they took care of the problem. It is the senior GM's responsibility to find competent GMs. If te senior GMs are not doing that, then you should talk with the convention organizers. If you want to run events, you would need to either talk with the convention organizer about running events or to the senior GM if they already have somebody coordinating the events.

As for Gencon, at least here in US, it is run by RPGA HQ. So in that case WOTC does organize the GMs. I believe DnD Experience is also run by RPGA HQ but that is the only two conventions I know of. The rest are organized by volunteers.
#4
WolfStar76
Jul 06, 2008 7:03:03
As for Gencon, at least here in US, it is run by RPGA HQ. So in that case WOTC does organize the GMs. I believe DnD Experience is also run by RPGA HQ but that is the only two conventions I know of. The rest are organized by volunteers.

Origins has been attended by RPGA HQ this year and last year.
#5
katestwinsister
Jul 06, 2008 7:50:28 Thanks for the replies guys.

My point was that whatever the status of the RPGA, Wizards is responsible for marketing its own products. Ensuring that good games are run at conventions is a primary marketing opportunity and it is not sensible that Wizards allow this to be completely random.

GenCon may not be run by Wizards, but because of its history the perception is that it's the "D&D convention" in a way that no other is. I think Wizards are crazy to let this whole thing be managed by someone who clearly doesn't have enough time to do it.

It may be possible for me to download RPGA stuff and run it at conventions, but the whole process for doing so is extremely convoluted. At present I would have to pass an online test for a game system I don't even run any more (3rd edition D&D) in order to qualify.

Perhaps this is all just a side effect of the fact that very few people play D&D in the UK any more? In which case - shouldn't they be doing something about that?
#6
WolfStar76
Jul 06, 2008 9:09:18
Thanks for the replies guys.

My point was that whatever the status of the RPGA, Wizards is responsible for marketing its own products. Ensuring that good games are run at conventions is a primary marketing opportunity and it is not sensible that Wizards allow this to be completely random.

GenCon may not be run by Wizards, but because of its history the perception is that it's the "D&D convention" in a way that no other is. I think Wizards are crazy to let this whole thing be managed by someone who clearly doesn't have enough time to do it.

It may be possible for me to download RPGA stuff and run it at conventions, but the whole process for doing so is extremely convoluted. At present I would have to pass an online test for a game system I don't even run any more (3rd edition D&D) in order to qualify.

Perhaps this is all just a side effect of the fact that very few people play D&D in the UK any more? In which case - shouldn't they be doing something about that?

Keep in mind that the RPGA, as a whole, is a volunteer organization. There are only two people I know of on the RPGA payroll.

As for the test - well, we're in a transitory place right now. Ian has said they're waiting to post the new test until people have had a couple months to get used to the new rules, and run a few games with them, before making the test 4E.

However it sounded like the test was pretty well ready to go, as soon as they want to "push the button" and make it go live.

All in all, the process isn't particularly "convoluted." It just takes some time to make changes, especially when a whole new rules system comes along.
#7
kithran
Jul 07, 2008 12:51:41
Can anyone at Wizards explain to me the pretty dire state of marketing D&D in the UK through the RPGA?

Let me explain. I am a very experienced D&D DM with lots of conventions behind me. I am able to attend all of the UK conventions in the South of the UK. I would love to volunteer to run games.

I have volunteered for GenCon UK and have heard nothing back, with just over a month to go. I have tried in the past to volunteer to run 'official' games at Dragonmeet, and ended up running my own. I have tried to run games at other conventions. It's very difficult to get anywhere, and very frustrating.

Conventions I have attended as a player have had DMs who do not play D&D regularly. Most recently I attended Games Expo which was a good event but at least two of the DMs running the D&D events didn't even like 4th edition!

What is going on? Wizards, are you relying on volunteers to do your marketing for you? Volunteers who are clearly hard pressed for time and who cannot do a good enough job. All it would take is to hire someone full time to run convention support in the UK - surely this isn't too much to ask? Convention support is surely one of the best ways to market 4th edition.

Come on Wizards, stop short-changing the UK. There are loads of us here who love D&D, and loads of us ready to support 4th edition, but what you're giving us is patchy and badly-organised. We deserve better!

OK first up although I am one of the Regional Admins for Living Forogtten Realms and was on the Onnwal Triad I am not employed by Wizards of the Coast. I am however based in the UK and have ended up organising the RPGA component of a number of conventions.

With regards to volunteering for Gen Con UK I (as far as I am aware) responded to everyone who expressed an interest in gm'ing that once the schedule was complete I would be sending out an email to everyone letting them know it was possible to sign up for specific slots. The schedule was uploaded at the end of last week and emails sent to everyone for whom I had an email address - I wanted to give those who had expressed an interest up front first chance to sign up for specific slots. If you didn't receive that email I can only presume I didn't have your address, but without knowing when you sent your original email I can't have a look to see if it reached me. I do know that at least one person used consupport to register their interest but hadn't updated their email address thus my response to them just generated a bounce.

With regards to conventions and the gm's the one thing you (and anyone else can do) is to let the person organising the games know at the time. For example for Gen Con UK I have to take it on trust initially that if someone says they are able to gm D&D 4th Edition that they can. I have specifically said that anyone who turns up to gm without the core rulebooks will be turned away - beyond that I can do nothing if he turns out to have never opened the books unless the players tell me. I was responsible for organising the gm's for UK Games Expo so if you have any comments on that particular event please send me a pm.

I don't konw what else you expect Wizards to do for marketing - did you take advantage of the D&D Gameday event last month? I know there was a large turnout for the UK Launch Party and ran gameday events in Southampton the next day.

As I mentioned at the start of this post I am not employed by Wizards however I do provide whatever help I can to conventions in the uk (or abroad). Last year I ran games or helped organise at Conception, Excaliber, Game 07, Gen Con Uk, D&D Gameday & Odd Con. This year I have already helped with Conception, D&D Gameday and UK Games Expo.

Paul James / Kithran
Gen Con UK Senior GM
LFR Luruar (UK / Ireland / South Africa) POC
#8
katestwinsister
Jul 07, 2008 16:56:30

Thanks for your reply. I am uncomfortable criticising when people like you volunteer their free time and put in a great deal of hard work. That's not what I am getting at.

I am one of those who volunteered for GenCon UK, and I have not heard anything. I guess that means I'm not going - which I'm pretty cheesed off about, to be honest. I suspect I am the person you are talking about through ConSupport - and I did update my email address on it.

It's just so frustrating to be a willing and very able 4th edition D&D DM who finds it incredibly difficult to give their free time.
#9
Madfox11
Jul 10, 2008 2:34:13 Paul talks about first pick for the early birds, he did not say that he was not looking for any more vollunteers. Did you take a look at consupport?

One thing, when you send an E-mail to somebody never assume it actually arrived. Just as you should never assume that because you never got a reply, it was never send. There have been a lot of times that an E-mail was lost on-line, or ended up in the spamfilter on either side.
#10
kithran
Jul 10, 2008 7:55:11 Katestwinsister and myself have also been in direct communication and they are now signed up as a volunteer. And as Pieter says there are still plenty of speaces for people wanting to volunteer for Gen Con UK.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 katestwinsister Jul 05, 2008 8:36:00	Can anyone at Wizards explain to me the pretty dire state of marketing D&D in the UK through the RPGA? Let me explain. I am a very experienced D&D DM with lots of conventions behind me. I am able to attend all of the UK conventions in the South of the UK. I would love to volunteer to run games. I have volunteered for GenCon UK and have heard nothing back, with just over a month to go. I have tried in the past to volunteer to run 'official' games at Dragonmeet, and ended up running my own. I have tried to run games at other conventions. It's very difficult to get anywhere, and very frustrating. Conventions I have attended as a player have had DMs who do not play D&D regularly. Most recently I attended Games Expo which was a good event but at least two of the DMs running the D&D events didn't even like 4th edition! What is going on? Wizards, are you relying on volunteers to do your marketing for you? Volunteers who are clearly hard pressed for time and who cannot do a good enough job. All it would take is to hire someone full time to run convention support in the UK - surely this isn't too much to ask? Convention support is surely one of the best ways to market 4th edition. Come on Wizards, stop short-changing the UK. There are loads of us here who love D&D, and loads of us ready to support 4th edition, but what you're giving us is patchy and badly-organised. We deserve better!
#2 darrell_uk Jul 06, 2008 5:44:17	Wizards only run one (two?) events in America, and they have at least ten times the players base we have here in the UK. (All the publishers I've ever talked to privately always say to expect 90% of their world-wide sales from the US.) Why should they do something here that they don't really do over there? They are not responsible for Gen Con in either country, or any of the other countries where it runs, that's Gen Con LLC, which is owned/run by someone else. That said, the gentleman coordinating volunteer DMs for the UK event has finally managed to finalise the schedule and reward program in the last couple of days, so if you have contacted him, expect to hear back soon. World wide, the RPGA doesn't go about organising events, with the exception (I believe) of D&D EXperience. What they do is to make available product to be run by anyone who wishes to organise it. All you would need to do is to contact a convention's organisers, ask if they would like you to prepare some RPGA events (e.g Living Greyhawk/Forgotten Realms), and if they do, find some other DMs, book the adventures, and advertise it. It works, I should know, I've done it often enough... I'm afraid that I can't comment on your Games Expo experience, as I wasn't there, but I agree that people who don't like a system probably shouldn't be running it, and if they are should definitely be keeping their mouths shut at what was meant to be one of the UK's main preview games, it's just professionalism after all. And finally, the UK marketing for D&D has (apparently) been handed to Esdevium Games Ltd, a major UK distributor, according to this post of the UK Role Players forums http://www.ukroleplayers.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=31847#p31847 They were responsible for organising the UK 4th Edition launch party at the London Dungeon, among other things. Hope this helps explain a few things.
#3 Beowulfe Jul 06, 2008 7:00:00	I know I have had some bad GMs before at conventions. I just went to the senior GM and told them about the issues. In most cases, they took care of the problem. It is the senior GM's responsibility to find competent GMs. If te senior GMs are not doing that, then you should talk with the convention organizers. If you want to run events, you would need to either talk with the convention organizer about running events or to the senior GM if they already have somebody coordinating the events. As for Gencon, at least here in US, it is run by RPGA HQ. So in that case WOTC does organize the GMs. I believe DnD Experience is also run by RPGA HQ but that is the only two conventions I know of. The rest are organized by volunteers.
#4 WolfStar76 Jul 06, 2008 7:03:03	As for Gencon, at least here in US, it is run by RPGA HQ. So in that case WOTC does organize the GMs. I believe DnD Experience is also run by RPGA HQ but that is the only two conventions I know of. The rest are organized by volunteers. Origins has been attended by RPGA HQ this year and last year.
#5 katestwinsister Jul 06, 2008 7:50:28	Thanks for the replies guys. My point was that whatever the status of the RPGA, Wizards is responsible for marketing its own products. Ensuring that good games are run at conventions is a primary marketing opportunity and it is not sensible that Wizards allow this to be completely random. GenCon may not be run by Wizards, but because of its history the perception is that it's the "D&D convention" in a way that no other is. I think Wizards are crazy to let this whole thing be managed by someone who clearly doesn't have enough time to do it. It may be possible for me to download RPGA stuff and run it at conventions, but the whole process for doing so is extremely convoluted. At present I would have to pass an online test for a game system I don't even run any more (3rd edition D&D) in order to qualify. Perhaps this is all just a side effect of the fact that very few people play D&D in the UK any more? In which case - shouldn't they be doing something about that?
#6 WolfStar76 Jul 06, 2008 9:09:18	Thanks for the replies guys. My point was that whatever the status of the RPGA, Wizards is responsible for marketing its own products. Ensuring that good games are run at conventions is a primary marketing opportunity and it is not sensible that Wizards allow this to be completely random. GenCon may not be run by Wizards, but because of its history the perception is that it's the "D&D convention" in a way that no other is. I think Wizards are crazy to let this whole thing be managed by someone who clearly doesn't have enough time to do it. It may be possible for me to download RPGA stuff and run it at conventions, but the whole process for doing so is extremely convoluted. At present I would have to pass an online test for a game system I don't even run any more (3rd edition D&D) in order to qualify. Perhaps this is all just a side effect of the fact that very few people play D&D in the UK any more? In which case - shouldn't they be doing something about that? Keep in mind that the RPGA, as a whole, is a volunteer organization. There are only two people I know of on the RPGA payroll. As for the test - well, we're in a transitory place right now. Ian has said they're waiting to post the new test until people have had a couple months to get used to the new rules, and run a few games with them, before making the test 4E. However it sounded like the test was pretty well ready to go, as soon as they want to "push the button" and make it go live. All in all, the process isn't particularly "convoluted." It just takes some time to make changes, especially when a whole new rules system comes along.
#7 kithran Jul 07, 2008 12:51:41	Can anyone at Wizards explain to me the pretty dire state of marketing D&D in the UK through the RPGA? Let me explain. I am a very experienced D&D DM with lots of conventions behind me. I am able to attend all of the UK conventions in the South of the UK. I would love to volunteer to run games. I have volunteered for GenCon UK and have heard nothing back, with just over a month to go. I have tried in the past to volunteer to run 'official' games at Dragonmeet, and ended up running my own. I have tried to run games at other conventions. It's very difficult to get anywhere, and very frustrating. Conventions I have attended as a player have had DMs who do not play D&D regularly. Most recently I attended Games Expo which was a good event but at least two of the DMs running the D&D events didn't even like 4th edition! What is going on? Wizards, are you relying on volunteers to do your marketing for you? Volunteers who are clearly hard pressed for time and who cannot do a good enough job. All it would take is to hire someone full time to run convention support in the UK - surely this isn't too much to ask? Convention support is surely one of the best ways to market 4th edition. Come on Wizards, stop short-changing the UK. There are loads of us here who love D&D, and loads of us ready to support 4th edition, but what you're giving us is patchy and badly-organised. We deserve better! OK first up although I am one of the Regional Admins for Living Forogtten Realms and was on the Onnwal Triad I am not employed by Wizards of the Coast. I am however based in the UK and have ended up organising the RPGA component of a number of conventions. With regards to volunteering for Gen Con UK I (as far as I am aware) responded to everyone who expressed an interest in gm'ing that once the schedule was complete I would be sending out an email to everyone letting them know it was possible to sign up for specific slots. The schedule was uploaded at the end of last week and emails sent to everyone for whom I had an email address - I wanted to give those who had expressed an interest up front first chance to sign up for specific slots. If you didn't receive that email I can only presume I didn't have your address, but without knowing when you sent your original email I can't have a look to see if it reached me. I do know that at least one person used consupport to register their interest but hadn't updated their email address thus my response to them just generated a bounce. With regards to conventions and the gm's the one thing you (and anyone else can do) is to let the person organising the games know at the time. For example for Gen Con UK I have to take it on trust initially that if someone says they are able to gm D&D 4th Edition that they can. I have specifically said that anyone who turns up to gm without the core rulebooks will be turned away - beyond that I can do nothing if he turns out to have never opened the books unless the players tell me. I was responsible for organising the gm's for UK Games Expo so if you have any comments on that particular event please send me a pm. I don't konw what else you expect Wizards to do for marketing - did you take advantage of the D&D Gameday event last month? I know there was a large turnout for the UK Launch Party and ran gameday events in Southampton the next day. As I mentioned at the start of this post I am not employed by Wizards however I do provide whatever help I can to conventions in the uk (or abroad). Last year I ran games or helped organise at Conception, Excaliber, Game 07, Gen Con Uk, D&D Gameday & Odd Con. This year I have already helped with Conception, D&D Gameday and UK Games Expo. Paul James / Kithran Gen Con UK Senior GM LFR Luruar (UK / Ireland / South Africa) POC
#8 katestwinsister Jul 07, 2008 16:56:30	Thanks for your reply. I am uncomfortable criticising when people like you volunteer their free time and put in a great deal of hard work. That's not what I am getting at. I am one of those who volunteered for GenCon UK, and I have not heard anything. I guess that means I'm not going - which I'm pretty cheesed off about, to be honest. I suspect I am the person you are talking about through ConSupport - and I did update my email address on it. It's just so frustrating to be a willing and very able 4th edition D&D DM who finds it incredibly difficult to give their free time.
#9 Madfox11 Jul 10, 2008 2:34:13	Paul talks about first pick for the early birds, he did not say that he was not looking for any more vollunteers. Did you take a look at consupport? One thing, when you send an E-mail to somebody never assume it actually arrived. Just as you should never assume that because you never got a reply, it was never send. There have been a lot of times that an E-mail was lost on-line, or ended up in the spamfilter on either side.
#10 kithran Jul 10, 2008 7:55:11	Katestwinsister and myself have also been in direct communication and they are now signed up as a volunteer. And as Pieter says there are still plenty of speaces for people wanting to volunteer for Gen Con UK.