Actions & Spellcasting - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Luca May 02, 2015 4:49:11	A wizard with Action Surge can, during his turn he can: - Cast one spell of any level as an action; - Cast one spell of any level as an action (from the Action Surge); - Cast one reaction spell of any level as a reaction. But if the same wizard, during the same turn also casts a Bonus Action spell, then all he can do is: - Cast one bonus action spell as a bonus action; - Cast one cantrip as an action; - Cast one cantrip as an action (from the Action Surge); - Cast one reaction cantrip as a reaction. Is this correct?
#2 Illithidbix May 02, 2015 7:40:26	Huh, I hadn't spotted that rule about bonus action spells... yes I think you're almost right. By the letter of the rules Probably a bit of an artifact of the fact that most class abilities don't really take in how they might work with multiclassing too much into consideration with esoteric rules combos. Although... it obviously also applies to Eldritch Knight fighters... BONUS ACTION A spell cast with a bonus action is especially swift. You must use a bonus action on your turn to cast the spell, provided that you haven’t already taken a bonus action this turn. You can’t cast another spell during the same turn, except for a cantrip with a casting time of 1 action.
#3 Luca May 02, 2015 7:43:04	A common example of reaction during your turn is when you cast a spell, an opponent cast counterspell on it and you cast counterspell on that counterspell...
(Reply to #3) Undrhil	Luca wrote:
#5 jaelis May 02, 2015 10:08:36	Luca wrote:
#6 Luca May 02, 2015 10:35:18	jaelis wrote:
#7 jaelis May 02, 2015 10:40:15	Oh, that's pretty good to know! And perhaps not totally obvious? People talk a lot about using Fast Hands with potions...
#8 Luca May 02, 2015 10:48:19	jaelis wrote:
#9 Luca May 02, 2015 11:03:15	Another related question. A wizard with a Necklace of Fireballs can: - Use that Wondrous Item to throw a Fireball; - Cast one bonus action spell as a bonus action. I would say yes, but it would seem like a way to "circumvent" the limitation. I'm still not convinced the limitation should be made this way.
(Reply to #8) AaronOfBarbaria	Luca wrote:
(Reply to #9) AaronOfBarbaria	Luca wrote:
#12 Luca May 02, 2015 11:42:31	The Necklace of Fireballs was only an example. There are various rechargeable/resusabe magic items that create effects not with a "cast action", but with a "use magic item action". - Ring of Soothing Stars (Ball Lightning effect) - Pipes of Haunting - Gem of Brightness - Horn of Blasting - Iron Bands of Bilarro and others I missed.
#13 mellored May 02, 2015 11:44:45	yea, the bonus action rule is a bit odd.
#14 lawrencehoy May 02, 2015 17:43:58	Luca wrote:
(Reply to #13) AaronOfBarbaria	mellored wrote:
(Reply to #14) Luca	lawrencehoy wrote:
#17 Luca May 03, 2015 3:42:54	AaronOfBarbaria wrote:
#18 mellored May 03, 2015 8:42:51	oh i understand why they have the rule, but IMO, it should only apply to 1 action, not your turn.
(Reply to #17) AaronOfBarbaria	Luca wrote:
#20 Luca May 04, 2015 6:28:18	The "inconsistency" is already there: - You can use your Action for anything that can be activated with one Action BUT if you cast a spell as Bonus Action, you cannot use the Action to cast non-cantrip spells. This limitation does not apply when activating magic items, even those emulating spell effects. - You can use the Bonus Action for anything that can be activated with one Bonus Action BUT if you cast a spell as an Action, you cannot use the Bonus Action to cast spells. This limitation does not apply when activating magic items, even those emulating spell effects. I only tried to reduce the number of cases it happened. There are vey few abilities that can alter the casting (from Action to Bonus Action). I don't think it would be very difficult to remember if you have one of those. Anyway it's crystal clear this "excpetion" is here for balance purpose, it's only that I hate exception to the rules (by rules!). It makes me think the rules could have been created in a different way, to avoid excpetions. I think at least I'll limit it to the main Action only (so if you had other Actions and/or Reactions, you could use them to cast Action/Reaction spells normally).
(Reply to #20) MasterNamer	Luca wrote:
#22 Luca May 05, 2015 6:12:06	MasterNamer wrote:
(Reply to #22) MasterNamer	Luca wrote:

Post/Author/DateTime

Post

Luca

May 02, 2015 4:49:11

A wizard with Action Surge can, during his turn he can:

- Cast one spell of any level as an action;

- Cast one spell of any level as an action (from the Action Surge);

- Cast one reaction spell of any level as a reaction.

But if the same wizard, during the same turn also casts a Bonus Action spell, then all he can do is:

- Cast one bonus action spell as a bonus action;

- Cast one cantrip as an action;

- Cast one cantrip as an action (from the Action Surge);

- Cast one reaction cantrip as a reaction.

Is this correct?

Illithidbix

May 02, 2015 7:40:26

Huh, I hadn't spotted that rule about bonus action spells... yes I think you're almost right.

By the letter of the rules

Probably a bit of an artifact of the fact that most class abilities don't really take in how they might work with multiclassing too much into consideration with esoteric rules combos. Although... it obviously also applies to Eldritch Knight fighters...

Luca

May 02, 2015 7:43:04

A common example of reaction during your turn is when you cast a spell, an opponent cast counterspell on it and you cast counterspell on that counterspell...

(Reply to #3)

Undrhil

jaelis

May 02, 2015 10:08:36

Luca

May 02, 2015 10:35:18

jaelis

May 02, 2015 10:40:15

Oh, that's pretty good to know! And perhaps not totally obvious? People talk a lot about using Fast Hands with potions...

Luca

May 02, 2015 10:48:19

Luca

May 02, 2015 11:03:15

Another related question.

A wizard with a Necklace of Fireballs can:

- Use that Wondrous Item to throw a Fireball;

- Cast one bonus action spell as a bonus action.

I would say yes, but it would seem like a way to "circumvent" the limitation.

I'm still not convinced the limitation should be made this way.

(Reply to #8)

AaronOfBarbaria

(Reply to #9)

AaronOfBarbaria

#12

Luca

May 02, 2015 11:42:31

The Necklace of Fireballs was only an example.

There are various rechargeable/resusabe magic items that create effects not with a "cast action", but with a "use magic item action".

- Ring of Soothing Stars (Ball Lightning effect)

- Pipes of Haunting

- Gem of Brightness

- Horn of Blasting

- Iron Bands of Bilarro

and others I missed.

#13

mellored

May 02, 2015 11:44:45

yea, the bonus action rule is a bit odd.

#14

lawrencehoy

May 02, 2015 17:43:58

(Reply to #13)

AaronOfBarbaria

(Reply to #14)

Luca

#17

Luca

May 03, 2015 3:42:54

#18

mellored

May 03, 2015 8:42:51

oh i understand why they have the rule, but IMO, it should only apply to 1 action, not your turn.

(Reply to #17)

AaronOfBarbaria

#20

Luca

May 04, 2015 6:28:18

The "inconsistency" is already there:

- You can use your Action for anything that can be activated with one Action BUT if you cast a spell as Bonus Action, you cannot use the Action to cast non-cantrip spells. This limitation does not apply when activating magic items, even those emulating spell effects.

- You can use the Bonus Action for anything that can be activated with one Bonus Action BUT if you cast a spell as an Action, you cannot use the Bonus Action to cast spells. This limitation does not apply when activating magic items, even those emulating spell effects.

I only tried to reduce the number of cases it happened.

There are vey few abilities that can alter the casting (from Action to Bonus Action). I don't think it would be very difficult to remember if you have one of those.

Anyway it's crystal clear this "excpetion" is here for balance purpose, it's only that I hate exception to the rules (by rules!).

It makes me think the rules could have been created in a different way, to avoid excpetions.

I think at least I'll limit it to the main Action only (so if you had other Actions and/or Reactions, you could use them to cast Action/Reaction spells normally).

(Reply to #20)

MasterNamer

#22

Luca

May 05, 2015 6:12:06

(Reply to #22)

MasterNamer