Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Skie Mar 19, 2015 4:24:46	So, either my search-fu is that bad or there are no masterwork items in 5E. I'm sure that I'm not the first person to notice this, but again I can't find any suggestions around these forums. So, in your games, are there mastercrafted items, especially weapons and armours? That would seem logical since magic items are more rare than in previous editions (which is good!), but for example elite military units still need better equipement.   As it was in 3.x e, I'd give such items +1 bonus only, but what about pricing? x2? x10?
#2 mellored Mar 19, 2015 5:13:02	There are none.   The +'s from items has been reduced a lot in 5e.
#3 QwertyAzerty Mar 19, 2015 6:12:51	I do agree that masterwork could be an interesting gold sink (if you don't need a full plate or if you already have one) that more player could use.   The problem is +1 in 5e is a LOT stronger then +1 was in 3.x.   If you remember as a fighter level 5 in 3rd edition I wouls have a Bab of +5/+1, add your strenght (+5) (and they was no max of 20 in a stats you could as high as you wanted, and a spell level 2 (Bull strenght) could give you extra strenght (so an other +2 from the increase strenght). then if you flanked teh target you gain a other +2, if you had higher ground advantage that an other +2, you took the weapon focus feat for an other +1 for a total bonus of +17 on your first attack and +13 on your second attack at level 5, compare to 5e where both attack will have profiency (+3) stat (+4) for a total of +7 on both attack.   So now gaining a masterwork weapon giving you a +1 bonus in 3.x would give you a bonus of 5% increase, compare to 14% increase in 5e for the same +1 bonus.   If you want to introduce masterwork (and I do believe it could be interesting) I would say that a masterwork weapon allow you to reroll natural 1 on attack roll (would occur 5% of the time so giving it an effectiveness similar to the +1 bonus from 3rd edition)   To explain RP wise why your weapon allow you to reroll natural 1, your weapon is extremely well made (perfectly balance for example) so it's much rarer to do a incredeble fumble with such a weapon.   For armor the same reason happen, where the AC in 3.x were much higher because there was many ways to improved your armor. so once again the +1 in 3.x had less of an impact then the same +1 in 5e. Maybe something like: a masterwork light armor reduce bludgeoning damage by 1, a masterwork medium armor reduce bludgeoning and slashing damage by 1 and Masterwork Heavy armor reduce bludgeoning, slashing and piercing damage by 1 (stack with heavy armor mastery feat)   RP wise, the light armor, have better quality padding absorbing some of the hit. The medium armor got better padding and the better quality rings to deflect blow more effectively. Heavy armor got the better padding, the better rings and better quality plating that resist better to piercing attacks.
#4 Skie Mar 19, 2015 8:17:29	Excellent point!  But giving a re-roll 1 quality would make masterwork weapons a bit better than magic ones, since rolling 1s means auto-miss. Perhaps +1 to damage instead.. As for armours - I love your ideas! What about prices? Economy seems more or less the same, so just +1000gp?
(Reply to #4) menakles	Skie wrote:
#6 AaronOfBarbaria Mar 19, 2015 10:41:39	Here's how I am killing two birds with one stone.   The birds: I like the idea of their being items so extremely well crafted in comparison to normal "good enough" crafting that there is mechanical representation of their superiority. I dislike the players ending up with stacks of magical weapons and armor that they are likely to skip out on using at a later date because they've likely found something more interesting (even if not as mechanically potent), but also run a setting that is on the higher end of the magic scale, so there are more treasure hoard rolls going on and thus more basic magic items like +1 this or thats showing up.   The stone: +1 weapons, armor, and ammunition are the result of exquisitely fine craftsmanship and are described as entirely mundane (though they still count as magic for bypassing resistance and immunity) unless they also feature minor powers like a bonus to initiative of glowing when a particular sort of enemy is near. +2 weapons, armor, and ammunition can be described as either the pinnacle of crafstmanship, or as being genuinely magical (with the same caveats as above) +3 weapons, armor, and amunition are still entirely magical, though the "magic" may simply be that they were created via Immortal magic and are thus the definition of perfect in both quality of materials and craftsmanship (and still following the caveats above).   That way I don't have to stress about there being too many items with +s to still have them feel magical, which is good because I like to use the random treasure tables for any treasure that isn't the goal of a specific quest so that the world around the characters doesn't feel quite so serendipitous, and I don't actually have to come up with some separate mechanic for representing superior craftsmanship.
#7 Illithidbix Mar 19, 2015 12:44:42	Masterwork armour already exists in 5E. It's the Breastplate, Halfplate, Splint and Plate armour. (And Studded Leather to a lesser extent)  All armour too expensive for 1st level characters.     I really like AaronOfBarbaria's idea myself. Esp. combined with liberal use of the special features table on page 142-143 of the DMG for actual magical items. And concur that at standard +2 Longsword feels insufficently wonderous.
#8 Kalani Mar 19, 2015 18:58:13	If I was being very generous, I would grant masterwork items the following benefit:    Due to its superior craftsmanship, this weapon counts as magical for the purpose of bypassing resistance to nonmagical [damage type] damage. I have no problem with providing PCs with spending gold to gain this advantage, especially given the fact that they can achieve similar results at 1st level via the magic stone cantrip. The weapons are no more powerful than normal weapons, but have a much easier time bypassing resistance.    Such weapons would occupy the space between magic items (which are not available for sale by default) and mundane items.   I would set their price at say 500-1000g + the cost of the weapon. They should not be cheap (especially in a game where the PCs have little to spend money on at higher levels).
#9 Illithidbix Mar 19, 2015 19:05:42	Kalani wrote:
#10 lawrencehoy Mar 19, 2015 20:52:44	menakles wrote:
#11 Kalani Mar 19, 2015 22:09:20	Alternatively, you could resurrect a weapon quality from the 4th edition vault, and give masterwork weapons the Brutal property. For simplicity sake, I would say this ability functions in an identical manner to the great weapon master fighting style - allowing you to reroll 1s and 2s with your masterwork weapon.   Alternatively, if that makes you uncomfortable, you could just give masterwork weapons a +1 damage bonus (but no bonus to hit).
#12 Synjin Mar 20, 2015 7:02:47	erdana, Arial">In 3E, a MW sword was a +1 to hit, but not damage, correct?  I would homebrew MW arms and armor in 5E something like, a MW sword has a 19-20 crit range, but that's it. Give it a finer edge for better crit chance, but no +1 to hit. Leave that to magic alone. Maybe a harder steel property to make it more durable. I can't recall if 5E has any Sundering mechanics to attack and break a weapon. For ranged weapons, perhaps increase the distance of a MW bow.   erdana, Arial">For 5E MW armor, maybe do something like it's got superb buckles and clasps that make it easier to don and doff, cutting that time in half (if you use that mechanic). Perhaps lighter material so there's no longer a STR requirement for the heavier armors. Due to the Bounded Accuracy of 5E, I would stay away from anything that confers a + to AC for sure. Like the weapons, leave that to magic only.   erdana, Arial">EDIT: I C&P'd this from another forum, but the text formatting wigged out. Hope what I said makes sense. Disregard the erdana, Arial">
#13 jaelis Mar 20, 2015 8:29:25	AaronOfBarbaria wrote:
(Reply to #13) AaronOfBarbaria	jaelis wrote:
#15 cowleymen Mar 20, 2015 9:41:30	I think just value of the weapon as well. I can tell you, if i found a sword that was described as finely made, worth well more then its "good enough" construction worker brother from the PHB table, im probably using the fancy looking sword. Weapons are a status symbol. Walking into town with a gem crusted pommel is quite a bit more impressive and eye catching then walking in with your worn steel pommel, even if its worn with love.   Never underestimate RP value. IF your player wants RP value anyways.   my ways of giving slightly more interesting items to players.   I dont have the DMG, so whats the table of minor effects that have been mentioned earlier?
#16 Tempest_Stormwind Mar 20, 2015 9:54:56	cowleymen wrote:
#17 cowleymen Mar 20, 2015 11:31:50	those tables sound great. Im not running a game yet, but I by far prefer special materials to just the generic arcane or divine blessings and magic imbued to items. I by far prefer lesser magic items just being special materials that require master craftsmen to turn into worth items or their source. Firebettle chritin(sp? exoskeleton skin. Like the parts that cover its wings) make a fire resistance or reduction shield. Special leather with bonus AC, surely drake-skin make far tougher leather then cow hides.  That sacred weapon a paladin is swinging? He spent a week in meditation and fasting, infusing the strength of his devotion in the steel.  Far more interesting for downtime craftiing as well.  use some of the lesser knowledge skills in harvesting parts from slain foes. Dragon blood is such an interesting material, with 13 know uses in alchemy/transmutation.
#18 cowleymen Mar 20, 2015 11:31:50	those tables sound great. Im not running a game yet, but I by far prefer special materials to just the generic arcane or divine blessings and magic imbued to items. I by far prefer lesser magic items just being special materials that require master craftsmen to turn into worth items or their source. Firebettle chritin(sp? exoskeleton skin. Like the parts that cover its wings) make a fire resistance or reduction shield. Special leather with bonus AC, surely drake-skin make far tougher leather then cow hides.  That sacred weapon a paladin is swinging? He spent a week in meditation and fasting, infusing the strength of his devotion in the steel.  Far more interesting for downtime craftiing as well.  use some of the lesser knowledge skills in harvesting parts from slain foes. Dragon blood is such an interesting material, with 13 know uses in alchemy/transmutation.
#19 cowleymen Mar 20, 2015 11:32:18	I have no clue why all my post are getting done in double
#20 Tempest_Stormwind Mar 20, 2015 12:43:39	cowleymen wrote:
#21 Ramzour Mar 21, 2015 3:42:45	AaronOfBarbaria wrote: