Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 SterlingRat May 04, 2015 5:47:52	I'm playing a wizard and in my game, I used the Minor Illusion cantrip to put friendly characters in a 5-ft cloud of dense mist   Here is what I think should happen: The allied character can immidiately see through the mist, as it is touching him (assuming that is a physical interaction) and that makes the illusion become faint.   Melee seems perfectly balanced the first time something attacks that character, it will have disadvantage because they can't see him... but since touching the mist reveals it as an illusion and makes it faint, it's only good for one use. the first time that character attacks something, he will have advantage for being unseen... but at some point during the attacking round, part of the mist would touch the target and thus become faint - again, one use only. What's more, it's only good for either the first attack or the first time they are attacked, not both. That's a fairly balanced cantrip.   Using the same trick on a Ranged character seems like it's a bit on the cheese side, though... since attacking or being attacked doesn't spoil the illusion, it could just keep going as long as they stay in the 5-foot square (since you can't move a minor illusion) and I don't try to re-cast it (even though it's not a concentraction spell, it says "The illusion also ends if you dismiss it as an action or cast this spell again")   I'm not trying to take advantage of the wording on illusion spells... I don't think being able to duplicate the "help" action from 30 ft away by casting a cantrip is unreasonable. However, it seems a little unreasonable and OP on the ranged application, which makes me think I am doing something wrong here... but I don't know what. Can anyone help? I'm pretty sure the DM will house-rule that it works the same on ranged as it does on melee to keep it from being OP, but I would prefer if it was an actual rule rather than a houserule, and it seems like it should be that way somewhere, but I can't figure out where.   What am I missing?
#2 jaelis May 04, 2015 5:58:21	First, it seems debatable whether "mist" would be considered an object as the spell requires. I could see going either way on that. But you could make a 5 ft stone block that would have basically the same effect.   Second, most medium characters would need to duck to be hidden inside a 5 ft cube. Smaller characters would be fine of course.   Third, it is debatable whether a creature can see through an illusion without making a check to investigate it. (Does the last line of the spell refer to any time you determine the object is an illusion, or only if you succeed on your check?)   So I'd say there is some DM interpretation required here.
#3 QwertyAzerty May 04, 2015 7:01:05	Personally I use Minor illusion to create a wall. Then my spellcaster can go behind it and crounch (you don't fight standing tall, it's too easy of a target, when you fight you usually crouch a little bit, so saying that a 6ft tall person while fighting will be 5ft tall it reasonable. Then since I know it's an illusion I can see through it (or can use a free interaction with my environement to barely touch it so it become transparent for me) Then while being behing my wall, I am unseen (not hidden, all the enemies know where I am), which simply require to loose line of sight. I am unseen only to enemy in front of the wall, if an enemy move onthe side or behind I'm no longer unseen (could create a illusion of a wall box to remove this limitation)   Like the OP said, I cannot move without recasting the minor illusion at my new location.   it require an action (or 2SP to quicken it with a sorcerer) to use I am easy to hit with AoE. since I cannot move away from my wall (without loosing it's benefit)   With a spellcaster I can cast my spell over the wall so not breaking the illusion. But if an enemy decide to attack and the attack touch the wall, then the wall disapear. So yes as long that my team distract the enemy and they get attack instead of me the spell work fine.   So yes I can cast minor illusion of a wall, then cast scorchign ray and gain advantage on every rays (since I'm still unseen on every ray) the ray fly over the wall to hit the target so they do not reveal the illusion. and the spell become null when the monster try to attack me and touch the wall. The enemy "think" that I have cover, but if they hit that "cover" they can see the attack passing throught it
(Reply to #3) SterlingRat	QwertyAzerty wrote:
#5 Avross May 05, 2015 10:31:48	There's also a flaw in your logic.   SterlingRat wrote:
#6 reddaemon May 06, 2015 1:05:19	It's not invisible, but it's not opaque either. Applying disadvantage as if he were blind is unreasonable IMO. The spell states that the illusion is faint if you disbelieve. I would treat that area as lightly obscured to the creature, and even that is a little extreme since if it is faint you should barely be able to tell it is there. You have a point in granting advantage to opponents' disbelieve roll though.
#7 Avross May 06, 2015 9:23:19	reddaemon wrote:
#8 Dyndrilliac May 08, 2015 23:30:45	I am currently playing a Deep Gnome Illusionist and I have been using my small size to my advantage by using Minor Illusion to create disuises around myself  so that I appear to an objective outside observer as a large mundane object that fits within a 5 foot cube. Boulders, small beds, desks, wagons, etcetera are all fair game according to the rules of Minor Illusion.