Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 RoguishDelight Mar 11, 2015 21:38:52	So after playing a 4e campaign for a while our DM who was a nice guy, fair and usually fun just having trouble making stuff in time and coming up with situations for every possible event left it open for if any of the players wanted to take over as DM, none of us really did but one player who currently was playing as a deva but she insisted on having a character while dming and claimed that she would still be fair and not favor herself or anything...We all beleived her and for a while it was okay...ironically the first campaign was a long tidious event that was similar to that of sleeping beauty, her deva had been struck by an arrow laced with a strange sleep spell that made him sleep and we had to find out how to solve it. Anyways over events and such we started to learn things of our DM. For starters was lots of pregidice on certain races. In our game we saw more devas (which are supposed to be insanely rare and never come across one another ever in their immportal lives) then we saw dwarves which was very odd since dwarves are quite common. The same went with drow which is a little more understandable. She also made it difficult for myself and our former DM, I playing a drow and he a dwarf, everywhere we went we were instantly hated and shoved away, it can be understandable for me being the drow but to lots of the extants was ridiculous... It also got annoying with how many characters were "better then us" everywhere we went despite being the heroes and main adventurers each and every town was packed with fighters, rangers, wizards and more, all of which were always at least a few levels higher then us which made us always feel weak and flat out lame. She also did many things in being unfair, for example at one point and friend and I were going to bring in two drow, evil drow, one of nobility and the other a servant but they were chaotic evil, we looked up some stuff and it seemed the best way to bring them in was them attacking some town, fighting with the main adventurers and if we won, take in the adventurers like servants and help them so they help us and if they won, admire their strength and join them. She flat out said no because it would make them look weak and claimed they would hate us no matter what even if we changed and died for them etc etc... Now a few games later she claimed she wanted to bring in a new character and get this! it was literally the exact same way we wanted to bring ours in just worse because it was going to be in the main plot and a main villain x.x   She also litterally freaked out whenever anything in her story seemed like it could be compromised and refused to make up background stories or let the characters do their own free thing at all...not to mention every plotline was about her characters...it just always lead to another whether it be the same one going through a string of nonsense or her bringing in a new character and making them into the main plot and ignoring us and our stories and plot and so on. We also didn't gain gold ONCE in the eight levels she was dm for. NOT ONCE and I was playing a rogue who frequently stole and did side jobs. We also never got any items worth anything. All that happened is her character got an enchanted item...   We have no other group to go to and we have four members, one of which is her, the other refuses to take any sides and claims she is doing fine even though he seems pretty miserable and then me and our former dm (who she refused to let take over again after he asked to) so it is entirely two on two here...I don't even know who is in the right and wrong at this point and after so many pointless and annoying arguments and such... what do I do here? mntioning anything makes her rage and threaten to leave and I don't want to just not play anymore..am I even in the right thinking this or should I just wait it out...cuz she has everything planned till last level and so far it is just a storybook of her characters and us being hated and unimportant... help???
#2 baldhermit Mar 11, 2015 21:47:44	You know what to do, just for some reason are waiting for someone else to say it. Talk with this new DM if you can, but likely move on and find a new group.
(Reply to #2) RoguishDelight	baldhermit wrote:
#4 Timpookie Mar 12, 2015 5:44:12	Well, first, you need to learn proper grammar and to avoid using run-on sentences.   Second, if you have any other friends, introduce them to D&D and play with them - Your old DM can DM if you like him and he wants to play, if not, you can DM if you're up to it.   The game you just described is essentially hell. Tell your DM that you feel your characters are unimportant to the story, and propose an ultimatum - Either she becomes a better DM, or you just don't turn up to play the next session and instead play only with the new group described the line above this. It seems a little extreme, and you may feel like you're letting go of an investment in a character, but your investment in your character died the minute the new DM ruined the game.
#5 Timpookie Mar 12, 2015 5:44:26	Well, first, you need to learn proper grammar and to avoid using run-on sentences.   Second, if you have any other friends, introduce them to D&D and play with them - Your old DM can DM if you like him and he wants to play, if not, you can DM if you're up to it.   The game you just described is essentially hell. Tell your DM that you feel your characters are unimportant to the story, and propose an ultimatum - Either she becomes a better DM, or you just don't turn up to play the next session and instead play only with the new group described the line above this. It seems a little extreme, and you may feel like you're letting go of an investment in a character, but your investment in your character died the minute the new DM ruined the game.
#6 Beoric Mar 12, 2015 5:58:40	Hard to say who is right and who is wrong, your presentation isn't exactly objective.  She is within her rights to make it "Deva World" if she wants, and to make prejudice against dwarves or drow a part of her setting; however, if that is the case she should probably warn you before you make a dwarf or drow character.   Wanting to play a chaotic evil character, and then use that character to hijack the campaign, is a bit of a red flag for me that maybe the fault is not all on her.  A little railroading would not be an unusual response from a new DM whose players were trying to sabotage her campaign.   But regardless of who is as fault, if you can't get on, there is no point in playing together.  It is possible to play one-on-one, although it is a bit more work for the DM, so you and your chaotic evil former DM could always play without her.
#7 iserith Mar 12, 2015 8:35:06	RoguishDelight wrote:
(Reply to #7) RoguishDelight	iserith wrote:
#9 iserith Mar 12, 2015 11:28:49	RoguishDelight wrote:
(Reply to #8) RoguishDelight	RoguishDelight wrote:
#11 Brimleydower Mar 14, 2015 14:21:24	This is a discussion that needs to take place at your gaming table. It doesn't matter if every single member of this community agrees with you here, because that will not change the situation you're in. It can be hard to have these sorts of talks with friends, especially if they feel like they are being put on the defensive.  I would recommend encouraging what you are enjoying about the game to help soften the blow of other critiques. Maybe help her find some DM guides (there are plenty out there) to help her learn the ropes (as it sounds to me like this is a case of a newish DM being unaware of some common pitfalls). It's important to make sure your concerns are viewed as a helpful critique instead of a personal attack, especially if the person in question is a friend beyond the gaming table.
#12 WilliamCQ Mar 28, 2015 1:58:11	I'm late to the conversation but I see some ways to go about it, the 1st the easier: Stop being so attached to your character and campaign. Just enjoy the few hours the session last, and maybe an hour preparation before the session and be done with it. If you find yourself thinking about something 1-2 days after the session ended, beside the preparation for the next session, find a way to detach yourself of such situations. Sometimes I find things pretty frustrating or boring while I play so I just phase out; I've seen others draw or play very light games (on their "smart" phones). As the hard talk was done, and she can't be reasoned with as yelling after you shows, either put pressure during the game (ie: she talk about doing the same thing you were refused to do then get on her case and don't let go until another player show it's getting too much). And if you're really fed up, incrementally get more on her case until another player step in; mind you might be the "looser" if someone step in, so if you can't take the heat... If you're not willing to do the former, do like it was suggested to you before and either convince acquaintances to learn the game or make efforts to recruit other players; the later being quite easier since you already have a GM.
#13 Zathris Mar 29, 2015 1:00:00	WilliamCQ wrote:
#14 WilliamCQ Mar 29, 2015 8:01:36	Maybe the OP has or will decide that he's fed up with the inaction of the member who think the GM is adequate and is ignoring the fact 2 people are fed up with her. Notice I mentioned maybe at the start of this post, and I also mentioned in my previous post WilliamCQ wrote:
#15 Imaculata Apr 09, 2015 10:05:14	What the OP describes is exactly the sort of stuff we listed in our "DM don'ts" topic. A DM who has her own Mary Sue characters, who are the main characters, when it should really be the players that take central stage. And when all the npc's around the players are stronger than them, then it is almost as if the DM considers the players an interruption of her carefully written stageplay, rather than active participants of the story. This sadly happens quite often with DM's who are passionate about telling a story, but are less experienced with running a fun game. It takes a while for many DM's to figure out just what makes a campaign fun to play for their players, and it sounds like your DM simply needs more experience.   When I run my campaigns, I always make sure that there are weak npc's, and strong npc's of about the same level as the players, or one level higher. The players are the main characters of the story, and the entire plot revolves around them. Its fun to throw in an unlikable npc every now and then, who simply cowers when intimidated by the players. I think you need to have the right balance between characters that are stronger than the players (such as the main villain) and players that are weaker or of equal strength. And Mary Sue plots are indeed really bad.   So what can you do about it? I'd say, talk it over with either the whole group, or in private.
#16 Hamenopi Apr 09, 2015 7:01:12	Talk to DM out of game. Say you aren't having fun. If Dm isn't willing to adjust, leave the session and come back next time and repeat your conserns.    if  (me_having_fun == false) then (me_playing == false) end if   The honest with your group. Be direct with your group. Communication is good.