In a campaign I'm currently playing in, the players have developed a trend of their characters trying to cheat and steal from each other almost constantly. This can range from keeping quiet about a magic item someone stealthily picked up, to directly pickpocketing other PCs. Now, this is not a complaint against the other players; we've all agreed that intra-party conflict is both realistic and challenging, so it is not my goal to stop or "punish" the behavior, merely to fight back.
My character is a Fighter with a heavy shield and plate armor, and low CHA, so his social skills and stealth/thievery are shot. His perception and insight aren’t great either, so it’s easy for the others to hide their deeds. This leaves brute force as his biggest strength, but I’d like to try other options first. I’d like to avoid sacrificing feats for skill training, as it means it’ll be several levels before it becomes effective, and it will take away from the build I’m working on. I realize this leaves me short on options, but if anyone’s got some creative ideas I haven’t thought of, I’d love to hear them. He is a Warforged with embedded belt pouches, so anything he’s already carrying that can fit is safe. He is level 5 if that helps.
I should note that my fighter can likely take out any other party member one-on-one, maybe even two-on-one, so brute force IS an option I’m considering. Being a Warforged surrounded by devious fleshbags, he grows more and more cynical every day. I think it’d be a great plot twist if he snapped and killed one or more party members.
Is your character worried about it happening to him?
Sure, you say your Cha is low as well as your perception/insight. That he's at a disadvantage vrs the devious fleshbags....
But that doesn't mean he's so deaf & dumb he doesn't notice others complaing about their stuff going missing. Nor that he's so dense as to fail to recognize a threat that he's ill-equipped to deal with.
So what you need is an ally (or two) watching your back who's better at those skills than you.
Fortunately you have something to offer - a secure means of storing (some) valuables.
So start making deals! Heck, you might even be able to turn a profit.
Secure storage for a mere ___/week. For that matter, if the entire party is stealing from each other and doesn't trust anybody else, why are they hanging around together?
That level of intra-party conflict is not remotely 'realistic', because realistically, nobody is going to spend time hanging around people they can't trust unless they are given no choice in the matter.
I've always liked the idea of secrets within the party, an assassin or thief among the group. However I always made sure my players used it as an end game plot twist. After all the trouble the group went to find the treasure of the coal pits a thief took it right from under them. The same is true when you learn that a long time friend is in fact an assassin or someone seeking revenge upon another player.
I don't see a point to pointless pickpocketing when the score is so little. If players are stealing from one another I'd be spliting the group once their wickied ways had been discovered. Why would your Fighter continue working with a group of pickpocketers?
What is everones alighment?
The actual pickpocketing has died down since the rogue was ambushed and killed by some NPCs he stole from. Now it's mostly sins of ommission, and mostly with things that can't be shared evenly right away, like art objects and magic items. Sometimes it happens in plain sight, and this usually ends with me holding onto art objects or distributing magic items, but sometimes it happens when a stealthy character scouts ahead, or even during battle.
Thankfully no one has stolen from me specifically. I've got the hidden pouches, I don't sleep, and there's the fact that I could kill any of them, especially while THEY sleep.
I can't recall their alignments off the top of my head, but none of them are evil or lawful.
I like the ally idea, and I know just the character who's loyalty might be bought. Thanks!
Anyway, my character could easily end up on the bad end of a lot of intra-party scheming so early on he cut a deal with one of the other members of the party. When fighting breaks out, I will give top priority to defending that character, moving to intercept threats toward him in preference to other targets. In return he keeps an eye on me, keeps me from getting scammed too much or saying dumb things to our superiors.
We actually talked about it, out of character, acknowledging that I may have set myself up for a betrayal in the long term. He agreed to only go down that route if it makes for an interesting plot point, not just to cheat my character out of some treasure. I'm fine with that. I knew going into an evil campaign that there would be some amount of mixed loyalties, and I don't mind losing a character if it furthers the story.
If you like that kind of campaign then so be it, it's your game. But any advice I could give on how to compete with the other "devious fleshbags" is just going to result in someone getting angry in real life, so I don't really have any. I'd just advise the OP not to ever take it personally, and hope nobody else does either.
This kind of group is not something I'd do all the time, but it's made for some interesting challenges. I know the other players well and it's never personal, and we never hold grudges for anything done in character. This is why I intend to deal with it in game as a disgruntled character rather than a player.
Ally with a couple of them. When the adventure is done, you and your allies kill off the others. Then kill your allies.
In a campaign I'm currently playing in, the players have developed a trend of their characters trying to cheat and steal from each other almost constantly. This can range from keeping quiet about a magic item someone stealthily picked up, to directly pickpocketing other PCs. Now, this is not a complaint against the other players; we've all agreed that intra-party conflict is both realistic and challenging, so it is not my goal to stop or "punish" the behavior, merely to fight back.
My character is a Fighter with a heavy shield and plate armor, and low CHA, so his social skills and stealth/thievery are shot. His perception and insight aren’t great either, so it’s easy for the others to hide their deeds. This leaves brute force as his biggest strength, but I’d like to try other options first. I’d like to avoid sacrificing feats for skill training, as it means it’ll be several levels before it becomes effective, and it will take away from the build I’m working on. I realize this leaves me short on options, but if anyone’s got some creative ideas I haven’t thought of, I’d love to hear them. He is a Warforged with embedded belt pouches, so anything he’s already carrying that can fit is safe. He is level 5 if that helps.
I should note that my fighter can likely take out any other party member one-on-one, maybe even two-on-one, so brute force IS an option I’m considering. Being a Warforged surrounded by devious fleshbags, he grows more and more cynical every day. I think it’d be a great plot twist if he snapped and killed one or more party members.
Realistic? You mean your friends and family and acquaintances regularly lie, cheat, and steal from each other?
This kind of group is not something I'd do all the time, but it's made for some interesting challenges. I know the other players well and it's never personal, and we never hold grudges for anything done in character. This is why I intend to deal with it in game as a disgruntled character rather than a player.
Ally with a couple of them. When the adventure is done, you and your allies kill off the others. Then kill your allies.
Then kill yourself, because, why not? If you're going to play a sociopath, no point doing it by halves.
This kind of group is not something I'd do all the time, but it's made for some interesting challenges. I know the other players well and it's never personal, and we never hold grudges for anything done in character. This is why I intend to deal with it in game as a disgruntled character rather than a player.
Ally with a couple of them. When the adventure is done, you and your allies kill off the others. Then kill your allies.
Then kill yourself, because, why not? If you're going to play a sociopath, no point doing it by halves.
Actually, I was thinking more "Walk away with a clear conscience."
He already said that the only reason his character was sticking around was a feeling of duty to finish the adventure. I figure the Warforged can off the humanoids when he's done and then go join the Lord of Blades...
This kind of group is not something I'd do all the time, but it's made for some interesting challenges. I know the other players well and it's never personal, and we never hold grudges for anything done in character. This is why I intend to deal with it in game as a disgruntled character rather than a player.
Ally with a couple of them. When the adventure is done, you and your allies kill off the others. Then kill your allies.
Then kill yourself, because, why not? If you're going to play a sociopath, no point doing it by halves.
"Now, I'm the only one left. Which means the only person I can't trust-- is me!" *bang*
In a campaign I'm currently playing in, the players have developed a trend of their characters trying to cheat and steal from each other almost constantly. This can range from keeping quiet about a magic item someone stealthily picked up, to directly pickpocketing other PCs. Now, this is not a complaint against the other players; we've all agreed that intra-party conflict is both realistic and challenging, so it is not my goal to stop or "punish" the behavior, merely to fight back.
My character is a Fighter with a heavy shield and plate armor, and low CHA, so his social skills and stealth/thievery are shot. His perception and insight aren’t great either, so it’s easy for the others to hide their deeds. This leaves brute force as his biggest strength, but I’d like to try other options first. I’d like to avoid sacrificing feats for skill training, as it means it’ll be several levels before it becomes effective, and it will take away from the build I’m working on. I realize this leaves me short on options, but if anyone’s got some creative ideas I haven’t thought of, I’d love to hear them. He is a Warforged with embedded belt pouches, so anything he’s already carrying that can fit is safe. He is level 5 if that helps.
I should note that my fighter can likely take out any other party member one-on-one, maybe even two-on-one, so brute force IS an option I’m considering. Being a Warforged surrounded by devious fleshbags, he grows more and more cynical every day. I think it’d be a great plot twist if he snapped and killed one or more party members.
Realistic? You mean your friends and family and acquaintances regularly lie, cheat, and steal from each other?
Friends and family? no. People whom I've just met and decided to go on an adventure with, who regularly kill other creatures, sentient and otherwise? perhaps.
Friends and family? no. People whom I've just met and decided to go on an adventure with, who regularly kill other creatures, sentient and otherwise? perhaps.
Why would you trust them with your life, but not your property?
In a campaign I'm currently playing in, the players have developed a trend of their characters trying to cheat and steal from each other almost constantly. This can range from keeping quiet about a magic item someone stealthily picked up, to directly pickpocketing other PCs. Now, this is not a complaint against the other players; we've all agreed that intra-party conflict is both realistic and challenging, so it is not my goal to stop or "punish" the behavior, merely to fight back.
Realistic? You mean your friends and family and acquaintances regularly lie, cheat, and steal from each other?
Friends and family? no. People whom I've just met and decided to go on an adventure with, who regularly kill other creatures, sentient and otherwise? perhaps.
Not buying this, but its not a problem.
Depends on "realism" in your games:
- First of all "realism" in soap operas and films often has this kind of intra-group conflict, because it makes for a fun story.
- Secondly, this sort of non-serious in-fighting and joking is standard fare with a group of friends just hanging out. Just the definition of non-serious/joking can be escalated to "stealing your virtual stuff" in a game without any repercussions outside the game (provided you've all signed up to it).
In games I've witnessed, though, it only works if the players actively work at keeping the balance right, finding reasons to alter their alliances and keep the banter fresh. Once there are clear winners or losers for the in-fighting - e.g. if the thief regularly gets all the loot, or conversely he is routinely excluded from all loot due to being found out in the past - then it can become grind for the losing players.
When the culprit doesn't come forward, suggest other ways of finding out who took the item. First, everyone empties their backpack one by one. If someone is unwilling to do so, accuse him of being the culprit and snatch his pack from him.
If this doesn't yield the missing item, it's time for some stripsearching. Everyone takes off their clothes until they're in their underwear. You join in by opening all your hidden pouches and compartments.
If this somehow doesn't yield the missing item, you were probably wrong in the first place. But be careful not to admit that! Instead, suggest that something else might have been the cause for the item disappearing, like one of those insidious fey creatures who snuck up on the party while you weren't paying attention. Find an explanation that satifies everyone, and be on your way.
This should likely take at least an hour of real game time, so it might reduce the number of future thefts for the sake of the campaign ever finishing.
Inspiration
Do a bottle episode: as soon as your character figures out something is wrong (stolen items, or other party members holding back loot), stop in your tracks and demand that the bastard who did it comes forward! Until he does, you are going nowhere, and so are the others. If someone attempts to leave, accuse them of being the culprit. If someone accuses you, argue/deny until you're blue in the face. Threaten them with violence if necessary, but mostly you're trying to turn the group against that one person.
When the culprit doesn't come forward, suggest other ways of finding out who took the item. First, everyone empties their backpack one by one. If someone is unwilling to do so, accuse him of being the culprit and snatch his pack from him.
If this doesn't yield the missing item, it's time for some stripsearching. Everyone takes off their clothes until they're in their underwear. You join in by opening all your hidden pouches and compartments.
If this somehow doesn't yield the missing item, you were probably wrong in the first place. But be careful not to admit that! Instead, suggest that something else might have been the cause for the item disappearing, like one of those insidious fey creatures who snuck up on the party while you weren't paying attention. Find an explanation that satifies everyone, and be on your way.
This should likely take at least an hour of real game time, so it might reduce the number of future thefts for the sake of the campaign ever finishing.
Inspiration
Brilliant, this is happening.
It has nothing to do with *realism* because we already make compromises to play a game like Dungeons and Dragons.
Any smart DM just reduces what treasure he finds out of appropriate wealth by level if playing 3.X or puts it in an appropriate slot for a parcel for the character and gives *you* more stuff somehow to replace it an keep things approrpriate.
I hesitate to call myself "smart", but yes that's what I'd do as DM by default, since I monitor character wealth versus expected wealth, ignoring the hows and whys, and regularly adjust treasure towards getting expected wealth.
That DM behaviour is 100% separate from player behaviour, although characters taking each other's stuff could make my life harder - I'd probably just give the team as a whole the expected amount of stuff (simply favouring low-equipped characters by targetting magic item *types*) and point this out. However, if all players were actively enjoying the intrigue, and no-one was being bullied OOC, then I'd most likely just let it run as is.
I have seen players using character stats and abilities as excuses to (virtual) bully other players, and I don't condone that. That's just basic disruptive play, and needs to be dealt with. However, a little bit of IC conflict and intrigue shouldn't be a problem for a group of friends playing D&D.
Buy a portable hole to keep all your unattended stuff, store it on the underside of your tongue, and sleep with a mask on. That should pretty much solve any problems that you may be having with less than scrupulous so-called allies.
*gulp!*
"Hoboy, hope I won't need that extra set of boots or any new torches until after sometime tomorrow..."
And get in an alliance with EVERYONE. You'll be safe from everyone, then, and you can always betray one of them and have allies to back you up.
Seeing as you are the strongest character in the party, everyone probably wants you on their side anyways.
Oh, and stop fretting about the type of game they are playing. It doesn't matter if it's "realistic" or not, it brings some fun times, and I can see this being a fun type of game for a short campaign if every player agrees to this beforehand.