Balancing the Raven Knight: Suggestions? - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Balancing the Raven Knight: Suggestions?

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
unknownair
Aug 13, 2012 15:52:40 As a house rule our DM has said that anything Dragon magazine related has to go through him before it's put in the game. There's a lot of unbalanced stuff in there he believes.

I've really wanted to take the Raven Knight epic destiny though for my slayer. It might not be the most powerful but I enjoy the flavour it comes with the the RPG situations I can use it with.

My DM though finds problem though with the fact that everytime I charge I gain insubstantial. Is there any aurguments you could make for this that I could put to my DM or some sort of change to what it gives me (maybe some sort of defense or resistance in place of it)? He's a very fair DM I find and he is always happy to debate these things.
#2
Chaosrex
Aug 13, 2012 21:24:51 Well being a Raven knight is a bit like being some kind of Soul reaper or Apprentice Grim Reaper.

You are like a ghostly Incarnation of the Raven Queen Will and Power, thus you can be insubtantial by moments when you shift your body from this plane to the Shadowfell momantarly.

Explain it like this.

And if not then asks him to swap out the insubstuntial with a +3 AC and Defenses till the end of your next turn and/or that your charge/run doesn't provoke any OA's.

Another way to RP it and trying to convinve him, is that when you charge, it is a charge of unstoppable Doom, its the March of Fated Death, where you come for your ennemies souls, to reape them and teach them that you do not challenge the Raven Queen or medle with her affairs and that you certainly do not disturb the death.
#3
Eisenritter
Aug 13, 2012 22:10:25 ...Your DM is a jerk. There's absolutely nothing wrong with Dragon material, least of all anything that came out before Essentials.
#4
Antillious
Aug 14, 2012 14:50:13 Yeah, mechanically insubstantial on a charge isn't exactly overpowered (ESPECIALLY on an epic destiny). I mean, it's trivial to have it so OA's aren't even allowed when you charge, so taking half damage should they hit is actually pretty weak in comparison. You'd still get hit with any effects, and you still risk having your movment stopped.
#5
Duskweaver
Aug 15, 2012 5:11:30
Yeah, mechanically insubstantial on a charge isn't exactly overpowered (ESPECIALLY on an epic destiny). I mean, it's trivial to have it so OA's aren't even allowed when you charge, so taking half damage should they hit is actually pretty weak in comparison. You'd still get hit with any effects, and you still risk having your movment stopped.

The insubstantiality lasts until the end of your next turn. For a character that charges every round (which can be almost trivial to achieve by epic tier), it ends up being effectively a permanent effect.

I still don't think it's overpowered for an ED feature, though.
#6
unknownair
Aug 15, 2012 9:05:08 Well just before I made this topic I made some arguements to him that I wasn't going to be charging much seeing as my original character wasn't made by me and he let me change up alot of things to it like paragon path. I have a lot more encounter powers now that can't be used on a charge. I suggested to him that we change it to "until the start of the next turn". Though hopefully I might just argue to keep it as it is. I don't play until Saturday so we will see. Still 3 levels until 21 anyway.
#7
WhisperMagellan
Aug 21, 2012 17:33:58 Unless there is errata, leave it alone. All of the paragon paths and epic destinies are pretty much fine as is.

(OK, I was miffed when Solar Wrath got nerfed from cburst 7 to cburst 2 or 3 and one of the effects disappeared--considering it was a PH1 paragon path, you'd think they would have noticed that it was "over-powered" BEFORE the book was published).
#8
Chaosrex
Aug 24, 2012 21:31:42
Unless there is errata, leave it alone. All of the paragon paths and epic destinies are pretty much fine as is.

(OK, I was miffed when Solar Wrath got nerfed from cburst 7 to cburst 2 or 3 and one of the effects disappeared--considering it was a PH1 paragon path, you'd think they would have noticed that it was "over-powered" BEFORE the book was published).

Be it in DnD, WH40k, WHB, or even MMo's, its always, always ALWAYS after the book/game comes out that they see their mistakes..., for the better or the worst.

You would think that with all the people working on it, someone would see it..., but noooo..., you whats the cause of this, too much cerebrale masturbation not enough playtesting.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 unknownair Aug 13, 2012 15:52:40	As a house rule our DM has said that anything Dragon magazine related has to go through him before it's put in the game. There's a lot of unbalanced stuff in there he believes. I've really wanted to take the Raven Knight epic destiny though for my slayer. It might not be the most powerful but I enjoy the flavour it comes with the the RPG situations I can use it with. My DM though finds problem though with the fact that everytime I charge I gain insubstantial. Is there any aurguments you could make for this that I could put to my DM or some sort of change to what it gives me (maybe some sort of defense or resistance in place of it)? He's a very fair DM I find and he is always happy to debate these things.
#2 Chaosrex Aug 13, 2012 21:24:51	Well being a Raven knight is a bit like being some kind of Soul reaper or Apprentice Grim Reaper. You are like a ghostly Incarnation of the Raven Queen Will and Power, thus you can be insubtantial by moments when you shift your body from this plane to the Shadowfell momantarly. Explain it like this. And if not then asks him to swap out the insubstuntial with a +3 AC and Defenses till the end of your next turn and/or that your charge/run doesn't provoke any OA's. Another way to RP it and trying to convinve him, is that when you charge, it is a charge of unstoppable Doom, its the March of Fated Death, where you come for your ennemies souls, to reape them and teach them that you do not challenge the Raven Queen or medle with her affairs and that you certainly do not disturb the death.
#3 Eisenritter Aug 13, 2012 22:10:25	...Your DM is a jerk. There's absolutely nothing wrong with Dragon material, least of all anything that came out before Essentials.
#4 Antillious Aug 14, 2012 14:50:13	Yeah, mechanically insubstantial on a charge isn't exactly overpowered (ESPECIALLY on an epic destiny). I mean, it's trivial to have it so OA's aren't even allowed when you charge, so taking half damage should they hit is actually pretty weak in comparison. You'd still get hit with any effects, and you still risk having your movment stopped.
#5 Duskweaver Aug 15, 2012 5:11:30	Yeah, mechanically insubstantial on a charge isn't exactly overpowered (ESPECIALLY on an epic destiny). I mean, it's trivial to have it so OA's aren't even allowed when you charge, so taking half damage should they hit is actually pretty weak in comparison. You'd still get hit with any effects, and you still risk having your movment stopped. The insubstantiality lasts until the end of your next turn. For a character that charges every round (which can be almost trivial to achieve by epic tier), it ends up being effectively a permanent effect. I still don't think it's overpowered for an ED feature, though.
#6 unknownair Aug 15, 2012 9:05:08	Well just before I made this topic I made some arguements to him that I wasn't going to be charging much seeing as my original character wasn't made by me and he let me change up alot of things to it like paragon path. I have a lot more encounter powers now that can't be used on a charge. I suggested to him that we change it to "until the start of the next turn". Though hopefully I might just argue to keep it as it is. I don't play until Saturday so we will see. Still 3 levels until 21 anyway.
#7 WhisperMagellan Aug 21, 2012 17:33:58	Unless there is errata, leave it alone. All of the paragon paths and epic destinies are pretty much fine as is. (OK, I was miffed when Solar Wrath got nerfed from cburst 7 to cburst 2 or 3 and one of the effects disappeared--considering it was a PH1 paragon path, you'd think they would have noticed that it was "over-powered" BEFORE the book was published).
#8 Chaosrex Aug 24, 2012 21:31:42	Unless there is errata, leave it alone. All of the paragon paths and epic destinies are pretty much fine as is. (OK, I was miffed when Solar Wrath got nerfed from cburst 7 to cburst 2 or 3 and one of the effects disappeared--considering it was a PH1 paragon path, you'd think they would have noticed that it was "over-powered" BEFORE the book was published). Be it in DnD, WH40k, WHB, or even MMo's, its always, always ALWAYS after the book/game comes out that they see their mistakes..., for the better or the worst. You would think that with all the people working on it, someone would see it..., but noooo..., you whats the cause of this, too much cerebrale masturbation not enough playtesting.