I have a Shadow Monk in my party, and they came across a dragon 
He started using his shadow teleport to appear beside the dragon in flight so he could wham/slam/bam and using his slow fall to land safely back to the ground. Thoughts? Opinions? ... on the validity of such a tactic ?
Well, as soon as he appears next to the dragon, he falls. He doesn't have time to make the attacks. He could teleport to be on the dragon and then step off to fall, but teleporting next to it shouldn't work.
If the monk appears on the dragon and then steps off, I would allow for the dragon to make an OA on the monk, also.
For me, it would kind of depend on how high and tall the dragon was. In the first second of freefall, the monk will drop about 3 squares (side note: if you fall at least 575 feet, it takes more than one turn to hit the ground), more than half of the time spent in the first 5'. I'd be okay letting him make his attacks if he remained adjacent for that time frame, given the existing abstractions in timing.
Also, a dragon in flight isn't really going to have a shadow to teleport to.
Undrhil wrote:
Undrhil wrote:
I'd let it work, if you're fighting in dim light. Seems like a cool idea.
But I wouldn't say that the shadow of a creature was ever enough to create a region of dim light in a brightly lit area.
EmpactWB wrote:
paulstrait wrote:
Tempest_Stormwind wrote:
Tempest_Stormwind wrote:
paulstrait wrote:
Coredump00 wrote:
paulstrait wrote:
If I was the Monk in question, I would be trying to teleport onto the Dragon's back, and kick / stomp it from there. Not teleporting to "the square / cube next to him as he flies by".
Have to carefully time the upswing on his wings and make sure everything is aligned right (so the shadow of the wing falls across his back).
This gives my Ancients Paladin5 (who just picked up Misty Step) a really nasty idea...
Hopefully none of the nay sayers are the sort to go to other threads and argue 'we play the game for fun!', because seriously, the monk just attacks a dragon with regular attacks - and you want to shut that down? How does that seem fun except for the DM who likes to say how the world works and shut people down to show it works HIS way?
I'm trying to see the problem the OP is raising - it's like reading a post where someone says "And then a PC pulled out a crossbow and tried to shoot someone with it!". There's no problem there - that's the game!
"Shadow" has more than one possible definition...
It can be a 2 dimensional darkness cast upon a surface by the dragon in flight up above... or it can be the 3 dimensional space between the dragon and the surface below. That entire region between the dragon and the ground would be "cast in shadow". You would be in the shade while within the shadow of the dragon.
Can you step into the shadow of a monster that is cast upon you? Or would you not constitute a solid surface? Would you instead have to turn around and step into the wall behind you?
I would say the entire region between the monster and you/the wall is shadow so I'd allow a monk to step into any space in that region.
Can a monk manage to teleport next to a dragon in flight, strike it, and teleport away before:
A) falling out of the shadow into light, either from the monk's movement, or the dragon's.
B) incurring an OA.
I don't think that would be possible...
Bloodscythe wrote:
jaelis wrote:
Tempest_Stormwind wrote:
jaelis wrote:
ChrisCarlson wrote:
Bloodscythe wrote:
brettlangbdl wrote:
ChrisCarlson wrote:
Bloodscythe wrote:
brettlangbdl wrote:
QwertyAzerty wrote:
jaelis wrote:
Bloodscythe wrote:
jaelis wrote:
Bloodscythe wrote:
jaelis wrote:
Sorry my post got mangled at the end. I meant to add that I could see you were inclined to apply definition 1, but I feel the context of the dim light rules suggests something more like definition 7 ("a place or time of little or no light.") Naturally I think that my reading makes more sense, but I don't have any reason to say yours is wrong.
To be more specific, I think the explaning sentences "An area of dim light is usually a boundary between a source of bright light, such as a torch, and surrounding darkness. The soft light of twilight and dawn also counts as dim light." are meant to clarify what they mean. I don't see them applying to the shadow cast by a horse.
jaelis wrote:
Bloodscythe wrote:
jaelis wrote:
Dude Id let it happen because of rule of cool, This just sounds like such a monk thing to do that I could give inspiration after his first turn duing it to spend in the fight at some point.
One other thing to consider is that if the dragon is more than say, 60-100 feet up...it's going to take the monk more than one round to fall to the ground. A clever dragon would take advantage of a foe who's only able to move in a single line... The dragon may be able to easily come up with a way to get advantage on his attacks or inflict disadvantage on the monk...
Avross wrote:
Read the Ability guys, can shadow step from and to anywhere that is in Darkness or Dim Light.. DONT NEED A SHADOW :P
Bloodscythe wrote:
BRJN wrote:
http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0229.html
Im not a fan of the teleport attack trick...mostly because the next step is for the monk to grapple which is silly.
I also am very uncomfortable with anyone teleporting on top of creatures. Because if i let a pc teleport on top of a dragon without a roll, then a dragon can land on top of a pc without one...or a wizard could teleport a rock on top of you or whatever. Sillyness ensues.
Byakugan01 wrote:
Falling doesn't trigger OAs, I'm pretty sure.
Yes: "For example, you don’t provoke an opportunity attack if an explosion hurls you out of a foe’s reach or if gravity causes you to fall past an enemy."
jaelis wrote:
Coredump00 wrote:
Well how about this! I just has this senario in my last session. I have an 8th level monk and two large green dragons attacked our party at the start of the game session. One of the dragons swas about 40' in the air during daylight.
NOTE: I do not have the Player's Handbook here while writing this post. The rules do state, as mentioned above, that you have only 60' of movement to "shadow jump" and it must be in low light or dark light. No you can not enter into a "darkness" spell when using the Shadow Monk's "shadow jump." My personal interpretation is that your "bending the rules" to try and attack a dragon using a "shadow jump" monk special ability. The dragon may have a shadow on it but it's STILL daylight.
NOTE: I killed the dragon without using my "shadow jump" feature. I was wearing a "Ring of Jumping" I umped up to the dragon and in round 1 was able to successfully grapple the dragon, barely. The GM rulesdI was hanging onto it's neck, but failed at a stun attempt. Round 2, I pulled out my "Immovable Rod" (first time I had used the rod), activated it , and then shoved it in the dragon's mouth. Round 3, the dragon got it's mouth temporarily caught on the rod for a fraction of a second that sent it into a deadly spiral out of control. I was able to hang onto the dragon at it plummeted to the ground, in whoch I successful slid right off the dragon when it crashed (Yes, just like Leoglas did in LOTR). Last round I stunned the dragon! And it never got back up as I flurried it (beat the crap outta of it). No shadow jump for me that time, but I sure do like the Advantage Roll when I shadow Step beside an opponent.
MonkPlayer wrote:
RulesJD wrote:
ChrisCarlson wrote:
It does read to me like a monk can't teleport in or out of a darkness spell, because of the sight requirement. Whether that was the intention I wouldn't know.
RulesJD wrote:
ChrisCarlson wrote:
RulesJD wrote:
ChrisCarlson wrote:
Basicly Shadow Step can teleport 60" in Darkness or dim light.. (Yes, Day light Spell screws him). as long as you can see where you teleporting.. pop! your there, thats why you have DARKVISION..lol
Teleport 60" up. and with the rest of your movement you fall 60".. ;) , Mobility Feat allows you to strike at the flying creature up to 60" up, and yes the dragon was in a cave :P
vamp70 wrote:
It was normal everyday darkness.. if I was using Magical Darkness - would get 2 levels of Warlock for devil-sight ;)
RulesJD wrote:
ChrisCarlson wrote:
RulesJD wrote:
RJD thinks that if you can see the border of space, then you can see the space, and therefore you can teleport to it. This is not completely crazy.
CC thinks that you need to see the volume of a space to see the space. This isn't crazy either.
Myself I would go with CC, since otherwise it wouldn't matter if there was a wall just inside the border of a dark space. I'm pretty sure you are not supposed to be able to teleport through a wall here.
jaelis wrote:
I would allow a monk to step out of magical darkness. They can see the area of darkness from outside of it so as long as they can step into a shadow within 60 ft of the magical darkness, it seems supported by the text.
I would allow a monk to step into magical darkness to teleport to another area of darkness they can see within 60 ft of the magical darkness.
Really, the only restriction I see is a monk can't see out of an area of magical darkness so if inside an area of magical darkness, they're limited to teleporting only within the area of magical darkness to an unoccupied space within the spell's effect.
Scenario:
Let's say it's nighttime. So it's dark out. Definitely dim light at best, so a shadow monk (who currently has darkvision, so he can see just fine) can theoretically <BAMPH!> about willy nilly.
Now let's say he is hit by a colorspray spell, fails his save, and becomes temporarily blinded. Now on his turn can he shadow step? At all? To anywhere?
ChrisCarlson wrote:
Bloodscythe wrote:
ChrisCarlson wrote:
ChrisCarlson wrote:
Says you have to see the space.
jaelis wrote:
Bloodscythe wrote:
Kishri wrote:
jaelis wrote:
Teleporting does indeed get you out of a grapple, and out of handcuffs/ropes/chains/whatever. He still needs the shadow howvever, and the shadow of the creature grappling him is unlikely to be sufficient unless that creature is significantly larger than the monk.