Going with the GSL - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Going with the GSL

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
arthnek_the_boar_dup
Aug 24, 2008 11:14:51 I have a free first edition based campaign setting I put out afew books for about a year ago.

I think I'll go ahead and write it up for 4th edition and put it out under the GSL after the revision is up and all of the dates make it a-ok to do so. I had not been planning to publish it otherwise so its a fairly safe test run for me and frankly I'm pretty jazzed to walk through the process and see how it goes.

If there is an interest I'll post non-sales pitch / info oriented posts somewhere appropriate on the boards here to let people know how it goes for me.

Arthnek
#2
tfvanguard
Aug 24, 2008 13:04:42 I would strongly advise waiting until the new GSL comes out.
#3
ranger_reg
Aug 24, 2008 23:55:42 First: Talk to a lawyer.
Second: Talk to a lawyer.
Third: Talk to a lawyer.
#4
charke
Aug 25, 2008 1:54:16
First: Talk to a lawyer.
Second: Talk to a lawyer.
Third: Talk to a lawyer.
DISCLAIMER: I Am Not A Lawyer

Now THERE's a signature!

Mark Charke
#5
fatumd20
Aug 25, 2008 8:18:34 I would also recommend talking to a lawyer just to make sure you are comfortable with the GSL. Then, if you are, go for it!

What kind of setting is it?
#6
scribble
Aug 25, 2008 16:20:17
First: Talk to a lawyer.
Second: Talk to a lawyer.
Third: Talk to a lawyer.

Just make sure you never talk to him/her about Fight Club.
#7
ranger_reg
Aug 25, 2008 19:54:01
Now THERE's a signature!

I'm just protecting myself. :P
#8
arthnek_the_boar_dup
Aug 25, 2008 23:55:48 Ok. Thanks for the advice guys. I will bounce the revised GSL off an attorney after it becomes available and before I test the waters.

That said I thought I should be clear that this is a bit of writing I hadn't really planned to publish in the first place. I mean I like the setting alot, don't get me wrong...but from my perspective I can only come out ahead on this particular deal.

I would be much more cautious with an existing product or one I felt had a real potential for going places. As it stands this is just a fun little side project.

Arthnek
#9
Fenian
Aug 28, 2008 22:31:01 What if despite your expectations the setting is massively popular and rivals FR and Eberron in market share.

Do you want to be THAT guy who has a winner that he sold away for a fraction of the value. Its unlikey sure but hey its happened before in other industries (and probably this one as well).
#10
ranger_reg
Aug 29, 2008 13:29:38
Ok. Thanks for the advice guys. I will bounce the revised GSL off an attorney after it becomes available and before I test the waters.

That said I thought I should be clear that this is a bit of writing I hadn't really planned to publish in the first place. I mean I like the setting alot, don't get me wrong...but from my perspective I can only come out ahead on this particular deal.

I would be much more cautious with an existing product or one I felt had a real potential for going places. As it stands this is just a fun little side project.

Arthnek

Maybe you should hold off on getting a lawyer if this is just a pet project and you're not ready to distribute yet.
#11
totoro
Sep 07, 2008 1:45:55
Maybe you should hold off on getting a lawyer if this is just a pet project and you're not ready to distribute yet.

Yeah. Don't waste your money. You don't need the GSL to express your creativity.

Write up the setting and don't copy anything from the WotC books. If you want to copy something, simply refer to it by page number in the appropriate rulebook and resist the urge. If you don't copy anything, you are fine. (And if you are using the product in your own personal game, not selling it, you can go ahead and copy what you want from the core rulebooks.)

If it ends up that your setting becomes popular/profitable, then you can ask for permission to fill in those references with inline text copied from the core rulebooks. If that is granted by the GSL, it is a great idea because it makes your product more user-friendly.

This all assumes you aren't labeling your product in a manner that causes confusion as to the source, but you are free to say that the product would work with 4e.

It also assumes WotC doesn't have an unpublished patent that covers some important aspect of 4e. That would certainly make the GSL more worthwhile!
#12
avengergreed
Sep 26, 2008 1:00:46
Yeah. Don't waste your money. You don't need the GSL to express your creativity.

Write up the setting and don't copy anything from the WotC books. If you want to copy something, simply refer to it by page number in the appropriate rulebook and resist the urge. If you don't copy anything, you are fine. (And if you are using the product in your own personal game, not selling it, you can go ahead and copy what you want from the core rulebooks.)

If it ends up that your setting becomes popular/profitable, then you can ask for permission to fill in those references with inline text copied from the core rulebooks. If that is granted by the GSL, it is a great idea because it makes your product more user-friendly.

This all assumes you aren't labeling your product in a manner that causes confusion as to the source, but you are free to say that the product would work with 4e.

It also assumes WotC doesn't have an unpublished patent that covers some important aspect of 4e. That would certainly make the GSL more worthwhile!

What the likelyhood that some parts are 4e patented and lurking under software patents for DDI insider or for Atari Video Games?

You think thats possible?
#13
Nylanfs
Sep 26, 2008 16:32:24 again ... can't patent mechanics.
#14
superdeadsmurf
Sep 26, 2008 16:49:28
What the likelyhood that some parts are 4e patented and lurking under software patents for DDI insider or for Atari Video Games?

You think thats possible?

unlikely.
Game mechanics are hard to patent since you usually need some sort of physical mechanical device. They might have some pending applications for some... they take a long time to process.
Pretty sure the only game wizards has a patent on or will ever be granted for games is Magic: The Gathering, which basically (in my understanding) only patents the tapping mechanic and the TCG/CCG idea.
#15
Steveman
Sep 26, 2008 20:19:09
again ... can't patent mechanics.

Mechanics is far too loose of a term to make such a statement about. Now, "you cannot patent the game mechanics of a tabletop RPG" is something different. However, the GSL has tidly and squat to do with patent law, so your statement was kind of a red herring anyway.

The GSL deals with copyright law, a many headed beast who's interpretation is at best fractured among the courts, and at it s worst directly contradicting at time.
WotC can copyright a great many things related to D&D, such as Any monster who's first appearance was within a D&D owned product, such as the monsters Beholder, Rust Monster, Owlbear, etc. They can also copyright any terminology specific to their game that has not already been used elsewhere. Any and all logos and the name D&D itself*.

* obviously no one else can use the name D&D for their products, but some people still think they can print on their materials "compatible with Dungeons and Dragons", which they can not.

Now Patent law can come into play in the movement of the material from tabletop to digital format, as computer code can be both copyrighted and patented. Particularly if a new SDK was created to support making games for the license.

This is as I understand it to the best of my ability, now mind you, my knowledge is not ironclad... as a wise man once said:
"First: Talk to a lawyer.
Second: Talk to a lawyer.
Third: Talk to a lawyer.
DISCLAIMER: I Am Not A Lawyer"
#16
ranger_reg
Sep 26, 2008 23:49:39
again ... can't patent mechanics.

We're not talking about patent. We're talking about copyright.
#17
kythri
Sep 27, 2008 8:01:17
* obviously no one else can use the name D&D for their products, but some people still think they can print on their materials "compatible with Dungeons and Dragons", which they can not.

Wrong wrongity wrong. A statement of compatibility on a supplemental work is neither infringing on or prohibted by a copyright.

http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ34.html

Nor is it infringing on a trademark to make a statement of compatibility. This is why Xerox (a direct competitor with HP) can make toner cartridges for HP LaserJet printers, and state that on the box:

http://www.xerox.com/go/xrx/template/018s.jsp?view=s13&prodID=6R934&Xcntry=USA&Xlang=en_US
#18
ranger_reg
Sep 27, 2008 17:49:15
* obviously no one else can use the name D&D for their products, but some people still think they can print on their materials "compatible with Dungeons and Dragons", which they can not.

Technically you can under the normal IP law. But if you agree to abide by the OGL or GSL, you may not.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 arthnek_the_boar_dup Aug 24, 2008 11:14:51	I have a free first edition based campaign setting I put out afew books for about a year ago. I think I'll go ahead and write it up for 4th edition and put it out under the GSL after the revision is up and all of the dates make it a-ok to do so. I had not been planning to publish it otherwise so its a fairly safe test run for me and frankly I'm pretty jazzed to walk through the process and see how it goes. If there is an interest I'll post non-sales pitch / info oriented posts somewhere appropriate on the boards here to let people know how it goes for me. Arthnek
#2 tfvanguard Aug 24, 2008 13:04:42	I would strongly advise waiting until the new GSL comes out.
#3 ranger_reg Aug 24, 2008 23:55:42	First: Talk to a lawyer. Second: Talk to a lawyer. Third: Talk to a lawyer.
#4 charke Aug 25, 2008 1:54:16	First: Talk to a lawyer. Second: Talk to a lawyer. Third: Talk to a lawyer. DISCLAIMER: I Am Not A Lawyer Now THERE's a signature! Mark Charke
#5 fatumd20 Aug 25, 2008 8:18:34	I would also recommend talking to a lawyer just to make sure you are comfortable with the GSL. Then, if you are, go for it! What kind of setting is it?
#6 scribble Aug 25, 2008 16:20:17	First: Talk to a lawyer. Second: Talk to a lawyer. Third: Talk to a lawyer. Just make sure you never talk to him/her about Fight Club.
#7 ranger_reg Aug 25, 2008 19:54:01	Now THERE's a signature! I'm just protecting myself. :P
#8 arthnek_the_boar_dup Aug 25, 2008 23:55:48	Ok. Thanks for the advice guys. I will bounce the revised GSL off an attorney after it becomes available and before I test the waters. That said I thought I should be clear that this is a bit of writing I hadn't really planned to publish in the first place. I mean I like the setting alot, don't get me wrong...but from my perspective I can only come out ahead on this particular deal. I would be much more cautious with an existing product or one I felt had a real potential for going places. As it stands this is just a fun little side project. Arthnek
#9 Fenian Aug 28, 2008 22:31:01	What if despite your expectations the setting is massively popular and rivals FR and Eberron in market share. Do you want to be THAT guy who has a winner that he sold away for a fraction of the value. Its unlikey sure but hey its happened before in other industries (and probably this one as well).
#10 ranger_reg Aug 29, 2008 13:29:38	Ok. Thanks for the advice guys. I will bounce the revised GSL off an attorney after it becomes available and before I test the waters. That said I thought I should be clear that this is a bit of writing I hadn't really planned to publish in the first place. I mean I like the setting alot, don't get me wrong...but from my perspective I can only come out ahead on this particular deal. I would be much more cautious with an existing product or one I felt had a real potential for going places. As it stands this is just a fun little side project. Arthnek Maybe you should hold off on getting a lawyer if this is just a pet project and you're not ready to distribute yet.
#11 totoro Sep 07, 2008 1:45:55	Maybe you should hold off on getting a lawyer if this is just a pet project and you're not ready to distribute yet. Yeah. Don't waste your money. You don't need the GSL to express your creativity. Write up the setting and don't copy anything from the WotC books. If you want to copy something, simply refer to it by page number in the appropriate rulebook and resist the urge. If you don't copy anything, you are fine. (And if you are using the product in your own personal game, not selling it, you can go ahead and copy what you want from the core rulebooks.) If it ends up that your setting becomes popular/profitable, then you can ask for permission to fill in those references with inline text copied from the core rulebooks. If that is granted by the GSL, it is a great idea because it makes your product more user-friendly. This all assumes you aren't labeling your product in a manner that causes confusion as to the source, but you are free to say that the product would work with 4e. It also assumes WotC doesn't have an unpublished patent that covers some important aspect of 4e. That would certainly make the GSL more worthwhile!
#12 avengergreed Sep 26, 2008 1:00:46	Yeah. Don't waste your money. You don't need the GSL to express your creativity. Write up the setting and don't copy anything from the WotC books. If you want to copy something, simply refer to it by page number in the appropriate rulebook and resist the urge. If you don't copy anything, you are fine. (And if you are using the product in your own personal game, not selling it, you can go ahead and copy what you want from the core rulebooks.) If it ends up that your setting becomes popular/profitable, then you can ask for permission to fill in those references with inline text copied from the core rulebooks. If that is granted by the GSL, it is a great idea because it makes your product more user-friendly. This all assumes you aren't labeling your product in a manner that causes confusion as to the source, but you are free to say that the product would work with 4e. It also assumes WotC doesn't have an unpublished patent that covers some important aspect of 4e. That would certainly make the GSL more worthwhile! What the likelyhood that some parts are 4e patented and lurking under software patents for DDI insider or for Atari Video Games? You think thats possible?
#13 Nylanfs Sep 26, 2008 16:32:24	again ... can't patent mechanics.
#14 superdeadsmurf Sep 26, 2008 16:49:28	What the likelyhood that some parts are 4e patented and lurking under software patents for DDI insider or for Atari Video Games? You think thats possible? unlikely. Game mechanics are hard to patent since you usually need some sort of physical mechanical device. They might have some pending applications for some... they take a long time to process. Pretty sure the only game wizards has a patent on or will ever be granted for games is Magic: The Gathering, which basically (in my understanding) only patents the tapping mechanic and the TCG/CCG idea.
#15 Steveman Sep 26, 2008 20:19:09	again ... can't patent mechanics. Mechanics is far too loose of a term to make such a statement about. Now, "you cannot patent the game mechanics of a tabletop RPG" is something different. However, the GSL has tidly and squat to do with patent law, so your statement was kind of a red herring anyway. The GSL deals with copyright law, a many headed beast who's interpretation is at best fractured among the courts, and at it s worst directly contradicting at time. WotC can copyright a great many things related to D&D, such as Any monster who's first appearance was within a D&D owned product, such as the monsters Beholder, Rust Monster, Owlbear, etc. They can also copyright any terminology specific to their game that has not already been used elsewhere. Any and all logos and the name D&D itself. obviously no one else can use the name D&D for their products, but some people still think they can print on their materials "compatible with Dungeons and Dragons", which they can not. Now Patent law can come into play in the movement of the material from tabletop to digital format, as computer code can be both copyrighted and patented. Particularly if a new SDK was created to support making games for the license. This is as I understand it to the best of my ability, now mind you, my knowledge is not ironclad... as a wise man once said: "First: Talk to a lawyer. Second: Talk to a lawyer. Third: Talk to a lawyer. DISCLAIMER: I Am Not A Lawyer"
#16 ranger_reg Sep 26, 2008 23:49:39	again ... can't patent mechanics. We're not talking about patent. We're talking about copyright.
#17 kythri Sep 27, 2008 8:01:17	* obviously no one else can use the name D&D for their products, but some people still think they can print on their materials "compatible with Dungeons and Dragons", which they can not. Wrong wrongity wrong. A statement of compatibility on a supplemental work is neither infringing on or prohibted by a copyright. http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ34.html Nor is it infringing on a trademark to make a statement of compatibility. This is why Xerox (a direct competitor with HP) can make toner cartridges for HP LaserJet printers, and state that on the box: http://www.xerox.com/go/xrx/template/018s.jsp?view=s13&prodID=6R934&Xcntry=USA&Xlang=en_US
#18 ranger_reg Sep 27, 2008 17:49:15	* obviously no one else can use the name D&D for their products, but some people still think they can print on their materials "compatible with Dungeons and Dragons", which they can not. Technically you can under the normal IP law. But if you agree to abide by the OGL or GSL, you may not.