Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Daisilodavi Oct 01, 2014 14:22:05	Apologies up front if this has been asked/answered. I tried to search and came up empty. Anyway.... Assassin rogue archetype has assassinate (lvl 3) and death strike (lvl 17). From what I can interpret assassinate is better in all ways and makes death strike completely useless. Assuming the assassin has surprise, he gains advantage on the attack roll since assassinate allows advantage on enemies that haven't acted. So the attack is made, it hits and is an automatic crit (again because of assassinate) which doubles damage. Same situation skipping over assassinate. The rogue attacks a surprised opponent with death strike, there is no advantage on the attack, the damage is still doubled, but the opponent has a chance to Con save to eliminate the double damage. The only way death strike is even useful is if it's effect stacks with assassinate. In that case you have a level 17 rogue with surprise and advantage doing 4d8 +36d6 damage with a rapier and sneak attack damage. An average of 144 damage and a potential max of 248 with one attack. I'm either missing something or death strike is either completely useless or kind of overpowered.
#2 GentlemanLoser Oct 01, 2014 14:24:04	They stack.   You double the Critical damage.
#3 Seraphex Oct 01, 2014 14:44:24	Daisilodavi wrote:
#4 Direach Oct 01, 2014 15:57:56	Successfully surprising and sneak attacking a lich, dragon, or beholder in its lair is harder than it may seem on paper. But if you can do it, you can give him such a pinch!
#5 2Chlorobutanal Oct 01, 2014 17:45:43	Considering that a level 17 Monk (Way of the Open Hand) can cause an enemy to save or be reduced to 0 hp (die), an Assassin causing an enemy to save or take double critical Sneak Attack damage doesn't seem unreasonable.  The Monk version is limited by resources and requires two actions to complete, whereas the Rogue version is limited by circumstance but costs no resources.
#6 Strill Oct 02, 2014 3:33:39	Direach wrote:
(Reply to #6) AaronOfBarbaria	Strill wrote:
#8 Timborama Oct 02, 2014 5:28:03	Spoiler alert: Assassins are really good at assassinating people.   Maybe the target is asleep, maybe it's because of their disguise, or maybe they're hiding in the shadows. But once Turn 1 is over, well, time for the rest of the party to pull their weight   "Alright, I did 250 damage in one round. Barbarian? Wizard? Your turn"   (It's super easy to regulate this as a DM. Throw the assassin a bone every now and then and he'll be happy. Other times the assassin will just be an average rogue, giving someone else a chance to shine. Also, remember that level 17 is when spellcasters gain Wish and Meteor Storm...so...yeah...)
(Reply to #8) AaronOfBarbaria	Timborama wrote:
#10 Xetheral Oct 03, 2014 10:26:35	Daisilodavi wrote: