Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Danny_Montanny Jun 03, 2015 19:29:45	This may be an old question, but I think it's pertinent to the upcoming Encounters season.   Skulker states that you may attempt to hide when lightly obscured from a creature. Dim light creates an area that's lightly obscured. Darkvision says, in darkness you see as if it were dim light.   You're lightly obscured in the dark from creatures with Darkvision. So you can try to hide right in front of the creature if you had this feat?
#2 jaelis Jun 03, 2015 19:31:59	Sounds right to me. Unless of course the creature also has a light source.
#3 mrpopstar Jun 03, 2015 20:31:07	Danny_Montanny wrote:
#4 lawrencehoy Jun 04, 2015 23:34:13	mrpopstar wrote:
#5 Danny_Montanny Jun 04, 2015 4:08:49	Any darkness beyond their range of vision is dark, any within is dim. Any dim light beyond their range is dim, any within is bright. So if there are no light sources, which is a horrible idea in the Underdark, a Skulker with Darkvision will have a great advantage when sneaking around, because they could essentially sneak around in the open. Not to mention, not taking disadvantage on finding traps like anyone else with Darkvision would without a light source.
#6 Noctaem Jun 04, 2015 4:13:33	Darkvision 60 feet turns any dim light within 60 feet into bright light.  Any dim light outside of 60 feet remains dim light.   Darkvision 60 feet turns any darkness within 60 feet into dim light.  Any darkness outside of 60 feet remains darkness.   So to answer the question of the OP.  If a creature has darkvision and is looking into an area of darkness within 60 feet, the skulker is still hidden, since he can hide in dim light as per the feat.  However, if the skulker was using dim light within 60 feet, he is no longer hidden, since the creature with darkvision is treating dim light as bright light within that range.     hope this helps.
#7 mrpopstar Jun 04, 2015 5:21:11	lawrencehoy wrote:
#8 Danny_Montanny Jun 04, 2015 5:24:13	Assuming a Skulker Rogue with Darkvision and no light sources attacking a target within their vision range: in melee they could start out hidden, sneak up out in the open, attack with advantage (sneak attack), hide as a bonus action, then move away and the OA will have disadvantage (assuming successfully hidden). At range they could start hidden anywhere out in the open, attack with advantage (sneak attack), then hide or if they missed could use their bonus action for any of their other Cunning Actions because they're still hidden.   Of course this is only against creatures with Darkvision and not some other extraordinary senses.
#9 jaelis Jun 04, 2015 5:57:36	Danny_Montanny wrote:
#10 Noctaem Jun 04, 2015 6:08:57	jaelis wrote:
#11 jaelis Jun 04, 2015 6:26:45	Well I suppose the wood elf can pull exactly the same trick as the skulker rogue in natural darkness, which isn't so uncommon.
#12 OoftaMeg Jun 04, 2015 7:18:50	Now if my dwarven rogue can only convince the rest of his party to stop carrying those silly light sources so the skulker feat would be worh while.     Interesting discussion though.  Also gives an in-world explanation of why creatures that have darkvision may still want dim light with them.
(Reply to #12) Danny_Montanny	OoftaMeg wrote:
#14 Noctaem Jun 04, 2015 7:34:37	jaelis wrote:
#15 mellored Jun 04, 2015 7:36:22	Both wood elves and skulker can hide in foliage, heavy rain, falling snow, and mist. But skulker also get's dim light.
#16 mellored Jun 04, 2015 7:38:17	Actually, i could see arguments that dim light is natrual.   It's not manufactured and it's not magical.     Though, i would disagree.
#17 jaelis Jun 04, 2015 7:39:54	I don't know what you mean by "simple darkness." But a dim light from a natural source is sufficient. JCrawford wrote:
#18 Noctaem Jun 04, 2015 7:41:49	mellored wrote:
#19 mrpopstar Jun 04, 2015 7:50:53	jaelis wrote:
#20 mellored Jun 04, 2015 7:53:38	So...   being in a cave is naturally dark but being in a mausoleum is unnatraully dark?
#21 Noctaem Jun 04, 2015 7:57:49	It comes down to if you consider the dim light produced by a torch or lantern, which are man made items that require they be lit by something, or dim light produced by non-natural constructions like a building or mausoleum (as mellored brings up) to be natural phenomena.  I personally don't in my day to day.  Apparently though the intent appears to be that any dim light created by means that are not magical is considered natural phenomena by 5e.  Welp, Wood elves are even more awesome than I previously thought.
#22 jaelis Jun 04, 2015 8:00:24	JC's response says that dim light created by a torch or lantern is not natural. The dim light of dusk (or a bright moon) would presumably be natural. I'd call dim light from phosphorescent fungi natural.   But darkness is trickier. Surely outdoors on a dark night is natural, but in a building maybe isn't? But what if it is night outside? And anyway it's not like the dim light here comes from the darkness, it comes from the darkvision, I guess the question is, is darkvision natural or or not?
#23 Noctaem Jun 04, 2015 8:05:39	jaelis wrote:
#24 jaelis Jun 04, 2015 8:08:22	Yes, I would say that a wood elf cannot hide in dim light resulting from sunlight peeping through the cracks of a building. That would not be "natural."   But of course a wood elf could hide in darkness inside a light-tight building... any creature can hide in darkness, natural or not.   Now can the wood elf hide from a creature with darkvision in that dark building? Not sure why it should matter if it is a building or a natural cave, surely darkness is darkness.
#25 lawrencehoy Jun 04, 2015 23:33:52	Danny_Montanny wrote:
#26 Noctaem Jun 05, 2015 5:13:01	[quote="lawrencehoy"]   Danny_Montanny wrote: