Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Zamzoph Apr 19, 2015 18:01:39	While making a rogue for my first 5e campaign, I was considering the usefulness of throwing daggers when I noticed something peculiar.  If my underrstanding is correct, it seems to me that there's little difference between throwing a dagger and throwing a shortsword as an improvised  weapon (PHB p. 147), so I wanted to pass by my thoughts here so that you guys can let me know whether or not I'm missing something in my analysis.   Consider a 1st level rogue with 12 Strength and 16 Dexterity.  The rogue notably starts with proficiency in both daggers and shortswords.   If the rogue throws a +1 magic dagger at a creature, the bonuses are calculated as follows: Attack Bonus:  2 (proficiency) + 3 (Dex, finesse) + 1 (magic) = +6 TOTAL Damage Bonus:  1d4 (dagger) + 3 (Dex, finesse) + 1 (magic) = 1d4+4 TOTAL Damage Type:  piercing (dagger) Range:  20 / 60 (dagger) Now if the rogue throws a +1 magic shortsword as an improvised weapon since it lacks the thrown property, the bonuses are calculated remarkebly similar: Attack Bonus:  2 (proficiency) + 3 (Dex, finesse) + 1 (magic) = +6 TOTAL Damage Bonus:  1d4 (improvised weapon) + 3 (Dex, finesse) + 1 (magic) = 1d4+4 TOTAL Damage Type:  DM discretion (improvised weapon) Range 20 / 60 (improvised weapon) In fact, the only real downside (besides the consideration of how much money is being thrown around) is the incompatibility between throwing a shortsword and two-weapon fighting (PHB p.195).  The shortsword lacks the thrown property, so I explicitly cannot throw a shortsword as the Attack action and  then use the weapon in the other hand as the bonus action, nor can I throw a shortsword as the bonus action.   So does my analysis here look correct?  Or does profiency, the finesse property, and/or magic not count when throwing a shortsword as an improvised weapon?  If something's  incorrect, what should the numbers really look like?   Judging by the rules for magic weapons (DMG p. 213), I think its wording is pretty clear that the magic bonus applies even if the weapon is being used in an improvised manner:   "You have a bonus to attack and damage rolls made with this magic weapon.  The bonus is determined by the weapon's rarity."
#2 jaelis Apr 19, 2015 18:31:49	You don't get prof bonus for improvised weapons.
#3 mellored Apr 19, 2015 18:33:40	you are not proficent in improvised weapons. unless you take the tavern brawler feat, in which case, go ahead.
#4 Zamzoph Apr 19, 2015 18:36:28	Would I still get to use the Dexterity modifier via the finesse property, or would I be forced to use the Strength modifier?
#5 mellored Apr 19, 2015 19:12:39	DM's call.
#6 cowleymen Apr 19, 2015 22:56:36	I would not let you throw a shortsword on dex. Improvised weapons use the most sensebile stat. Short swords arent balanced for throwing, and way quite a bit. A hand axe ways about the same as a shortsword, and I believe those to be light thrown, but no fienesse on them. So Str in my game for throwing shortswords.    A little bit of follow up, I would let small items that you can pretty much fit in one hand as a dex. improvised throwing weapons. So things like plates, silverware, cups, candlesticks, small work tools, table decorations/center pieces.