Looking at the table of contents I see:
* Boars - already got!
* Crocodile - already got!
* Dryad - Good god! What are these people thinking?
* Ghoul - In the MM1.
* Giant - Maybe its different giant types???
* Goblins - Do these people think people will buy this instead of the MM1?
* Goblin Bear - Is this a lame attempt at hiding the fact its a Bugbear?
* Hag, Harpy, Horse, Hound, Minotaur, Naga, Ooze, Roc, Skeleton, Sphinx, Spider, Troll, Wraith, Wyvern, Zombie - all in the Monster Manual.
Okay! So we know a third of the monsters are already in the MM1. Looking at the preview we have the Asaath, Barrow Worm and Bat Devil (Pterrans?). All of which seem somewhat interesting.
Looking at the stats for the monsters in the preview, they appear mostly balanced. Although I have concerns about:
* Asaathi Baneguard - Specifically Bite. This seems a bit too overpowered.
* Asaathi Maleficent - Just generally unsure about this creature.
So overall, I am intrigued by this PDF. But I want to hear what other people think first.
Now, if only there was a 4E version of the Tome of Horrors...
the 3E version was pretty good. It had the advantage of being out before the MM was in the last version, as well.
In that case, it explains all the duplicate monster entries.
The 3e "version" of Creature Collection was from a different company - Sword and Sorcery Studios (White Wolf) - so I don't think the quality of that book reflects, either way, on the quality of this product. (I agree the 3.0 CC was a great book, and I still use it.)
This one appears to be an update to 4e. I see both Fiery Dragon and S&S on the cover. Do some research, if the same guys worked on it, I'd definitely pick it up (I loved the 3e one). Otherwise, I don't know. Personally I might get it anyway just to have all those wonderful nasties updated without doing the work myself.
This one appears to be an update to 4e. I see both Fiery Dragon and S&S on the cover. Do some research, if the same guys worked on it, I'd definitely pick it up (I loved the 3e one). Otherwise, I don't know. Personally I might get it anyway just to have all those wonderful nasties updated without doing the work myself.
Enworld seemed pretty chuffed about it, so I'm leaning towards getting it unless someone comes in and says "it's terrible for reasons X, Y and Z"
This one appears to be an update to 4e. I see both Fiery Dragon and S&S on the cover.
If it's an update, I'll go out on a limb and say it's good quality. the 3e one is great, with some wonderful concepts and critters.
In that case, it explains all the duplicate monster entries.
More than likely, those are "headers" for subsections - like Abomination in the MM, which has the Tarrasque and a dozen other monsters.
For example, the Dryad entry probably has the Hamadryad. The Ghoul entry probably has Ice Ghouls (which, BTW, are NOT undead in 3E version). The Goblin entry probably has Coal Goblins, and the Gnomes has Brewer Gnomes, and so on.
More than likely, those are "headers" for subsections - like Abomination in the MM, which has the Tarrasque and a dozen other monsters.
For example, the Dryad entry probably has the Hamadryad. The Ghoul entry probably has Ice Ghouls (which, BTW, are NOT undead in 3E version). The Goblin entry probably has Coal Goblins, and the Gnomes has Brewer Gnomes, and so on.
So, yeah - what he said.
The headers the OP listed are just a means of collecting a number of different subtypes of creatures together. There is very little, if any, actual overlap of content between the MM and the CC. Just fyi.
Cheers,
Scott
The headers the OP listed are just a means of collecting a number of different subtypes of creatures together. There is very little, if any, actual overlap of content between the MM and the CC. Just fyi.
Good to know
I was very surprised by that although based on what I'd heard I was willing to get it even though I thought half the races would be repeats.We will certainly tweak things before going to print if folks find them over-/under-powered.
Oh you don't want my feedback for that (the least of which because I won't get a chance to use them until at least August ;)). My group plays extremely well together, and I suck at rolling dice as a DM (I'm average as a player frustratingly enough ;)).
And while I've got your ear, three quick questions.
Have you got racial write-ups similar to those in the Monster Manual? It looks like either the Racial Templates or the Basic NPCs might be that part.
And if you do have similar write-ups, do you think they might be okay to use for PCs (the MM ones, while somewhat imbalanced for players, isn't horribly so).
And finally again if you do have similar write-ups, could you let me know what a couple of them are? or if the Bat Devils and Asaath are among them (not that I'd let players play a Bat-Devil)?
I like to have racial write-ups so I can easily make my own NPCs, and I'm definitely keen on using both those races in my Eberron campaign (although I'm a tad unsure where to stick the Asaath at this stage, there's a perfect spot for Bat-Devils in Droaam).
Have you got racial write-ups similar to those in the Monster Manual? It looks like either the Racial Templates or the Basic NPCs might be that part.
I had them about finished when I decided not to include them in the CC; I was thinking they might fit better in a setting book, should we decide to do one. And if that doesn't happen, we can certainly load them out as a PDF web expansion. NP.
And if you do have similar write-ups, do you think they might be okay to use for PCs (the MM ones, while somewhat imbalanced for players, isn't horribly so).
Many of the races are indeed great for PCs: asaatthi, ratfolk, and proud are just the first three that come to mind.
And finally again if you do have similar write-ups, could you let me know what a couple of them are? or if the Bat Devils and Asaath are among them (not that I'd let players play a Bat-Devil)?
Both of those are among the ones I had already drawn up, yes. I'll dig up the file at some point and maybe post just a couple to whet people's appetites.
I had them about finished when I decided not to include them in the CC; I was thinking they might fit better in a setting book, should we decide to do one. And if that doesn't happen, we can certainly load them out as a PDF web expansion. NP.
Well I hope to see them in one form or another.
I'll dig up the file at some point and maybe post just a couple to whet people's appetites.
I certainly wouldn't mind that :D
IT IS AWESOME!
I thought the 4E MM was fairly well done - this beats it hands down. A great variety of monsters, familiar to the holders of the old CC books, but full of wonderful, unexpected surprises for those who haven't run across these book's creatures before.
One thing that wasn't pointed out that I'd like to note is this has not only creatures from Creature Collection I, but Creature Collection II (didn't check to see if there were any from III, but I suspect so.)
I also really like the sample NPC class monsters in the back - a very nice touch. I'm talking an example 5th, 10th, 15th, 20th, 25th and 30th level example of each class written up as a monster in the back, with race templates to go with it to customize each. The MM could have really used a section like that!
My only disappointment: none of the Carnival of Shadow creatures made it into the book. That's a very small disappointment though, it was just a hope to see them in the book. Also, while not a disappointment as the artwork is of very good quality, everything is in black and white. I just suspect some people might be turned off by the book not being in color (but as I have learned, B&W art is the best place to apply the crayons, just ask my 1E books :D )
One last thing I intend to look into: Is there a print/hardback version of this book out? If so, I'd love to get my hands on it...
Okay, I just bought me a copy of this because I was curious.
IT IS AWESOME!
I thought the 4E MM was fairly well done - this beats it hands down. A great variety of monsters, familiar to the holders of the old CC books, but full of wonderful, unexpected surprises for those who haven't run across these book's creatures before.
One thing that wasn't pointed out that I'd like to note is this has not only creatures from Creature Collection I, but Creature Collection II (didn't check to see if there were any from III, but I suspect so.)
I also really like the sample NPC class monsters in the back - a very nice touch. I'm talking an example 5th, 10th, 15th, 20th, 25th and 30th level example of each class written up as a monster in the back, with race templates to go with it to customize each. The MM could have really used a section like that!
My only disappointment: none of the Carnival of Shadow creatures made it into the book. That's a very small disappointment though, it was just a hope to see them in the book. Also, while not a disappointment as the artwork is of very good quality, everything is in black and white. I just suspect some people might be turned off by the book not being in color (but as I have learned, B&W art is the best place to apply the crayons, just ask my 1E books :D )
One last thing I intend to look into: Is there a print/hardback version of this book out? If so, I'd love to get my hands on it...
Thanks for the review. Too bad about the Carnival of Shadow creatures, they were my favorite ones. The artwork doesn't surprise me as that was the same as previous editions. And yeah, I'd like a print version too.
Also, I mentioned before that I'd dig up a couple of the monsters-as-player-races stats I'd put together, so here goes. (Admittedly, these have not gone through the same degree of playtesting or analysis as the monsters in the book, since we pulled them, but I think they should be fine.)
RATFOLK
Average Height: 5'2" - 5'10"
Prerequisite: 125–170 lb.
Ability Scores: +2 Constitution, +2 Dexterity
Size: Medium
Speed: 6, climb 4
Vision: Low-light
Languages: Common
Cornered Rat: When flanked or bloodied, you gain a +2 bonus to damage rolls.
Filth-Dweller: You gain a +3 racial bonus to saving throws against disease and poison.
Filth-Laden Bite: You can use filth-laden bite as a standard action.
Filth-Laden Bite
You snap your teeth into your enemy with violent abandon.
At-Will
Standard Action Melee 1
Attack: Strength or Dexterity vs. Fortitude
Hit: 1d4 + Strength or Dexterity modifier damage, and the target is weakened until the start of your next turn.
Increase the damage to 2d4 + Strength or Dexterity modifier at 11th level, and 3d4 + Strength or Dexterity modifier at 21st level.
Special: At 1st level, choose either Strength or Dexterity. The ability you choose is thereafter the score you use to modify attack and damage rolls for this power.
ASAATTH
Average Height: 5'9" - 6'7"
Prerequisite: 180–260 lb.
Ability Scores: +2 Strength, +2 Dexterity
Size: Medium
Speed: 7
Vision: Blindsight 1, low-light
Languages: Common, Draconic
Poison Resistance: You have resist poison 5 + one-half your level
Asaatthi Evasion: You cannot be slowed. If you suffer an effect that would normally cause you to be immobilized, you are instead treated as if you were slowed for that effect's normal duration.
Follow-Up Lunge: You can use follow-up lunge as an immediate reaction.
Follow-Up Lunge
You follow your melee attack with a lunging bite, sinking your fangs into your opponent's flesh.
At-Will
Immediate Reaction Melee 1
Trigger: You hit a target with a melee basic attack
Attack: Dexterity vs. Fortitude
Hit: 1d4 + Dexterity modifier damage, and ongoing 3 poison damage (save ends).
Increase the damage to 2d4 + Dexterity modifier and ongoing 5 poison damage at 11th level; increase to 3d4 + Dexterity modifier and ongoing 10 poison damage at 21st level.
Special: You can use follow-up lunge only once per round, even if you hit more than once with a melee basic attack during the round.
Also, I mentioned before that I'd dig up a couple of the monsters-as-player-races stats I'd put together, so here goes. (Admittedly, these have not gone through the same degree of playtesting or analysis as the monsters in the book, since we pulled them, but I think they should be fine.)
Thanks
Those appear to be significantly more powerful then either PC races or the MM1 NPC write-ups.While I imagine a PC of these races would be overpowered (I'd be interested to hear what others think), I think monsters created using them will be powerful, but not necessarily overpowered.
Seriously, though, I'm working on R&R now, and I hope to have the bulk of the work done in the next 2 to 3 months. (Keep in mind this is just something I'm doing on the side, not my day job.) But at this stage I really wouldn't want to make any promises about deadlines that I can't keep.
As for a Creature Collection 2, I would say it is unlikely, though not unpossible. ;)
Okay, I just bought me a copy of this because I was curious.
IT IS AWESOME!
Very good. I'm looking forward to the dead tree version. If I had to guess, I would say the the Carnival of Shadows stuff was just too world specific. If monsters from CCII and III made it in there, it sounds like the product was aimed at being more broadly appealing by choosing monsters which can be slotted into many campaigns. Not that Carnival of Shadows couldn't, but they did have a lot of history tied to the Scarred Lands. I think, in the long run, that may be a better way to go.
Very good. I'm looking forward to the dead tree version. If I had to guess, I would say the the Carnival of Shadows stuff was just too world specific. If monsters from CCII and III made it in there, it sounds like the product was aimed at being more broadly appealing by choosing monsters which can be slotted into many campaigns. Not that Carnival of Shadows couldn't, but they did have a lot of history tied to the Scarred Lands. I think, in the long run, that may be a better way to go.
Surprisingly, there is still quite a bit of Ghelspad-specific info in the entries. However, with WotC having made the PoL setting mesh quite closely to to Ghelspad's past (with the Primordial-God war and all), the info looks like it would be pretty easy to incorporate into any D&D game.