Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 WanderingBard Sep 05, 2015 23:14:03	Do skill checks and/or saves in combat take up an action? I always had skill checks​ in combat take and action, i.e doing an acrobatic stunt, moving an object, spotting a weakness with perception etc. But for saves I always just had it be rolled automatically at the start of the affecteds turn. Because of this I always thought of effects that cause a creature to save to be pretty weak unless it was a stun etc. But I was listening to a stream that talked about how spells that need a save to dispell is good because it forces a monster to use its action to deal with it, possibly saving a low health ally that might of died the next turn. Clarification would be great.
#2 AaronOfBarbaria Sep 05, 2015 23:37:10	Skill checks might or might not take up an action, depending on what is being done - all the uses are detailed in the rules.   Saving throws never take up an action.
#3 Mad_Jack Sep 06, 2015 3:43:49	Some spells might require the target to take some sort of action to end the effect (putting out flames, disbelieving an illusion, etc.) but you don't need to take an action to make a saving throw against a spell that requires one. Spells that require saves to end an effect are good because even if they only last for one turn before the target manages to shrug them off, they've still inconvenienced the target and possibly effectively denied them an action if the spell did something like prevent them from targeting someone (say, if they were blinded), prevent them from attacking (either directly or by dictating who they attack) or kept them from reaching someone to attack them (reduced their speed or knocked them prone)...
#4 Coredump00 Sep 06, 2015 5:39:40	What the PC decides to *do* will either be 'free' or take 'an action' (by action I mean action/bonusaction/reaction).   After that, as the DM you decide if there is any uncertainty in the outcome of what they are doing, and that is what determines if an ability check is needed or not.     As for the stream, I am assuming they were refering to specific spells that require the player to use their action to (fill in blank) which means they can take another saving throw.  Or the spells that allow for another save at the end of a turn. But neither making a saving throw, nor taking an ability check, requires the use of an action.
#5 iserith Sep 06, 2015 7:53:56	Right, it's the fictional act of doing a thing that may or may not take up an action during combat. A character doesn't make ability checks or saving throws - the character just does things with or without an uncertain outcome. In the latter case, the DM calls for an ability check or saving throw.    Examples of things in combat that might take up an action mechanically are making a melee or ranged attack, casting most spells, hustling beyond your regular speed, making a tactical withdrawal, focusing on avoiding being hit, assisting someone else, hiding, preparing to do a thing on a contingency, trying to find someone or something that is hidden, interacting with something in a somewhat complex manner. If what a player describes what his or her character is doing is at least as complex or time-consuming as these examples, then it's reasonable to say it takes up an action.   Question: Are your players asking to make ability checks during play? Or are they just describing what they want to do?
#6 Yunru Sep 06, 2015 10:48:02	*Ahem* Otto's Irresistable Dance. That is all.
#7 iserith Sep 06, 2015 11:30:51	Yunru wrote:
#8 Yunru Sep 06, 2015 13:35:46	Which requires an action. My point, for those who haven't caught on, it that although saving throws dont take an action, some effects require you to use an action to have a saving throw.
#9 iserith Sep 06, 2015 13:46:07	Yunru wrote:
#10 Nevvur Sep 07, 2015 2:01:29	This thread got me curious, so I did a little poring over the PHB. I might have missed some, but the effects of the following spells can be overcome by successfully using your action: Ensnaring Strike, Entangle, Force Cage (sort of), Maze, Otiluke's Freezing Sphere (sort of), Otto's Irresistible Twerk (wait...), Web.   Pretty much all other crowd control type spells allow for a saving throw (no action) to end the effect, or last until the duration/concentration ends.
#11 WanderingBard Sep 07, 2015 12:10:16	The stream was Orc Labs Podcast 39 – Talking with Treantmonk! 5E Wizards I wasan't listening in too carefully, but I do remember that the example they gave was casting minor illusion to create a box on your low health ally so the enemy would either have to attack with a disadvantage to finish him off or take a action to see through the illusion potentially saving the low health party member. That part confused me
#12 Mad_Jack Sep 07, 2015 17:26:12	That's a function of the minor illusion cantrip (and most other illusions that don't require a target) - you don't actually make a save for that spell... Unless you physically interact with the illusion and thus reveal it's nature (in their example the attack being the interaction, which is why they''d have a penalty to hit), you have to spend an action to make an Intelligence check vs the caster's spell save DC in order to disbelieve it. It's not technically a saving throw, although it does function somewhat like one.