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| #1Khronoswolf7Jul 01, 2014 9:50:23 | Hi! Sorry if this is the wrong forum.
First, I'm entirely new to D&D (although not to gaming in general). I played 2nd edition for a while nearly twenty years ago, but of course I remember so little that it hardly counts. Right now, I'm making a character for my very first campaign, one in which all the other players are either also entirely new, or still somewhat new. I've read several guides for Sorcerers, but there's a few questions I can't really seem to find a distinct answer for on my own.
The party consists of Warden, TacWarlord, Avenger, Rogue, Monk, and then myself. My intention is to play a Sorcerer, because I love the overall flavor and feel of the class, and also because I wanted something that keyed off Charisma for the social skills. However, I'm wondering if I'll really be able to meaningfully contribute to the party. With three strikers already, will another character that primarily only does damage be completely redundant, or is there some way I can differentiate myself and fill a particular aspect? (I know Sorcerers excel at AoE, but do those other classes do the same? Is it possible to take a more Control-centric role?) Similarly, it seems that the rogue might be able to fill the social skills aspect pretty much as well as a sorcerer can.
Also, if I /do/ stick with a Sorcerer, I find myself torn between Dragon and Storm. I really like the overall feel of each, but does one lend itself better to working with a party full of melee than the other? I love the idea of getting in close with Dragon, but would Storm be better for the initiative bonus in order to better drop huge AoEs before the melees get in the way? Does one generally have better feat/power rider support for working around melee? And does one lend itself better to the other for dipping into some control? If I do go Dragon, which resistance/pierce is particularly newbie-friendly?
Sorry for the all questions, but thanks in advance for any help. |
| #2baldhermitJul 01, 2014 10:07:48 | Dragon is generally considered the more optimisable version, but Storm is very very good. I think sorcerers make the strongest strikers. Even though they only wear cloth, between all their melee range burst and blasts, the best encounter power in the game (Flame Spiral), several defensive utilities, immediate and minor action attacks, they can easily deal half the parties total damage output.
I prefer Storm because it allows me to also put some points in Con, which makes me feel better, but is not necessarily the best choice. General wisdom as strikers go is that offense makes for the best defense, as downed enemies do not fight back.
Now on the other hand if you decide that between the avenger, the rogue, the monk and the taclord (by the way, I feel sad for that 'lord since none of those three strikers have a BA unless they pick up a feat. the sorcerer however has ensorcelled blade).. if you decide that between the three strikers, there is enough damage output already, and you still like the flavor of the sorcerer, I would advice you to mechanically play a Cha based warlock, and apply the flavor of the sorcerer to it.
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| #3Khronoswolf7Jul 01, 2014 10:29:57 | Well, as new as I am, any optimization will probably be mediocre at best. That's why I was more interested in which one between Dragon and Storm would be better for working around all the melee in the party, or let me dip into some control, rather than just raw performance.
The Taclord is actually my roommate, and for at-wills, she already picked the one that works on any basic attack, rather than just melee basic attack. But we didn't look much further down the list. Are there other abilities later on that affect only melee basic attacks? Should I make a point of picking up ensorcelled blade instead of/alongside Acid Orb? (I'll be human, so 3 at-wills). And will that be enough, or do the other party members need to grab the feat? On that note, is MBA not simply hitting them with your weapon?
On the subject of Warlock, aren't they also strikers? Do they actually have a lot of control options, then? And would we have anyone for good AoE?
(Also, thanks for your help!) |
| #4baldhermitJul 01, 2014 10:44:22 | Avengers, rogues and monks do not have either melee or ranged BA. The avenger can grab the power of skill feat that turns Overwhelming Strike (the only avenger at will that matters), rogues that go brutal have decent Str and can swing a weapon, other rogues are screwed, as are monks.
(a standard MBA is Strength based. Avengers have Wisdom as primary, Rogues and Monks have Dexterity as primary)
If you do go sorcerer, you most definitely should pick up ensorcelled blade. Do not forget you can also use an MBA for opportunity attacks.
Warlocks can be made as strikers with some effort (and some feats), they make for pretty good single target controllers right out of the box.
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| #5NoctaemJul 01, 2014 18:42:04 | The advice that hermit has given so far is very good. I actually played some months ago a Sorcerer myself. Here's the level 10 version of the character. Feel free to make changes where you see fit but the character worked extremely well. Once I got to level 11 I was allowed by hermit (who was the DM at the time) to make some changes to the character concept. But during all of heroic, this was the build:
Hesketh ====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======
Background: Auspicious Birth (Auspicious Birth Benefit) Theme: Infernal Prince
FINAL ABILITY SCORES STARTING ABILITY SCORES
TRAINED SKILLS
UNTRAINED SKILLS
FEATS
POWERS
ITEMS |
| #6thespaceinvaderJul 02, 2014 2:43:29 |
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| #7Mr.DurrikenJul 02, 2014 9:30:22 | If you want to have more control effects as a sorcerer, consider the elementalist sorcerer and go with water. At-will slide and slow effects. Not super control, but with 5 other (presumably) melee based characters, being able to slide both enemies and allies around would be pretty cool. Also the elementalist is a post-essentials style character, so as a new player you have less choices to get mucked up in on creation and leveling and they generally play a bit quicker in combat.
TjD |
| #8Khronoswolf7Jul 23, 2014 9:49:44 | Much belatedly, but thanks everyone for your help! (Incidentally, the rogue went crossbow, so he's at least got a good RBA). Here's what I've come up with thus far, if anyone has any pointers.
Show ====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ====== |
| #9thespaceinvaderJul 24, 2014 2:40:25 | You have to have a VERY good reason (usually, you need a specific weapon/implement you don't natively get; or you get it free) not to have an Expertise feat be your first.
And if you get it free, a Superior Implement feat would be the alternative in almost all cases (and you've got that one, though I'd be surprised if Incendiary is better than Accurate).
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| #10Khronoswolf7Jul 24, 2014 6:09:00 | Thanks for the reponse!
Reading the boards, I've definitely picked up the importance of Weapon Expertise. I went with Incendiary first so that I could work it into my character's backstory, and because -- if I switch out DF for Acid Orb -- everything but ESB will get the +1 anyway. I'm definitely going to pick up War Wizard's Expertise right at level 2. Incendiary vs Accurate came down for me that the latter just feels bland by comparison, and Incendiary still gives accuracy to almost everything for now. I'll retrain over to Accurate later if Incendiary stops meshing as well with my power selection.
But on that note, a question for whomever can answer it. Does the +2 damage for fire attacks on Incendiary apply to secondary rolls such as on Burning Pyre or Flame Spiral? Also, for powers like ESB, where the keyword is 'Varies' and it gains elemental damage equal to my Dragon Soul Resist -- does 'Varies' actually become 'Fire?' Would it benefit from the +2 damage?
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| #11thespaceinvaderJul 24, 2014 7:48:26 | Yes, to both of your latter questions. |
| #12Illogical_BloxAug 11, 2014 12:34:29 |
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