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| #1Sands666Feb 26, 2015 14:56:41 | Not sure if this has been asked before. I tried searching the forums, but the forum search engine was only pulling up things from 2005/8.
My question is about Life Drain effects when a character drops to 0 hit points. In the text for monsters with Life Drain it says "The target dies if this effect (taking damage and failing a Con save against Life Drain) reduces its hit point maximum to 0".
Does this mean that ALL hit points that a character had must have been diminished by Life Drain, or does this mean that if the final attack that reduces a character to 0 hit points suffers Life Drain, that the character dies?
For example: Say a character with 60 hit points is fighting a Wraith and has taken damage from it every turn, but saved against Life Drain on every hit except the last one. The Wraith diminishes the PC to 5 hit points and then hits the PC again for 20 damage. On that final blow the PC unluckily fails it's Con save (thus its HP Maximum is droped by 20, but it also is at 0 HP now). Does the character die in that situation since it is being reduced to 0 HP and has failed it's save, or does it not count because technically the Wraith has only diminished the character's hit point maximum from 60 to 40?
The rule doesn't really clarify if you need to keep track of Life Drain effects seperatly to total HP lost. Personally I am leaning towards death at 0 for a failed save regardless, simply because its easier, but not sure if that is the way it is meant to be used.
Thanks for any help in advance.
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| #2SleepsInTrafficFeb 26, 2015 15:17:38 | Totally dead. No need to track life drain separately. |
| #3Macv12Feb 26, 2015 15:27:21 |
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| #4AaronOfBarbariaFeb 26, 2015 15:28:08 | Life drain only causes death if your hit point maximum is reduced to 0.
In your example, the character would be at 0 HP and dying normally - with a hit point maximum of 40 instead of 60 until finishing a long rest. |
| #5Sands666Feb 26, 2015 16:17:15 | Excellent, thanks! |
| #6QwertyAzertyFeb 27, 2015 4:56:34 |
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| (Reply to #4)SleepsInTraffic |
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| #8DarkGameMasterApr 30, 2015 3:44:58 | Hello Fellow Gamers, I am also very confused by the Life Drain ability as well. I have some questions as to it's game mechanic. Last week our DM killed our Cleric using the Succubus' Draining Kiss ability which is similar to life drain. My issue is this.
Does it completely negate the DEATH SAVE that is granted any character who begins their turn with 0 HP? Also, because it lowers your HP maximum as well as damaging the charcater with psychic damage is there no way to heal the character if his HP MAX is 0 besides Revivfy? Would Spare The Dying work?
Aside form that would the party not get advantage against the Succubus once she is revealed as hostile as Charm Person spell states in the PHB PG.221 or is Monster Charm different? If so please clarify the difference as I do not have a Monster Mannual, yet.
Finally, if a Flumph was summoned because of Wild Magic (Dm's Chioce) ,would his stench hinder the entire party with disadvantage against the saves we must make versus the Succubus' Charm & Draining Kiss or would the propssed Advantage stated above cancel the Disadvantage out and everyone roll normally as stated in the PHB PG. 173? Not to mention would we then have to save versus poison from the stench of the Flumph as well? Even though he fled almost immediately after being summoned. (Again Dm's Choice)
Please, let me know what you all think. I am seriously on the edge concerning 5th edition because of the mash of rules. It seems as though Every single thing that upset me about all the previous editions has made it's way into 5th Edition. The monster encounters are like 1st (Brutal) The player options are like 2nd (LImited) and the spells/powers are extremely weak like in 4th of which I only played once. Not to mention the save system is just nerfed all to hell! The only releif I find are the many variant character options that remind me of 3.0 & 3.5 Which are by far my favorite Editions of D&D. So far, I am not immpressed with 5th Edition. Please feel free to comment. Thanks ahead of time for all your help. Have a blast gaming. |
| #9jaelisApr 30, 2015 6:25:49 |
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| #10QwertyAzertyApr 30, 2015 5:47:50 | their is a difference between dieing and dead.
you are dieing if you drop between 0 and negative max HP. For example, a character with 30 Max HP, woul dbe dieing if his HP is between 0 and -29. Remember you don't get to -29, your HP is automatically back to 0. while dieing you can make death save, you can receive spare the dieing and you can be heal back to 1+HP and be back in the fight.
If you reach negative max HP (so in our example, if the character drop to -30 or lower with a single hit) or if he fail 3 death saves you are then DEAD. Once dead, the only thing that can bring you back is revivify, raise dead, reincarnate, true ressurection, wish, divine intervention etc...
So if your Max HP is 0, and you have 0 HP, then you reach negative Max HP so you are DEAD. so you now need a revivify, raise dead, reincarnate, true ressurection etc... |
| #11RazintarrApr 30, 2015 5:58:37 |
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| #12DarkGameMasterApr 30, 2015 12:27:01 | Hello Again, Thanks for all the great input. Let me clarify first to you "JAELIS", It seems that although the Monster Charm ability and The Charm Spell fuction off the same mechanic they are not the same at all.
What I was trying to say was that The party (Excluding my Druid who had just joined) had encountered this exact same Succubus before and barely survived. With that being said I believe that advantage should have been granted to everyone ,but my character. It wasn't.
I used the description under Charm Person as an example because what it is saying is that if you try to charm a person whom you are fighting "the person you are trying to charm" gets advantage. Because you are hostile toward him.
That to me is evidence that any charm like ability would work the same way. How can something charm you if you know it to be an enemy creature was my point? Especially one you have encountered before and who's abilities your character is fully aware of? The DM had the power to grant advantage to the party in that respect, He did not.
Second, to Jaelis and Razintarr both, My DM used the Flumph to grant disadvantage to the ENTIRE PARTY, not just those within 5ft of the creature, Without using the Flumph's Stench Spray ability I might add. That to me is cheating or stacking the deck in the DM'S favor. Although I am hoping he just overlooked or somehow I missed him using the ability and he will correct his wrong. I will see on Tuesday at the game when I bring up my concerns.
Also, where does it clarify in the books that the stench spray only grants disadvantage to attacks and ability checks and NOT to saves. That would be helpful info to have. Thanks.
Thirdly, Thank you QwertyAzerty for clearing that issue up. It was very confusing to me how the Draining Kiss just drops your HP max as well as your HP through Psychic damage. It is in my opinion that should not be a CR 4 ability ,but more a CR 5 or even CR 6. Although from what I understand it has been dumbed down from previous edition's. So I guess there is that to be grateful for.
Overall, I think my DM is just out to kill the group as he has done so or tried to do by raining death down upon us all since we began. I am no sure I am enjoying 5th Edition because of that fact or the fact that the rules seem so compacted and unexplained. Maybe that was why I prefered 3.5 or D20 rule settings because they went into extreme detail.
Well, Thank you all for the great advice and takecare out there. Until next time.
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| #13jaelisApr 30, 2015 13:26:25 |
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| #14RazintarrMay 01, 2015 2:12:01 |
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| #15DarkGameMasterMay 13, 2015 15:26:48 | Hey There, Sorry I have not posted for awhile, been busy! Actually gotta run soon ,but just wanted to thank you all for your comments, post and suggestions. I appreciate it. Our cleric died despite the DM's Mistakes. No mercy.
Now, we have a paladin and are doing a bit better ,but I have had to tool my Druid for more of a Healer Set and that is not the path I wanted to go. Still, we are still alive in game despite the DM's consant attacks from Fiendish creatures. We are dealing with A night hag at the moment who almost killed me outright with her Nightmare Haunting over the course of a week in game.
We of course in game do not know she is a night hag, just a hag, but thankfully due to the group pulling togehter we where able to get my Hp Max resotred and have won two successful encounters against her so far. Have yet to destroy her or banish her ,but we have a plan set in motion.
I will keep you all informed how it goes. Thanks for all the help. Later. |