DiasExMachina to release NeuroSpasta - GSL Cyberpunk

Post/Author/DateTimePost
#1

SerenaDawn

Jan 01, 2009 21:54:22
DIAS EX MACHINA TO RELEASE GSL COMPLIANT CYBERPUNK IN 2009

In 2009, Dias Ex Machina will begin to develop and release non-fantasy role playing games which will be 4th Edition compatible and 100% GSL compliant. These games will be developed from a similar baseline and will not only be compatible with each other, but also with Amethyst and most other GSL products.


IMAGE(http://www.diasexmachina.com/NeuroSpasta.jpg)

“Everything can be Manipulated”



In the near future, after growing pressure from charter countries, the United Nations shifted their headquarters from New York to a sovereign, self-governing floating city-state between Qatar and Bahrain. It was designated the Special Administrative Municipal Autonomous Zone and christened “Archon” by official mandate. Eventually it went by another name: “Nowhere”. It was built from the ground up as a shining example of the potential and progress humanity had hoped to achieve. It was to be a beacon of peace in a world plagued by conflicts triggered by ethnic violence and starving resources.

The dream faded quickly as Archon became a powder keg, a political microcosm that reflected the hostilities of the rest of the world. Not only did the city have to defend its residents from themselves, but also from terrorists seeking to break apart the new world order. To ensure peace in the city, a counter-terrorism unit was formed to specifically deal with external and internal threats to national security, the Division of Public Safety. The DPS was granted power under the Special Executive Authority, a UN appointed position dealing with threats to state health. They had no oversight and were given jurisdiction over the entire state, including the UN General Assembly building and the more than 200 embassies contained in the city’s borders.

Archon’s unique feature is its parallel reality. It is the first city existing both in a physical world and in a virtual one—two realities which occupy the same space. One might question what’s truly genuine and what’s an illusion. In this city, as is in most of the world, everyone is connected 24/7 to a digital network where part of their memory rests in cyberspace, where your thoughts and even your reality can be modified. Those who defend the city must do so in both worlds. These threats are not data pirates plugging themselves into terminals but individuals that could take control of human thought, hack directly into people's brains, altering their actions, what they see, and even aspects of their personality. As the world balances on the edge of chaos, all eyes have turned to one city to guide the way.

NeuroSpasta is a new role playing game directly inspired by the new generation of cyberpunk, dealing with the issues of perceived reality and concepts of self-identity in a growing environment prone to anarchy. It deals with political tensions, international espionage, terrorism, and cybercrime. “I feel the genre has made some real leaps since Sterling and Gibson paved the first few steps,” says game designer Chris Dias. “NeuroSpasta takes encouragement from these contemporary examples like The Matrix and Ghost in the Shell along with inspiration from the Bourne films and “24” while also trying to offer an original vision people will find interesting. We wanted to every idea to make sense—to make it a believable setting by rooting with a lot of modern concerns dealing with international relations, ethic violence, and the growing globalization.”

In NeuroSpasta, players will be able to create not only traditional physical characters but virtual ones as well--imitation or real personalities that can interact with the outside world. Characters will not only be able to fire weapons and blow up cars but also “hack” opponents on the fly, altering their senses, even killing them. There will be vehicle combat, power armor, robots, dozens of weapons and a full spectrum of cybernetics.

NeuroSpasta will be 100% GSL compliant and fully compatible with many other 4th Edition books, including Amethyst. It has no distributor so NeuroSpasta is currently destined for PDF and POD but Dias Ex Machina knows the end result will match the gloss and finish of their other projects.

There is no confirmed release date for NeuroSpasta but DEM aims to have it completed for the late fall.


Dias Ex Machina received critical acclaim and fan-support for its Amethyst role-playing game, being awarded an Honourable Mention at the 2008 Ennies for best setting. Upon announcement of the 4th Edition update to Amethyst, response was universally positive, eventually leading to it being picked up and distributed by Goodman Games for release this spring.
#2

Cyber-Dave

Jan 01, 2009 22:48:21
Oh, my, god... I just creamed my pants... No, I mean seriously... I was excited about Amethyst. I am ecstatic about this!
#3

GMforPowergamers

Jan 01, 2009 22:52:47
#4

farmer42_dup

Jan 01, 2009 23:39:18
I...Wow. Just, wow. Sweet. Amazing. With pasta. And I repeat CD, I think I need new pants.
#5

Nylanfs

Jan 02, 2009 5:17:16
Hmm, this will be interesting to see how the limits of the "no redefining of core items" clause of the GSL are worked around.

I'll might still buy it, but will probably stick with SR for my cyberpunk fix.
#6

Cyber-Dave

Jan 02, 2009 9:25:47
Hmm, this will be interesting to see how the limits of the "no redefining of core items" clause of the GSL are worked around.

I'll might still buy it, but will probably stick with SR for my cyberpunk fix.

Man, I hate Shadowrun SO much... SO much. Its not even cyberpunk. I mean, the pillars of the cyberpunk genre hate the game. Well, at least the pillar... Gibson has nothing good to say about Shadowrun, and I fully side with his comments about the game. Gag me with a spoon.

Anyways, I don't see why the GSL would be so hard to work around. The GSL basically says you can not change the core mechanics of the system. But, all this project would require are some new classes and probably a new skill or two (computer use comes to mind)... that doesn't redefine any core items. Its purely addition. The rest of the mechanics (skill checks, attack rolls, hit points, etc) can continue to work as per normal rules.
#7

kythri

Jan 02, 2009 21:26:08
Man, I hate Shadowrun SO much... SO much. Its not even cyberpunk. I mean, the pillars of the cyberpunk genre hate the game. Well, at least the pillar... Gibson has nothing good to say about Shadowrun, and I fully side with his comments about the game. Gag me with a spoon.

Gibson doesn't like fantasy. He especially doesn't like fantasy mixed with cyberpunk. That's fine. Gibson's new stuff sucks, anyhow, so he's a leaning pillar, if anything.

Shadowrun is like Reese's Peanut Butter Cups - Weisman was the genius who put the two together and did it well.

I love the ties between Earthdawn and Shadowrun, too. Great stuff.
#8

Cyber-Dave

Jan 02, 2009 22:29:36
Gibson doesn't like fantasy. He especially doesn't like fantasy mixed with cyberpunk. That's fine. Gibson's new stuff sucks, anyhow, so he's a leaning pillar, if anything.

Um, actually, his second last book was one of his best. Neuromancer and Pattern Recognition are pretty much the best two. He's not leaning nothing... Hell, he could never write another good cyberpunk novel again and he would still be the most important name to the genre. Without Gibson the genre would not even exist.

Shadowrun is like Reese's Peanut Butter Cups - Weisman was the genius who put the two together and did it well.

Its funny. I love Reese's Peanut Butter Cups... I just can't give even the slightest shred or iota of respect to Shadowrun. Each their own I guess. I just really don't like that setting. I think maybe its because it was the first sci-fantasy I ever came into contact with, and for a long time I really didn't like sci-fantasies (even though now I do). I just can't shake my first impression of that setting, no matter how hard I try.
#9

SerenaDawn

Jan 03, 2009 0:14:11
I think we're getting off topic, which is how awesome this ideas is. :D

Seriously...You guys (and gals...okay guys) have been supportive of DEM since the beginning. Since NeuroSpasta is currently without a larger publisher, we'll need all the support you guys can offer. Pass the word. And yes, we will be seeking playtesters eventually.
#10

Cyber-Dave

Jan 03, 2009 0:27:01
I've already posted an advertisement for this over on the d20 Modern boards. :P

I know its a product I will be buying.
#11

MrCelsius

Jan 03, 2009 2:23:40
I think we're getting off topic, which is how awesome this ideas is. :D

Seriously...You guys (and gals...okay guys) have been supportive of DEM since the beginning. Since NeuroSpasta is currently without a larger publisher, we'll need all the support you guys can offer. Pass the word. And yes, we will be seeking playtesters eventually.

I dunno you folk (Mongoose scared me away from third-party developers in 3e), but you had me at '4th ed cyberpunk'. I love 4e, and I've always wanted to play a cyberpunk game. I look forward to the intricate character potential of having differing virtual and real-world personas1.

That said, and forgive the slight off-topic, but... did you just amend your phrasing to be gender-inclusive... then retract that amendment? I'm not furious or anything, mind, more... bemused. It seems an odd PR move.


__
1 Am I the only one who digs hard on the idea of playing a pen-and-paper persona who plays a virtual persona? I've always been drawn to the potential of playing characters with assumed identities (beyond simply running a con or sneaking into a castle), and now I may have an outlet beyond 'changeling wizard'. :D
#12

SerenaDawn

Jan 03, 2009 3:03:22
That said, and forgive the slight off-topic, but... did you just amend your phrasing to be gender-inclusive... then retract that amendment? I'm not furious or anything, mind, more... bemused. It seems an odd PR move.

Well, I guess you would have to know my odd sense of humor. Besides, those who know me, and know Amethyst, know how respectful it is about gender. A review posted by a female gamer wrote the following about Amethyst:

"Finally, while I can't say I speak for all female roleplayers, I can say that personally I appreciate the designers' attention to little romantic details such as cultural marriage ceremonies, and relationships between fey and non-fey. While male roleplayers might balk at the idea of roleplaying a romance, I have to say that it's something I think is lacking in roleplaying in general. After all, what great fantasy novel doesn't include a romance?"

Besides, I was only reffering to the loyal posters here, also common posters on the Amethyst thread. If one is a female, please step forward so I may shudder in unctrollable bashfullness.
#13

Quintarius

Jan 03, 2009 11:26:08
Wow!
After i read the title "4th Edition Cyberpunk"
I wanted to ask "Does it have Cyberspace like Shadowrun?" then i saw that it's basicaly AROUND Cyberspace i "creamed my pants" so to speak ^_^

But what i would really like to know with that is:
Shadowrun could only be played ether in normal space XOR in Cyberspace, many of my co-players hated cyberspace play because as a "normal space player" you had to sit around and wait till the hacker did thier job.
The 4th Edition of Shadowrun is better in this way but not perfekt.

How does NeuroSpasta solve this problem?
(As I love Cyberspace/battle combined with ReallifeBattle and would like my co-players to love it too)
So two question arise:
How fluid will the combat be if you have a "hacker" type of character and a few "fighter"-likes?

Is it possible to play characters without any cybernetics so they won't be affected by the cyberworld (and rendering hackers useless against them)?
#14

ieattrollsforbreakfast

Jan 03, 2009 17:08:00
Very, very interesting.
I was looking forward to Amethyst, but this might be even closer to the type of game I'd like to run.

Here's hoping there are a new set of classes to supplement Amethyst's Techans!
#15

SerenaDawn

Jan 03, 2009 20:31:36
Thanks all of you...we need support like this

Quintarius: I may dash your hopes and if I do, I will be quite put out.

By the time of the game's setting, no one bothers with cell phones or blackberries. Everything is done via wireless neural interface. People surf the net as they drive to work, as they stand in the shower, with no ports sticking out of their necks. Hackers, or Manipulators as we call them, can hack virtually anyone or anything in the encounter or beyond and do it as fast as other players fire their guns. We are currently not envisioning a GUI for hacking. In fact, nearly every idea glorified with Cyberpunk starting with Neuromancer and ending with RTGs amazing 2020 game is not being used at all. We are trying something new. So no surfing cyberspace virtually--you move from domain to domain. And everyone can enter the virtual world...just some people are better in it than others.

Oh and cybernetics are not the only way to improve your character. We have genetic modification via viral therapy and good old-fashioned hard work.

But, yeah, nearly everyone in the setting can be hacked. Everyone has Firewalls. People can turn off outside access but this is not foolproof. You can go without any implants, even Neural-Net access, but that means being unable to enter any virtual environements and in this city, that could get boring. So although it is not as common elsewhere in the world, in this place, you don't go without it...

Still a work in progress....
#16

SerenaDawn

Jan 04, 2009 21:15:30
It would be important to point out that to call ourselves 4ed Cyberpunk may infringe on RTG's Cyberpunk game, a publication I personally love and have played more than any other game. So it would be more specific to call us GSL Cyberpunk than 4th Edition Cyberpunk to avoid confusion.
#17

Nylanfs

Jan 05, 2009 17:11:15
As long as it was being used in the description of the game and not in the actual title of the source and you weren't attempting to make any type of confusion between RTG's and your product then you should be fine as it was. But IANAL, and they tend to err on the side of caution.
#18

cnath

Jan 05, 2009 17:11:20
Yow!! To say that this looks amazing is an understatement!! Very much looking forward to further developments.
#19

SerenaDawn

Jan 05, 2009 19:55:00
Well, I have more RTG products than I think any other company and they were supportive when I made my Necropolis, Conestoga, and Alien-FUZION games back on the free site. I like Pondsmith and I wanted to cover my base in case there was any confusion.

By the way, you are right, it was not part of the title. Its just Neurospasta. The secondary title would be:

Counterterrorism * Cyberpunk * Espionage.

And thanks Cnath...
#20

Cpt_Micha

Jan 06, 2009 8:30:02
Wow... I want this so bad.
#21

Quintarius

Jan 07, 2009 2:14:28
@Serena:
Feature question:
- Will there be a full immersion VR?
(So maybe full Cyber-combat?)
- will there also be new Monsters or how could we include MM1 Monsters in the setting?

- May we ask more questions regarding playmechanics/setting? *G*
#22

SerenaDawn

Jan 07, 2009 20:34:25
Since every single character, as well as resident, in the city has a Neural Net Interface; everyone can access the VR Network. Not only that, the city also has a holographic grid which allows virtual characters and environments to be generated in the real world...like being in a cafe where half the customers are actually holographs "phoning" in from another location. These are some of our current ideas. Hackers can "telepresense" themselves into locations and hack available machinery they see for their benefit.

Since this setting is attempting to be realistic, we are avoiding anything paranormal, including monsters and aliens, though we will have an enemy chapter with robots, powered armor, and various mercenaries and terrorists. That being said, as a GSL game, every class and monster from WOTC's publications will be compatible. So you can pick-and-mix what you like. Amethyst is the same way.

And ask away...there is a long road ahead of us and I may not have all the answers just yet, but I will endeavor to try...
#23

Quintarius

Jan 08, 2009 10:45:24
Hmmm
I think new Weapons are a given. Will they be realistic, fantasy and/or named liek Originals? (Don't think thats possible ^^')

How many Classe swill there be? Any Hints what will be there?

Can Hologram and RealPerson fight against eachother? (and then Hologram against Hologram? *G*)

Vehicles? If yes, what?


Hm I think ther ewill come more questions, but thats it for today ^^
#24

SerenaDawn

Jan 10, 2009 0:16:10
Hmmm
I think new Weapons are a given. Will they be realistic, fantasy and/or named liek Originals? (Don't think thats possible ^^')

How many Classe swill there be? Any Hints what will be there?
Can Hologram and RealPerson fight against eachother? (and then Hologram against Hologram? *G*)
Vehicles? If yes, what?
Hm I think ther ewill come more questions, but thats it for today ^^

Most of the lower tech weapons from Amethyst will be carried over along with a few new ones. The same goes for armor. We can't use name brands, of course and a few new companies will be added. Expect a few weapons to be inspired from my work on GITS.

As for classes...we are going to trying something new no one has done before. Keep in touch for that. We are hoping to have more class options than Amethyst or even the PHB but not take as much space.

We want to make certain people understand you are not playing Holograms but more digital personalities or characters that can adjust their presence without having to physically move. Holographic imagery is part of the concept but you are not playing Arnold Rimmer from Red Dwarf.

....And we're still working on it. At the moment, we are researching the setting...not the rules. The United Nations are a big subject.

Yes there will be vehicles. No, we have no idea what we will be offering just yet.
#25

Quintarius

Jan 10, 2009 4:41:45
What doyou mean with your work on GITS? (I think you mean Ghost in the Shell)
#26

Cyber-Dave

Jan 10, 2009 13:59:17
He does.
#27

SerenaDawn

Jan 10, 2009 15:05:41
I do
#28

Quintarius

Jan 10, 2009 21:50:00
lol,
Ok HOW did you work with it?
Now I'm curious (as it's one of my fav movies)
#29

Cyber-Dave

Jan 10, 2009 22:19:05
I am 99.9% certain he worked on the game, not the movie.
#30

Quintarius

Jan 11, 2009 5:53:57
Hehe, yea possible, I have to look on DiasEx to eeit I guess ^^'
#31

farmer42_dup

Jan 11, 2009 6:24:54
So...the burning question. Will the game have AKA47's? Because that would probably be the greatest triumph in geek easter egg history.
#32

SerenaDawn

Jan 11, 2009 12:55:49
We are aiming (cough) to avoid specific brands of weapons except for additional designs we plan to introduce based on current advances in firearm technology. So expect ideas based on the G11 C&C the P90 and so forth. Expect caseless, electronically stacked projectiles, gauss weapons, etc. There are basic firearms but we probably won't name the AK-47 specifically. You can just use the stats and just call it that. We won't stop you.

And no...I have never been hired by Bandai, Shirow, Production IG or Manga....although I did write the pilot episode of CG cartoon made in England a few years back.
#33

farmer42_dup

Jan 11, 2009 22:06:01
We are aiming (cough) to avoid specific brands of weapons except for additional designs we plan to introduce based on current advances in firearm technology. So expect ideas based on the G11 C&C the P90 and so forth. Expect caseless, electronically stacked projectiles, gauss weapons, etc. There are basic firearms but we probably won't name the AK-47 specifically. You can just use the stats and just call it that. We won't stop you.

And no...I have never been hired by Bandai, Shirow, Production IG or Manga....although I did write the pilot episode of CG cartoon made in England a few years back.

I was actually referencing tvtropes. The AKA-47 is the name given to just what you plan on doing, where it's totally, seriously, not possibly related to a weapon whose license you don't possess that looks surprisingly similar.
#34

SerenaDawn

Jan 12, 2009 0:51:41
Holy hell, I didn't even SEE what you were doing there. AKA-47. HA. That's pretty smart. Shows you how well I pay attention sometimes. The great thing about setting a story 60 years in the future rather than 10 or 15 or even 30 is that most of what we accept will no longer exist. The only thing you can't change is us...
#35

Cyber-Dave

Jan 12, 2009 3:06:48
As men (or rather Women) smarter then me have said; technological solutions alone or in the main cannot solve political problems, and the costs of such attempts are too high: not only do such solutions fail but their implementation also generalizes paranoia.--Wendy Hui Kyong Chun
#36

Zontar

Jan 14, 2009 20:30:07
SerenaDawn, why "NeuroSpasta"?

Sergio :-)
#37

SerenaDawn

Jan 15, 2009 14:20:44
Good question. It was asked on ENworld as well. It does require a little bit of research but our tagline should be a hint. Any guesses?
#38

Zontar

Jan 15, 2009 20:46:02
Good question. It was asked on ENworld as well. It does require a little bit of research but our tagline should be a hint. Any guesses?

From Wikipedia:

The Greek word usually translated as "puppets" is neurospasta, which literally means "string-pulling", from nervus, meaning either sinew, tendon, muscle, string, or wire, and span, to pull. Aristotle referenced pulling strings to control heads, hands and eyes, shoulders and legs.

Sergio :-)
#39

SerenaDawn

Jan 27, 2009 2:32:41
Oh, and you're right, by the way.

Told you, it was easy.
#40

Nylanfs

Feb 04, 2009 5:10:10
Serena, I just read "Lady of Mazes" by Karl Schroeder. Sounds almost exactly how Neurospasta would be. Any influence?
#41

JohnLynch

Feb 04, 2009 7:33:08
This setting looks extremely interesting as well SerenaDawn.

A few questions/comments.

Nowhere appears to be quite similar to what I've heard about Sigil in that its a city full of people from different lands with plenty of politics and intrigue. Was it an inspiration or just two separate settings exploring similar themes and ideas?

Also with this being PDF/PoD only (at least for now. I won't be surprised if Goodman Games offers to publish it if Amethyst sells well), what will be required to play it? Will players have to have access to the book so they can build virtual and physical versions of the characters and get custom rules for playing the game? Or will DMs be able to buy it and run it without his players knowing much about the setting?

I'm guessing with such things as genetic modification via viral therapy players will have to get the book. But I thought I'd ask anyway.

those who know me, and know Amethyst, know how respectful it is about gender.

Plus with a name like SerenaDawn, lots of people are likely to think you're female ;)

:P

It would be important to point out that to call ourselves 4ed Cyberpunk may infringe on RTG's Cyberpunk game, a publication I personally love and have played more than any other game. So it would be more specific to call us GSL Cyberpunk than 4th Edition Cyberpunk to avoid confusion.

They've trademarked a genre?

Since this setting is attempting to be realistic, we are avoiding anything paranormal, including monsters and aliens, though we will have an enemy chapter with robots, powered armor, and various mercenaries and terrorists.

A workable alternative is that people's virtual/holographic avatar aren't representative of who they are or what they're doing. So while your physical body might be fighting other humans, what you actually see is yourself as a dragonborn wizard fighting a group of orcs. Or while you might be standing still, what you actually see is yourself as a dragonborn wizard fighting a group of orcs.
#42

SerenaDawn

Feb 04, 2009 22:39:21
Thank the maker for Wikipedia. I hadn't heard of either of those, Sigil or Lady of Mazes. Never played Planescape. So no, there was no influence there. Ghost in the Shell and my own cyberpunk game, Necropolis, were the primary influences.

Some people have picked up were Serena Dawn comes from. it is not about gender. It's a very very old sci-fi gaming refference.

They haven't copyrighted a genre, but there may be isses with us reffering to our game as 4th Edition Cyberpunk specifically.

As for the game, it is GSL, so you need at least the PHB and maybe the DMG. Obviously, the MM would not be required unless you are creating an urban fantasy homebrew with it.

We are keeping NeuroSpasta under tight wraps for now and will release more information after Amethyst hits the shelves...
#43

JohnLynch

Feb 04, 2009 23:13:36
As for the game, it is GSL, so you need at least the PHB and maybe the DMG.

I meant will players require the NeuroSpasta book or can they get away with not getting it and only the DM having it (less people have to buy, more likely people will be to play the game. Although the less people have to buy the less money you get ;)).

We are keeping NeuroSpasta under tight wraps for now and will release more information after Amethyst hits the shelves...

Fair enough, I'll keep an eye out for your posts
#44

Cyber-Dave

Feb 04, 2009 23:16:29
Why can't Amethyst be released already? I want to buy the book already.

For the first time ever, I find myself looking forward more to a 3rd party supplement than any core product currently on the release schedule.
#45

Quintarius

Feb 05, 2009 0:39:48
I think itS still some kind in development as far as I can tell ^^'
But yes, I find myself wanting this 3rd PArty D&D4 pseudo-Shadowrun very likeable.
I love the new SR-version but i don't really like the system. With NeuroSpasta I think two of my fav things would be combined ^^
#46

SerenaDawn

Feb 06, 2009 8:17:06
I think itS still some kind in development as far as I can tell ^^'
But yes, I find myself wanting this 3rd PArty D&D4 pseudo-Shadowrun very likeable.
I love the new SR-version but i don't really like the system. With NeuroSpasta I think two of my fav things would be combined ^^

I think I should point out that given our current state of development, we are not aiming for the game to be 100% compatible with 4ed Edition D&D. I know that seems a weird thing to say with us being GSL-compliant but GSL compliance does not have to make a game D&D comaptible. As it stands, we are adding and removing several D&D staples that will require certain homebrew rules to adapt to be compatible. Just as D20 Modern requires a little effort, so will NeuroSpasta. We needed to honor the intent of our game, not the possibility of its compatibility of other games. I just wanted to give a heads up for those hoping to homebrew a 4th ED SR game.
#47

Cyber-Dave

Feb 06, 2009 18:01:13
I think I should point out that given our current state of development, we are not aiming for the game to be 100% compatible with 4ed Edition D&D. I know that seems a weird thing to say with us being GSL-compliant but GSL compliance does not have to make a game D&D comaptible. As it stands, we are adding and removing several D&D staples that will require certain homebrew rules to adapt to be compatible. Just as D20 Modern requires a little effort, so will NeuroSpasta. We needed to honor the intent of our game, not the possibility of its compatibility of other games. I just wanted to give a heads up for those hoping to homebrew a 4th ED SR game.

Wow. You just made me a very happy man!
#48

Quintarius

Feb 07, 2009 8:01:50
Serena, could you clarify for the sake of curiousity what rules will be "homebrewed"?
#49

SerenaDawn

Feb 07, 2009 9:42:17
Serena, could you clarify for the sake of curiousity what rules will be "homebrewed"?

I have always had issues with the term "homebrew"-- it always feels ametuerish. There are certain elements of D&D 4th ED which are being "ignored" and certain new rules which are being added. It is WAY too early in our development to go into details on the hard rules which are being added as none of them have been tested yet, though I will say one of those rules is a hardness/armor-piercing system to defense and attack. Once again, let me stress, it's too early to say specifics or to depend on what I said as fact and a sign of the future.
#50

Quintarius

Feb 08, 2009 5:31:30
I'm way to curious to let that stand but fornow i haveto ;)

But, will there be something like: "If you want to play NeuroSpasta you should think about leaving the complete arcane and divine power-source out"?
#51

SerenaDawn

Feb 09, 2009 0:21:07
We don't even need to say that. Like with Amethyst, our wording is very specific: "These are the available classes in the canon setting" and "these are the available races in the canon setting". We use that same wording for languages and monsters. With monsters, we have "canon monsters" and "non-canon but not game breaking" and we have "non-canon". People who buy the game can do what they wish, so we simply state what is in the official setting and let the respective DMs do the rest.

NeuroSpasta would use similar wording. We are still fielding the possibility that making the game 100% fantasy 4th ED compatible will improve potential sales. Its the cost on the integrity of the setting that concerns me personally.
#52

Quintarius

Feb 09, 2009 1:25:51
Not that i find the setting intresting, but I will buy NeuroSpasta because of the rules and the possibility to play a kind of ShadowrunD20
Thats just the guy I am.
I'll take a setting and make it how i see fit.
Hope you won't hold it against me ;)
#53

SerenaDawn

Feb 09, 2009 2:11:17
Not that i find the setting intresting, but I will buy NeuroSpasta because of the rules and the possibility to play a kind of ShadowrunD20
Thats just the guy I am.
I'll take a setting and make it how i see fit.
Hope you won't hold it against me ;)

Hold it against you? This is why I create my own games in the first place.
Barring making a bonfire and burning our books to the chaos god Slannesh, if you buy it, do what you wish.
#54

Quintarius

Feb 09, 2009 5:58:14
Will do, both ;)
#55

Nylanfs

Feb 09, 2009 16:54:30
Alternately you could do a free simple pdf download on the developer's suggestions on how to adapt the setting to a pure fantasy setting, that way saving the print space.
#56

SerenaDawn

Feb 10, 2009 2:13:49
Most likely, it will be a last page addendum...
#57

SerenaDawn

Feb 24, 2009 10:35:37
Now that's out of the way, we have not been ignoring NeuroSpasta. In fact, it still receives hours of work every day. We could be enlisting playtesters as early as April. Those interested should contact me.

Meanwhile, I wanted to dive into some of the game concepts we have been working on. Yes, lifepaths from Amethyst are still present though they are significantly downtuned from their fantasy counterparts. Amethyst's were mostly region specific and had benefits as minor as skill increases to major class alterations. The latter is not present in NeuroSpasta and we have mostly just skill bonuses. This is because since we've added a level of complexity already with the Ladders, we didn't want to burden it too much with unnecessary rules.

I can confirm that we have four races for NeuroSpasta: Nugenic, Prosthetic, True-Born, and Virtuant. NeuroSpasta's tagline of "Everything can be Manipulated" translates to every part of the game. This includes our races. Not a single race gains a specific attribute bonus. Knowing that, we were still able to make the four races extremely unique. Virtuant, the hardest one to define, ended up as one of my favorites, not because of their bonuses, but because of what they can do as simulated personalities. Its real "out-of-the-box" thinking. For your homebrew gamers out there, you can always ignore whatever races don't fit your setting.

Here is the drum-roll. By current count, we have 11 single-build classes. Yes, you read right. All of them should fit in the same page count as 5 traditional multi-build classes. When I say "single-build" I don't mean single powers, just not as many powers to choose from at each level as what you would get with fighters or paladins. The variety of character generation comes from the ladders. Ladders are chosen at first level, like classes. You gain all the bonuses from your ladder and your class but while classes are very specific, ladders are much more generic--based more on your attributes than your actual role. Current ladder count stands at six and each one focuses on a specific two-attribute combination (Juggernaut--Strength/Constitution, Runner--Dexterity/Intelligence, etc). Taking these into account, you have 66 combinations to choose from. With that under your belt, a DM could create any science-fiction or modern game using these base rules. To fits these all in the first book, we won't be going into paragon paths or epic destinies or include any opponents or equipment over 11th level, though our classes and ladders will go all the way to 30.

Here is some cool news. The setting is getting a major boost in authenticity. As many who have followed this know, NeuroSpasta is set in an UN-controlled city in the no-too-distant future--a future we are trying to make as realistic and as plausible as possible. To that end, we have brought on board a political and international relations advisor. He's a lawyer and a professor and Pittsburgh’s School of Law, with a specialty in international law with a unique perspective on the dealings of the UN. This level of detail is exactly what we are shooting for with NeuroSpasta and despite our cybernetics and virtual personalities and nanotechnologies; underneath it all is a political landscape of a future which could possibly exist...

...but, you know, probably not...

Me out.
#58

Nylanfs

Feb 24, 2009 15:59:43
Cool, I always like realism in my games. Hence I love CCP's economic reports on EVE.
#59

Cyber-Dave

Feb 24, 2009 16:08:48
Here is the drum-roll. By current count, we have 11 single-build classes. Yes, you read right. All of them should fit in the same page count as 5 traditional multi-build classes. When I say "single-build" I don't mean single powers, just not as many powers to choose from at each level as what you would get with fighters or paladins. The variety of character generation comes from the ladders. Ladders are chosen at first level, like classes. You gain all the bonuses from your ladder and your class but while classes are very specific, ladders are much more generic--based more on your attributes than your actual role. Current ladder count stands at six and each one focuses on a specific two-attribute combination (Juggernaut--Strength/Constitution, Runner--Dexterity/Intelligence, etc). Taking these into account, you have 66 combinations to choose from. With that under your belt, a DM could create any science-fiction or modern game using these base rules. To fits these all in the first book, we won't be going into paragon paths or epic destinies or include any opponents or equipment over 11th level, though our classes and ladders will go all the way to 30.

Hmmm... I don't know if I am excited or turned off by this. How free form will multiclassing be? I REALLY like the open ended class concepts of 4e. Its one of my favorite aspects. I hated how 3e had very restrictive class abilities. If the game both has restrictive class abilities AND doesn't include free form multiclassing, are you sure the game won't feel very restrictive int he area of character creation? Will there be a ladder to represent every possible two combination of stats? What if you don't want to focus on Dex and Int, but instead on Dex and Strength? Just what sort of bonuses do you get from ladders? Do powers come from classes or ladders? If classes are pretty much just a starting set of class abilities, and your "class powers" instead all come from ladders, I could see that working out very cool! You would no longer then multi-class, but rather muli-ladder... So, you would be defined by a choice of starting class abilities, and then a ladder for your powers, and potential a multi-ladder for a second list from which to choose powers. Is that what you are trying to get across? Is that what you are doing? Or do powers still come from your class choice? Or do powers come from both?

So many questions. So much excitement. I guess I will just have to wait and see...

The professor news is VERY cool though. Are you allowed to give away his name or a link to his CV?
#60

SerenaDawn

Feb 26, 2009 3:47:35
I love it when I drop breadcrumbs. So many questions.

Multiclassing will be the same as in the Player’s Handbook. No reason to suspect that will change. Amethyst features multi-build classes because the paths were very generic (Stalker, Grounder, etc). This was intentional because we wanted to present them in the same vein as fantasy characters. We wanted NeuroSpasta’s to be specific to greater expand the possibilities of more classes later and assist those wanted to homebrew their own games. So here, we have Sniper, Medic, Hacker, and so forth. The expanded possibilities for variety come with ladders. They offer more abilities that compensate for the lack of magic items. We offer six ladders and doing math (tapping the table repeatedly), there are fifteen combinations. Though we have ones like Dex/Int as well as Dex/Str, we don’t have, say, Con/Cha. There are certain combinations that don’t make a lot of sense. Just look the attribute combinations in the PHB for guidance. That is not saying we won’t create an Int/Con ladder later, but we want these to make sense and not waste space for ladders that seem out of place. These are not “Strong Hero” types but “Juggernaughts” and “Born Leaders.”

The system is still in the prototype phase so I can’t go into it just now about this whole thing, but what I will say that ladders offer alternative powers and additional abilities throughout character progression in the same way magic items can. All the powers and features offered reflect the theme of the ladder. Since classes are single-build with only 1 or 2 powers each level, you get additional variety from tapping the ladder. So you may have 1 utility power at 2nd level in your class but two more from your ladder. So when you reach 2nd level, you have a choice of 3 to choose from. This is the limit of the complexity we plan on. There is no reason, whatsoever to convolute it anymore than it has to be.

So to sum up, you choose a ladder and a class. Classes cannot be altered because that’s in the GSL. The only thing you’ll notice is that they are smaller. Ladders have features at different levels and alternate powers and are not based on your role in the group but your basic statline.

And just for those people trying to find holes in our plan:
What about those that just want role-playing over combat? Yup, we thought of that.
What about not having to buy new weapons every second level? Yep, thought of that to.
What about the lack of monsters dishing out cash and prizes? Oh yeah, got that handled.
What about those wielding cybernetics getting more powerful than “fleshies”? Totally on top of that one.
Lack of magical enhancement? Done.

…and people are saying you can’t do anything with the GSL…

The phone’s on the hook, Scott.
#61

Cyber-Dave

Feb 26, 2009 5:15:12
Hmmmm...

I guess I just really hope that no given "class+ladder" choice ends up having less powers options than a single character class in 4e currently has.

The open end ended/customizability of classes in both 4e and Saga is one of the major selling points of the current evolution of the d20 game. I'm really hoping that you guys don't choose to do away with that.

But, no point me coming to any conclusions till I see more of what you have done!

I eagerly await more tid bits.
#62

SerenaDawn

Mar 18, 2009 2:13:07
Three weeks ago, we finished the ladders--the biggest rule addition we have made to the 4ED ruleset. After our Close Combat Specialist class was finished, I dared my crew to create characters for that single class, but select a different ladder for each one. With our new batch of martial feats, we started up our first Mixed Martial Arts brawl. I drew an octagon on the map and we went one-on-one with our builds.

I played an aging shaolin kung-fu master. Conan played a calculating sambo wrestler, Mike, a massive juggernaught with meaty fists, and Schuyler, an agile taekwondo expert. Yes, there really is all that variety out of single class dependant on your ladder and feats chosen. I won’t say who won (IT WAS MEEE!).

Over the past two weeks, we got all our other classes down. These include Infiltrator, Faceman, Sniper, Gunslinger, and Combat Authority. We merged Engineer into Manipulator, and Driver into Faceman, though you can still choose driver powers via feats. Manipulator is our hacker class. We have been trying to approach the vernacular of NeuroSpasta with a fresh perspective. So gone are the “deckers” and the “riggers” and the “jacking-in” and the “plugging-in”. A few days ago, we got to looking back and reminiscing about older cyberpunk novels and games of the 80s and 90s and snickered at the inaccuracy of their predictions. Although the concepts of an urban sprawl and the privatization of the government as well as the encroaching control of corporations were prophetic, few of them could properly predict the advancement of computerization and the speed in which computers would evolve in processing power and graphic potential. The hardest hit were the role playing games, which endorses truly fantastic and ludicrous concepts for the sake of "being cool", regardless of its logical application. Manipulator is more than just a corporate hacker, as they are able to tap into someone's blackberry, Iphone, or even their brain implants. And no, hacking does not take place on a grid map or a hexboard. There is no graphical representation of it at all. This was a simple decision as the concept of adding a dimension to something which has none seemed against our mission-statement.

So yeah, there could be a functional product by the end of March. Does that mean it will be out sooner? Nope, just more time for testing. The game still won't be released until the end of the year. Hell, we don't even have a logo yet.
#63

Quintarius

Mar 18, 2009 4:54:36
ah still can't wait for it. and i'm very excited about the manipulator.
#64

Nylanfs

Mar 18, 2009 13:34:55
Actually I think that having a graphical representation of the computer systems is more likely than less. Simply because humans as a whole are visual creatures. There are very few people that can work with pure idea's in the world, realitively speaking. So that for a corpration they will design their system for the lowest common denominator that they would hire to do that job.
#65

SerenaDawn

Mar 18, 2009 15:52:59
I never said there was absolutely no graphical representation to the internet, but there is no graphical representation to it in game purposes in the realm of hacking. It would be a series of pop-up screens and command prompts.

The "surfing" and "illusion of dimension" seen in Johnny Mnemonic and other cyberpunk settings (like the preeminent Cyberpunk 2020 RPG) I believe to be archaic and not representative of the direction the net is going. So placing a box on a grid map and saying that is the firewall of a corporation and have players move around it and attack, avoiding ICE and so forth, I think is pure nonsense. It would look neat, but it would never really occur. In addition, since you can hack into targets in the real world in real time during an encounter, stopping the game so you can move to another map for another battle would disrupt the flow of the game. We will have servers as monsters, they just won't have the same template as MM monsters.
#66

Cyber-Dave

Mar 18, 2009 16:16:41
Do you plan to make use of augmented reality?
#67

spawnofmorgoth

Mar 18, 2009 17:45:50
When I GMed cyber-adventures I never used scale or tactical maps. But I often used process flow diagrams or Venn diagrams to show regional relationships and photos to show environment backgrounds. Distance meant little as if you can get on a fiberoptic expressway you can do a few laps around the planet in under a second. Descriptions are great, but scale (and therefore tactical movement) are totally meaningless.

You still need to know what nodes you have to visit to access specific hardware and to try and avoid areas where security and traffic could foil your plans. Diagrams can be made by the GM and used to track the progress of the player. I showed these diagrams to players at first (and kinda grimaced at some meta-gaming) because I wanted players to learn how my descriptions matched with the process flow diagram. After a couple cyber-excursions I cut the apron strings and would help them sketch out an 'attack plan' (theoretical flowchart) prior to hacking and then described what they actually encountered in cyberspace (so they had to edit the 'plan' on the fly and hope their map matched mine... just like old school D&D).
#68

SerenaDawn

Mar 18, 2009 22:58:39
Do you plan to make use of augmented reality?

A HUGE portion of NeuroSpasta deals with augmented reality.
#69

alisair_longreach

Mar 21, 2009 3:30:50
Some persons in the Neurospasta setting might have objections to having a neural implant because of religion, health or wealth. One solution I just came up with is mirrorshades. Hitech mirrorshades with a computer display overlay on the inside of the glasses combined with earplugs and an iPod-like gadget for dataprocessing and memory storage.

Besides mirrorshades and black sunglasses are an essential trope in cyberpunk and the main setting of Neurospasta is set on a sunny island of the coast of Dubai.
#70

SerenaDawn

Mar 21, 2009 19:10:52
Some persons in the Neurospasta setting might have objections to having a neural implant because of religion, health or wealth. One solution I just came up with is mirrorshades. Hitech mirrorshades with a computer display overlay on the inside of the glasses combined with earplugs and an iPod-like gadget for dataprocessing and memory storage.

Besides mirrorshades and black sunglasses are an essential trope in cyberpunk and the main setting of Neurospasta is set on a sunny island of the coast of Dubai.

We won't have mirroshades. We will never have mirroshades. I won't wear mirroshades. My friends don't wear mirrorshades. No one has worn mirroshades since 1989. You can put in mirrorshades in your game but the fact they are typical of cyberpunk is the reason why they won't be present in NeuroSpasta.

"The SEED (Synaptic Embedded Electronic Device) is as common and as safe as an ear piercing. With the development of version 2.1 of the GNOSIS operating system, malware and viruses have been all but eliminated."
#71

Cyber-Dave

Mar 21, 2009 21:30:08
I still wear mirrorshades sometimes.

I like aviators...
#72

SerenaDawn

Apr 24, 2009 2:34:45
My rants against BSG and Caprica aside, I have been a little off the grid the last few days. Conan and I have been picking apart the NeuroSpasta rules left and right, top to bottom. The setting is still lacking in detail and that is going to be the direction I take for the next few weeks. We have played around with a few classes, specifically with Manipulator, which can make or break the game. I know people will object to the fact that our hacking rules do not require a map. There were many reasons for this. For one: it's just not realistic. Two: We don't expect the entire group to create hackers so to be bogged down with a battle only one or two people will play seemed...well...selfish. Most hacking battles take only minutes and occur during physical combat. Of course, battle servers and giant AIs may be different but they still won't measure to the length of full gridmap combat. Manipulators have powers caused "Hacks" and can enhance those with programs and feats that expand one's repertoire.

I can also safely announce the full list of NeuroSpasta classes:

Combat Authority
Faceman
Gunslinger
Heavy
Infiltrator
Man-At-Arms
Manipulator
Sniper
Specialist
Vanguard

This is in addition to the six ladders which can be combined with any of these.

I have stuck by my guns and refused to insert a katana in the game...
...but there will be chainsaw...
#73

Nylanfs

Apr 25, 2009 7:49:33
But what about mirror shades?
#74

SerenaDawn

May 20, 2009 14:59:56
Meanwhile, NeuroSpasta continues to chug along. Currently, our real dilemma is understanding the financial system. Since we don't have enhancement items save for a handful of skill bonus items, there is simply no place for players to sink their hard-earned money....so we created new sinks. As mentioned, we had cybernetics and a few weapons, armour and programs, but several classes and ladders don't have that option. If you are a prosthetic, you have tonnes of options. If you are a manipulator, you have as well, but classes like faceman or specialist may not have one...so we designed some great ways to spend your cash. For one, we are giving the specialist the capability to control robots and weapon turrets...which is when we realized on top of accidentally recreating games like Gears of War, Mirror's Edge, and Splinter Cell; we have also recreated Team Fortress.

As for the faceman, which also doubles as a driver, we added in vehicles. Now, that may not fully solve the problem since you can buy a nice car at 1st level and never need to upgrade...so we decided to include car modifications. I, being a tuner-nut, should have thought of this earlier, but creds go to Cam and Conan for offering this one up. I have owned eight cars in a very short tenure and three of them have been modified for street legal use, so I should have known better. So even though you can buy an awesome car at first level, you can spend the rest of your level progression making that car perfect, with increases to its manoeuvrability, armour, and hit points.

Another big addition recently is some rule clarifications with our new firearm rules, which will probably go into Amethyst as errata. These are not rule changes, but rules to make what we did make more sense.

Finally, in an effort to showcase what we have done with the game, I decided to create a mini-module everyone can download for free. It will include 5 pre-generated characters using the NeuroSpasta system and place them in a-shot unique adventure outside of the setting's canon. It is currently called, "Lost in Happyland" and will be available in July, well after the FreeRPGDay release of Amethyst. Personally, if this module wasn't canon, I would publish professionally--I think it's that awesome. I have to stop myself for spending TOO much time on it.
#75

MechaPilot

May 20, 2009 16:14:12
Do you allow for education as a money sink?

Anyone who's been to college can testify that becoming trained in a new skill is a great way to drop a couple thousand dollars. I myself am trying to become an accountant and have already sunk almost 5k into my classes toward my degree (and i'm only about 1/4 of the way there).
#76

SerenaDawn

May 21, 2009 3:25:51
An education money sink would not be something I would opt for. The biggest reason being that we removed enhancement from the game and I doubt someone is going to spend hundred of thousands of dollars for a +6 bonus to Sciences. Second, for this to be realistic, your character would have to be away for the time required to be educated. We do have some skill-based money sinks, with both physical and mental skills, but university is not one of them. Thanks for the idea though, I actually gave it some thought.
#77

Nylanfs

May 21, 2009 5:19:44
What about equipment degradation/obsolecence over time? In SR there's a fairly good effective mechanic for software and cybernetic's, that they need upgraded due to tech advances. Which of course cost's money.
#78

SerenaDawn

May 21, 2009 20:32:09
Well, considering that D&D doesn't make you pay to sustain weapons that would actually NEED to be replaced between each major battle, I certainly won't make NeuroSpasta characters pay to sustain technology which could function indefinetly. I would much rather players spend money on cool stuff throughout their lives than buying stuff at 1st level and spending the rest of the game keeping it cool. Once something offers its bonus, spending money to keep that bonus is punishing characters that use it compared to fantasy games, which don't. A gun can fire thousands of rounds and rarelty need more than a good cleaning and oiling. Nah, I think we're good letting people buy awesome stuff throughout their lives.
#79

Nylanfs

May 21, 2009 22:57:12
Well it's not really about tangible items like guns, food, transportation etc. It's more like software, you have to constantly update and upgrade your software to keep on the bleeding edge, same goes with the cybernetics, new tech is constantly coming out.

Pus there's also lifestyle costs which affect your health (ie a squatter in some abandoned warehouse isn't in the best of health and possibly has a weaker immune system, compared to a wealthy first-class citizen).
#80

SerenaDawn

May 24, 2009 4:17:38
The problem with that concept is that cybernetics and software are already a money sink. They don't need to be any more so. The issue (which we have solved), regarded those players that don't purchase cyberware or programs or power armor. Weapons are not that much of a sink now and to make them pay for these they don't benefit from unlike cyberware and programs would be unfair. But ladders help you with that and we have robots and cars and other cool things to spend your hard earned money on. I

Additionally, I have no desire to make the player spend money on their accommodations and furniture. If I wanted that, I would play Sims. ;)
#81

SerenaDawn

Jun 05, 2009 3:55:05
NeuroSpasta reached 129,000 words today. What's left? A few little things here and there...languages and currency for one. We just finished robots. Robots represent a new approach we had not thought of until we tackled it. Like we mentioned earlier, we are striving to create a money sink for every type of class. Whether it be weapons, armor, vehicles, or cybernetics, everyone has something to spend their money on. Robots are a new addition and a great way for non-combat orientated characters to spend their money. What we needed to conquer was a way for a player to either let the robot control itself or to take control of it directly. What advantages would there be to control the robot directly over letting it handle itself. We wanted the player to use actions to control their robots over letting the machines control themselves. We needed to really think about it and the answer came naturally. The system in place is easy and uses mechanics within 4th Edition which allows the robot/s to get better with level progression. We have base weapon platforms, rover robots, and android bodyguards. Of course, these can also all be used as monsters as well. Monsters, by the way, are the only real thing we have left to do.
#82

SerenaDawn

Jul 07, 2009 23:55:47
More from our friends at Gnomes Stew. On Friday, July 10th, they will be running an article on NeuroSpasta. This will include never before released information on the setting and game mechanics as well as an exclusive preview of the game's breathtaking logo.
#83

shard_of_suzail

Jul 12, 2009 8:25:15
I just got asked to run a cyberpunk 2020 game, so i`m watching the idea of gsl cyberpunk with great interest. Keep at it guys.
#84

Nylanfs

Jul 12, 2009 9:45:41
I don't think that 4e game system can be altered enough to truly compatible with the GSL and be as grim and gritty as cyberpunk is typically thought of. Although SD might supprise me

And for Cyberpunk my favorite is still ShadowRun.
#85

SerenaDawn

Jul 14, 2009 1:30:06
Well, grim an gritty is a state of mind and setting, not rules. You can make your setting as dark as you wish with little no bearing on the rules you use. If you wish something more "realistic" then I hope we succeed in that regard.

By the way, the main page at http://www.diasexmachina.com/ has been updated with the logo and its own NeuroSpasta page. Our logo has a blue background to Gnome Stew's black.
#86

SerenaDawn

Jul 14, 2009 1:45:58
Showing off
IMAGE(http://www.diasexmachina.com/neurospasta-blue.jpg)
#87

serphet

Jul 14, 2009 1:50:54
---
#88

Nylanfs

Jul 14, 2009 5:11:02
Well, grim an gritty is a state of mind and setting, not rules. You can make your setting as dark as you wish with little no bearing on the rules you use. If you wish something more "realistic" then I hope we succeed in that regard.

By the way, the main page at http://www.diasexmachina.com/ has been updated with the logo and its own NeuroSpasta page. Our logo has a blue background to Gnome Stew's black.

But if there isn't must threat from death &/or dismemberment it's not quite as grim and gritty, at least I wouldn't consider it so.
#89

SerenaDawn

Jul 15, 2009 3:53:03
Well, we don't go so far as to implement dismemberment rules though our classes are easier to kill IMHO if they don't use cover and teamwork...
#90

SerenaDawn

Jul 22, 2009 19:51:19
Eighteen groups are currently playtesting NeuroSpasta. So far, feedback has been positive and useful. There have been quite a few issues we have tried to deal with. Some of them relate to Amethyst.

The most notable of these have dealt with ammunition usage and firearm damage.

I have noticed quite a few homebrew gamers working on their own variation of modern weapons. In every situation, we here at DEM have felt the damage outputs of these weapons have been remarkably high. Simply put, there is this common belief that a 9mm round will do two or three times more damage than say, a broadsword.

When did this occur?

Comparing a pistol to a short sword and saying the pistol should do more damage makes little sense to me. Compare a Heavy machine gun to a katana? The only advantage a firearm has to a melee weapon is range. When it came to actual physical damage to an unarmed opponent, the melee weapon wins. Yet I see these damage capacities for weapons listed as 2d10 and 3d6. Yes, pistols in Amethyst and NeuroSpasta do 1d4 - 1d6. Two-handed weapons like rifles and small machine guns do 1d8. Heavy machine guns do 1d8 to 2d6. Amethyst has enhancements so that a railgun is a +4 weapon and a laser is a +5 weapon. Further, NeuroSpasta has both hardness values and armor penetration so that a pistol cannot damage a tank while a tank will utterly destroy a normal person.

The other point was ammo. Simply put, we didn't want to confuse issues so rapid fire weapons were always in increments of 5 but even adding additional rounds, the damage increase was not severe. This was because we didn't want the damage capacities of firearms to get away from us. In the end, your powers will dictate your high-damage hits, not the weapons. This was another fact people seemed to forget. In Amethyst, yes, a machine gun does 1d8...but certain powers with them are 6[W]. That's an insane amount of damage from only 10 bullets. The other point is that ammunition usage can really get away from you. If you do an area effect with a heavy weapon, targeting 6 guys and you go full out with Burst fire, you just used 90 rounds of ammunition in 6 seconds. That seems a lot, right? Check out the M-60 and see how many rounds of ammunition it can fire in 5 seconds (here's a hint, its 92). Thankfully, there is also a feat which reduces this number. Yes, this means you'll be changing clips. Yes this means you may run out of ammo. This is the problem you must contend with in a modern game with firearms.

Another issue was movement. In both Amethyst and NeuroSpasta, if you move before you fire your weapon, you incur a -1 penalty to attack rolls. This means if you don't want this penalty, you will have to shoot first and then move on your round. Heavy weapons are even worse; it's a -4 penalty if you move before shooting. Yes, its high...it's almost useless to even shoot. That's the point. Despite what you have seen in movies, it is nearly impossible to fire a heavy weapon while running at full speed. Thankfully, certain classes suppress or decrease this penalty. In Amethyst, the Grounder ignores the penalty of two handed small-arms and heavy weapons are treated as two-handed small arms. In NeuroSpasta, both the Heavy and Man-At-Arms classes feature similar rules (the Heavy gains it with heavy weapons; Man-At-Arms gains it with two-handed small arms). We were more worried about ammunition usage in Amethyst because players have to buy everything. In NeuroSpasta, bullets flow like water.

Next time, I talk philosophy again...

...I can hear you groaning...
#91

fatumd20

Jul 22, 2009 21:31:23
...I can hear you groaning...

Not me. I say bravo! I couldn't agree more with what you have written. I think some people need to remember that setting, flavor and theme are as strong a component to a game as the tech. It's not about who and what does the most damage, it is about the journey getting there. Sure that includes combat and these points only help make the combat more memorable, not limited.
#92

SerenaDawn

Jul 27, 2009 2:35:33
Today, I begin a series of articles on the details of the NeuroSpasta setting, specifically around many of the philosophical points being presented.

Archon is considered the prototype of not only a new government, but a new mindset. It is considered by proponents and critics alike as the catalyst for the slow elimination of ethnic groups and traditional values. This is due not only by the city's policy, but by its level of technological advancement and that advancement's effect on its population and state of mind. Archon is not alone in this trend, though it is considered the trailblazer. Other progressive municipalities, like Tokyo, Berlin, and Brasilia, although following this similar trend, and decades ahead of most of the rest of planet, still pales in the progress of Archon, the test bed of nearly every technological breakthrough not subsidized or controlled by one government. The most obvious and significant example of this development is the SEED, which is prevalent in 99% of the working population of Archon, more than any other region on Earth. Archon also has a largest ratio of prosthetics and virtuants, though Japan still prides itself the largest manufacturer and operator of robots. With no history to call its own, Archon became the refuge of millions seeking a new life or to escape their old one, thus the draw by those with questionable ethnicity. As the development of cybernetics increased and the potential of the Seed expanded into regions the designers thought possible, yet the public was not expecting the mindsets of the residents of Archon began to differ from those living in traditional nations. This included their concepts of free will, consumerism, self-identity, and the definition of what makes one human.

When the SEED prototype was revealed, it was advertised as the greatest single advancement of mankind since the internet, not in as much as the breakthroughs of cybernetics and nanotechnology, but in its potential effect on the human race. Before, internet users were limited to sharing clumsily worded blogs or ineffectual data bursts of 140 characters. More devoted supporters would upload and share video and music files across massive social networking sites. With the SEED, such archaic social circles became obsolete. Not only could every brain be a hub of social interaction, but there was no longer a limit of which human senses to convey. With the SEED's capacity to record incoming stimuli, new networking sites that popped up strained the bandwidths of current internet providers. By then, traffic had already reached a point of hundreds of petabytes of data being moved across the planet every minute. The entire planet would have to share the workload to meet the demands of the new generation. There were few networks which were rooted entirely in one location, facilitating the demand for even more powerful central computers, which led to gargantuan servers like MCP and SIM. Of them all, MCP was the largest, and designed to handle such huge amounts of information. It became the home of nearly every social interacting site in the world. With a free and virtually unlimited refuge of data, the amount of uploadable information skyrocketed, which resulted in even more consumers purchasing and installing SEEDS. The majority of this uploaded information came in the form of human memory, which users were recording and uploading at an alarming rate. Not just the venue of pornography, these memory-swaps grew in size as people began uploading their vacations, sports victories--any event that someone else could find entertaining. Eventually, even the mundane found demand. Some users got to uploading every single moment of their lives online, in some insane drive for immortality. A user wishing to access the memory need only stream it from the site and experience it as fresh as if he or she were living in the moment.

The fear emerged quickly that people would stop living their own lives and the true progress of civilization would only experienced by a handful and shared with the mindless masses below. They would unplug themselves from their more interesting surrogate to eat and sleep and resume following the loves and pains of the one that actually lived. A later modification made the addition even more alluring, when a brilliant programmer by the name of Akira Okuda developed the TCA protocol. Okuda had attention deficit disorder and had grown impatient with his streaming memoires. The Time Compression algorithm software became standard with GNOSOS 1.2. Okuda had calculated how fast a human being could receive and process a memory and developed a system which streamed the incoming memory much faster than real time. To the viewer, the memory appeared normal and the experience was "lived" in normal time, but when disengaged from the memory, less than a fifth the time had actually passed. Now the concern would be that people wouldn't make room for their own memories, only download more from others.

End part 1...
#93

kage_no_neko

Jul 31, 2009 13:26:54
I can readily see the references to Ghost in the Shell; I also recognize touches of Serial Experiments Lain and the .Hack// series of anime and games. I am happy to see corollaries here as I have always felt these anime/games were social commentaries that most people have misunderstood. The TCA protocol you list is a scary potential found to some extent in all these, but as the .Hack// series portrays I wonder how something like this would affect the online worlds of MMOs; living someone's real life is one thing but I have always preferred to step completely out of reality, after all I am a role player.
#94

SerenaDawn

Aug 01, 2009 2:38:28
I will say I admit inspiration but some of the sources may surprise you. I was not a huge fan of Lain. I much preferred Texhnolyze. I never saw .Hack//.

Anyways...where was I....oh yesss....



The eventuality that did occur was not expected. Although millions of people would download memories daily, most of the time, the memories they preferred to experience were their own, which they would replay from home servers. Many times, instead of downloading new memories, they would repeat older ones personally experienced over and over again. This new addiction was unforeseen and psychoanalysts attempted to classify this dependence. It was easy to identify why an individual would prefer their own memories over others, but to spend their lives repeating those over and over confounded many of them. Even today, vast numbers of people world-wide stopped forming new memories, merely reliving events of their youth. This addiction was eventually called Pervasive Reminiscence Replication Disorder (PRRD).

Oddly enough, this addiction is much more prevalent in lower-class communities, and especially in nations with a lower quality of living. In Archon, this addiction is only noticed in areas like the REZ. In A3 and Loka, it is virtually nonexistent. That being said, the downloading of "foreign" memories is more popular than ever in more advanced nations.

The drawback with recorded memory, of course, is a complete lack of control over the experience. The user would see the face of the real source of the memory in a mirror and have no influence over his or her actions, even to the point of being unable stop actions that go against the moral fortitude of the downloader. This introduced another psychological condition: Cognitive Proxy Separation Anxiety (CPSA). CPSA had its roots over a century ago as experts analyzed the effect of violent visual and auditory stimuli on children, namely with the introduction of violent television and movies. It was discovered that a small percentage couldn't separate the anxiety encountered by characters on a screen from their own. Further, these stimuli influenced their behavior as it exposed them to actions they found a compulsion to replicate. Even more found the experiences desensitizing. However, the vast majority were able to detach experiences seen on a screen with those actually experienced. Downloadable memories, unfortunately, circumvent that barrier the human psyche places on stimuli received from a TV/movie screen or from a radio. The event feels completely real and is regarding as a true memory by the one streaming it, despite the jarring shifts in self-image and attitude. CPSA occurs in individuals that develop other deep-rooted psychological conditions from viewing other people's memories. They develop post-traumatic stress disorder and phobias as well as social anxiety and obsessive compulsive disorders. Some patients went further and had complete emotional and psychological breakdowns from which they never recovered. This is in despite of the emotional state of the person originally experiencing it. For example, a popular choice for memory downloads were experiences by soldiers in armed combat. These were tempting and were streamed by the millions, especially by teenagers addicted to simulated combat via computer games. But the soldiers recording those memories were trained for months if not years to handle such stresses and with no such padding, the streamed memories caused significant emotional damage, especially since, with the advent of the TCA protocol, the entire memory could be downloaded and experienced in minutes before the brains desire for food or sleep overrode the reproduced memory. When experiencing a memory, a person is emotionally connected to it and most people can't terminate the experience once it begins unless certain fail safes kick in, including any stimuli from the outside world meant to jostle the subject. Those that have no such event occurring, and place no such fail safes themselves, are often forced to experience the memory until its conclusion. Websites where memory systems were exchanged became known as Memory Swaps, while the actual memories themselves were nicknamed ProMs (Proxy Memories). Soon after, ProMs were defined specifically as real memories created by one source and downloaded by others. Syms, or Synthetic Memories are nearly identical except the memory has been intentionally modified or is fabricated from the ground up to alter realty. Synthetic memories are not as popular as real memories as users want the authenticity of reality. If they wanted something completely fabricated, another type of virtual experience was waiting to cater to that desire. Those addicted to these experiences, including sufferers from CPSA, have been called proxiphiles, loose strings, and sometimes just zeros.

While memory swaps were gaining in popularity, other aspects of the SEED were quickly maturing. This included reversing the recording sensors of the Seed, overriding sensory input to a body. This was a feature always included as it allowed users to access built in music and video players. They could make phone calls and surf the net without ever requiring a screen or keyboard. Beyond this, companies started developing passive spam simulations, which involved creating advertisements in one's visual field when they enter a certain area. These features could be suppressed but, soon after, it expanded into the entertainment industry. Instead of clumsy and unrealistic holograms, gamers would simply tie into the Seed network for the simulation. It was then easy to fabricate an artificial environment using direct sensory input, leading into two distinct experiences, virtual recreation and total immersion experiences. Virtual recreation involves matting virtual images into real backdrops. This includes simulated people and even sets. This makes the experience feel more real and also makes rendering cheaper as the backdrops don't need to be digitized. Several large recreation facilities offer day-long virtual adventures in hanger-sized sets with little more than a few boxes, a handful of buildings, and rows of artificial plants. Total immersion, a far more expensive option, disengages the subject's motor functions and overrides all sensory input. In these sceneries, there is no limit on the extremity of the event. Several corporations install catheters and food tubes for immersion experiences that can last for days. Total immersion allows the use of time compression, allowing a dozen hours of gameplay in only two, unlike virtual recreation, which must be in real time. Both of these experiences allow direct user input to change events and circumstances. The players can look like themselves or anyone else they wish. There was still, however, the problem of CPSA, as the experiences were direct and unavoidable, meaning the target believed they were in that situation. Though the vast majority of users could separate fantasy from reality, those susceptible to CPSA could not as the barrier the human mind places on traumatic images and stories relayed by an external device was circumvented. It became even more prevalent the detachment felt by those experiencing someone else's memory was no longer present, and the number of global CPSA cases grew. Society, unfortunately, was unwilling to wait for treatments or tolerances before moving on.
#95

SerenaDawn

Aug 03, 2009 2:51:44
Last word on NeuroSpasta, we had polished up most of our opponents. Suffice to say, I know we are after the deadline. I know I said we were selecting playtesters at the beginning of August and it looks like it may still be another week. Apologies, once again. Although I know a few of these may not make it to the final book (put off for the second one), currently we have over 50...

...Well...because of a little rule we are implementing...that 50 actually increases to 130. And no, we won't go into that yet.
#96

SerenaDawn

Aug 09, 2009 21:58:09
THE NEW CONSIOUSNESS, Part 3
Here is the third and final part in the series...


The overriding or augmentation of sensory input started increasing worldwide. The number of hackers employing it was rather low. The user would enter an area with a simulation marker, that marker would ask the user if it can present the simulation. The simulation carries an "invisible" ID tag that tells the brain the image is not real, regardless of the detail of the actual simulation. Users can be set to "auto-receive" or "auto-refuse" or selective prompt, not unlike cookies of computers. Most hackers, unable to crack that defense feature, have been forced to hack the simulations, which could always be turned off. Hackers able to break the GNOSIS defense protocols are extremely few. Beyond advertising, these open-simulated areas, or "Osim" expanded to dozens of applications, including sporting events (relaying driver information over the race cars as they circled the track), combat training (tracking enemy hits), and education (showing graphs and equations without worrying over eyesight and clumsy chalkboards). Photo realistic simulations were and still are extremely difficult to produce, preventing the home consumer from fabricating illusions on the fly. Programs could be purchased allowing one to hang great pieces of art from the walls of their home without the pesky complications of buying the art or nailing a frame to a wall. The program would install the image and display that image on a marker you place on the wall. With this technology, the only limit was the lack of tactile and olfactory response. Visual and auditory stimuli could be replicated with precision if given enough time and money. Tactile impute required a great deal of additional information and was only capable with total immersion experiences which shut down all external inputs for its own.

The newest craze to hit the digital age relating to Seeds are virtual cafes. These are real locations that allow the mingling of virtual and physical people. Users downloading to the location pay for access to the cafe while real people need only order food or coffee. The cafe creates a perfect representation of the individual you want to be (either from a template or from photos you provide) and generates the avatar in the cafe all other Seeds users there can talk and interact with. Virtual Cafes have expanded to also be virtual arenas, virtual schools, and virtual stores, where simulated people can access for a small fee (or no fee depending on the situation). This form of telepresence gave those afraid of the outside world access they had not previously believed. Eventually, these introverted individuals stopped leaving their homes altogether, refusing to interact with anyone unless through their virtual self. Total immersion simulations allows tactile interaction if necessary but most of the time, these simulated representations, known as "proxies" would occupy more than half of these real/virtual locations.

Archon has the highest number of V/P Sites (Virtual / Physical) in the world. UN policy prohibits any employee or diplomat from using a proxy in the work place. The UN buildings are limited in their Seed simulations, only making exceptions for dignitaries unable to attend certain events. It has been estimated that nearly 500,000 people telepresence into Archon from outside the city every day.

The variety of organic and synthetic representation has brought an examination of the definition of humanity and the mark of a civilized being. Philosophy classes around the world began specialized lectures dedicated to this new mindset. It was beyond the definitions of the soul but in the value of an intelligence wasted in comparison to an intelligence utilized. There were an increasing number of humans on the planet that were no longer being productive. This was not because of poverty or mental disability as this growing demographic had no such limitations, and many of them were wealthy. These individuals would stop generating new memories in exchange for experiencing the memories of others. In addition, those generating new memories are now able to transmit their likeness to other places in the world without ever leaving their home. They are going places without having travel, which cut heavily into the tourism market. Countries started attacking Memory Swap sites because of the damage being caused to their economy. Pay sites were making a modest profit but their traffic paled in comparison to the hundreds of free sites across the world. As the number of memories exploded in a matter of months, it was easy to download a lifetime worth of memories that were not your own. What defined a human being if it wasn't memory? Their personality? Personality is shaped by genes but also by life events. Memory was now an open domain for all to experience any event anyone else wanted to share...and share they did. Everything from sexual encounters, thrill sports, to crime could be found. At the same time, a person's heritage and race was also in question as a definition of one's self. Beyond plastic surgery and sexual identity operations, people could now change everything about them. Some did it via virtual imagery, some through a slave robot, but many allotted to swapping their body out altogether. The only part organic that remained was the brain. Sexual preference, racial profiling, and gender roles simply didn't matter in the wake of undefined human identity. Alarmists feared a growing insanity was about to burst--as individuals with no roots, heritage, or race would turn to anarchy. Although a few did, most...turned to Archon. A city with no heritage was the perfect refuge for those abandoning their old lives. This new demographic refused to envy the past, only learn the mistakes made then. National paranoia developed in many countries as what defined their sovereignty was also in question. Fanatics from nearly every religion accused those abandoning their flesh as renouncing god and dozens of prosthetics fell to hate crimes since emerging into the public. Even still, prosthetics could still be defined as human, as they had a human brain. But a human brain in an artificial body filled with synthetic and surrogate memories can hardly be considered human. Mankind had just learned to accept the growing nugenic population--people whose god-given genes were modified against nature's will by parents looking to improve upon the design.

Robots, on the other hand, were an easy target for hate. Few looked human and those that did could only barely simulate human responses. Even the companion robots, believable in almost every way, still lacked a certain spark. Despite the arguments of their owners, robots didn't have souls or personalities. Artificial Intelligence was just that, a simulated intelligence that mimicked behavior through programming rather than a soul. No matter how intelligent they got, or how human they appeared, they were not sentient. Then the virtuants appeared.

Virtuants are created in a program simulation similar to the basic building blocks of DNA and genes. The basic disposition is formed using algorithms meant to mimic a newborn. The synthetic personality is then grown with artificial and surrogate memories, shaped by their into the exact final form as ordered by the buyer. Virtuants are aware of their purpose and are raised with the desire to carry it out, forgoing the need of parameters and failsafes. Virtuants lived their youth with fake memories but, upon emerging into the real one, begin creating their own. Virtuants are generally not allowed to telepresence outside of the location of their central server and the majority don't wish to. They seldom want to experience synthetic memories. Even total immersions virtual experiences seldom excite them (although, since they are each as different as normal people, exceptions do occur). Virtuants use human-based prosthetic bodies which are indistinguishable from ones used by organic brains. Only visible marking allows others to tell them apart from prosthetics. They also have true personalities, not a series of programmed responses. They act human and look as human as most others encountered, yet society refuses to accept them as such. Unlike some organic humans living through the memories of others and producing nothing with their intellect, virtuants strive to earn their place. Despite their worth in society, they have yet to earn the same rights as their masters.

As this new consciousness grows and expands, newer extremes have emerged. This includes humans with no body, wired directly into a machine without a prosthetic, or humans that have implanted so many of their memories in digital storage, they have been able to swap out more and more of their own organic brain. If a human is able to transfer his or her intellect to a machine, would that intelligence have rights? What would define it as being human? In addition, it has been theorized that a cloned human brain with cybernetic implants may be implanted with a virtuant personality. Would that be a human? As the progressive side of humanity pushes further into future, the disparage between them and the traditionalist side widens. As this traditional segment of the popular grows more fearful and fanatical, it threatens to tear certain countries apart. Archon is seen as the flagship of this new self identity and the center point where like minded individuals congregate.
#97

carbon_dragon

Aug 11, 2009 14:12:53
I have two questions based on my reading the Amethyst Adventure. I know that it's not exactly the same system and I didn't even see the Amethyst game book, but based on that:

1. Amethyst was constrained by the damage that at-wills and encounter powers were supposed to do at low levels such that even heavy weapons (such as an assault rifle or a machinegun) appeared to have damage levels way under what they should be relative to say a crossbow. Is that the case in this game? Am I going to find M-16s doing d8 damage in the same game as a crossbow doing the same?

2. Is the game book going to be available at Gencon?

Thanks.
#98

SerenaDawn

Aug 12, 2009 3:24:06
Here we go again...

Let me say again that the idea that a 13 gram bullet somehow doing more damage that a 450 gram arrow is not realistic. Guns were easy to master and gave you amazing range. That was their edge. Even taking velocity into account....ok....Can't do that here. This is an Amethyst post...I'll make it there. I'll get my data down and get my facts straight...

Amethyst will not be ready by GenCon though I am sure the Hearts of Chaos module may be available. Seek out Goodman's booth and let them know you await Amethyst. Ask when it will be available. Show your support. Some guys will be doing some HOC modules there.
#99

Cyber-Dave

Aug 16, 2009 20:03:03
I am pretty sure that the FTLB of bullets are actually much higher than the FTLB of crossbows or arrows, despite the bullets lower grain size, due to its much higher velocity. But, I am not 100% sure. I would need to double check the math to empirically make that claim.

That being said, its a game, not a physics class.
#100

talaxar

Aug 16, 2009 20:21:57
yah been working on this (prices are in global dollars, that is silver pieces).

Rev Wires Level 10+
A highly invasive surgery has allowed your body to move at high speed and lethality
Lvl 10 50,000Ṩ , Lvl 30 31,250,000Ṩ
Lvl 20 1,250,000Ṩ
Item Slot: Muscle
Healing Surge Drain: 3 surges
Property: This item grants an additional action point that you can spend once per encounter (but never more than one per
round). This extra action point is in addition to your standard
once per milestone point, and does not interfere with that
one’s use. Therefore, this item lets you use more than one
action point per encounter (two in fact).
Additionally, you receive a +2 bonus to initiative.
Level 20: 2 extra action points per encounter (+4 to initiative).
Level 30: 3 extra action points per encounter (+6 to initiative).
Special: You receive a -2 penalty to all Charisma based skills
except Intimidate because you constantly twitch violently.

VIA-Wire Level 8+
This specialized piece of cybernetics, allows the user to merge with a vehicle or other large machine, granting increased reaction time and better control.
Lvl 8 34,000Ṩ, Lvl 28 21,250,000Ṩ
Lvl 18 850,000Ṩ
Item Slot: Muscle
Healing Surge Drain: 2 surges
Property: This item drastically improves driving skill. It
grants an additional action point that you can spend once per encounter (but never more than one per round). This extra action point is in addition to your standard once per milestone point, and does not interfere with that one’s use. Therefore, this item lets you use more than one action point per encounter (two in fact).
However, this additional action point can only be spent performing vehicle related actions including: driving, attacking with vehicle mounted weapons, or using sensor equipment. For sake of simplicity, buildings and any other large technology is a vehicle as well.
This item requires a minor action to connect to the vehicle in question, once connected you cannot leave the vehicle, but you can disconnect with a free action.
Additionally, you receive a +2 item bonus to Pilot.
Level 20: 2 extra action points per encounter (+4 to Pilot).
Level 30: 3 extra action points per encounter (+6 to Pilot).


Adrenal Booster Level 5
Your adrenalin glands have been upgraded with reflex control valves that regulate the release of high powered adrenalin, while your heart has a safety regulator to limit overdosing.
Lvl 5 10,000Ṩ, Lvl 25 6,250,000Ṩ
Lvl 15 250,000Ṩ
Slot: Heart
Healing Surge Drain: 1 surge
Property: This item grants a +4 bonus to initiative.
Level 15: +8 bonus to initiative.
Level 25: +12 bonus to initiative.


Body Box Compartment Level 1
A very small and hidden compartment is implanted around your intestines, unfortunately some of them had to be removed, but you don’t get stomach cramps all the time.
Wondrous Item: 3,600Ṩ
Property: This item allows you to hide a small item within a secret compartment somewhere on your body. The item must have a concealability rating of 16 or higher, and weigh less than 10 grams.

Cybergill Level 5
A small filter has been attached to the lower part of your trachea, just above your lungs. It catches water and immediately separates it into breathable oxygen and hydrogen that is vented out through a valve in your chest.
Item Slot: Lungs 10,000Ṩ
Property: This cybernetic item allows you to breathe underwater with no risk of drowning.

Emergency Medical Unit Level 9
An automated medic kit has been implanted near your aorta artery allowing drugs to be administered immediately throughout your body.
Item Slot: Heart 42,000Ṩ
Power (Daily): Minor Action. You regain hit points as if you had spent two healing surges.

Nanite EMU Level 14
This improved version of an emergency med unit has microscopic robots designed to repair damaged cells in a very efficient manner.
Item Slot: Heart 210,000Ṩ
Healing Surge Drain: 1 surge
Property: You gain regeneration 5 when bloodied. If you are at negative hit points you can spend a healing surge as a free action and return to life with the appropriate hit points.
Power (Daily): Minor Action. You regain hit points as if you had spent two healing surges.


Carbon Fiber Bone Lacing Level 3
This is the first stage of bone lacing technology. A very durable alloy made from carbon nano-tubes woven into a mesh that is molded to your bone structure.
Item Slot: Bone 3,600Ṩ
Healing Surge Drain: 1 surge
Property: This item grants resistance to critical hits from all un-typed damage. Roll a d10 and if the result is a 1 the attack is just an ordinary hit.


Titanium Bone Lacing Level 8
This is the second level of bone lacing technology. Plated titanium has been grafted to the largest areas of bone, on top of the carbon fiber mesh.
Item Slot: Bone 34,000Ṩ
Healing Surge Drain: 2 surges
Property: This item grants resistance to critical hits from all un-typed damage. Roll a d10 and if the result is a 3 or lower the attack is just an ordinary hit.
Also, when an effect causes you to move, such as a push or pull, you can lessen the effect by 1 square.


Mithral Bone Lacing Level 12
The third level of bone lacing uses a mithral mesh to surround your bones in place of the carbon fiber material.
Item Slot: Bone 130,000Ṩ
Healing Surge Drain: 1 surge
Property: This item grants resistance to critical hits from all un-typed damage. Roll a d10 and if the result is a 3 or lower the attack is just an ordinary hit.


Adamantium Bone Lacing Level 16
The fourth level of bone lacing tech is similar to titanium in design, but uses large plates of indestructible adamantium mounted to the mithral base.
Item Slot: Bone 450,000Ṩ
Healing Surge Drain: 3 surges
Property: This item grants resistance to critical hits from all un-typed damage. Roll a d10 and if the result is a 4 or lower the attack is just an ordinary hit.
Also, when an effect causes you to move, such as a push or pull, you can lessen the effect by 2 squares.

Uberinum Bone Lacing Level 23
The most advanced form of bone lacing is a thick mesh molded around your bones that’s made of the practically unbreakable and lightweight metal uberinum.
Item Slot: Bone 4,250,000Ṩ
Healing Surge Drain: 2 surges
Property: This item grants resistance to critical hits from all un-typed damage. Roll a d10 and if the result is a 5 or lower the attack is just an ordinary hit.


Flex Hands Level 7
Your hands have been replaced with bendable bones and electronic muscle, allowing it to collapse and disjoin.
Item Slot: Hands 26,000Ṩ
Property: +2 bonus to Acrobatics checks to escape from restraints, and a +2 bonus to Thievery checks for sleight of hand actions.






Gunlink Level 2+
This amazing device links your mind with a firearm, using your brain’s sense impulses to imprint an imaginary crosshair in your field of view. Higher grade versions compensate your aim or even pull the trigger for you.
Lvl 2 8,400Ṩ, Lvl 24 5,250,000Ṩ
Lvl 14 210,000Ṩ
Healing Surge Drain: 1 surge
Property: This item grants you a +1 bonus to attacks when using a firearm equipped with a smartlink system.
Level 12: +2 bonus.
Level 22: +3 bonus.
#101

carbon_dragon

Aug 17, 2009 13:41:18
Here we go again...

Let me say again that the idea that a 13 gram bullet somehow doing more damage that a 450 gram arrow is not realistic. Guns were easy to master and gave you amazing range. That was their edge. Even taking velocity into account....ok....Can't do that here. This is an Amethyst post...I'll make it there. I'll get my data down and get my facts straight...

Amethyst will not be ready by GenCon though I am sure the Hearts of Chaos module may be available. Seek out Goodman's booth and let them know you await Amethyst. Ask when it will be available. Show your support. Some guys will be doing some HOC modules there.

I suspect neither of us are experts. However there are two ways to think about this. One is the "common sense" approach, and one is the scientific approach. The common sense approach goes like this -- If what you were saying is true, we'd still be using crossbows and not rifles, and certainly not flintlocks, wheellocks, or matchlocks. So on it's face your contention seems unlikely to me.

Then there is the scientific approach. That small bullet is going at supersonic speeds through that body. Typically bullets are designed to tumble or deform in order to make the wound channel bigger and dig a bigger path of destruction through the body -- WAY more than an arrow ever would. Then there is hydrostatic shock. That is what happens when the shockwave from a bullet is propogated through the body by means of the water we're mostly made of. Getting shot with a 22 can be fatal but doesn't give you many of these effects. But being shot with an M-16 or an AK-47 or a Weatherby rifle is another story altogether. And go to a .50 sniper rifle and you won't even be there after the shot.

No guns are NOT crossbows and the wounds they make aren't the same either. Phoenix Command is an old game that models what a bullet does to you with great accuracy. It's worth a look if you can find it.

Another common sense sanity check is that the d20 Modern setting (WotC's own modern setting in the 3.5 world) has guns doing more damage than crossbows.

If I run a modern game I want a set of rules I believe in, and naturally I would expect you to do the same.

I did go by Goodman's booth and talk to them about Amethyst. Thanks for your reply.
#102

bone_naga

Aug 17, 2009 14:05:04
Check the Amethyst thread, SD posted a very good explanation of the differences between crossbows and bullets there. Also, D&D is abstract, and while a bullet can kill you dead, so can an axe to the face. So there's not much reason for a bullet (at least not until you get into the heavier weapons, like an M2 or M107) to do more damage than an axe or sword.

And ballistics aside, the range alone gives guns a huge advantage, and while early firearms were slow to reload, with semi and full auto weapons you have a huge advantage there. So its not really fair to say that we would never have taken up firearms if they didn't do more damage. Hell, the US Army went from a 7.62 down to a 5.56, and from a .45 to a 9mm, so apparently damage isn't everything ;)
#103

narukagami

Aug 17, 2009 16:22:18
Firearms do more damage because they create a MUCH larger wound channel, fragment, tumble, create a larger entry wound, and can turn an area of your insides the size of a football into hamburger with a projectile the size of a pea due to all the above, their velocity, and numerous other factors. An arrow or crossbow bolt simply doesn't compare.

If you don't know these basics then I don't know if I can trust the quality of your product.
#104

bone_naga

Aug 17, 2009 16:43:38
Firearms do more damage because they create a MUCH larger wound channel, fragment, tumble, create a larger entry wound, and can turn an area of your insides the size of a football into hamburger with a projectile the size of a pea due to all the above, their velocity, and numerous other factors. An arrow or crossbow bolt simply doesn't compare.

If you don't know these basics then I don't know if I can trust the quality of your product.

Sometimes a sword goes right through your heart, sometimes it grazes you. Sometimes a bullet tumbles around and hits all your internal organs, and sometimes it passes clean through, hitting no organs, bone, arteries, or nerves. Anyone that can survive an axe to the face can survive a bullet. This is an abstract combat system, after all. Besides, there is game balance to consider as well.

And again, he posted an excellent post in the Amethyst thread. Take a look at it.
#105

tylara67

Aug 17, 2009 17:58:15
I suspect neither of us are experts. However there are two ways to think about this. One is the "common sense" approach, and one is the scientific approach. The common sense approach goes like this -- If what you were saying is true, we'd still be using crossbows and not rifles, and certainly not flintlocks, wheellocks, or matchlocks. So on it's face your contention seems unlikely to me.

This assertion was answered in the post you quoted. The advantage of guns wasn't damage inflicted, it was range and ease of use.

And science? Really? You're worrying about science in a system designed to feature magic prominently? A system that uses non-Euclidean geometry?

Firearm stats should be based on game balance and game balance alone.
#106

talaxar

Aug 17, 2009 18:02:41
no one has any comments on how I handled cybernetics (see above)
#107

carbon_dragon

Aug 17, 2009 19:36:53
This assertion was answered in the post you quoted. The advantage of guns wasn't damage inflicted, it was range and ease of use.

And science? Really? You're worrying about science in a system designed to feature magic prominently? A system that uses non-Euclidean geometry?

Firearm stats should be based on game balance and game balance alone.

No, in d20 modern the advantage was damage inflicted (2d6 to 2d12). But your point that D&D bears no relation to reality is a good point. D&D is indeed a bad place to look for realistic physics of any kind -- or even a mediocre treatment of fireams for a modern setting.

If it's any consolation to you, it's clear that WotC is firmly in your camp in regards to game balance. I do not believe that will change in 4e and that is why I don't think 4e will ever be stretched to successfully create a good modern setting. It would, as you indicate, violate a basic assumption of the game. For that we will have to use other RPGs.

My group is trying WoD to get our gun fix at the moment.
#108

Chandrak

Aug 17, 2009 20:34:16
(Removed, the point was already made, no need to repeat it).
#109

SerenaDawn

Aug 17, 2009 20:47:20
I have asked my comrade, Conan Veitch, to voice his opinion on this debate as he is much more learned in historical facts. Before he does, let me say a few things...

...Once again, if you read THIS article elsewhere on this site, you will see my opinion on the facts. Bullets are smaller but move faster so they have hydraulic shock on their side. Arrows have mass and lot more and different forms of energy on their side to help with penetration, which assists in wound infliction. In the end, once you account for all these variables...you have to acknowledge that any real world justification for firearm damages in 4ED is utterly pointless. This doesn't change the original debate that deals with what does more "damage". Well damage in game terms and lethality are two different things. For one, that article shows (and all evidence I have acquired proves) that arrows penetrate further with less energy applied than a bullet. If you fired a bullet with the energy in an arrow, it would be an annoyance. If you fired an arrow at the speed of a bullet....ewww.

...I honestly cannot comment on your cybernetics Talaxar. For one, I have a 15,000 word chapter in NeuroSpasta on the same subject and I don't want to give the impression you influenced our approach in anyway. You should post that in its own thread so it can get the proper attention it deserves.

...Bone Naga. Thanks. It's good to know people are figuring this out. When you list a rifle as doing 2d10, you automatically class it as doing more damage to the human body as a great axe through your torso. There is simply no way to accommodate every variable in the 4ED system without adding in so many new rules to turn off the new players. Amethyst and NeuroSpasta has enough problems as it is adding in these rules. There is nothing to be gained by bogging it down with location hits and infection.

...Finally, everyone seems to be making judgments on game without reading it. Both games use powers that detail these very same random elements to hits. So I'll leave you with the NAMES of some of powers in Amethyst and NeuroSpasta. I hope that will renew faltering confidence...

Aggravate the Wound
Off the Skull
Strafe
Covering Fire
Standing Barrage
Short Controlled Burst
Creeping Barrage
Stacking Burst
Wildfire Blitz
Overwatch
System Shock
Blood Poisoning
Head Shot
Lockdown Advance
Cripple over Kill
Internal Ricochet
Systemic Inflammatory Response
Penetrable Shot
Eye-Shot
No Exit Wound
Use the Mil Dot
Found the Sweet Spot
Magic Bullet
Adjusting Windage and Parallax
C-C-Combo Breaker
Flawless Victory
Knock-out Button
Roundhouse Attack
Total Submission
#110

brokenjade

Aug 30, 2009 22:25:04

This sounds like it will be one hell of a setting.  I am intrigued by what i have read so far and this is definatly a setting to watch.


I am curious if there is a proposed release date yet or are you not at liberty to say.


 


I am in full support of you guys and am also keeping an eye out for Amethyst

#111

SerenaDawn

Aug 31, 2009 16:59:25

Both eyes, hopefully.  NeuroSpasta's release depends on Amethyst's release and success.  Pure and simple.  NS also has a longer playtest process as it messes with the status quo way more than any 3rd party product on the market.  Yes, I am making that statement and I am open to people daring me another product pushes the envelope more. 

#112

brokenjade

Sep 02, 2009 0:37:27

I appreciate the long playtesting it makes for a better product.  The only other company that playtests as much as you guys to generat a fine product is Pinnacle Entertainment Group the creators of Savage Worlds


 


4e and Savage Worlds are the only game systems i work with curentl everything i else i mine for ideas

#113

SerenaDawn

Sep 03, 2009 2:54:02

I was going to talk about hacking today but I had a chance to read the Skill Powers preview from DnD Insider. Basically, players can now elect to choose a power based on skills they have training in over their class. I think this is another great idea and one I wish we had thought of. The ladder system is similar in idea but not in application. Skill Powers are obviously skill base and only require your training in a skill to select it. Ladders are entire assortment of attack and utility powers are based around your character's attribute build. You can still choose skill powers instead of your class or ladder abilities and this offers unlimited options of variety. That being said, many of the Acrobat skill powers can be found with the Runner Ladder and the Runner ladder offers you additional character creation abilities as well as boosts at later levels. Expect us to incorporate elements of the later PHBs into NeuroSpasta as time marches on...


..Except their vehicles...still not good enough for us.


#114

SerenaDawn

Sep 24, 2009 1:50:17

As for NeuroSpasta, it continues to grow and perfect itself. Just yesterday, we added expanded rules with the garrote, including feats and an assassin paragon path with abilities and powers that use the garrote exclusively. Following that, we are developing an expansion to the Engineer skill to include sabotage. And after popular request, we have included alternate ammunition for your favorite weapons. This includes tracer, armor piercing, and hollow point rounds. Explosives have been expanded and we recently included a new rule to allow players to create their own skill challenges to enemies (and vice versa).


One an unrelated topic involving equipment, a recent...ahem...colorful conversation with someone else on the WOTC board has given me the inspiration to play with finances. I am inspired by the Wheel of Fortune...yes, Wheel of Fortune. You remember those final rounds of WoF. Contestants were allows to pick 5 consonants and a vowel. Well, they always picked RSTLNE, without fail. So eventually, the show just gave them those for free and asked them to pick a few more (of course, those ended being all the same as well). We are doing that same thing. So all classes are being given options for standard equipment. Non-combat classes are given substantially more than combat classes (just 'cause). This way, 1st level equipment carries costs that are more realistic. There are still substantial options for standard equipment but it seemed ridiculous to make a sniper class pay for his sniper weapon.


Finally, I am leaving you with concept art for NeuroSpasta. These do not represent final visions but concepts in progress. As always, all artwork is by Nick Greenwood...


power_armor.jpg


 


attack_helicopter.jpg


Kaaris_FSP_Jessica.jpg


AAV.jpg

#115

SerenaDawn

Oct 13, 2009 3:20:17

    Have you ever wondered how the world would ACTUALLY change in 80 years?  Look back 80 years from today as examples.  Countries we hear about every day, like Israel and Iran, were both declared in this time period.  In my lifetime alone, we saw the largest single nation on Earth shatter into a half-dozen smaller republics.  After that, another country, far smaller, got drawn into a civil war which created splinter nations of only a few hundred thousand people.  Other countries were considered property of a monarch, including my own.  We have the fall of the Soviet Union, the rise of Japan as an economic superpower, and seen the transfer of power from kings and military juntas to democracies across the world.  We have witnessed the greatest nations disintegrate and the rise of superpowers from the brink of collapse. 

    As NeuroSpasta's rules chugs along in playtesting, I have returned to working on its setting.  I realized to make a sensible timeframe, I need to explain everything, at least for my own personal records.  In aid in that, I have started writing a brief history of every country of consequence over the next 80 years. From the creation of the republic of Palestine to a reunification of Korea, I've left no stone unturned.  I imagine this may take a while.  I understand some choices may seem bizarre, others may appear blatantly controversial.  Some countries won't be mentioned as they are not expected to change (like France...seriously, what would you expect).  However, I do go into minute details if they affect the overlying geopolitical landscape.  I understand readers may not be interested in the goings-on between Bangladesh and India or why Lebanon regained the title of "Paris of the Middle East".  No one asks what goes on in Ghana in today's news.  I hope, by creating this rich tapestry of political conflict, it will serve to inspire adventures with some credence to them. 

    I am currently still debating if I should divide the United States or not.  I sunk half of the Netherlands and shattered the economy of Kuwait.  You may think that's cruel, but this afternoon, I wiped out Maldives.
 
Nuff said...

#116

SerenaDawn

Oct 28, 2009 3:01:22

SNAKES AND...


 



 


After nearly a year, we are ready to talk about one the most important concept in the history of this company, Ladders.  Very few companies out there have made a serious effort to radically alter the rules of 4th Edition D&D.  Of course, when I mean alter, what I mean is, amend and add to.  Already, we made a huge step with the addition of modern and futuristic firearms.  It wasn't enough to just give them damage values and ranges; we needed to construct a system which had to be rigorously tested (and still is). 


 



 


NeuroSpasta implements a change as radical as modern firearm rules are with Amethyst.   The reason we didn't incorporate this system with Amethyst was twofold.  For one, it didn't exist yet, but more importantly, making the character generation of modern characters more complicated than their fantasy counterparts in the same campaign setting may discourage people from attempting those roles.  But if we separate this element into its own game, away from fantasy, it makes this additional level of complication easier to swallow.  Of course, for players still wanting to slot in these new rules, they can. 


 



 


This new system is called the Ladder system.  We hope that this bundle of new GSL-compliant rules would be universal for all DEM products and as such, all Dungeons & Dragons products.  We could implement the ladders not only with NeuroSpasta, but every other campaign world we release using 4th Edition mechanics. 


 



 


As some of you have previously read, the ladder system implements two important concepts. 


 



 


1:  It thoroughly reduces the number of available powers for classes.  Where a fantasy class would have 70+ powers from levels 1-30, a class using our system only has between 30 and 40.  Thus, we can include more classes in our books.  The majority of these classes are also single builds.  So if we were making a ranger, there would be two distinct ranger classes, a dual wielding blade master and an archer.  Think this is limiting?  Wait. 


 



 


2:  The inclusion of ladders.  Ladders define what your character is like rather than the role he or she plays.  It represents abilities and powers based not on your vocation in life, but your natural talents either chosen or bestowed from birth.  As such a ladder does not have a boiler plate of defining a role, proficiencies, hit points or healing surges.  In fact most ladders give you none of these.


 



 


Originally, ladders were only meant to offset the lack of scaling magic in a modern setting like NeuroSpasta with the intent of drastically reducing the obsessive need to always acquire money.  The ladder offered you free "magic" effectively as you developed.  This later expanded to include level 1 abilities as well as alternate powers, all based around a common theme with the ladder you've chosen.


 



 


So, at first level1, before choosing a class, you select a ladder.  Each ladder focuses on two dominant attributes.  We chose two instead of one because we didn't feel focusing only on one would be fun or realistic. 


 



 


Here are our ladders:


 



 


Born Leader:  Charisma, Intelligence


 


Juggernaut:  Constitution, Strength   


 


Runner:  Dexterity, Wisdom


 


Savant:  Intelligence, Wisdom


 


Veteran:  Charisma, Wisdom


 


Warrior:  Dexterity, Strength


 



 


Each ladder first lists features a character gains at 1st level.  These initial abilities are huge, as they not only alter your character's outlook, the actually altar the class you will later choose.  If you select warrior ladder, you can use Dexterity for all your melee attack powers regardless of what your class indicates.  If you select the juggernaut ladder, you can use Constitution for your ranged attacks when employing two handed or heavy weapons.  Pushing this further, a savant ladder is able to drop attack powers in favor of more utility powers.  Nearly every ladder has some feature which allows you to alter your class.  In addition, there are also alternative powers as you progress.  A warrior has more alternative attack powers while a savant would have more utility powers.  In all, each ladder offers about a dozen+ alternative selections. 


 



 


Not only that, at 3rd, 6th, 11th, 16th, 21st, and 26th level, you gain the option to acquire a free new ability or opt to acquire a financial windfall which you can put towards better weapons or gear. 


 



 


So let us turn back to the ranger example.  As stated, a ladder-based ranger would be two classes, a swordmaster and an archer.  Those are two character builds.  With the six ladders we have included thus far, you now have twelve...twelve different distinctive variations of those two classes.  Twelve different ways you can approach a ranger.  Wanna make a ranger that can run across tree branches scale over buildings like a parkour master, select the runner ladder.  Want a ranger that is also the leader of armies and the proud icon of authority, select the born leader. 


 



 


The initial fear was that certain ladder/class combinations were obvious choices for power gamers.  Although we knew this couldn't be prevented, we discovered, to our amazement, that nearly every class didn't have one obvious choice.  Our playtesters discovered new strengths with combinations we never knew existed.  With NeuroSpasta's 10 classes and 6 ladders, that introduces 60 combinations in just a little more space than that of the PHB's class chapter. 


 



 


When we asked our testers if this added level of complexity was too much despite the variety, we discovered they were welcomed with open arms.  Of course, the ladder system is designed only to work with the modern classes we are making for NeuroSpasta and others future games.  There are currently no plans to go backwards and start playing with fantasy classes, though this could change.  Future products could add more ladders but would most likely add new classes, as each new class would represent six new builds. 


 


 


So what do we have in our gaming group?


 


Veteran--Sniper


 


Born Leader--Combat Authority


 


Juggernaut--Heavy


 


Savant--Manipulator


 


Runner--Infiltrator


 


Warrior--Man-At-Arms


 



 


And you can now see why the ladder system will require almost as much playtesting as the original DUNGEONS & DRAGONS rules.  And yes...playtesters are still welcome...


 



 

#117

ChrisTheS

Oct 30, 2009 11:54:44

Sounds very shiny.  I'd like to playtest, but you know my situation - no 4e group, no 4e playtesting

#118

SerenaDawn

Dec 03, 2009 21:21:39
We have our first piece of official Neurospasta internal artwork, one of our favorite robots.

 


Robot4-Website-Large.jpg



Additionally, we have created a whole slew of universal opponents which can be modified with one of several templates to adept them for any purpose.  You can have terrorists, special forces, civilian mobs, or even robots.  After a dozen or so pages of opponents, our names for these got a little strange...




Ill-Equipped Combatant        


Man with Pipe Wrench


Phallic Compensator


Bell-Tower Bastard


Ammo Waster


Machine Gun Menace


Flesh Fortress


Pyrophiliac



 


Yes, I could have called him a Pyromaniac but...hmm...it's been done.  So here is how it works.  We have eight templates you can apply to our seventeen non-unique troops.  Here is an example:


 



Regimented


Regimented units work as a team and must deploy in numbers in an encounter to be effective.  On their own, they are useless.  Unlike a mob however, these forces have undergone training to work together, and as such are not known for acts of stupidity like breaking from a line.


The adversary gains a +2 enhancement bonus to AC while adjacent to another adversary.  In addition, the adversary gains the immediate reaction power Combat Drill.


Combat Drill (immediate reaction; when an ally shifts into or out of an adjacent square)


The adversary may shift one square.



And then you can apply it to any of these universal opponents like this...



Ammo Waster (Ranged)                   Level 5 Minion




Medium Natural Humanoid                XP 50


Initiative +4                                                                Senses Perception +3


HP 1; a missed attack never damages a minion


AC 21; Fortitude 14, Reflex 15, Will 14, Firewall 19


Hardness 1




Speed 6


RBA SMG (standard; at will) * Weapon




            Ranged 10/20 +9; vs. AC; 5 damage; AP 1


Wild Spray (move action; at will)




            The adversary must hit with its ranged basic attack. Immediately after resolving damage it may make one SMG attack against an enemy adjacent to the target.


Alignment Any                                              Languages Any         


Skills Intimidate +7, Stealth +9


Str 13 (+3)      Dex 14 (+4)     Wis 12 (+3)


Con 12 (+3)    Int 12 (+3)      Cha 11 (+2)


Equipment SMG




 



 



 

#119

Cyber-Dave

Dec 09, 2009 16:06:42
Gah. I can't wait to purchase this. Any news on when Amethyst will be purchasable in book form? That will at least tide me over for a little whitle untio Neuro becomes available...