Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 NN1 Aug 27, 2014 10:19:05	I was wondering if there was any rules on re-trying failed ability checks explicitly in the rules.  While it doesn't seem to ban the practice, the DC 17 strength check to burst rope would mean that rope couldn't reliably hold someone of average strength for more than a minute or two if retries were allowed as an action (heck, an average strength person could burst/slip out of manacles in about 2 minutes).   Personally, I'd make retries DM's discretion as to how often they are allowed and/or what negative consequences of repeated attempts are (straining in vain against ropes could cause injury (damage) and possibly tire you out (exhaustion)).   Still, I'm interested in official rules.  P174 of the PHB states that a failure of an an ability check "means the character or monster makes no progress toward the objective or makes progress combined with a setback determined by the DM," suggesting that the results of failure can cause DM discretion setbacks at least.   Any clearer rules?
#2 alienux Aug 27, 2014 10:44:39	This was addressed in the playtest rules, but I can't remember the exact wording (and I stupidly deleted all of my playtest packets a few weeks ago).   If I remember correctly, the rule essentially said that if it was something that a character could resonably be expected to succeed at eventually, there was no point in making them make check after check until they finally roll high enough, you just let them auto succeed if they want to keep retrying. If something is very unlikely to succeed, or if the failed check makes additinal checks pointless (ie. diving to save a glass vial of liquid that shatters if you don't catch it), then no checks should be redone.   That isn't the exact wording, and I'm sure I'm off a little, but a lot of it would be up to DM discretion. If someone can just continually retry checks, there's not point in even using dice in the first place. This will be covered in the DM Guide when it comes out, and I'm sure it will be covered in the DMDnDBasic pdf document at some point when it gets updated.
#3 KarlB Aug 27, 2014 11:07:53	It really comes down to measuring consequence of failure. For example, scaling a wall would slow your progress if you fail a roll, not have you fall. So you could try again and again, even though you'd fall behind. On the other hand, if you tripped on something and had to roll a fast acrobatics check to stop yourself from falling off the roof, then the consequence of failure would be to fall off the roof. Splat. No reroll possible.   But as someone mentioned above, the only times a skill check should even be necessary is if there's either consequence of failure or a time constraint. If neither is a concern, you pretty much automatically succeed as you can take your sweet time. Please note that if your GM is asking you to roll, it's likely because one or the other is present. So just because your rogue is picking a lock to an empty house in between guard patrols, the DM could decide that after three failed checks, some random drunk passerby might see you and make a fuss about it.   Please note, this sort of thing is bound to be in the DMG as that's a DM call. The Player's Handbook is just there to tell you HOW to roll skill checks, not the why or what.
(Reply to #2) NN1	alienux wrote:
(Reply to #3) NN1	KarlB wrote: