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Always flatfooted rogue weapon?

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
gogocharlie
Jan 26, 2010 15:12:01
I remember reading in one of the books about a special weapon (Rapier?). It made anyone the rogue was fiighting always be considered flatfooted.

My GF is rolling up her first character (Rogue), and i want to recommend saving up for it...

Can anyone remember what it was?
#2
shadow_viper
Jan 26, 2010 17:59:06 Which Edition?
#3
Neutronium_Dragon
Jan 26, 2010 22:34:48 Since flat-footed is a 3E term, I'd assume it's for 3E. I don't think there's any generic weapon type that will do this but there are probably some magical item properties that can (although they may be limited-use) - the Magic Item Compendium is probably the best place to look.
#4
brassbaboon
Jan 26, 2010 22:38:51 Hmmm... I'm pretty sure if there was such a weapon, it wouldn't be on sale in any of my 3.5e campaigns.

Sneak attack is a goal for a rogue, not a given. That's half the challenge of playing a rogue, figuring out how to gain sneak attack. A weapon that just gave it to you every time would make playing a rogue boring to me.
#5
chanter_hound
Jan 27, 2010 1:00:24 Must have been homebrewed. I've just scanned through crystal keep and they don't have naything like that.

Best thing I'd say to do as a rogue is get touch spells. Most evil thing EVER! you can do :D

I'd also suggest a gander at complate scoundrel. There is a few tricks you can pick up with hidden weapons to make your opponant flat footed. My rogue now is able to make a tumble check to get his sneak attack, twice per combat. And Draw a hidden weapon, gaining sneak attack, twice per combat.
#6
shadow_viper
Jan 27, 2010 1:50:08
Since flat-footed is a 3E term, I'd assume it's for 3E. I don't think there's any generic weapon type that will do this but there are probably some magical item properties that can (although they may be limited-use) - the Magic Item Compendium is probably the best place to look.

Ahh right, it's combat advantage in 4E
#7
gogocharlie
Jan 27, 2010 1:55:04 Sorry, forgot to specify 3.5
I think i may have been thinking of a weapon combined with a specific ability or something...
#8
Neutronium_Dragon
Jan 27, 2010 5:54:05 > Sneak attack is a goal for a rogue, not a given.

Design-wise it was assumed that the 3E rogue would be getting sneak attack with almost every attack he makes. If something is preventing that from happening (and it isn't just that the creature is immune) then an item solution is in keeping with that assumption.
#9
Mad_Jack
Jan 27, 2010 22:13:08
In 3.5 I think the two main enchantments rogues used on their weapons were Subtle and Blurstrike. Neither gave unconditional SA opportunities, though.
#10
shadow_viper
Jan 27, 2010 22:54:25 Deadly Precision is also a good one.
#11
LordOfWeasels
Jan 28, 2010 16:47:47
Sorry, forgot to specify 3.5
I think i may have been thinking of a weapon combined with a specific ability or something...

"Clever Strike" is the closest thing I know of - At-Will, gain Combat Advantage as long as any ally is adjacent to the target.

I remember there being a power printed in Dragon in the last month, in an article about Duelist Rogues, that gave them CA with a Rapier as long as *nobody* else is adjacent to you or the target - but it's not in the builder yet, I don't still have the Dragon PDF handy, and I can't be arsed to go find it by sifting through the last several Dragons. So I can't give you the details.

So, yeah: Check out the Duelist Rogues article.

#12
LordOfWeasels
Jan 28, 2010 16:51:52
Sorry, forgot to specify 3.5
I think i may have been thinking of a weapon combined with a specific ability or something...

"Clever Strike" is the closest thing I know of - At-Will, gain Combat Advantage as long as any ally is adjacent to the target.

I remember there being a power printed in Dragon in the last month, in an article about Duelist Rogues, that gave them CA with a Rapier as long as *nobody* else is adjacent to you or the target - but it's not in the builder yet, I don't still have the Dragon PDF handy, and I can't be arsed to go find it by sifting through the last several Dragons. So I can't give you the details.

So, yeah: Check out the Duelist Rogues article.

I looked it up anyway. Dragon 381, "Class Acts: Rogue", Feat: Flash of the Blade

Prerequisite: Rogue, proficiency with rapiers
Benefit: While wielding a rapier, if you and your target are the only creatures adjacent to each other, you can deal your Sneak Attack damage to that target if you do not have combat advantage against that target.
#13
brassbaboon
Jan 28, 2010 17:34:50
> Sneak attack is a goal for a rogue, not a given. Design-wise it was assumed that the 3E rogue would be getting sneak attack with almost every attack he makes. If something is preventing that from happening (and it isn't just that the creature is immune) then an item solution is in keeping with that assumption.

I suppose that depends on what level your rogue is, and how generous your DM is with magic items.
#14
brassbaboon
Jan 28, 2010 17:40:15 To gain sneak attack as much as possible, the last 3.5e rogue in our group used the improved feint feat to feint as a move item, denying the target their Dex bonus and therefore making them vulnurable to sneak attack.

I had a spellthief once who used "distract assailant" in the same manner, with the advantage that "distract assailant" is a swift action, so he could move and get his sneak attack.

There are lots of ways to improve your chances at gaining sneak attack. And if your DM is any good, there are lots of ways to counter them.
#15
shadow_viper
Jan 28, 2010 19:35:21
Sorry, forgot to specify 3.5
I think i may have been thinking of a weapon combined with a specific ability or something...

"Clever Strike" is the closest thing I know of - At-Will, gain Combat Advantage as long as any ally is adjacent to the target.

I remember there being a power printed in Dragon in the last month, in an article about Duelist Rogues, that gave them CA with a Rapier as long as *nobody* else is adjacent to you or the target - but it's not in the builder yet, I don't still have the Dragon PDF handy, and I can't be arsed to go find it by sifting through the last several Dragons. So I can't give you the details.

So, yeah: Check out the Duelist Rogues article.

As pointed out in his quote, he is playing 3.5, rather than 4E.
#16
LordOfWeasels
Jan 29, 2010 7:33:23

As pointed out in his quote, he is playing 3.5, rather than 4E.

Wow.

I read that, then I quoted it, and *even then* I still didn't parse it.

Last night was apparently a bad brain day.

Okay, let's change my answer: Try the D20 forums, specifically the Classes and Class Features forum. You're much more likely to find D20 players who have recent and specific knowledge there, rather than in the D&D forums.
#17
TelinArtho
Jan 29, 2010 12:55:50 What ever happened to the rogue with a ring of blinking? That was always a fine way to get sneak attack in any game I've seen.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 gogocharlie Jan 26, 2010 15:12:01	I remember reading in one of the books about a special weapon (Rapier?). It made anyone the rogue was fiighting always be considered flatfooted. My GF is rolling up her first character (Rogue), and i want to recommend saving up for it... Can anyone remember what it was?
#2 shadow_viper Jan 26, 2010 17:59:06	Which Edition?
#3 Neutronium_Dragon Jan 26, 2010 22:34:48	Since flat-footed is a 3E term, I'd assume it's for 3E. I don't think there's any generic weapon type that will do this but there are probably some magical item properties that can (although they may be limited-use) - the Magic Item Compendium is probably the best place to look.
#4 brassbaboon Jan 26, 2010 22:38:51	Hmmm... I'm pretty sure if there was such a weapon, it wouldn't be on sale in any of my 3.5e campaigns. Sneak attack is a goal for a rogue, not a given. That's half the challenge of playing a rogue, figuring out how to gain sneak attack. A weapon that just gave it to you every time would make playing a rogue boring to me.
#5 chanter_hound Jan 27, 2010 1:00:24	Must have been homebrewed. I've just scanned through crystal keep and they don't have naything like that. Best thing I'd say to do as a rogue is get touch spells. Most evil thing EVER! you can do :D I'd also suggest a gander at complate scoundrel. There is a few tricks you can pick up with hidden weapons to make your opponant flat footed. My rogue now is able to make a tumble check to get his sneak attack, twice per combat. And Draw a hidden weapon, gaining sneak attack, twice per combat.
#6 shadow_viper Jan 27, 2010 1:50:08	Since flat-footed is a 3E term, I'd assume it's for 3E. I don't think there's any generic weapon type that will do this but there are probably some magical item properties that can (although they may be limited-use) - the Magic Item Compendium is probably the best place to look. Ahh right, it's combat advantage in 4E
#7 gogocharlie Jan 27, 2010 1:55:04	Sorry, forgot to specify 3.5 I think i may have been thinking of a weapon combined with a specific ability or something...
#8 Neutronium_Dragon Jan 27, 2010 5:54:05	> Sneak attack is a goal for a rogue, not a given. Design-wise it was assumed that the 3E rogue would be getting sneak attack with almost every attack he makes. If something is preventing that from happening (and it isn't just that the creature is immune) then an item solution is in keeping with that assumption.
#9 Mad_Jack Jan 27, 2010 22:13:08	In 3.5 I think the two main enchantments rogues used on their weapons were Subtle and Blurstrike. Neither gave unconditional SA opportunities, though.
#10 shadow_viper Jan 27, 2010 22:54:25	Deadly Precision is also a good one.
#11 LordOfWeasels Jan 28, 2010 16:47:47	Sorry, forgot to specify 3.5 I think i may have been thinking of a weapon combined with a specific ability or something... "Clever Strike" is the closest thing I know of - At-Will, gain Combat Advantage as long as any ally is adjacent to the target. I remember there being a power printed in Dragon in the last month, in an article about Duelist Rogues, that gave them CA with a Rapier as long as nobody else is adjacent to you or the target - but it's not in the builder yet, I don't still have the Dragon PDF handy, and I can't be arsed to go find it by sifting through the last several Dragons. So I can't give you the details. So, yeah: Check out the Duelist Rogues article.
#12 LordOfWeasels Jan 28, 2010 16:51:52	Sorry, forgot to specify 3.5 I think i may have been thinking of a weapon combined with a specific ability or something... "Clever Strike" is the closest thing I know of - At-Will, gain Combat Advantage as long as any ally is adjacent to the target. I remember there being a power printed in Dragon in the last month, in an article about Duelist Rogues, that gave them CA with a Rapier as long as nobody else is adjacent to you or the target - but it's not in the builder yet, I don't still have the Dragon PDF handy, and I can't be arsed to go find it by sifting through the last several Dragons. So I can't give you the details. So, yeah: Check out the Duelist Rogues article. I looked it up anyway. Dragon 381, "Class Acts: Rogue", Feat: Flash of the Blade Prerequisite: Rogue, proficiency with rapiers Benefit: While wielding a rapier, if you and your target are the only creatures adjacent to each other, you can deal your Sneak Attack damage to that target if you do not have combat advantage against that target.
#13 brassbaboon Jan 28, 2010 17:34:50	> Sneak attack is a goal for a rogue, not a given. Design-wise it was assumed that the 3E rogue would be getting sneak attack with almost every attack he makes. If something is preventing that from happening (and it isn't just that the creature is immune) then an item solution is in keeping with that assumption. I suppose that depends on what level your rogue is, and how generous your DM is with magic items.
#14 brassbaboon Jan 28, 2010 17:40:15	To gain sneak attack as much as possible, the last 3.5e rogue in our group used the improved feint feat to feint as a move item, denying the target their Dex bonus and therefore making them vulnurable to sneak attack. I had a spellthief once who used "distract assailant" in the same manner, with the advantage that "distract assailant" is a swift action, so he could move and get his sneak attack. There are lots of ways to improve your chances at gaining sneak attack. And if your DM is any good, there are lots of ways to counter them.
#15 shadow_viper Jan 28, 2010 19:35:21	Sorry, forgot to specify 3.5 I think i may have been thinking of a weapon combined with a specific ability or something... "Clever Strike" is the closest thing I know of - At-Will, gain Combat Advantage as long as any ally is adjacent to the target. I remember there being a power printed in Dragon in the last month, in an article about Duelist Rogues, that gave them CA with a Rapier as long as nobody else is adjacent to you or the target - but it's not in the builder yet, I don't still have the Dragon PDF handy, and I can't be arsed to go find it by sifting through the last several Dragons. So I can't give you the details. So, yeah: Check out the Duelist Rogues article. As pointed out in his quote, he is playing 3.5, rather than 4E.
#16 LordOfWeasels Jan 29, 2010 7:33:23	As pointed out in his quote, he is playing 3.5, rather than 4E. Wow. I read that, then I quoted it, and even then I still didn't parse it. Last night was apparently a bad brain day. Okay, let's change my answer: Try the D20 forums, specifically the Classes and Class Features forum. You're much more likely to find D20 players who have recent and specific knowledge there, rather than in the D&D forums.
#17 TelinArtho Jan 29, 2010 12:55:50	What ever happened to the rogue with a ring of blinking? That was always a fine way to get sneak attack in any game I've seen.