Can we take on Lolth? - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Can we take on Lolth?

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
addi83
Mar 04, 2011 9:46:21 Our group has just turned level 27, but we have not had an extended rest. (the GM is lenient about such things in our current situation, we get new powers, but don't refresh spent powers or regain hitpoints/surges/action points upon leveling without rest)

We are currently low on dailies, and only about half the group has action points available for the fight (not including the bard, who has neat tricks up his sleeve when he uses those)

We are fighting an end-game struggle in the Forgotten Realms, where through various means, Cyric has unleashed primordials to fight the gods, trapped their avatar forms on the prime material plane (at least those who have residencies in Celestia, not those who reside in the infernal chaos, like Lolth). We have around 6 hours till the end of the world. Using one of his tricks, the bard CAN let us take an extended rest in 4 hours, so we can be at full strength in the final confrontation, assuming we live that long, but we just slew one of Lolths favorite pets, and she just popped in, in person, to have some words with us on that.

I do believe that considering the situation, it might be reduced to a social encounter and we wouldn't necessarily need to fight her. But I am playing a drow sorceress with a vendetta against Lolth and has poor priority-management, so I might just want to go for her anyway.

Add to this that the GM has hinted that we could get our hands on 'The Loom of Fate' which would enable us to cause Lolths final death, if we were to defeat her, rather than just have her discorporeate.

I don't have access to the exact statblocks of the rest of the group, they should mostly have ok attacks, damage and defenses unless otherwies noted.

The group consists of:

Our defender, an elven Warden with good surivability, regeneration and high defenses. Can do ok damage wise for a defender.

Our leader, a Half elf bard with some really neat tricks, most of which have been used up by now.

Our other leader, a human cleric. He has monstrous defenses, but unfortunately he's very poorly constructed and apart from having plentiful and powerful heals and being hard to hit, he's not much use...luckily that's all the use we really need out of him. (DM will let me go over his charsheet and help him rebuild a bit for the next session, since he's a relative newbie to the rest of us)

Myself a striker, playing a Drow Storm Sorceress with pretty good equipment and spells, but not deliberately 'broken' in any way. (attack mod of 31 against reflex for most of my spells, lots of damage if I hit, rather low defenses)

Our other striker, an elven ranger with absolutely insane damage output and accuracy. (thanks to some arrows that allow re-roll-take better and I find rather broken, but whatever), should be a real asset in this fight

Our third striker, a tiefling infernal warlock with a wizard multiclass. He's rather poorly constructed and the player has a poor grasp of his mechanics and abilities. Still, he has pretty good damage output when he hits, and I've helped him get his accuracy up to snuff.

So, my question is, do we stand a chance? Not asking for a breakdown of Lolths abilities (I know she's a Level 35 lurker, but I'm not gonna look her up and study her in detail, I feel that would be cheating, so don't tell me any of 'that' stuff)

I just worry that someone who is a Goddess, and is that many levels above us, would have defenses that are just beyond our range of hitting often enough to stand a chance.
#2
trebor_rjf
Mar 04, 2011 10:31:08 lolth is one of the hardest bosses in dnd, if i were you id avoid fighting her. especially if you have new players playing level 27 characters.
#3
mellored
Mar 04, 2011 10:46:31 Note that you DM may have adjusted things. So she might not be lvl 35.

If she is, then you'll very likely die.
#4
addi83
Mar 04, 2011 15:09:10 I see, I'll take it into consideration, I don't think the GM is deleveling her though.

At least she doesn't have any Lolthcats with her.

"We can haz adventurerz?"
#5
ADHadh
Mar 06, 2011 14:19:14 OMGLOLTH
#6
QuestorTelloc
Mar 31, 2011 10:22:20
I see, I'll take it into consideration, I don't think the GM is deleveling her though.

At least she doesn't have any Lolthcats with her.

"We can haz adventurerz?"

You realize this gives me the right to strangle you with your computer's power cord, right? ;)

And, to the OP, no. Unless you and your party are all super-optimized AND you have some miraculous help, you're dead. I'm going after her eventually in my own campaign world, and I'm not even going to THINK about it until everyone is level 30, and even then we're only going to have someone lock her out of the Demonweb Pits for a thousand years while she battles us. When she recorporealizes, she's homeless! Anyway, don't do it. You'll all die.
#7
thekafka
May 04, 2011 18:30:25
She is a HIGH level GOD!!!! i dont care if yall are level 40, if you are not at least a 8 devine rank. she will kill you, better yet, her flunkeys will kill you. she will have demi-gods all around her.

look up what feats gods and get and i bet she has all of them.

there is one where a god can just point and someone and they DIE! just die, no save, no nothing unless u are another god.
#8
m4kitsu
May 04, 2011 23:55:45 /em slow clap*

You do know this thread is two months old, right? Generally, thread necromancy is considered bad form unless you have something interesting and relevant to contribute.... which you do not.

Oh, and it was about 4e. There is no such thing as divine ranks, monsters no longer have feats, and there is a good chance the PCs will [b]be[/i] Demigods by the time they get to her.

Also, actually, she's a Level 34 Solo Lurker -well within the capabilities of a well-prepared level 30 party. I'd imagine getting to and cracking the Loom would be the hard part, really. After that, "Hey guys let's go kill Lolth! It'll be fun!" is a rub-it-in-her-face-then-steal-her-portfolio victory lap.

Heck, I think we've proven it's possible for a Ranger to take her down in a single round without help. Anyone know if that build still works?

* - Oh good, my slow clap processor made it into this thing. So we have that.
#9
pippenainteasy
Sep 23, 2011 23:07:18 Even non-optimized parties should not have trouble with Lolth. She has no flight, no damaging aura, and very limited offense with an over-reliance on ongoing poison damage. Pretty depressing for a multi-spheric greater god. But then again influence of god might not = combat power. Just search around the forums--a party of 4 Level 27-30s should have no problems taking down Lolth within 2 rounds without some allies. I think this is a throwback to the previous editions where Lolth as a Greater Goddess had only 66HP and was just wearing a "kick-me" sign.

Vecna and Tiamat are significantly more powerful solos, although should still be used with allies as they wouldn't stand very long in a boxing contest with a high level party.
#10
nelphine
Sep 24, 2011 11:59:39 First: If you were optimized, and she was level 35, you could still beat her at level 25 fairly easily - but that's IF you were designed for god killing which you are not.

Second: In previous editions, when she had 66 hp, she was also originally presented in a room where she was virtually immune to range attacks, and by saying 'come' she could kill everyone in the party who was wearing heavy armour, no save. So sure she had 66 hp; but as a DM I never had anyone hurt her, let alone actually beat her.

Third: Your party would probably have fun playing against her, just make sure you have an escape route; that way you can try, and if failing, RUN AWAY. It's not such a bad idea sometimes, and you can learn all kinds of things for when you tackle her again at level 28 (or 30, or whatever).

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 addi83 Mar 04, 2011 9:46:21	Our group has just turned level 27, but we have not had an extended rest. (the GM is lenient about such things in our current situation, we get new powers, but don't refresh spent powers or regain hitpoints/surges/action points upon leveling without rest) We are currently low on dailies, and only about half the group has action points available for the fight (not including the bard, who has neat tricks up his sleeve when he uses those) We are fighting an end-game struggle in the Forgotten Realms, where through various means, Cyric has unleashed primordials to fight the gods, trapped their avatar forms on the prime material plane (at least those who have residencies in Celestia, not those who reside in the infernal chaos, like Lolth). We have around 6 hours till the end of the world. Using one of his tricks, the bard CAN let us take an extended rest in 4 hours, so we can be at full strength in the final confrontation, assuming we live that long, but we just slew one of Lolths favorite pets, and she just popped in, in person, to have some words with us on that. I do believe that considering the situation, it might be reduced to a social encounter and we wouldn't necessarily need to fight her. But I am playing a drow sorceress with a vendetta against Lolth and has poor priority-management, so I might just want to go for her anyway. Add to this that the GM has hinted that we could get our hands on 'The Loom of Fate' which would enable us to cause Lolths final death, if we were to defeat her, rather than just have her discorporeate. I don't have access to the exact statblocks of the rest of the group, they should mostly have ok attacks, damage and defenses unless otherwies noted. The group consists of: Our defender, an elven Warden with good surivability, regeneration and high defenses. Can do ok damage wise for a defender. Our leader, a Half elf bard with some really neat tricks, most of which have been used up by now. Our other leader, a human cleric. He has monstrous defenses, but unfortunately he's very poorly constructed and apart from having plentiful and powerful heals and being hard to hit, he's not much use...luckily that's all the use we really need out of him. (DM will let me go over his charsheet and help him rebuild a bit for the next session, since he's a relative newbie to the rest of us) Myself a striker, playing a Drow Storm Sorceress with pretty good equipment and spells, but not deliberately 'broken' in any way. (attack mod of 31 against reflex for most of my spells, lots of damage if I hit, rather low defenses) Our other striker, an elven ranger with absolutely insane damage output and accuracy. (thanks to some arrows that allow re-roll-take better and I find rather broken, but whatever), should be a real asset in this fight Our third striker, a tiefling infernal warlock with a wizard multiclass. He's rather poorly constructed and the player has a poor grasp of his mechanics and abilities. Still, he has pretty good damage output when he hits, and I've helped him get his accuracy up to snuff. So, my question is, do we stand a chance? Not asking for a breakdown of Lolths abilities (I know she's a Level 35 lurker, but I'm not gonna look her up and study her in detail, I feel that would be cheating, so don't tell me any of 'that' stuff) I just worry that someone who is a Goddess, and is that many levels above us, would have defenses that are just beyond our range of hitting often enough to stand a chance.
#2 trebor_rjf Mar 04, 2011 10:31:08	lolth is one of the hardest bosses in dnd, if i were you id avoid fighting her. especially if you have new players playing level 27 characters.
#3 mellored Mar 04, 2011 10:46:31	Note that you DM may have adjusted things. So she might not be lvl 35. If she is, then you'll very likely die.
#4 addi83 Mar 04, 2011 15:09:10	I see, I'll take it into consideration, I don't think the GM is deleveling her though. At least she doesn't have any Lolthcats with her. "We can haz adventurerz?"
#5 ADHadh Mar 06, 2011 14:19:14	OMGLOLTH
#6 QuestorTelloc Mar 31, 2011 10:22:20	I see, I'll take it into consideration, I don't think the GM is deleveling her though. At least she doesn't have any Lolthcats with her. "We can haz adventurerz?" You realize this gives me the right to strangle you with your computer's power cord, right? ;) And, to the OP, no. Unless you and your party are all super-optimized AND you have some miraculous help, you're dead. I'm going after her eventually in my own campaign world, and I'm not even going to THINK about it until everyone is level 30, and even then we're only going to have someone lock her out of the Demonweb Pits for a thousand years while she battles us. When she recorporealizes, she's homeless! Anyway, don't do it. You'll all die.
#7 thekafka May 04, 2011 18:30:25	She is a HIGH level GOD!!!! i dont care if yall are level 40, if you are not at least a 8 devine rank. she will kill you, better yet, her flunkeys will kill you. she will have demi-gods all around her. look up what feats gods and get and i bet she has all of them. there is one where a god can just point and someone and they DIE! just die, no save, no nothing unless u are another god.
#8 m4kitsu May 04, 2011 23:55:45	/em slow clap* You do know this thread is two months old, right? Generally, thread necromancy is considered bad form unless you have something interesting and relevant to contribute.... which you do not. Oh, and it was about 4e. There is no such thing as divine ranks, monsters no longer have feats, and there is a good chance the PCs will [b]be[/i] Demigods by the time they get to her. Also, actually, she's a Level 34 Solo Lurker -well within the capabilities of a well-prepared level 30 party. I'd imagine getting to and cracking the Loom would be the hard part, really. After that, "Hey guys let's go kill Lolth! It'll be fun!" is a rub-it-in-her-face-then-steal-her-portfolio victory lap. Heck, I think we've proven it's possible for a Ranger to take her down in a single round without help. Anyone know if that build still works? * - Oh good, my slow clap processor made it into this thing. So we have that.
#9 pippenainteasy Sep 23, 2011 23:07:18	Even non-optimized parties should not have trouble with Lolth. She has no flight, no damaging aura, and very limited offense with an over-reliance on ongoing poison damage. Pretty depressing for a multi-spheric greater god. But then again influence of god might not = combat power. Just search around the forums--a party of 4 Level 27-30s should have no problems taking down Lolth within 2 rounds without some allies. I think this is a throwback to the previous editions where Lolth as a Greater Goddess had only 66HP and was just wearing a "kick-me" sign. Vecna and Tiamat are significantly more powerful solos, although should still be used with allies as they wouldn't stand very long in a boxing contest with a high level party.
#10 nelphine Sep 24, 2011 11:59:39	First: If you were optimized, and she was level 35, you could still beat her at level 25 fairly easily - but that's IF you were designed for god killing which you are not. Second: In previous editions, when she had 66 hp, she was also originally presented in a room where she was virtually immune to range attacks, and by saying 'come' she could kill everyone in the party who was wearing heavy armour, no save. So sure she had 66 hp; but as a DM I never had anyone hurt her, let alone actually beat her. Third: Your party would probably have fun playing against her, just make sure you have an escape route; that way you can try, and if failing, RUN AWAY. It's not such a bad idea sometimes, and you can learn all kinds of things for when you tackle her again at level 28 (or 30, or whatever).