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4E Essentials questions?

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
RedHeadSamurai23
Oct 09, 2010 0:18:29 Hello all. ive been playing 4e since it's release a while back, and ive been tryin to keep up on the new stuff that comes out, but i have to say that with all the information floating about on the site i still cant make heads or tails what people think of the essentials stuff, and what is its purpose. and how is it effecting the game. the most ive payed attention to or at least grasped with a bit of ease was the upgrade to character races. but im still tryin to figure out the rest how the classes work and other stuff. What makes it so different from the old stuff please help a guy out.
#2
Novacat
Oct 09, 2010 0:59:19 I'm in the same boat. I took a look at the red box, and I still can't figure out how to even make a character, other than by going through that dumb little walkthrough scenario that it presents. I can't even seem to find any class or race information.

I would like to give Essentials a fair try, but it seems to be too much hassle to even find the rules.
#3
DeathMutantLives
Oct 09, 2010 2:16:57 I have been running some Essentials-only games and, in my experience, they seem more satisfying than a "regular" game. Why? Because the characters are so simple, combat runs smoother with the players making faster decisions, taking less time to resolve an attack and less interrupts for rules interpretations. We actually have extra time to roleplay -- even in combat -- and enjoy the adventure instead of just focusing on optimizing our actions during a combat encounter.

The Red Box is not Essentials, btw, it is a D&D "starter game" that uses the 4e game system; much like Gamma World. The classes in the Red Box are only defined to 2nd level and many of the class powers are not included in the Heroes of the Fallen Lands book -- even though the class name is the same.

Experienced players should just bypass the Red Box altogether and create characters using the Heroes of the Fallen Lands. The Red Box is good for a new group starting from scratch with no players or a DM that have any significant D&D 4e experience.
#4
Krusk
Oct 09, 2010 10:48:46
If I am correctly informed, I very well could be wrong, 4Ee (my new term for essentials because my other one brings up so much hate apparently) is supposed to have a rules book for playing the game. This book includes things like how combat works, and such. Then there is a rulebook for 4 classes, that explains how to play those classes. Another rulebook for another 4 classes, ect. The goal being more smaller (Cheaper?) books. So when you are playing a fighter, you only need the book with fighter, cleric, wizard, rogue. Not the book with fighter, wizard, rogue, cleric, paladin, ranger, warlord, ect.

The only book out so far (IIRC) is the rules book, so you shouldn't be able to play it yet.
#5
MalakLightfoot
Oct 09, 2010 17:24:23 Essentials is mainly intended as an on-ramp for new players and lapsed players from previous editions. As such, the player books (Heroes of the Fallen Lands and the upcoming Heroes of the Forgotten Kingdoms) contain simplified builds with fewer choices to ease players into the game and streamline the leveling experience.

One of the ways they are trying to bring in lapsed players is by reaching back into D&D history for inspiration. The five builds in Heroes of the Fallen Lands seem to run the gamut. The Slayer reaches back to AD&D and AD&D2E. The Knight reaches back to 3.0. The Warpriest reaches back to 3.5. The Mage is the closest build to what we are used to in 4E. The Thief is an entirely new beast, while it's attacks may be simple Basic Attacks, the movement tricks are entirely new.

Because the new "sub-class" builds tweak with or eschew entirely the normal At-Will / Encounter / Daily power structure, and some folks are worried that Essentials is the death of that power structure (for martial classes, at the very least), Essentials has gotten mixed reviews (to put it mildly). Those who have approached Essentials with an open mind and tried them in their home games have discovered that the new material integrates pretty much as we were promised it would (which is almost, if not completely, seamlessly). Classic builds play alongside Essentials builds just fine, and neither overshadows the other.

As for the products:

The Red Box is the ultimate low end entry point, with choose your own adventure style character building. While the adventure contained within is supposed to be good, you really can't play D&D with just this, and you will need to revise / remake whatever character you come up with by using a more advanced product (whether that be the Player's Handbook or Heroes of the Fallen Lands).

The Rules Compendium is most of the current rules of the game, reprinted in one book and updated with the errata up to September. If you already have the Player's Handbook and Dungeon Master's Guide AND keep up with the errata, you don't need this book. There are still some rules for which you will need to reference older materials, such as Rituals and some weapon qualities.

Heroes of the Fallen Lands is the first Essentials player's book. Much of the information is reprinted and updated from the Player's Handbook, but the subclass builds are unique to this product. HotFL also updates Dwarves, Eladrin, Elves, Halflings and Humans to be more in line with the races that were released in PHB3. Humans get to choose between a racial power or the extra at-will, and the other races now have one fixed stat boost, and the second stat boost comes from a choice of two stats.

Heroes of the Forgotten Kingdoms is the second Essentials player's book. At this point, we don't know if it will reprint the character creation and basic gameplay information that was reprinted in HotFL. It will also contain unique subclass builds for the Druid (as a Leader, not a Controller), Paladin, Ranger (two builds, one Controller, one Striker) and Warlock. It will also update Dragonborn, Drow, Half-Elf, Half-Orc and Tiefling to the PHB3 standard.

The Dungeon Master's Kit contains a two part adventure, a DM's screen, some tokens and a book. The book is mostly reprinted and updated information from DMG1 and DMG2. If you already have those AND keep up with the errata, you don't need this either, but the other things in the box may have value to you. There are some unboxing videos for this on youtube, you might want to watch one and see if it is for you.

The Monster Vault contains some reprinted monsters and some new monsters (the ratio we have been told is 30% / 70% reprint to new). Aside from the book, there are also a bunch of counters in the box. I haven't seen an unboxing vdeo for this yet, but one should be out soon if it hasn't been posted already.

The Essentials Dice Set is an easy choice. If you have been playing for a while, you probably have more dice than you know what to do with. If this is your first D&D game, it might be worthwhile.

The last products are three sets of map tiles; Dungeon, Town and Forest. It is my understanding that many of these tiles are reprints from earlier tile sets that have gone out of print. If you have any previous tile sets, I would suggest trying to find an unboxing video or comprehensive list of tiles contained within for each set. If you don't have any tiles, then you may or may not need them. I get by with a battlemat and a set of pens.

I hope that answered your question to your satisfaction.
#6
RedHeadSamurai23
Oct 11, 2010 1:25:50 this is wonderful. thank you very much, it was one of my fears that essentials was somehow going to make older class choices obsolete.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 RedHeadSamurai23 Oct 09, 2010 0:18:29	Hello all. ive been playing 4e since it's release a while back, and ive been tryin to keep up on the new stuff that comes out, but i have to say that with all the information floating about on the site i still cant make heads or tails what people think of the essentials stuff, and what is its purpose. and how is it effecting the game. the most ive payed attention to or at least grasped with a bit of ease was the upgrade to character races. but im still tryin to figure out the rest how the classes work and other stuff. What makes it so different from the old stuff please help a guy out.
#2 Novacat Oct 09, 2010 0:59:19	I'm in the same boat. I took a look at the red box, and I still can't figure out how to even make a character, other than by going through that dumb little walkthrough scenario that it presents. I can't even seem to find any class or race information. I would like to give Essentials a fair try, but it seems to be too much hassle to even find the rules.
#3 DeathMutantLives Oct 09, 2010 2:16:57	I have been running some Essentials-only games and, in my experience, they seem more satisfying than a "regular" game. Why? Because the characters are so simple, combat runs smoother with the players making faster decisions, taking less time to resolve an attack and less interrupts for rules interpretations. We actually have extra time to roleplay -- even in combat -- and enjoy the adventure instead of just focusing on optimizing our actions during a combat encounter. The Red Box is not Essentials, btw, it is a D&D "starter game" that uses the 4e game system; much like Gamma World. The classes in the Red Box are only defined to 2nd level and many of the class powers are not included in the Heroes of the Fallen Lands book -- even though the class name is the same. Experienced players should just bypass the Red Box altogether and create characters using the Heroes of the Fallen Lands. The Red Box is good for a new group starting from scratch with no players or a DM that have any significant D&D 4e experience.
#4 Krusk Oct 09, 2010 10:48:46	If I am correctly informed, I very well could be wrong, 4Ee (my new term for essentials because my other one brings up so much hate apparently) is supposed to have a rules book for playing the game. This book includes things like how combat works, and such. Then there is a rulebook for 4 classes, that explains how to play those classes. Another rulebook for another 4 classes, ect. The goal being more smaller (Cheaper?) books. So when you are playing a fighter, you only need the book with fighter, cleric, wizard, rogue. Not the book with fighter, wizard, rogue, cleric, paladin, ranger, warlord, ect. The only book out so far (IIRC) is the rules book, so you shouldn't be able to play it yet.
#5 MalakLightfoot Oct 09, 2010 17:24:23	Essentials is mainly intended as an on-ramp for new players and lapsed players from previous editions. As such, the player books (Heroes of the Fallen Lands and the upcoming Heroes of the Forgotten Kingdoms) contain simplified builds with fewer choices to ease players into the game and streamline the leveling experience. One of the ways they are trying to bring in lapsed players is by reaching back into D&D history for inspiration. The five builds in Heroes of the Fallen Lands seem to run the gamut. The Slayer reaches back to AD&D and AD&D2E. The Knight reaches back to 3.0. The Warpriest reaches back to 3.5. The Mage is the closest build to what we are used to in 4E. The Thief is an entirely new beast, while it's attacks may be simple Basic Attacks, the movement tricks are entirely new. Because the new "sub-class" builds tweak with or eschew entirely the normal At-Will / Encounter / Daily power structure, and some folks are worried that Essentials is the death of that power structure (for martial classes, at the very least), Essentials has gotten mixed reviews (to put it mildly). Those who have approached Essentials with an open mind and tried them in their home games have discovered that the new material integrates pretty much as we were promised it would (which is almost, if not completely, seamlessly). Classic builds play alongside Essentials builds just fine, and neither overshadows the other. As for the products: The Red Box is the ultimate low end entry point, with choose your own adventure style character building. While the adventure contained within is supposed to be good, you really can't play D&D with just this, and you will need to revise / remake whatever character you come up with by using a more advanced product (whether that be the Player's Handbook or Heroes of the Fallen Lands). The Rules Compendium is most of the current rules of the game, reprinted in one book and updated with the errata up to September. If you already have the Player's Handbook and Dungeon Master's Guide AND keep up with the errata, you don't need this book. There are still some rules for which you will need to reference older materials, such as Rituals and some weapon qualities. Heroes of the Fallen Lands is the first Essentials player's book. Much of the information is reprinted and updated from the Player's Handbook, but the subclass builds are unique to this product. HotFL also updates Dwarves, Eladrin, Elves, Halflings and Humans to be more in line with the races that were released in PHB3. Humans get to choose between a racial power or the extra at-will, and the other races now have one fixed stat boost, and the second stat boost comes from a choice of two stats. Heroes of the Forgotten Kingdoms is the second Essentials player's book. At this point, we don't know if it will reprint the character creation and basic gameplay information that was reprinted in HotFL. It will also contain unique subclass builds for the Druid (as a Leader, not a Controller), Paladin, Ranger (two builds, one Controller, one Striker) and Warlock. It will also update Dragonborn, Drow, Half-Elf, Half-Orc and Tiefling to the PHB3 standard. The Dungeon Master's Kit contains a two part adventure, a DM's screen, some tokens and a book. The book is mostly reprinted and updated information from DMG1 and DMG2. If you already have those AND keep up with the errata, you don't need this either, but the other things in the box may have value to you. There are some unboxing videos for this on youtube, you might want to watch one and see if it is for you. The Monster Vault contains some reprinted monsters and some new monsters (the ratio we have been told is 30% / 70% reprint to new). Aside from the book, there are also a bunch of counters in the box. I haven't seen an unboxing vdeo for this yet, but one should be out soon if it hasn't been posted already. The Essentials Dice Set is an easy choice. If you have been playing for a while, you probably have more dice than you know what to do with. If this is your first D&D game, it might be worthwhile. The last products are three sets of map tiles; Dungeon, Town and Forest. It is my understanding that many of these tiles are reprints from earlier tile sets that have gone out of print. If you have any previous tile sets, I would suggest trying to find an unboxing video or comprehensive list of tiles contained within for each set. If you don't have any tiles, then you may or may not need them. I get by with a battlemat and a set of pens. I hope that answered your question to your satisfaction.
#6 RedHeadSamurai23 Oct 11, 2010 1:25:50	this is wonderful. thank you very much, it was one of my fears that essentials was somehow going to make older class choices obsolete.