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Best AC class to begin?

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
jdmimports19
Dec 29, 2012 0:02:16 What is the best class to use to have the highest ac I can get from 1st level to 20th level. I heard monk is good but how to distribute ability points and still be able to do damage? also i tried paladin with best armor and only got to 26 ac. I read that wizards can reach the highest ac with spells i guess but im not experienced enough to be a wizard.
#2
Mad_Jack
Dec 29, 2012 9:24:26
Why do you want the best AC?

What does having a high AC give you - what are you trying to achieve with it?

#3
Krusk
Dec 29, 2012 10:11:09
the best non-infinate AC I have seen was made like this http://community.wizards.com//go/thread/view/75882/19865126/Got_bored..._which_resulted_in_a_new_AC_record . Miss chance that gives you better than 1/20 odds of being hit is still better than any AC.

What is your goal for this thread? Having a high AC just for the sake of it? Use Ottos build.
#4
baldhermit
Dec 29, 2012 12:03:45 Paladin is the only class that can start in plate. Does that answer your question ?

I can recommend you go to the charop forum and read some handbooks.

Paladin level 20 in a common magic +5 (lvl 21) plate armor should have something like 37 AC, without even taking any sort of defensive feats.

Any light armor / cloth class like monks, avengers can only achieve high AC by boosting Dex, and taking some feats.

#5
thespaceinvader
Dec 29, 2012 12:29:35
Paladin is the only class that can start in plate. Does that answer your question ?

No, it really doesn't, since plate/shield isn't the only way to get to max AC at level 1.

Also, it's incorrect, since Knights also come with plate proficiency, and any class that gets scale can buy plate at level 1 for a moderate investment.
#6
baldhermit
Dec 29, 2012 12:34:12 Sure, whatever. The original poster is so vague in his question as to make it impossible to answer.

Let me rephrase: there are a few classes, among which the Knight and Paladin, that start with a proficiency in plate, so without a feat or any other investment you could start with a decently high AC.

Other classes, mostly in light armor, can boost their AC with feats and/or good abilities scores in Dex/Int.

However, if you tell us what it is you are looking for or hoping to achieve, we can better assist you finding an answer.
#7
crimsyn
Dec 29, 2012 16:54:21
Other classes, mostly in light armor, can boost their AC with feats and/or good abilities scores in Dex/Int.

Also, some classes allow you to boost AC with other ability scores, such as the Seeker and the Warden
#8
KColette
Dec 29, 2012 17:02:42 There are plenty of ways to get high AC. Avenger or Monk with Unarmored Agility and high dexterity/intelligence. If you go with a human, pick up Hafted Defense and give them staves.

Heck, make a human wizard. Get them the Staff of Defense feature, 20 Intelligence, Unarmored Agility and Hafted Defense. You have now have high AC on one of the squishiest classes in the game.

But you don't need huge AC. You just want to avoid low AC. Which pretty much every class can do with ease, since every class has some means of boosting their AC, either through getting heavy armor by default or using one of their secondary or primary stats for AC with light armor proficiencies.
#9
baldhermit
Dec 29, 2012 17:05:10 All of this still trying to catch fog with a butterfly net until the OP is more specific in what he wants and hopes to achieve.
#10
crimsyn
Dec 29, 2012 17:29:45 If you're trying to make the toughest character you can, it's a question of more than just your base full-time AC value. Toughness is also a function of your other defenses, HP, availability of self-healing, temporary buffs to defenses and debuffs to enemy attacks, saving throws and ability to shrug off status effects, etc.

The general consensus is that the Warden is the toughest class; especially a con-based Warden like an Earthstrength.
#11
jdmimports19
Dec 29, 2012 20:17:25 i just want to have a really high ac so i almost never get hit. a dm is starting a new game with us and i want to try it. not sure what plate is or what warden is. we play on 3.5 version. we have a lot of different books so im sure what you are all talking about is in them somewhere. starting at level 1, what class/race will get me the highest ac i can get? best armor shields etc.. and continuingly increase each level. anything but a wizard would be helpful i am not good with non combat characters. well what i mean is i like to just fight which is why i want a really high ac so i wont get hit.
#12
Matyr
Dec 29, 2012 20:19:22 Telling us what edition you are playing would have likely helped a lot of the confusion you are having. Everyone here defaulted to 4e instead of 3.5.

I don't play 3.5 so I don't have any answers for you sadly, but that is why you might get confused reading things on this thread.
#13
jdmimports19
Dec 29, 2012 20:27:52 oh ok i didn't realize they were so different
#14
Tech-Priest
Dec 30, 2012 3:45:23
oh ok i didn't realize they were so different

2 Totally different games. Even in 3.5, how have you not heard of Plate Armor? Anyways, pick up a Fighter or Paladin, and you'll be fine.

Ugh, 3.5 nostalgia...
#15
Krusk
Dec 30, 2012 9:24:00 My response is 3.5.

Still, the best method to not be hit is to have miss chances.

If you want a really high AC don't go monk, it generally has a low AC. Best AC can generally be found with buff spells and being a caster. Failing that, go for mithril full plate, a decent dex score, an animated shield, ring of protection, amulet of natural armor. So something like warblade, crusader, paladin, ranger, barbarian, duskblade and fighter.

When buying magic items to increase AC, get a bunch of +1 items that provide a bonus of different types before going for a +2 bonus. Its generally cheaper. +1 Natural Armor, +1 Deflection bonus. stuff like that.
#16
MalakLightfoot
Dec 30, 2012 13:19:20
i just want to have a really high ac so i almost never get hit.

DO NOT start an arms race with your DM. Giving yourself an "unhittable AC" will only encourage him to level up the monsters so that when they hit you on a 15 or better, they are hitting the rest of your party on a 5 or better, and none of you will be able to handle the damage (or he will find ways to bypass your AC altogether, either with touch attacks or save or die spells).

Make yourself hard to hit, but not impossible to hit, and this arms race never needs to happen. Aim for the DM only hitting you on 15+. Expected accuracy for all parties involved in a combat is hit on 10+ (base game rule assumption, not CharOp assumption). Skew this too far, and the DM has to react in order to keep encounters meaningful and exciting. A boring fight where everyone is swinging and missing (or even where the only ones missing all the time is the monsters) is good for no one.

#17
Matyr
Dec 30, 2012 13:25:40 Don't worry. In 3.5 there are enough things that can ignore a high AC that boosting it through the roof really won't be as big an issue as it seems...
#18
Sir_Joseph_the_Crowe
Jan 01, 2013 14:18:15 Monk is a good choice. or fighter with high dex, combat expertise, dodge, armor that allows max dex, maybe a tower shield (hide behind it and stand in a corner; you'll almost never get hit). At higher levels get unarmed strike, deflect arrows, snatch arrows to block ranged attacks, fight defensively. A lot of these decrease your ability to hit an opponent, but make for a good tank. While the enemy wastes time trying to hit you, your allies can flank them and finish them off. Another tactic is that the best defense is a good offense. Power attacking strong barbarians tend to kill quickly. Dead enemies are typically much easier to avoid. At higher levels, you'll get damage reduction, so even if you get hit, it's not as bad. Plus, the higher hit points means you'll likely survive.

There are also some prestige classes that are all about dodging blows... ninja from complete adventurers guide comes to mind... or duelist.
#19
Sir_Joseph_the_Crowe
Jan 01, 2013 14:21:02
Monk is a good choice. or fighter with high dex, combat expertise, dodge, armor that allows max dex, maybe a tower shield (hide behind it and stand in a corner; you'll almost never get hit). At higher levels get unarmed strike, deflect arrows, snatch arrows to block ranged attacks, fight defensively. A lot of these decrease your ability to hit an opponent, but make for a good tank. While the enemy wastes time trying to hit you, your allies can flank them and finish them off. Another tactic is that the best defense is a good offense. Power attacking strong barbarians tend to kill quickly. Dead enemies are typically much easier to avoid. At higher levels, you'll get damage reduction, so even if you get hit, it's not as bad. Plus, the higher hit points means you'll likely survive.

There are also some prestige classes that are all about dodging blows... ninja from complete adventurers guide comes to mind... or duelist.

Or sorcerer... use obscuring mist or a darkness spell, then use true-strike to avoid the concealment miss chance when you attack. Be sure to stay away from the opponent in the mist to get the best out of the concealment.

At higher levels, a cloak of displacement is a must for the dodgy character.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 jdmimports19 Dec 29, 2012 0:02:16	What is the best class to use to have the highest ac I can get from 1st level to 20th level. I heard monk is good but how to distribute ability points and still be able to do damage? also i tried paladin with best armor and only got to 26 ac. I read that wizards can reach the highest ac with spells i guess but im not experienced enough to be a wizard.
#2 Mad_Jack Dec 29, 2012 9:24:26	Why do you want the best AC? What does having a high AC give you - what are you trying to achieve with it?
#3 Krusk Dec 29, 2012 10:11:09	the best non-infinate AC I have seen was made like this http://community.wizards.com//go/thread/view/75882/19865126/Got_bored..._which_resulted_in_a_new_AC_record . Miss chance that gives you better than 1/20 odds of being hit is still better than any AC. What is your goal for this thread? Having a high AC just for the sake of it? Use Ottos build.
#4 baldhermit Dec 29, 2012 12:03:45	Paladin is the only class that can start in plate. Does that answer your question ? I can recommend you go to the charop forum and read some handbooks. Paladin level 20 in a common magic +5 (lvl 21) plate armor should have something like 37 AC, without even taking any sort of defensive feats. Any light armor / cloth class like monks, avengers can only achieve high AC by boosting Dex, and taking some feats.
#5 thespaceinvader Dec 29, 2012 12:29:35	Paladin is the only class that can start in plate. Does that answer your question ? No, it really doesn't, since plate/shield isn't the only way to get to max AC at level 1. Also, it's incorrect, since Knights also come with plate proficiency, and any class that gets scale can buy plate at level 1 for a moderate investment.
#6 baldhermit Dec 29, 2012 12:34:12	Sure, whatever. The original poster is so vague in his question as to make it impossible to answer. Let me rephrase: there are a few classes, among which the Knight and Paladin, that start with a proficiency in plate, so without a feat or any other investment you could start with a decently high AC. Other classes, mostly in light armor, can boost their AC with feats and/or good abilities scores in Dex/Int. However, if you tell us what it is you are looking for or hoping to achieve, we can better assist you finding an answer.
#7 crimsyn Dec 29, 2012 16:54:21	Other classes, mostly in light armor, can boost their AC with feats and/or good abilities scores in Dex/Int. Also, some classes allow you to boost AC with other ability scores, such as the Seeker and the Warden
#8 KColette Dec 29, 2012 17:02:42	There are plenty of ways to get high AC. Avenger or Monk with Unarmored Agility and high dexterity/intelligence. If you go with a human, pick up Hafted Defense and give them staves. Heck, make a human wizard. Get them the Staff of Defense feature, 20 Intelligence, Unarmored Agility and Hafted Defense. You have now have high AC on one of the squishiest classes in the game. But you don't need huge AC. You just want to avoid low AC. Which pretty much every class can do with ease, since every class has some means of boosting their AC, either through getting heavy armor by default or using one of their secondary or primary stats for AC with light armor proficiencies.
#9 baldhermit Dec 29, 2012 17:05:10	All of this still trying to catch fog with a butterfly net until the OP is more specific in what he wants and hopes to achieve.
#10 crimsyn Dec 29, 2012 17:29:45	If you're trying to make the toughest character you can, it's a question of more than just your base full-time AC value. Toughness is also a function of your other defenses, HP, availability of self-healing, temporary buffs to defenses and debuffs to enemy attacks, saving throws and ability to shrug off status effects, etc. The general consensus is that the Warden is the toughest class; especially a con-based Warden like an Earthstrength.
#11 jdmimports19 Dec 29, 2012 20:17:25	i just want to have a really high ac so i almost never get hit. a dm is starting a new game with us and i want to try it. not sure what plate is or what warden is. we play on 3.5 version. we have a lot of different books so im sure what you are all talking about is in them somewhere. starting at level 1, what class/race will get me the highest ac i can get? best armor shields etc.. and continuingly increase each level. anything but a wizard would be helpful i am not good with non combat characters. well what i mean is i like to just fight which is why i want a really high ac so i wont get hit.
#12 Matyr Dec 29, 2012 20:19:22	Telling us what edition you are playing would have likely helped a lot of the confusion you are having. Everyone here defaulted to 4e instead of 3.5. I don't play 3.5 so I don't have any answers for you sadly, but that is why you might get confused reading things on this thread.
#13 jdmimports19 Dec 29, 2012 20:27:52	oh ok i didn't realize they were so different
#14 Tech-Priest Dec 30, 2012 3:45:23	oh ok i didn't realize they were so different 2 Totally different games. Even in 3.5, how have you not heard of Plate Armor? Anyways, pick up a Fighter or Paladin, and you'll be fine. Ugh, 3.5 nostalgia...
#15 Krusk Dec 30, 2012 9:24:00	My response is 3.5. Still, the best method to not be hit is to have miss chances. If you want a really high AC don't go monk, it generally has a low AC. Best AC can generally be found with buff spells and being a caster. Failing that, go for mithril full plate, a decent dex score, an animated shield, ring of protection, amulet of natural armor. So something like warblade, crusader, paladin, ranger, barbarian, duskblade and fighter. When buying magic items to increase AC, get a bunch of +1 items that provide a bonus of different types before going for a +2 bonus. Its generally cheaper. +1 Natural Armor, +1 Deflection bonus. stuff like that.
#16 MalakLightfoot Dec 30, 2012 13:19:20	i just want to have a really high ac so i almost never get hit. DO NOT start an arms race with your DM. Giving yourself an "unhittable AC" will only encourage him to level up the monsters so that when they hit you on a 15 or better, they are hitting the rest of your party on a 5 or better, and none of you will be able to handle the damage (or he will find ways to bypass your AC altogether, either with touch attacks or save or die spells). Make yourself hard to hit, but not impossible to hit, and this arms race never needs to happen. Aim for the DM only hitting you on 15+. Expected accuracy for all parties involved in a combat is hit on 10+ (base game rule assumption, not CharOp assumption). Skew this too far, and the DM has to react in order to keep encounters meaningful and exciting. A boring fight where everyone is swinging and missing (or even where the only ones missing all the time is the monsters) is good for no one.
#17 Matyr Dec 30, 2012 13:25:40	Don't worry. In 3.5 there are enough things that can ignore a high AC that boosting it through the roof really won't be as big an issue as it seems...
#18 Sir_Joseph_the_Crowe Jan 01, 2013 14:18:15	Monk is a good choice. or fighter with high dex, combat expertise, dodge, armor that allows max dex, maybe a tower shield (hide behind it and stand in a corner; you'll almost never get hit). At higher levels get unarmed strike, deflect arrows, snatch arrows to block ranged attacks, fight defensively. A lot of these decrease your ability to hit an opponent, but make for a good tank. While the enemy wastes time trying to hit you, your allies can flank them and finish them off. Another tactic is that the best defense is a good offense. Power attacking strong barbarians tend to kill quickly. Dead enemies are typically much easier to avoid. At higher levels, you'll get damage reduction, so even if you get hit, it's not as bad. Plus, the higher hit points means you'll likely survive. There are also some prestige classes that are all about dodging blows... ninja from complete adventurers guide comes to mind... or duelist.
#19 Sir_Joseph_the_Crowe Jan 01, 2013 14:21:02	Monk is a good choice. or fighter with high dex, combat expertise, dodge, armor that allows max dex, maybe a tower shield (hide behind it and stand in a corner; you'll almost never get hit). At higher levels get unarmed strike, deflect arrows, snatch arrows to block ranged attacks, fight defensively. A lot of these decrease your ability to hit an opponent, but make for a good tank. While the enemy wastes time trying to hit you, your allies can flank them and finish them off. Another tactic is that the best defense is a good offense. Power attacking strong barbarians tend to kill quickly. Dead enemies are typically much easier to avoid. At higher levels, you'll get damage reduction, so even if you get hit, it's not as bad. Plus, the higher hit points means you'll likely survive. There are also some prestige classes that are all about dodging blows... ninja from complete adventurers guide comes to mind... or duelist. Or sorcerer... use obscuring mist or a darkness spell, then use true-strike to avoid the concealment miss chance when you attack. Be sure to stay away from the opponent in the mist to get the best out of the concealment. At higher levels, a cloak of displacement is a must for the dodgy character.