Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 TraigosOde May 19, 2015 7:45:01	How does one calculate the passive perception of a character with the observant feat that is looking through the eyes of a familiar?   Let’s say a wizard has an owl familiar (which has advantage on checks that rely on site) and the observant feat.  When he is looking through the eyes of the familiar what is passive perception score?    For purpose of discussion, let’s say that he has a 13 wisdom, is level 5 and is skilled in perception.   The rules appear to state that it should be 10 (base) + 3 (proficiency) + 5 (observant) + 5(advantage on the sight checks from owl) + 1 (stat bonus) for a result of 24.    RAW seems to support that result.  In terms of RAI, one could argue that Observant was meant to only give advantage on the check but the language was simplified to a +5 bonus and since advantage does not stack the advantage from the owl and the feat don’t stack but if Observant doesn’t stack with advantage in general that is a pretty big blow to the value of the skill.     Here’s the relevant rules I’ve found as references.     Task Difficulty RAW Very easy 5 Easy 10 Medium 15 Hard 20 Very hard 25 Nearly impossible 30   Passive Perception RAW   A passive check is a special kind of ability check that doesn’t involve any die rolls. Such a check can represent the average result for a task done repeatedly, such as searching for secret doors over and over again, or can be used when the DM wants to secretly determine whether the characters succeed at something without rolling dice, such as noticing a hidden monster. Here’s how to determine a character’s total for a passive check:   10 + all modifiers that normally apply to the check   If the character has advantage on the check, add 5. For disadvantage, subtract 5. The game refers to a passive check total as a score.   Find Familiar RAW While your familiar is within 100 feet of you, you can communicate with it telepathically. Additionally, as an action, you can see through your familiar’s eyes and hear what it hears until the start of your next turn, gaining the benefits of any special senses that the familiar has. During this time, you are deaf and blind with regard to your own senses.   Owl Senses RAW Keen Sight. The owl has advantage on Wisdom (Perception) checks that rely on sight.   Observant Feat RAW   You have a +5 bonus to your passive Wisdom (Perception) and passive Intelligence (Investigation) scores.
#2 Bloodscythe May 19, 2015 10:32:49	One could argue that you don't gain the benefits of the observant feat through your familiar since you're "deaf and blind with regard to your own senses."   Where'd you get the Passive Perception RAW?  As far as I knew, passive perception isn't a check at all.  You don't roll dice.  It's more like a DC that opposes a creature's attempt to hide from you, not unlike the DC of spells when a creature has to make a saving throw.  I don't know that RAW supports giving you a +5 to passive perception if you have advantage except in the case of a creature trying to hide from you.  It's more a rule for hiding than a rule.  Passive perception covers more than simply noticing hidden creatures.   I think RAW would limit you to either your passive perception, which gains the observant feat bonus, or your active perception check, which gains advantage because of the owl's special senses.   Of course, the rules might actually limit you to the owl's passive perception and its active perception check.  I don't know the rules for familiars well enough.  Do you use its senses instead of your own?  If so, I'd imagine you use its perception scores, not your own.
#3 Rya.Reisender May 19, 2015 11:50:33	The rules indeed state that advantage means +5 on passive checks. And since observant doesn't say advantage but says +5, it could be interpreted as "was intentionally written so that it stacks with advantage".   But the question really is if observant applies to your familiar's senses too.