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| #1ZherogFeb 03, 2009 11:08:48 | My players have requested that they be presented an opportunity to join an adventurer's guild, and a great chance to introduce that will come in our next game session (at the end of the month). They want two things:
I've run a similar setup in the past. In a 4 year game I ran, the players were all employed by a thieves' guild (even the lawful good dwarf :D ). So I certainly have some ideas on how to go about creating and running a guild. But I'm always interested in fresh perspectives and new ideas. So, with that in mind:
If your ideas are race or class specific, here's the current group: an elven evoker an elven "archer" (homebrewed class, basically a ranger/fighter multiclass) a dwarven fighter a halfling rogue All four characters are 5th level. The evoker has plans of taking levels in master specialist; to the best of my knowledge, none of the other players intend to take levels in a prestige class. So there's the landscape. Give me your thoughts. |
| #2quiterjon_dupFeb 03, 2009 11:17:24 | Just to make sure I understand correctly. Your group wants an Adventurers Guild so they can be told to go do such and such, when done they come back and roleplay what they did? |
| #3ZherogFeb 03, 2009 12:12:18 | No, not quite. They want to join a guild so they can be told "here's a job we need done, why don't you go take care of it." They go on the adventure and when they're done they report back to their boss and discuss how things went. roleplaying would still occur when they get the assignment as well as while they're on the assignment. |
| #4Cohen95Feb 03, 2009 12:19:50 | An Agent. Every good adventuring troupe that's registered with the guild needs an Agent. This person's responsibilities is to manage the group for the guild. He's responsible for collecting their dues, getting them assignments, and advocating on their behalf with the superiors of the guild. Oh, yeah, and he gets a cut, in addition to their dues. Depending on the agent (or manager or handler or what-have-you), their cut could take the shape of higher dues, or it could simply be that he requests a specific item on certain adventures, and calls "dibs" prior to them even accepting the quest. |
| #5tafkamhokieFeb 03, 2009 12:29:16 | We have use Adv. Guild's extensively in my games. Here are the benefits of membership: Can legally carry non-peacebonded weapons in town. Get free moneychanging services (for exchanging foreign coins and for turning gems/jewelry/art into cash) Get a discount on consumable magic item purchases and spellcasting services with local merchants and temples. Get a secure place to sleep and store your stuff in town. Get access to a job bulletin board (aka adventure hooks). If you require characters to train before leveling-up, the guild would provide access to qualified trainers. In 4e, each Adv. Guildhouse would probably have a teleportation circle and would know the coordinates of all the others...thus making long distance transport a bit easier for As for what it would cost...I have done it one of two ways. #1 - Requires a 500 gp initiation fee. This keeps most of the rif-raf from claiming to be adventurers just so they can carry weapons in town. It also gives me a decent campaign-starting hook...a wealthy benefactor is looking to hire some newbie adventurers and is willing to pay your initiation fee to help you get started. #2 - Requires a level-adjusted maintenance fee. Probably 10 gp per month per level. A bit steep for 1st through 3rd level characters, but totally manageable once you survive past that point. |
| #6KruskFeb 03, 2009 13:57:12 |
A- perhapse a discount on magical goods. To represent this, as DM I would say non members pay 5-10% ontop of list price in phb. Access to mages that can make custom items for the players. IE I want a flaming sword, and none are in stock, hook me up. Possibly some minor form of deputy status in town. We caught these thieves, lets capture them and take them to the gaurds. Legally. B- Maybe one -two mandated quests that seem lame. (Obviously an adventure hook for you. During the quest of babysit the town nursery, some of the children turn out to be some sort of evil fey. I see you are 3.5 so Redcaps for example?) On call 24/7 in the event that their home town is attacked to defend it free of charge. C-I would simply have the adventurers know that they will not be payed for their services, but they are allowed to keep 100% of what they find on their adventures. Clearing out a den of goblins, you get all the filthy rags. Clearing out a dragon? you get the horde. The guild in exchange for protecting the town is given its guildhall free, and is exempt from taxes. Additionally, people often times let them eat free at resturaunts and inns. For the bulk of their food mages use the various 3.5 make food spells. |
| #7skyodinFeb 03, 2009 21:28:14 | The criteria they are looking for are broad enough that you could use just about any kind of patron to fill in the role of an adventurer's guild. Here are some ideas: A powerful merchant dealing in foreign trade: In this case, the PCs become members of the trading company, working as guards and field investigators for the business. Responsibilities: Escorting caravans or trade ships on route to distant lands, investigating why businesses (such as mines or shops in foreign cities) have not sent word for a few months, slaying monsters threatening trade routes. The PCs are expected to conduct themselves in such a way to not stain the reputation of their employer. Benefits: Pay for their services, as well as access to goods at employee prices and connections to other merchants across the land. Furthermore, the PCs have opportunity for advancement in the company, potentially being able to open their own businesses, or gain ownership of a ship. Dues: Probably not necessary, since the employer is making good money if the party succeeds at their assigned tasks. A king or powerful noble: In this case, the PCs become soldiers or agents in the service of a lord or king. Responsibilities: Slaying monsters, dealing with vassals plotting rebellion, holding off foreign invasion, etc. The PCs will probably be expected to put up with formal balls and diplomacy as well. Benefits: While the PCs may be paid, they are just as likely to be eligible for grants of land and formal titles. They may also be allowed to act with the authority of being an agent of the king. Having an excuse to hang out with princesses isn't a bad perk either. Dues: None, but if the PCs become vassals of the king, they will probably have to pay annual taxes. Hmm, not sure on any other suggestions. I hope this helps. |
| #8ace_of_timeFeb 03, 2009 21:49:24 | I do this one some. 1. I have a list of jobs for them to choose from. Then when they prove them selves of worth sometimes the guild has ask them to do some favors. 2. They pay 100 gps a month plus 10% money earned from completing guild jobs. 3.a. Benefits are free room in guilds of towns when on guild jobs. b. 10% to buy and selling from guild protected shops. c. Free travel when on guild jobs. (with in reason) D. Info and library access. E. Access to Pro classes. Paragon paths in 4e. |
| #9DavidFeb 04, 2009 3:54:06 | I once played in a game where I had to join an adventurer's guild. The DM was a terrible Railroader. My advice is to either forget about it, or make it more political like the Harpers. Let the organization have an objective that isn't wealth. |
| #10melloredFeb 04, 2009 5:09:51 | You can also have competing guilds, it'd make for a nice "recurring villain", or perhaps an ally. |
| #11ace_of_timeFeb 04, 2009 6:25:10 | You could make like sub guilds. One for each class or type and each with different goals. They all work together most of the times, But not always!;) |
| #12ZherogFeb 04, 2009 9:16:49 | Alright... let's get caught up. Thanks to everybody for their input and ideas.An Agent. >>snip<< Nice idea. The last time I did the guild thing, they dealt directly with the boss because of in-character reasons. I like this idea, setting up an intermediary for them to work with most of the time. We have use Adv. Guild's extensively in my games. Here are the benefits of membership: Interesting. That's an idea I hadn't thought of. Get free moneychanging services (for exchanging foreign coins and for turning gems/jewelry/art into cash) I don't typically worry about coins - a gold piece is a gold piece, just to simplify. The last guild I ran had the gems/jewelry/art deal though. The PCs could turn those in for 75% of market value (with a guarantee of getting an accurate appraisal as well). If they wanted to take the time to shop around for a buyer, they could certainly do that. But it would take longer. Get a discount on consumable magic item purchases and spellcasting services with local merchants and temples. My last guild was an arm of the church of Olidammara, and the PCs did get potions at a discount from the church. I'll probably set up something similar this time, as well as giving the wizard a discount on buying new spells for her spellbook. Get a secure place to sleep and store your stuff in town. They're not going to be staying in one town. Soon, they'll be heading off into the Return of the Temple of Elemental Evil. While I can certainly establish a "safe house" in Hommlet, there'll come a point where the secure sleeping place will be impossible. Still, storage is good. Get access to a job bulletin board (aka adventure hooks). Yep, absolutely. If you require characters to train before leveling-up, the guild would provide access to qualified trainers. I don't require training, though I sometimes toss it in as a background flavor thing. Such as, for example, a mentor teaching a new feat or spell. In reality, they would've learned it without me pulling in the mentor just by virtue of leveling. But the mentor thing adds some flavor once in a while. In 4e, each Adv. Guildhouse would probably have a teleportation circle and would know the coordinates of all the others...thus making long distance transport a bit easier for I can see teleportation service being offered even in 3.5 (which is what my group plays). As for what it would cost...I have done it one of two ways. At the moment, I'm leaning towards a combination. Require some form of membership fee coupled with yearly or monthly dues. A- perhapse a discount on magical goods. To represent this, as DM I would say non members pay 5-10% ontop of list price in phb. I'm likely to offer discounts on some stuff. Access to mages that can make custom items for the players. IE I want a flaming sword, and none are in stock, hook me up. The party wizard already does a fair bit of item crafting. And I have pretty relaxed rules -- for example, I allow anybody to contribute XP to the creation process, not just the character with the feat. Still, there's a lot of feats she doesn't have, and even for the feats she does have there's a lot of spells she doesn't have access to. As an evoker she has two forbidden schools, and she took an alternate class feature that requires her to give up a third school. So there's definitely room for a wizard/cleric/whatever to help with item crafting. Possibly some minor form of deputy status in town. We caught these thieves, lets capture them and take them to the gaurds. Legally. This works nicely when coupled with tafkamhokie idea of allowing them to carry non-bound weapons. B- Maybe one -two mandated quests that seem lame. (Obviously an adventure hook for you. During the quest of babysit the town nursery, some of the children turn out to be some sort of evil fey. I see you are 3.5 so Redcaps for example?) Both of these are good ideas. The first works really nice as little side quests to their main adventure, should I find they need a bit more XP or whatever. C-I would simply have the adventurers know that they will not be payed for their services, but they are allowed to keep 100% of what they find on their adventures. Clearing out a den of goblins, you get all the filthy rags. Clearing out a dragon? you get the horde. Interesting ideas. The criteria they are looking for are broad enough that you could use just about any kind of patron to fill in the role of an adventurer's guild. Here are some ideas: >>snip<< Oh, very nice thought! They're currently friendly with a priest from the church of Pelor. (even though none of them worship Pelor, go figure...) I was going to use that NPC to get them into the guild. But there's certainly no reason I can't instead have the priest introduce them to a noble or even a more powerful priest. Food for thought... Hmmm... 1. I have a list of jobs for them to choose from. Then when they prove them selves of worth sometimes the guild has ask them to do some favors. Good idea, though given the scope of Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil, this may not get a chance to play out too much. 2. They pay 100 gps a month plus 10% money earned from completing guild jobs. The Olidammara guild I ran previously took either a percentage cut or - in some instances - laid claim to a specific item before the players went on the job. 3.a. Benefits are free room in guilds of towns when on guild jobs. I definitely like the idea of them having a place to stay that's either free or really cheap as well as guaranteed safe. b. 10% to buy and selling from guild protected shops. Do you mean 10% discount when buying and a 10% extra when selling (so, for example, 60% of market value rather than 50%)? If so, I definitely like this idea. c. Free travel when on guild jobs. (with in reason) Very interesting idea. I'll have to work with this one. D. Info and library access. The Olidammara guild had a library, and I was even able to work a plot hook around it where the PCs had to go collect an overdue book. E. Access to Pro classes. Paragon paths in 4e. Probably not an issue in my game, since the only prestige class that seems likely to come up is master specialist. I can certainly provide a "trainer" for that, though. I once played in a game where I had to join an adventurer's guild. The DM was a terrible Railroader. My advice is to either forget about it, or make it more political like the Harpers. Let the organization have an objective that isn't wealth. I'm not a terrible railroader, so that concern goes out the window. I keep coming back to my previous guild, but the Olidammara guild I ran was pretty deep into politics - though a lot of times the players didn't understand the political nature of what they were doing. You can also have competing guilds, it'd make for a nice "recurring villain", or perhaps an ally. This is a very nice idea. I love the idea of a friendly rivalry, rather than having an outright war between two guilds. (though that can be fun, too.) You could make like sub guilds. One for each class or type and each with different goals. They all work together most of the times, But not always! This sounds a bit like the setup for Paizo's Pathfinder Society. * Thanks, everybody, for your cool ideas! Keep 'em coming! When I finally pull things together in a few weeks, I'll share. |
| #13ace_of_timeFeb 04, 2009 19:29:44 | Alright... let's get caught up. Thanks to everybody for their input and ideas. Yes that is what I meant. |
| #14daidojitaidoruFeb 05, 2009 1:41:49 | In addition to the above ideas there are other benifits that come as being part of a guild. 1 - Financial Protection: Your customer is far less likely to kick you out without paying if there's a bunch of high level guys who will come knocking. And even if the person IS dumb enough to tick off the guild, they can pay your characters from the guild coffers and deal with collection while your group keeps fighting the good fight. 2 - Legal Protection: If the guild gets suckered into a bad job, or if somethign just goes wrong, you've got a group of people there to help you out. It's a lot easier to have a guild representative explain the situation to the king while your party hides in a safe house then to convince an irate monarch he's wrong in between his sentance and your execution. 3 - Physical protection: That last job tick off some evil secret society? So long as the issue is work related you've got a whole bunch of people who kill stuff for a living who've got your back. Basically it's a nice ally from a GM standpoint, in that they won't help wipe the dungeon for the PCs (That's their job. Literally.) but they will help against hopeless odds or massive orginizations (justifying how your PCs survived tangling with those groups at all.) As for extra dues something adventurers guilds will probably demand is information. If you find a long lost tomb, or the weakness of a particular monster the guild probably wants to know. That's something that might save an agents life later on. So the guild will probably demand to see what magic items you picked up (just in case it's a relic/artifact), who you met and what you saw. In addition there's probably a minimum fee for services. So if your party runs across a poor village in need, they may find themselves in the unfortunate position of having to pay the guild fee to save the village. This is a for profit organization after all.... |
| #15DragoncatFeb 05, 2009 2:14:22 | Remember to play up two big things. Connections- You'll get friends. Or at least amiable acquaintances. Maybe it's a retired wizard who can do some upper level rituals in a pinch. Perhaps it's a mentor figure, an old knight or crafty thief. Or just a bunch of lower-level buddies who will sometimes help you out of a jam, or get in a jam themselves and require aid. Fellow members of the guild, their hopes and dreams, their tasks and trials, can be a wonderful source of plot, story hooks, and roleplaying gold. Shotgun Style DMing- Don't say "Alright, we've got a job, do it." Give them control over their tasks in another fashion: "Alrighty, we've got four jobs at the moment, take one if you want, we'll divide them up among the teams." Provide options, so if they don't feel like going to the kobold lair, they can stop the gnoll raiders, or investigate the disappearance of the mayor's daughter, or delve into an archeological site that's infested with undead. Or, if they don't want a job, they can turn them down to pursue other tasks, knowing that the world around them will still move on. In short, keep the world busy, make it seem like it NEEDS an Adventuring Guild. Plus, with point number one, the "Other Guys" might get a nice mention as well, someone to compete in the local gossip for Best Adventurers of the Month. Oh, and have a mascot. |
| #16mycroftbFeb 13, 2009 9:05:02 | One idea would be to have the Adventurer's Guild be an affiliation, rather than one organization. Each guild hall is independently owned and operated, and although they all offer AG mandated services, some may charge higher fees or have other services available. Some halls are run by grizzled old veterans that don't take well to the sedentary lifestyle. Decades of dealing with problems by busting down the door and kicking butt have left them ill prepared to face a ledger. Some of these are way too nice to adventurers, or have a crooked accountant, or some other thing is pulling them deeply into debt. An increasing number of halls are getting bought up by a big corporation, mainly some of the bigger cities, and are offering all kinds of extra services - for extra coin, of course. "Well, yes, we do have free lodging for guild members. BUT. Wouldn't you like to sleep on an extra soft mattress in your own individual room, with a guarantee of no vermin AND private baths? All for only an extra.." etc. This sort of thing could give the sameness and reliability that your PCs want while still slipping in unique events and situations. |
| #17trashcrapFeb 13, 2009 10:37:16 | If I was an adventurer, I would expect reasonable lodgings when requested, discount powerful magic items, issued standard gear, and information (there are other operatives in the guild, and information they could provide about the world around me could be very valuable). All of this at all times while not on a mission. What I would be willing to do is go on adventures without question. What I would expect to pay in dues is usually nothing since the completed mission should provide more benefit to them than anything. I am pretty much an employee. I should not be the way this business makes money. They supply a service, and I take care of problems they incur. (Protect the caravan) Or another example would be I would expect that I would get hired and receive a large sum of money in order to do the job. Other than that, everything is the same as the first example. I would consider doing the job, but I would reserve the right to deny it (and thus not get paid). In this situation, I would pay fees while not on a mission since I probably AM the way this business generates revenue. They are more than likely an organization who's service is paying people like me to shape their environment to their liking. (Mercenary, Thieves/Assassin Guild, or even something like the Harpers) |
| #18koradziFeb 15, 2009 15:44:52 | An Agent. Every good adventuring troupe that's registered with the guild needs an Agent. Definitely! It adds that personal touch when the party's contact with the guild is only a minor functionary; that way his success depends on the success of the players. The "information broker" style of agent can be a lot of fun; maybe he's not getting specific orders from higher up, and his job is to look for opportunities for the group. This can be a hoot if he's not too principled. |